Hard News by Russell Brown

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Hard News: The sole party of government

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  • mark taslov, in reply to Sofie Bribiesca,

    Maori feel that everyday. Indian and Asian would certainly get attitude more than say South African and American or English.

    I get it here, I’m sure Chris must too, it’s easy to dismiss as benign but its deepset, and ok, fair enough, education in China is skewed, there is no recent history of broad and identifiable - indigenous or otherwise = multiculturalism, but in New Zealand, anyone who considers themselves of any moral standing resorting to any of this recent “The German”, “Foreign Politcal Types” bullshit might as well be throwing books on the bonfire.

    Te Ika-a-Māui • Since Mar 2008 • 2281 posts Report Reply

  • Sofie Bribiesca, in reply to mark taslov,

    but in New Zealand, anyone who considers themselves of any moral standing resorting to any of this recent “The German”, “Foreign Politcal Types” bullshit might as well be throwing books on the bonfire.

    Hear! Hear!

    here and there. • Since Nov 2007 • 6796 posts Report Reply

  • JonathanM, in reply to David Hood,

    David: In case it's useful, that data in CSV for party + electorate vote is here:

    party and electorate vote 2011 and 2014

    Parent folder has the R scripts.

    Since Jul 2012 • 64 posts Report Reply

  • Farmer Green, in reply to mark taslov,

    none of you standing idly by have ever spent time in the cells, never been commanded to remove your laces or turn out your pockets,

    You'd be wrong there. Being strip -searched leaves a real lasting impression, especially when there's about 20 of them and they're BIG pigs.

    Lower North Island • Since Nov 2012 • 776 posts Report Reply

  • mark taslov, in reply to Sofie Bribiesca,

    …ah but the numbers humble voter, ’tis the numbers and the data and the polling and the splitting and the contrast, and the pie graphs and the bar charts and the whimsy swinging factions that shunted civil liberty whimpering down the corridor to the stinking chamber.

    You’d be wrong there. Being strip -searched leaves a real lasting impression, especially when there’s about 20 of them and they’re BIG pigs.

    So I’d be right:

    next to none of you standing idly by have ever spent time in the cells, never been commanded to remove your laces or turn out your pockets,

    And so you know, and yet you feed the machine with your no way back now you drive its motion with your warnings for those not yet tarred and varnished.

    Immunised to risk your corpse -weakly quivering – pleads with those who may love our country more. As if you have some kind of moral mandate. Just throw another log on the fire farmer green, wouldn’t want you to catch a chill.

    Te Ika-a-Māui • Since Mar 2008 • 2281 posts Report Reply

  • Farmer Green, in reply to mark taslov,

    r no way back now.

    Mark you know as well as I do that there is a way.( Rick just happens to be one of my mates from back then, and I like the song.)

    But you’re not going to paint a friggin’ target on your forehead . Are you?
    We’re talking about the present pathway, right? No way back on that path.
    It's funny , but it was my Dad , 50 years ago who gave me the news; he'd seen one of his mates , innocent , taken down , and he thought that I should know.

    Lower North Island • Since Nov 2012 • 776 posts Report Reply

  • mark taslov, in reply to Farmer Green,

    But you’re not going to paint a friggin’ target on your forehead . Are you?
    We’re talking about the present pathway, right? No way back on that path.

    When targets come this cheap, call me the dartboard. Along with all our other immigrants. As is your right, you can stay silent or you can malign the cause of those who speak up. I hoped you’d like that song, fitting.

    Te Ika-a-Māui • Since Mar 2008 • 2281 posts Report Reply

  • Farmer Green, in reply to mark taslov,

    I like that shande fur de goyim schtick you got going there. When was it now . . . towards the end of the second millenium?

    Lower North Island • Since Nov 2012 • 776 posts Report Reply

  • mark taslov, in reply to Farmer Green,

    Since the treaty, more or less. Don’t get me wrong Farmer Green, I’ve nothing against having a bit of a how do you do with the ruling class, but now like the rest of the lefties who swung right you’re just another apologist, rewards reaped for your apology. So go on, mate, enjoy the $$ and:

    Te Ika-a-Māui • Since Mar 2008 • 2281 posts Report Reply

  • Farmer Green, in reply to mark taslov,

    rewards reaped for your apology.

    Fair enough. It seems far more accidental to me. There was every reason for me to fail- scrambled out of a mortgagee sale in the ’87 crash ; got back on the horse in a public tender in the 90s. It’s just the way the cookie crumbled.
    But yeh . . . I’ll take it.
    Actually thinking back . . . my luckiest break was being shown the door by the collectivists at Fonterra.
    Things like that help to clear the mind of theory ; reality is so cleansing.

    Lower North Island • Since Nov 2012 • 776 posts Report Reply

  • Joe Wylie, in reply to Farmer Green,

    flat earth • Since Jan 2007 • 4593 posts Report Reply

  • mark taslov, in reply to Farmer Green,

    But yeh . . . I’ll take it

    And in all fairness to you Farmer Green, you have made it your life’s work to contribute in a tangible way to these other pressing issues our planet faces, unlike countless others who couldn’t give an actual fuck about democracy or civil liberties and who without much ado besides a little faint-hearted bleating about these votes, these golden figures, iffy rolls, sheepish turnouts and magic numbers crunched, prattle on:

    Te Ika-a-Māui • Since Mar 2008 • 2281 posts Report Reply

  • David Hood,

    thanks for that Jonathan. I've been hunting figures for the number on the rolls in 2011 this evening for figuring turnout(elections.org only has the current roll). In the end I went to the wayback machine and got the figures "approximate" to the election.

    Dunedin • Since May 2007 • 1445 posts Report Reply

  • Farmer Green, in reply to Joe Wylie,

    You were there too?

    Lower North Island • Since Nov 2012 • 776 posts Report Reply

  • Joe Wylie, in reply to Farmer Green,

    You were there too?

    The 1960s? Yep.

    flat earth • Since Jan 2007 • 4593 posts Report Reply

  • Farmer Green, in reply to mark taslov,

    to contribute in a tangible way to these other pressing issues our planet faces,

    I had a choice . The way of the bard was open - but . . . . what to say?
    A good enough reason to get some dirt under one's nails, and one does get to eat -eventually.

    Lower North Island • Since Nov 2012 • 776 posts Report Reply

  • Kumara Republic, in reply to Chris Waugh,

    Not strictly relevant, but racism and xenophobia are an issue.

    And from a serving cop, no less, who you'd expect to maintain the law instead of breaking it.

    The southernmost capital … • Since Nov 2006 • 5429 posts Report Reply

  • Sofie Bribiesca, in reply to Kumara Republic,

    And from a serving cop, no less, who you’d expect to maintain the law instead of breaking it.

    They can be the worst.

    here and there. • Since Nov 2007 • 6796 posts Report Reply

  • mark taslov, in reply to Kumara Republic,

    you’d expect to maintain the law instead of breaking it.

    Maybe, as a defensible New Zealand ‘moderate’ she just thought the guy was a Foreign Prick.

    Te Ika-a-Māui • Since Mar 2008 • 2281 posts Report Reply

  • Ian Dalziel, in reply to Farmer Green,

    may the siècle be unbroken...

    ...towards the end of the second millenium

    but the end of 'millennium' is double 'enned', innit?

    There's the real Y2K bug!
    it still bugs me...

    ;- )

    Christchurch • Since Dec 2006 • 7943 posts Report Reply

  • David Hood,

    Adjusting for the number of people on the roll (so as a proportion of the available electors rather than just raw numbers)

    Electorates where National's vote went up:
    "Hutt South" "Port Hills"

    Electorates where Labour's vote went up:
    ...

    Electorates where Green's vote went up:
    "Helensville" "Mt Albert" "Mt Roskill"

    Electorates where NZ First's vote went up:
    "Auckland Central" "Bay of Plenty" "Botany" "Christchurch Central"
    "Christchurch East" "Clutha-Southland" "Coromandel" "Dunedin North"
    "Dunedin South" "East Coast" "East Coast Bays" "Epsom"
    "Hamilton East" "Hamilton West" "Helensville" "Hunua"
    "Hutt South" "Ilam" "Invercargill" "Kaikōura"
    "Mana" "Māngere" "Manukau East" "Manurewa"
    "Maungakiekie" "Napier" "Nelson" "New Lynn"
    "New Plymouth" "North Shore" "Northcote" "Northland"
    "Ōtaki" "Pakuranga" "Palmerston North" "Papakura"
    "Port Hills" "Rangitata" "Rangitīkei" "Rimutaka"
    "Rodney" "Rongotai" "Rotorua" "Selwyn"
    "Tāmaki" "Taranaki-King Country" "Taupō" "Te Atatū"
    "Tukituki" "Waikato" "Waimakariri" "Wairarapa"
    "Waitaki" "Wellington Central" "West Coast-Tasman" "Whanganui"
    "Whangarei" "Wigram"

    Dunedin • Since May 2007 • 1445 posts Report Reply

  • mark taslov,

    ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

    Te Ika-a-Māui • Since Mar 2008 • 2281 posts Report Reply

  • Steve Parks, in reply to mark taslov,

    What’s your take on why they lost it Steve, or why they didn’t win?

    Well that’s a big question, I think Jack got it about right back on page 7:

    The tax cuts they did were financed on our nations credit card. The modest tax hikes suggested are needed to cover our needed spending and because the original tax cuts are a drain on our economy. Cutting taxes in a recession for your core base is good politics, but fucking disastrous for our national accounts.

    I don’t think this issue won them office in 2014. They won because they simplified the choice, socialist p.c nutters versus nice John. How they simplified it that way is a topic for much discussion.

    There’ll be variations on epithets for the Left: socialist p.c. nutters to some, disorganised rabble to others, and for others it will be that they just don’t trust that smarmy guy who sometimes says some odd shit and many in his party don’t like.

    And Dotcom, of course.

    And I say this one with hindsight: the timing of the release of Hager’s book (should have been earlier).

    All of that kind of thing was on one side. On the other: John Key. Perceived by many a centrist ‘swing’ voter as: nice, or competent, or down to earth, or moderate (he’s kept National from becoming too right wing, I have been told by a traditional Labour voter, so he doesn’t need to vote Labour at this stage and risk those Greens coming in and ruining the economy*).

    So basically, many many people like or even love certain things about the left parties – certain policy ideas, or even a particular party. But the overall framing is that with the left you can’t get the good without the bad. The left lot have no John Key to keep us all safe from the excesses. So they look back to the right and see actual John Key and a government who they perceive has run a country kinda-sorta-pretty okayish despite some bad luck (earthquakes, world economic downturn) and as Craig suggested earlier, they get all small c conservative and vote for consistency.

    And all the hullabaloo around dirty politics and spying and whatnot so close to an election just reinforced that they should vote positive. And vote positive, for many many people, was a vote to the nice, moderate, down to earth relaxed guy who has it all under control.

    I also thought this commentary by the International Socialist Organisation was very useful.

    http://iso.org.nz/2014/09/22/lessons-to-learn-from-bitter-defeat/#more-2220

    (Although apparently Danyl McLauchlan thinks that giving this consideration is part of the problem.)

    And this from Nandor.

    http://nandor.co.nz/2014/09/22/election-2014-the-aftermath/

    * That anecdote is just one example of the problems he left faced. Traditional Labour voter with utterly irrational fears that the Greens just aren't a credible governing party, because ... printing money, or socialism, or something. To him, the Green Party are a niche party that doesn't get to seriously share power. That's just one attack line that's been used against the Greens, and supported to a degree by the systematic bias of the media. The absurdity of it is that the Grens are barely more left than Labour.

    Wellington • Since May 2007 • 1164 posts Report Reply

  • Steve Parks,

    *problems the left faced. Edit window ran out.

    Wellington • Since May 2007 • 1164 posts Report Reply

  • mark taslov,

    Thanks Steve, that was very thorough, and for the links, both good reads, that Nandor’s always rung my bell.

    Te Ika-a-Māui • Since Mar 2008 • 2281 posts Report Reply

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