Hard News by Russell Brown

Read Post

Hard News: The sole party of government

651 Responses

First ←Older Page 1 4 5 6 7 8 27 Newer→ Last

  • BenWilson, in reply to tussock,

    Yeah who knows. But massive majorities were not uncommon at all.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 10650 posts Report Reply

  • mark taslov, in reply to Jack Harrison,

    apparently committed, mainly a list inspired by simple right wing pundits who love to say “p.c” a lot

    Well now they've got one they can pin on National.

    Te Ika-a-Māui • Since Mar 2008 • 2281 posts Report Reply

  • BenWilson, in reply to mark taslov,

    Well now they’ve got one they can pin on National.

    Ah, but don't forget that Labour also voted for it.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 10650 posts Report Reply

  • mark taslov, in reply to BenWilson,

    Yeah, most of them. Sorry, the context was bills submitted by non-Labour members becoming indelibly associated with the Labour Party, just slipping it across the floor. If there's anything to take the edge off this election result it's the vanilla centrality of successive New Zealand Governments.

    Te Ika-a-Māui • Since Mar 2008 • 2281 posts Report Reply

  • tussock, in reply to steven crawford,

    And it was passed by parliament with conscience votes.

    No it wasn't. Both Labour and National whipped the final vote. 113 to 7.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crimes_%28Substituted_Section_59%29_Amendment_Act_2007

    It also destroyed United Future as a political entity, by the by. Big changes around that thing, and still a massive amount of misinformation.

    Edit: SNAP.

    Since Nov 2006 • 609 posts Report Reply

  • Jack Harrison, in reply to Chris Waugh,

    Sure, but high p.r profile such as twitter is a big vehicle for them because they are members of a huge historic "state sponsored" national sport that dwarfs all other sporting cultures. It should be free of this.

    As individuals yap away.

    wellington • Since Aug 2014 • 296 posts Report Reply

  • Pete,

    I haven't seen a mention of it but some people I spoke to mentioned the Capital Gains Tax proposal as a reason to not vote Labour

    Turkeys and Thanksgiving..

    Since Apr 2008 • 106 posts Report Reply

  • Amanda Wreckonwith, in reply to Jack Harrison,

    They could also start to take A hardline attitude to media bias,,as the Democrats did in the U.S. Pointing out commentators who are clearly cheering p.r instruments of the New Zealand National Party,

    Doubt who in NZ has the balls to do it. Looks like whining when coming from politicians.
    Similarly with the 'think tank' situation - these organisations are not independent so don't report them as if they are.

    I still can't understand why people don't call bias, spin and deceit when they see it. It was nice to see David Slack at least make an attempt on the Panel recently. But why did we have to wait so long? Why does no one call out the other crazies like Denise The Strange Orbit or Jock Anderson? This program leads into the the major news broadcast in the country. It is too important to let cozy Jim get away with his schtick.
    I know NZ is a small country but the 'mateyness' of our media is tiresome.

    Since Sep 2012 • 171 posts Report Reply

  • Katharine Moody,

    Labour's loss last night wasn't as big as National's loss in 2002.

    Labour seats, 2014 = 32 (24.69%)
    National seats, 2002 = 27 (20.93%)

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Zealand_general_election,_2002

    Wellington • Since Sep 2014 • 798 posts Report Reply

  • mark taslov, in reply to Pete,

    That’s definitely my take on it. Ian has some corroboration.

    Te Ika-a-Māui • Since Mar 2008 • 2281 posts Report Reply

  • Russell Brown, in reply to Marion Ogier,

    You hit the nail on the head. I’ve heard lots of positive things about how good a local MP Ruth Dyson has been. People vote for a good hardworking local MP, then consider which party they feel offers leadership to the country. Labour just didn’t front with a team people could believe offered leadership.

    Harkanwal Singh's excellent interactive for the Herald tells the story. Even where people clearly wanted their Labour candidate back in Parliament, they did not back Labour. I read earlier that Labour only won the party vote in five electorates. I'm not sure that's true, but it feels it.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 22807 posts Report Reply

  • Russell Brown, in reply to BenWilson,

    Now we’ve got the left being held responsible because it turns out that our government is quite corrupt and that it deliberately set out to spy on us, and feeds a lot of secret attack lines to a guy who churns even right wing stomachs. These are features, not bugs. Initially undocumented.

    And I make no apology for caring about all of that. It concerns me, deeply.

    I get that in large part these are "beltway issues" but I think what has been discovered is troubling and needs setting right. The overwhelming nature of the victory unfortunately makes that less likely.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 22807 posts Report Reply

  • Chris Waugh, in reply to BenWilson,

    Internet/Mana [.......]. Labour just killed them stone dead.

    Bit early to be making that call, perhaps? Internet seemed to have some good ideas and some talent, but perhaps need to reorganise without Dotcom. Mana seems a bit more solid, and I couldn't shake the feeling that what happened in Te Tai Tokerau was the Establishment ganging up to get rid of the upstart Little People. But perhaps if Mana could go underground and rebuild for the next 3 years, they might have a base from which to stage a comeback next time?

    Wellington • Since Jan 2007 • 2401 posts Report Reply

  • Jack Harrison, in reply to Russell Brown,

    Nationals winning margins were huge, two ticks everywhere. Labour needs to scream “party vote” next time.

    Also Cunliffe profiled badly in our media. Folk didn’t warm to him. This does need to be investigated but not today.

    Cunliffe should just say “get real” to anyone who thinks the Labour Party are in a position to reflect purposefully less than 24 hours after the result. These “resign” stories are a beat up and are an example of a headline driven media.

    wellington • Since Aug 2014 • 296 posts Report Reply

  • Matthew Poole,

    The Herald's electorate boundary tool. It's the proposed boundaries not the final ones, but very few actually changed markedly from the proposal.

    Auckland • Since Mar 2007 • 4097 posts Report Reply

  • Katharine Moody, in reply to Russell Brown,

    And I make no apology for caring about all of that. It concerns me, deeply.

    Winston Peters is going to make bringing those responsible for Dirty Politics to account as his legacy, I believe. As he said in one interview - why would Key call him .. unless, that is, he wanted to silence him. And he then stated he wouldn't sell out anyway.

    He's a man on a mission - no one more up to it, either. He'll get his man :-)!

    Wellington • Since Sep 2014 • 798 posts Report Reply

  • Amanda Wreckonwith, in reply to Chris Waugh,

    Hone took a massive gamble with KDC. It didn't pay off.
    Unless Kelvin Davis stuffs up in TTT then Hone is finished as far as I can see - he can't really move to another Maori seat as he doesn't have the family ties. People who I know that supported him in the past have lost their trust. Quite sad really.

    Since Sep 2012 • 171 posts Report Reply

  • BenWilson, in reply to Chris Waugh,

    Bit early to be making that call, perhaps?

    I hope so, but being completely wiped from political power is a very heavy blow. It’s the kind of blow we all wish on ACT, but National will never deliver, even when they are supposedly in this awesome position. Which does make you wonder whether they themselves really believe that they’re in that position. I didn’t get a sense of it from any of the interviews of their leaders apart from Key* last night. They need Dunne and whatever the latest ACT guy who hasn’t yet got busted is called, otherwise they’ve got a 1 seat majority without NZF.

    *And with Key I simply can't tell what's going on in his head. The words change, but the face and tone stays the same. I can fully imagine him elaborating on a plan to get rid of ACC with the same folksy managerial tone that he'd use to describe getting rid of an unused old coffee machine in the kitchen.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 10650 posts Report Reply

  • simon g, in reply to Jack Harrison,

    Yes, Labour only need to learn one lesson at this stage. The rest can wait.

    Lesson being ... immediate post-election resignations didn't work in 2008 or 2011. Leave Cunliffe in place while the party has an honest and far-reaching inquest (I'm not confident that they can, but I know they should).

    If Labour MPs had spent the last 6 years at the beach, the party vote wouldn't have been any worse. Take a long break from Gower-itis ("I want answers and I want them now! Gimme the drug!"), start again in 2015, after the summer.

    I have my doubts about Cunliffe's ability to be a caretaker while the bigger, deeper issues are addressed, but if he cares for his party and people, that's what should do.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 1328 posts Report Reply

  • Jack Harrison, in reply to Katharine Moody,

    The opposition has a lot of ammo, if aimed correctly, who knows.

    wellington • Since Aug 2014 • 296 posts Report Reply

  • Farmer Green, in reply to mark taslov,

    Democracy isn’t about imposing ideas, it’s about listening to and reflecting the will of the people. To find the answer as to why the left lost, much can be learned from how the right won.

    Wow! Somebody said it.
    A lot of talk here about tactics ; very little about policy.

    Did anyone notice that National was NOT promising tax cuts?

    O.K. I don't belong here , obviously, so anything I might say is coming from the wrong side of the fence to be taken seriously, but Labour and the Greens were both promising big tax hikes.

    Non-negotiable policy? It sure looked like it.
    Oh well, only turkeys vote for Xmas.

    Lower North Island • Since Nov 2012 • 776 posts Report Reply

  • Katharine Moody, in reply to Chris Waugh,

    Bit early to be making that call, perhaps? Internet seemed to have some good ideas and some talent, but perhaps need to reorganise without Dotcom. Mana seems a bit more solid, and I couldn’t shake the feeling that what happened in Te Tai Tokerau was the Establishment ganging up to get rid of the upstart Little People. But perhaps if Mana could go underground and rebuild for the next 3 years, they might have a base from which to stage a comeback next time?

    I'm hoping against hope they stay Internet Mana. Laila and Hone are great together as is evidence so brilliantly in this Herald interview;

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11308342

    And I'm also hoping that Dotcom's legal team keep him in NZ and he stays with IMP in that visionary role. We have an internet-age Einstein on our shores here. I hope we can benefit from him building one tech company after another, based in NZ and wildly successful worldwide.

    Wellington • Since Sep 2014 • 798 posts Report Reply

  • Farmer Green, in reply to Amanda Wreckonwith,

    I'm hopeful that Hone will get over his lover's quarrel with the Maori Party ; are they really so far apart?

    Lower North Island • Since Nov 2012 • 776 posts Report Reply

  • Jack Harrison, in reply to simon g,

    Cunliffe needs to address his warmth factor and labour need to reflect on the possibility of a warmer, more media savvy leader.

    D.C can state that he indeed did look Prime Ministerial at times and that Dirty Politics over shadowed his "month in the electoral sun." It's a tough one. Reflection needs to be done in a sensible adult like fashion.

    wellington • Since Aug 2014 • 296 posts Report Reply

  • simon g, in reply to Farmer Green,

    By your analysis, parties should not promise to move on superannuation, or property bubbles, or environmental protection, or anything that might need to be addressed.

    Were you a big fan of Muldoon's economic management?

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 1328 posts Report Reply

First ←Older Page 1 4 5 6 7 8 27 Newer→ Last

Post your response…

Please sign in using your Public Address credentials…

Login

You may also create an account or retrieve your password.