Southerly by David Haywood

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Southerly: Who was George Hildebrand Alington—and why did he give away his “Girl child 23 months old”?

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  • Lynley Chapman, in reply to SteveH,

    "My" Pemley is a great name to trace, "my" John MORRISON not so much....

    Goose chases up the wrong tree and those gnarly brick walls all add to the genie soup for sure Steve.

    Asking questions, talking to others and sharing head scratching data all helps I find in my genie work.

    Porirua • Since Aug 2011 • 45 posts Report Reply

  • Lynley Chapman, in reply to David Haywood,

    Details obsessed in genealogy is a very good attribute...

    This data was from an old NZ Genealogical Society Index CD, Version 5 which has been superseded. Not sure I can do better than this for you at the moment.

    I have put the word out to see if the Women only 1893 Electoral Roll (compiled post suffrage legislation) is available anywhere online. I've only ever seen it on Micro fiche and indexed on this CD.

    I will get back to you once I get an answer or perhaps Steve or another sleuth can offer help here.

    Porirua • Since Aug 2011 • 45 posts Report Reply

  • David Haywood,

    Some information on Rev Holland (one of the signatories to the adoption letter)…

    13 August 1889: He was at St Paul’s, Papanui beginning an 18 month appointment.

    22 July 1891: He was lecturing in Ashbuton to raise funds for Rakaia church. (So probably appointed to a position there by this date).

    8 October 1891, he was visiting All Saints Church, Methven (this is just before Eileen Winter Coleman was born).

    By 1892 his residential address was listed as Rakaia in Wise’s directory (while based in Rakaia, it seems his parish included Methven, Ashburton, Barr Hill, etc).

    In April 1891 there is a connection with Alington (Star , Issue 7143, 21 April 1891, Page 3):

    St John’s, Barr Hill. The annual meeting of the parishioners was held on April 16. There was a moderate attendance. The Rev J. Holland, curate of Rakaia, presided. Mr Alington, minister’s warden, read the statement of accounts, which was considered very satisfactory. The curate reappointed Mr Alington as his warden, and the parishioners re-elected Mr D. Hurst. The following were elected vestrymen Messrs J. Spooner, A. C. Maxwell, Mills, S. Hurst, Chapman and Urwin. It was decided to carry out some necessary repairs, also to procure some new seats and to have the ground put in order.

    Note that Alington re-appointed. I believe that this may be W. Alington who had already performed a similar role in Burnham. At any rate, there was a definite connection between Rev Holland and the Alington family.

    Rev John Holland raw location data follows:

    * Wises’ Directory 1886: Kumara

    * Star , Issue 6077, 5 November 1887, Page 3: Rev John Holland at Saint Matthew’s

    * Star , Issue 6271, 22 June 1888, Page 3: Rev J. Holland at CHCH Cathedral

    * Press, Volume XLVI, Issue 7270, 28 March 1889, Page 6: Rev John Holland is hospital chaplain

    * Star , Issue 6527, 22 April 1889, Page 4: St John’s Rangiora
    * Star , Issue 6622, 13 August 1889, Page 3: Rev. Holland appointed “in charge” of Saint Paul’s Papanui “for next 18 months”
    * Press, Volume XLVI, Issue 7432, 26 December 1889, Page 4: Rev J Holland at Saint Paul’s Papanui

    * Ashburton Guardian, Volume XII, Issue 2412, 22 July 1891, Page 3: The Rev John Holland lectures this evening at St. Stephen’s Schoolroom [Ashburton] on his life m the East. Indies.
    * Star , Issue 7289, 8 October 1891, Page 3: Rev J Holland, All Saints Church, Methven

    * Wises’ Directory 1892-93: Rakaia
    * Electoral roll Selwyn 1893: Holland, John, Rakaia, Clerk in Holy Orders, residential

    * Electoral roll Selwyn 1896: as for 1893

    * Electoral roll Selwyn 1900: as for 1893

    Dunsandel • Since Nov 2006 • 1156 posts Report Reply

  • David Haywood,

    Connection between W.H. Wynn Williams (the solicitor who paid the £20 to Mrs E.A. Williams) and the Alington family.

    In July 1888, Wynn Williams was acting as solicitor to Herbert Alington (GH Alington's brother).

    Dunsandel • Since Nov 2006 • 1156 posts Report Reply

  • Lynley Chapman, in reply to Lynley Chapman,

    The 1893 Electoral Roll for Women is available on the website Findmypast.

    Amelia Mary Coleman is indexed but I don't have a subscription to the site so I cannot access the actual image. Sorry about that David.

    Someone else may have a sub and can help with a screen shot.

    Porirua • Since Aug 2011 • 45 posts Report Reply

  • David Haywood, in reply to Lynley Chapman,

    Thanks, Lynley! If all else fails, I believe the main library in CHCH has the roll available – so I can check when I next visit the ruins.

    Dunsandel • Since Nov 2006 • 1156 posts Report Reply

  • Nicky McCreanor, in reply to David Haywood,

    I can put you in touch with Bill - spoke to him relatively recently and I know where he is.

    Wellington NZ • Since May 2014 • 2 posts Report Reply

  • Lynley Chapman, in reply to David Haywood,

    Genealogy amongst the archeology then at Central Library?

    To further confound things. I have been back on my old laptop to run the Version 5 Index CD and lo from the 1893 E/R for NZ Women:

    Eliza Ann Webb Reg # 11721 19 Montreal St, Storekeeper

    Eliza Ann Webb Reg # 14663 19 Montreal St, Storekeeper

    Eliza Winter Reg # 3373 Riversleigh, Avonside, Domestic Duties

    Porirua • Since Aug 2011 • 45 posts Report Reply

  • David Haywood, in reply to Nicky McCreanor,

    I can put you in touch with Bill – spoke to him relatively recently and I know where he is.

    Thank you, Nicky -- much appreciated!

    Dunsandel • Since Nov 2006 • 1156 posts Report Reply

  • SteveH, in reply to Lynley Chapman,

    Eliza Ann Webb Reg # 11721 19 Montreal St, Storekeeper

    Eliza Ann Webb Reg # 14663 19 Montreal St, Storekeeper

    Eliza Winter Reg # 3373 Riversleigh, Avonside, Domestic Duties

    Eliza Ann Winter Reg # 12179 Caledonian Road, St Albans, Household Duties

    Obviously there is some potential for confusion with 3 women with similar names around at the same time, but I think #12179 is “our” E A Winter nee Webb. There are school records for her Winter children starting St Albans school in March 1892, though her address is listed as Crescent Rd:

    Cyril John Martin Winter, born 6 Feb 1883, admission 21 Mar 1892, last day 21 Sep 1896, last school Methven, parent/guardian E A Winter, Crescent Rd

    James Reginald Winter, born 24 Feb 1885, admission 21 Mar 1892, last day 24 Feb 1896, rest as above

    Vina Isabella Winter, born 22 Mar 1886, admission 15 Mar 1892, last day 28 Apr 1893, destination Methven (suspect this was mistakenly recorded as destination rather than last school), parent/guardian E A Winter, Crescent Rd

    Percy E Winter, born 18 Mar 1887, admission 15 Mar 1892, parent/guardian E A Winter, Crescent Rd (rest missing)

    Also found Bertie:

    Bertie Forster, Hasting Street School, born 22 Jan 1895, admission 4 Feb 1901, parent/guardian Mrs Forster, Hasting St

    EDIT: DH 20JUN14 -- Crescent Road is now Trafalgar Street; Deans Street (where Susan Webb lived in house #1 at one point) is now Purchas Street.

    Since Sep 2009 • 444 posts Report Reply

  • David Haywood, in reply to Lynley Chapman,

    Genealogy amongst the archeology then at Central Library?

    Depressingly, yes!

    And, heck, I wonder if I explained myself properly -- I can access the NZ electoral rolls, no problem (I mentioned Eliza Ann Webb of Montreal Street upthread), but I just couldn't find Amelia Mary Coleman in 1893.

    However -- good news -- I have just found Amelia tucked away in the 1893 supplementals (she must have registered late). She's in Webb Street just as you said.

    Dunsandel • Since Nov 2006 • 1156 posts Report Reply

  • Hebe, in reply to SteveH,

    Vina Isabella Winter – unusual name. Probably a contraction of her aunt Malvina’s name.

    Christchurch • Since May 2011 • 2899 posts Report Reply

  • David Haywood, in reply to SteveH,

    There are school records for her Winter children starting St Albans school in March 1892, though her address is listed as Crescent Rd:

    Hells bells, Steve, your fact-finding is positively superhuman! Bloody well done!

    I’ve also come to the same conclusion RE: Eliza Ann Winter, Caledonian Road, 1893, being the one we want – but via a different method.

    Wise’s Directory lists William Winter at Caledonian Road; but he’s not in the electoral rolls at all. So I conclude that Eliza is still using his name in Wises (there’s no other Winter on Caledonian Road) – in the same way that she is still using his surname at her children’s school (which makes sense from her perspective).

    I strongly suspect that keeping herself and her children all with the same surname is the reason for the ‘Winter’ in Eileen Winter Coleman’s name.

    If Eliza arrived Christchurch around March 1892 then the baby would be only a couple of months old. I wonder if the baby was in Christchurch or with Susan Webb (Eliza’s mother) in Methven? I also wonder what kind of ‘nurse’ Susan was – the Christchurch papers of the time seem to use the word ‘nurse’ for what we would refer to as a ‘nanny’ nowadays.

    Given that Caledonian Street was Eliza’s (and her mother’s) old neighbourhood, where presumably people were aware of Eliza’s abandonment, then I suspect the baby might be in Methven.

    Does that give us a path to adoption via, say, the orphanage (and/or Rev Holland) in Ashburton where the Colemans are perhaps living at this time? I feel that the timing of the £20 payment on December 21st 1892 might be significant – perhaps this is when Eliza agreed to adopt the baby to the Colemans, and they took possession in time for Christmas (with the adoption being arranged by Susan Webb, Alington, and Rev Holland).

    In July 1891, the Coleman’s are described as visiting Christchurch from Ashburton, so they may well still be in Ashburton during most of 1892.

    Then the Colemans move to Christchurch and discover that their adopted child’s mother lives only 800 m away.

    Dunsandel • Since Nov 2006 • 1156 posts Report Reply

  • SteveH, in reply to Hebe,

    Vina Isabella Winter – unusual name. Probably a contraction of her aunt Malvina’s name.

    Nice spotting, I'm sure that's it.

    Since Sep 2009 • 444 posts Report Reply

  • Lynley Chapman,

    I had a sniff around the NZSG Index Version 5 for Eliza Ann's children.

    Cyril John Martin Winter, born 1883, married Amy Charlotte EVERETT in 1913. He died in ChCh in 1943, Probate in ChCh Archives. Occupation: Tailor. He appears to have lived for many years at 6 Hendon St, St Albans.

    Amy died in Wellington in 1949 and is buried in Karori Cemetery.

    A surprise entry for CJM Winter was for Christs College School List 1850-1956, p 433. It might be that a son of his attended this college but the entry did make me blink!

    Edith Annie Winter, born 1884 - nothing on the CD about her.

    James Reginald Winter, born 1885. His WW1 record is on Archway but it appears that he saw little or no service. Occupation Boot Maker.
    He married Irene ANKINS in 1915. James died 1964 in ChCh

    Vina Isabella Winter born 1886. She married William HOBBS in 1912. She died 1965 and is buried in Waimari Cemetery.

    Percy Edward Winter, born 1887, died Invercargill 1927, Salesman

    Horace Clement Wilfred WEBB, born 1890. Died 1916 at the Somme, WW1, Buried in Armentieres, France. He enlisted in Whangarei. Recorded his mother Mrs E Webb, East Belt, ChCh as his NOK.

    Porirua • Since Aug 2011 • 45 posts Report Reply

  • David Haywood, in reply to Lynley Chapman,

    Horace Clement Wilfred WEBB, born 1890. Died 1916 at the Somme, WW1, Buried in Armentieres, France. He enlisted in Whangarei. Recorded his mother Mrs E Webb, East Belt, ChCh as his NOK.

    Very interesting! I believe I know where our Eliza Ann Winter/Kennard lived until 1914, and it was never in the East Belt.

    I feel a round of birth certificate ordering coming upon me – I’ll state here and now that I strongly suspect that our Eliza Ann Winter/Kennard had only one illegitimate child.

    In other news (from 1889): it turns out that Rev John Holland was once the chaplain of the "hospital, lunatic asylum, and other public charitable institutions in the neighbourhood of Christchurch" (this would have included orphanages). So he had a lot of contacts.

    I've been reading about Rev Holland for the last few hours -- and, by crikey, I like the sound of him!

    Dunsandel • Since Nov 2006 • 1156 posts Report Reply

  • David Haywood,

    Attachment

    From the inquiring mind of Lynley Chapman:

    Good morning David.

    I have just received small photos of George Coleman and Amelia Mary Coleman from a list member off NZ rootsweb - she contacted a distant cousin - no name offered sadly.

    Here they are – Amelia somewhat overpowered by a voluminous dress and parasol.

    Thanks
    Lynley

    And now I'm off to go cycling with my wee children...

    Dunsandel • Since Nov 2006 • 1156 posts Report Reply

  • David Haywood,

    From this entry in the THE CYCLOPEDIA OF NEW ZEALAND:

    THE REV. JOHN HOLLAND, Vicar of St. Bartholomew’s, was born in Lancashire. England, and was educated at St. Augustine’s College, Canterbury, Kent. He was ordained deacon in 1877, and priest in the following year, and became a missionary; as such he was stationed at Sarawak, North Borneo, for two years and a half, and at Singapore for a similar period. In 1881 Mr. Holland came to New Zealand, and was stationed at Kumara for nearly three years. He was subsequently for about five years chaplain to the public institutions in Christchurch. After being nine years at Rakaia, he became vicar at Kaiapoi in 1900.

    EDIT 02JUN14:Probably unrelated, but John Holland’s wife was known as ‘Eileen’ but her actual name was ‘Ellen’. See: Women and the Arts, p.55, 2nd to last paragraph.

    According to this family tree (in which the marriage certificate seems to have been sighted) John Holland married Ellen Wreaks on 18 February 1890, Papanui, Christchurch. From the same source: Holland was born 9 December 1850 in Worsley, Manchester, and died 26 September 1930; he is buried in the Barbadoes Street Cemetry.

    If this is correct, he would have been newly-ish married, and aged 42 (his wife was 36) when the Alington’s child was born. It is conceivably possible that he and his wife looked after the child until she was adopted by the Colemans (and hence the child’s adopted name of Eileen).

    I could find no children for Rev Holland and his wife on the BDM database.

    Dunsandel • Since Nov 2006 • 1156 posts Report Reply

  • Lynley Chapman, in reply to David Haywood,

    Thanks David! I have thanked the lister. My inquiring (!) mind woke me in the wee hours with the thought of baptism records as another avenue for details re parents.

    Enjoy your cycling with the small fry.

    Porirua • Since Aug 2011 • 45 posts Report Reply

  • Bodmin, in reply to Hilary Stace,

    I have a copy of "Karori & its people" and there are multiple references to Alington in the index , Alington Architects, Bill Alington, & Margeret Alington are all mentioned. Bill was a well respected architect who retired in 2000.

    Happy to copy details of references if they may help.

    John

    Auckland • Since May 2014 • 10 posts Report Reply

  • Hilary Stace, in reply to Bodmin,

    Thanks but I drive past Karori library several times a week so could easily stop there and look at the book myself. But does it mention any more about the Alington for whom Alington Road is named? Fanny Irvine-Smith (mentioned above) says he was an early school teacher. I wonder whether that Alington is linked to the Alington in the title of this post and Bill who must be his descendant (grandson? or close relative) because they are both Hildebrand Alington.

    Wgtn • Since Jun 2008 • 3229 posts Report Reply

  • David Haywood,

    I’ve just had a big spend-up at BDM – hopefully this should provide the information (names, dates, signatures, handwriting, etc.) to nail down all the loose ends.

    I’ll post the BDM results here as they come to hand (eight days, according to BDM).

    I’m also going to write a post that will entertainingly (I hope) summarize the results of all the hard work that’s be done by the people commenting here.

    * Birth printout – Webb, Berty Alfred Forster – 1895/2583
    * Birth printout – Webb, Hilda Annie – 1892/3429
    * Birth printout – Webb, Horace Clement Wilfred – 1890/18287
    * Marriage printout – Webb, Eliza Ann – Winter, William – 1882/35
    * Marriage printout – Winter, Eliza Ann – Kennard, Frederick – 1898/3379

    Dunsandel • Since Nov 2006 • 1156 posts Report Reply

  • David Haywood,

    Oh, and see update to this post:

    Dunsandel • Since Nov 2006 • 1156 posts Report Reply

  • SteveH, in reply to David Haywood,

    I’ll post the BDM results here as they come to hand (eight days, according to BDM).

    Not arrived yet? I'm getting impatient.

    Since Sep 2009 • 444 posts Report Reply

  • David Haywood, in reply to SteveH,

    Now arrived! Will post later tonight. I can promise a surprise (well, not much of a surprise to me, but a surprise to some...)

    Dunsandel • Since Nov 2006 • 1156 posts Report Reply

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