The union is not for the workers - the union IS the workers. If the members (i.e. you, Andrew Geddis, in this particular discussion) are not happy with the way their union is run, it is up to them to put their shoulder to the wheel and be the change, instead of waiting for someone else to do it for them.
That is just a massive fairy story - Union structures and their hierarchy are virtually impregnable – they are the lid on the box that contains the aspiration of working people (to earn a living wage) and that lid is kept firmly in place with the chains of employment legislation.
I don’t need one and I’m not Maori but I certainly feel comfortable having Unions represent the people.
There's no problems with them representing their members - that's what I expect my union to do.
Why some of them get to be the deciding vote in choosing a future Prime Minister however I have no idea.
and to select a deputy from such as Jacinda, Grant, or Nash.
Might be a bit of a PR issue with Nash....http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/63403143/MP-in-the-firing-line-as-parkers-see-red
He would be well advised to flick the engine....maybe when he's big enough???
I expect him to have the qualities needed to convince Palmer to stay on in finance, to draw Robertson close on the front bench, and to select a deputy from such as Jacinda, Grant, or Nash.
I assume you mean Parker in finance. If those all bagging Little actually took time out to listen to him and not like him after, I may understand. If you did listen to him you would have heard him say, his respect for the other contenders has grown while on the road . You would have heard him express disappointment about Parker's choice but would be talking to him. You would have heard him say he planned to call them all in to look at positions they may be interested in. You would have heard him repeat how CGT wasn't delivered properly and that it wasn't right for right now whilst they try reclaim those that were turned off them in this last Election and that they had to take a look at all the reasons behind their thrashing which CGT was one of. If you heard him or read any of the interviews it, would be obvious why he is setting CGT aside for now!
He would be well advised to flick the engine….maybe when he’s big enough???
They won't let me put out fires, isn't that a shame
Someday I'll be big and strong and fight every flame...
True. I did mean Parker. As for CGT being on the back burner for now, what Little said twice on National Radio with Kathryn a few days ago was that CGT and Super67 "would not be on the policy statement" for the 2017 election. To me that was parallel to privatization not being on the policy statement during Lange's first election campaign as opposition leader. But guess where it was? In the bottom drawer ready for an airing once the treasury benches were won. I'm pragmatic enough not to pick fault with that. I hope that's not too two-faced of me.
That’s exactly where my head went :)
I loved Flick as a child
I hope that’s not too two-faced of me
Nah just good you can see that there is a bigger picture than just personality involved
I loved Flick as a child
Him and Toot.
Him and Toot.
Always with the lil' guy . :)
So Nash parks legally, and like everyone else parking near a CBD, he denies a spot to some other motorist, who, if they had parked there would have denied a spot to someone else. I've no doubt this is, or could be made into a PR problem. But where's our sense of proportion? Oh, I forgot. We readily melt in the warmth of an "aw shucks" smile while ignoring the cold hard fact of a huge fiscal problem right ahead of us re Super entitlements.
Union structures and their hierarchy are virtually impregnable
What absolute bull faeces DexterX.
I’ve no doubt this is, or could be made into a PR problem. But where’s our sense of proportion?
I suspect the PR problem has arisen because Stu seems to have little sense of proportion.
Goodness me…a fire engine as his promotional vehicle…what was he thinking???
(That…and him disingenuously letting the nation know that Cunliff had failed to congratulate him on his electoral win….)
Spare us all the egos of these people, and the silly games they play.
For what its worth…I say give Little a fair crack of the whip.
We seriously need a Labour leader with a strong workers’ rights background, we seriously need to halt this creeping acceptance that the only way to economic security is by exploiting workers….and the lowest paid workers the most.
I'm inclined to Dimpost's comment, in that I'm not interested if he's the sort I can have beer with (pace Andrew Geddis) but whether he can sort out the Party.
Indeed Leopold. It’s such a ripe odd cliche:
"s/he’s a PM I could have a beer with"
What are the circumstances?
Does ‘could’ here denote my preference to do this or simply the likelihood of such an event occurring? Is ‘a beer’ a shared cup? Our own vessels? A keg? A colloquialism denoting a sequence of beers until we’re both three sheets to the wind? To me it feels like a vessel of beer each in which case who’s buying? Will I feel or be made to feel inadequate about my choice of beers? What’s the correct exit strategy once we’ve each finished our beers? What’s the etiquette for taking leave of the PM after a single or unfinished beer?
Will I need to be holding on out of concern that the PM might take a swig of my beer while I’m in the Gents? Does the PM have any communicable diseases that I should be watching out for? If the bar staff refuse to serve a sloshed PM should I similarly refuse my beer in a show of solidarity?
Then there’s this ‘with’; Are we at a pub? Do I invite the PM in mid-doorknocking? Perhaps we’re at the beach? Are we alone or in a group? How ‘with’ the PM do I need to be to claim I had a beer with? I could probably handle a beer with the PM at a noisy bar or the TAB where the focus was on something else, a karaoke joint might also work, but in a quiet high country pub with that guy and his verbal diarrhea I’d rather drown.
Although this may seem the obvious inference I also have to ask; will there be conversation accompanying the beer, or could we be Speights mates? What’s more crucial, the beer or the conversation? Must I finish my beer? Couldn’t I just sidle up to the PM and get Gary to take pic so it looks like I had a beer with? If I say ‘hi PM’ will the claim be more valid? What proximity qualifies?
What is the tone of the conversation? Must it be convivial or is jibing on the cards? Can I spend the beer tearing the PM a new flag hole? Can it end in a bit of biffo? If it ends in biffo should I accompany the PM to the ER or should I bolt? If the PM floors me should I nark? How much should I divulge? Should I just make a statement to the police or can I also talk to the media? Is it ethical to profit from this story in Woman’s Day? Should I ensure the PM doesn’t drink and drive? Can I take Key’s keys? Should I give the PM heads up that he appears to have spilt something on his crotch? If the PM asks for a dance, could I agree? Can I put Home Brew on the jukebox? If I can’t take his smarmy bullshit and ditch him mid pint does it still count?
If the chinwag rather that the beer is the emphasis, must my beer contain alcohol? Could the drink be substituted? Could I smoke a race horse/ blast a couple of rails/ drop acid/ shoot horse with the PM? Again who’s buying and who’s going to take the rap? Should we agree to terms in advance? Should I plant evidence on his person? I’m always amazed how many people can parse the subtext and answer the question:
"Is s/he someone you could have a beer with?"
with an unconditional and unqualified ‘yes’ or ‘no’.
As if it actually means something.
Why some [unions] get to be the deciding vote in choosing a future Prime Minister however I have no idea.
Oh, please. See above for remarks on the Labour Party constitution and its links to unions. If you don't like how the Labour Party does it, then vote elsewhere or work to change the constitution.
As for future prime ministers, I believe that's up to the voting public and which party ends up on top.
I believe that many of us will be working hard to change the constitution. The last LED meeting of my own electorate seemed to be unanimous in believing it should be changed. It's up to Labour members not to waste energy bitching about the manner of Little's election but to stir up the right waves. I say this even while I'm beginning to believe that Little is looking more and more like an inspired choice. He, of all people has the mandate to take the unions to task and sounds like he won't be taking any of the old cloth-cap nonsense that so soured our movement in the general public's mind.
"… Little is looking more and more like an inspired choice."
Especially after his interviews on Q&A and The Nation this weekend. His critics are looking sillier by the minute.
"His (Little's) critics are looking sillier by the minute."
Maybe a little unjust. More likely his critics are altering their views by the minute as Little steps out in public as opposition leader. That's been my experience anyway.
Maybe a little unjust. More likely his critics are altering their views by the minute as Little steps out in public as opposition leader.
Equally unjust is to stab the Party in the back and delegate the Party to incompetence (due to it’s internal process) before the guy had a chance to step out as the Opposition Leader. Frankly I think that’s been pretty selfish, something I have not much time for.
Rather than say one 'could' have a beer with him, perhaps it is better to say one 'would' have a beer with him. I certainly would.
..have a beer with the PM, Little or Robertson? Do go on...who's buying? How many are you having? Where are you having it? What are you drinking? Would there be chatter? Anything in particular you'd like to discuss? Anything off limits? Why beer? Details please Ian!
Oh, please. See above for remarks on the Labour Party constitution and its links to unions. If you don’t like how the Labour Party does it, then vote elsewhere or work to change the constitution.
Well I've never party voted Labour, and I can't see myself doing so in the near future, and the only thing that would have ever made me likely to hold my nose and become a member was to vote for Grant, and I didn't do that either.
But the fact remains that Labour will be the major party in the next left wing government, and because they interact at the edge in the center of the bell curve, the one that we most rely on to take votes from the right side of the equation. So I'm as interested in how they choose my future PM, as any other party that I'm also not a member of.
You're that lady from The Nation, aren't you?
Lisa Owen? Nah Matey, I’m not. Prescriptivists…Give us another grammar lesson bud.