Hard News by Russell Brown

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Hard News: Paying for what doesn't come free any more

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  • Yamis,

    I was thinking a bit a while back about whether there will ever be something similar to MYSKY developed for radio.

    I realise that some radio stations have 'listen back' options at their websites but I'm thinking more of a 'radio box' where you could set it to record particular shows on particular stations to listen back to at your leisure later on.

    As an example I listen to Radio Sport A LOT but there are some hosts I can't stand and some I enjoy and find entertaining, but basically if you miss their show then it's gone for good. Ya missed it.

    Also there are commentaries of matches that you might like to listen to later as though they are live (especially if you haven't heard the result). That's what I do with most sport on TV.

    Radio Sport now has live English Premier League games on each weekend from midnight until 6am and that's something people could record and listen to when they wake up perhaps.

    I wouldn't expect it to be anywhere near as big as the TV equivalent but there's no reason why there couldn't be particular radio stations that sign up to it and are available and some sort of annual or monthly subscription with the money being shared out.

    Anyway, just some ideal futuristic thinking :)

    Since Nov 2006 • 903 posts Report Reply

  • Sacha, in reply to Yamis,

    you could set it to record particular shows on particular stations to listen back to at your leisure later on

    isn't that basically podcasting?

    Ak • Since May 2008 • 19745 posts Report Reply

  • Kumara Republic,

    Surprise, surprise. The trolls start crawling out of the woodwork before it's even begun. Tempted, but not about to give him any oxygen.

    The southernmost capital … • Since Nov 2006 • 5445 posts Report Reply

  • Rich of Observationz, in reply to Yamis,

    It wouldn't be hard to code. Trouble is, they might send you to jail for it.

    Back in Wellington • Since Nov 2006 • 5550 posts Report Reply

  • BenWilson, in reply to Yamis,

    I'm pretty sure there are multiple programs available on Android that do this with internet radio stations. As Rich says, coding it wouldn't be hard at all, I would probably be able to get something functional in a week. I don't recall if they do it for all broadcasts, or just some subset with which they have arrangements, but the ones I looked at claimed to be able to do it for thousands of stations.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 10657 posts Report Reply

  • Richard Aston,

    Bloody good project Russell and I for one would be glad to subscribe at around $100/yr , shit I spend more on coffee.
    I moan about the lack of quality journalism these days so I'd be more than happy to be part of doing something about that.

    Northland • Since Nov 2006 • 510 posts Report Reply

  • Rob Stowell, in reply to Richard Aston,

    I definitely want to support this. PAS is a great place for journalism.org to find subscribers- or advertise stories. Something like this has been bruited for too long- fantastic to find a project is underway.
    (FWIW- I think both micropayments and an annual subscription should be offered. They suit different people, budgets, and styles.)

    Whakaraupo • Since Nov 2006 • 2110 posts Report Reply

  • Russell Brown, in reply to Yamis,

    I was thinking a bit a while back about whether there will ever be something similar to MYSKY developed for radio.

    To an extent, there is already something just like that. It’s called … MySky.

    Sky carries the two Radio NZ stations, Kiwi and Tahu FM. You can record them, although they make you do it manually.

    Freeview carries the Radio NZ stations and Base FM and recording looks easier on our Freeview PVR.

    But yeah, there isn’t a comprehensive solution and if there was one, Rianz would probably have a panic attack about “stream-ripping” or something.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 22850 posts Report Reply

  • Russell Brown, in reply to BenWilson,

    I’m pretty sure there are multiple programs available on Android that do this with internet radio stations.

    Stream-ripping. I think I'd object to this on the basis that it would serve to validate the copyright owners' perpetual belief that people actually bother doing this :-)

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 22850 posts Report Reply

  • linger, in reply to Tom Semmens,

    Give away the news and sell the analysis?

    Only works if readers believe that the analysis is useful … which, sadly, runs headlong into confirmation bias (i.e., people find it easiest to believe analysis that conforms to their existing opinions). Stripping (uninformed) opinion away to leave facts presented without bias is a large part of the “value added” by reputable news sources. (Not sure how much of NZ’s MSM still counts as “reputable” by this measure.)

    Also, if there's any "public good" argument to be made at all, doesn't that imply providing the widest possible access to a full understanding of an issue?

    Tokyo • Since Apr 2007 • 1944 posts Report Reply

  • Rich of Observationz,

    Stripping (uninformed) opinion away to leave facts presented without bias is a large part of the “value added” by reputable news sources

    It's also impossible. Any selection of presented facts will be biased, through the selection of those facts, the tone of the presentation, the choice of voices, etc.

    This needn't be conscious. The day to day beat reporting of most NZ media doesn't overtly *aim* to portray a lawless society under siege from criminal brown people - that's just the effect they achieve.

    My morning radio (Active FM) has recently begun to deliver a counter-narrative, simply by leading the news with a number of world stories before any domestic coverage.

    It's all bias.

    Back in Wellington • Since Nov 2006 • 5550 posts Report Reply

  • James W,

    Give away the news and sell the analysis? Thus, read for free the bare bones news about the Kiwi deaths in Afghanistan, pay to read the in-depth story and analysis by xyz.

    Yeah, this is the only way it can work, because a hundred sites will carry the same news story. It's the analysis by writers you like and trust you (presumably) pay for.

    Presentation is important. It's like, The AV Club's Newswire features pop culture news you could find on any number of sites, but it's Sean O'Neal's snarky tone that makes me come back to read it everyday. I'd pay for that.

    Have you heard of MATTER, Russell? I contributed to the Kickstarter. In their words:

    MATTER will focus on doing one thing, and doing it exceptionally well. Every week, we will publish a single piece of top-tier long-form journalism about big issues in technology and science. That means no cheap reviews, no snarky opinion pieces, no top ten lists. Just one unmissable story.

    They are aiming to charge 99c per story – see here for more info.

    Since Jul 2008 • 136 posts Report Reply

  • Yamis, in reply to Russell Brown,

    I sort of meant a portable device. A radio that you can cart around with you that can pick up stations and then be programmed to record them or whatever. It obviously wouldn't be cheap (at first anyway). And no, I don't mean one with a bloody tape deck in it to record on to. I mean something more sophisticated :)

    Including car radio's that do the same.

    I'd quite like to be able to get in my car for the drive home at the end of the day and be able to listen to some of a show from earlier in the day, or a commentary that I'd missed, or an interview...

    At the moment you're just at the mercy of whoever is on, or whatever ads are playing, over and over ... and they are basically all to do with penis's on radio sport (directly or indirectly).

    I don't imagine there's much demand for it now but I see it as being something that might well be developed over the next decade or two.

    Since Nov 2006 • 903 posts Report Reply

  • BenWilson, in reply to Yamis,

    I sort of meant a portable device. A radio that you can cart around with you that can pick up stations and then be programmed to record them or whatever. It obviously wouldn't be cheap (at first anyway). And no, I don't mean one with a bloody tape deck in it to record on to. I mean something more sophisticated :)

    Smartphones already do this. All of it. They pick up not only FM radio, but can stream internet radio, and there are apps to capture both kinds of streams. But once you're on the net on your smartphone, you will quickly see why this idea that seems brilliant is now almost anachronistic. To have to muck around pre-recording things when you can search the entire internet full of downloads and streams of stuff that's already in good nick doesn't really appeal. It's been done, but it's a small niche market.

    I use mine in the car, btw, with a simple input cable. 32GB microSD card full of music etc, and the internet for everything else. My phone is worth about $400 now.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 10657 posts Report Reply

  • Russell Brown, in reply to Yamis,

    I sort of meant a portable device. A radio that you can cart around with you that can pick up stations and then be programmed to record them or whatever. It obviously wouldn’t be cheap (at first anyway). And no, I don’t mean one with a bloody tape deck in it to record on to. I mean something more sophisticated :)

    Those things totally exist in the DAB world. But it seems that not much has happened with DAB in New Zealand in the last 18 months.

    Imagine how useful DAB instant rewind would be for Morning Report or to catch the names of artists on music radio. Sigh.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 22850 posts Report Reply

  • Rich of Observationz, in reply to BenWilson,

    And cellular data is almost reaching the pricing where it's affordable to use a smartphone for all-day radio listening over 3G. Except of course, when one's roadtrip goes outside the coverage area.

    Back in Wellington • Since Nov 2006 • 5550 posts Report Reply

  • BenWilson, in reply to Rich of Observationz,

    Except of course, when one's roadtrip goes outside the coverage area.

    Which also applies to FM. I don't think I've ever managed to hear BaseFM without the internet yet.

    But yes, on road trips, I might have to resort to the 600 hours worth of music on my SD card. The humanity!

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 10657 posts Report Reply

  • Yamis, in reply to Russell Brown,

    Those things totally exist in the DAB world. But it seems that not much has happened with DAB in New Zealand in the last 18 months.
    Imagine how useful DAB instant rewind would be for Morning Report or to catch the names of artists on music radio. Sigh.

    Next you'll be telling me they've actually already invented stuff that grills sliced bread!! pfffft.

    Out of interest (because I will never be able to afford one) what are modern cars doing in terms of factory radios?? Any chance that this sort of technology will become the norm in new vehicles?

    Since Nov 2006 • 903 posts Report Reply

  • Jeremy Eade,

    The most successful financial job I ever had was selling media advertising. You have to twist some arms to hit target but target was good. The problem was the ROI on advertising, it was easy measure for most small business, very little immediate return. Business is built on so much more than a slick ad. That's hurting media revenue as much as online.That's reality.

    auckland • Since Mar 2008 • 1112 posts Report Reply

  • Kyle Matthews,

    I am curious to know if anyone has ever tried a sort of trademe model – you deposit an amount of money and everytime you access “below the fold” for indepth news and analysis a deduction is made. Once your account has run out of money your attempt to access or comment takes you to the payment screen.

    That would seem to be the logical way for it to work - a wee add-on to your browser which pops up and confirms that you want to pay 25 cents to read this article.

    Since Nov 2006 • 6243 posts Report Reply

  • Russell Brown, in reply to Kyle Matthews,

    That would seem to be the logical way for it to work – a wee add-on to your browser which pops up and confirms that you want to pay 25 cents to read this article.

    That's basically how Flattr works -- except with Flattr you allocate some of your monthly account after reading or watching something you like.

    It's just a shame that Flattr is almost unusable for most people.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 22850 posts Report Reply

  • Sacha, in reply to Yamis,

    what are modern cars doing in terms of factory radios?

    Moving towards having a decent amp and speakers and relying on you to plug your own mobile device into them as a controller?

    Ak • Since May 2008 • 19745 posts Report Reply

  • Sacha, in reply to Jeremy Eade,

    The problem was the ROI on advertising

    Yes despite online's better measurability, so little ad spend is going there in NZ. Media agencies seem to be wedded to the old even though they can't show it works.

    Ak • Since May 2008 • 19745 posts Report Reply

  • David Hood, in reply to Sacha,

    Media agencies seem to be wedded to the old even though they can’t show it works.

    To be honest, I assumed they were wedded to it because no-one can show it doesn't work.

    Dunedin • Since May 2007 • 1445 posts Report Reply

  • Kumara Republic,

    Yet another Big Tobacco press release dressed up as a Roughan special. And yet another reason for Journalism.org.nz to call bullshit.

    The southernmost capital … • Since Nov 2006 • 5445 posts Report Reply

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