Hard News by Russell Brown

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Hard News: Never mind the quality ...

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  • SteveH, in reply to Konrad Kurta,

    I’m mystified as to how ‘the general public’ don’t seem to give a shit about blatant lies being told to their faces. Key, Slater, Collins et al have been lying non-stop ever since the book came out. Is anybody keeping a tally? It’s unbelievable that people would actually swallow any of this.

    And it's not like it just started with the book. It seems about 95% likely that Key lied over knowledge of Kim Dotcom and Collins certainly lied over Oravida. It's depressing that so many people seem willing to give Key a free pass simply because they like him/his personality/his looks or don't like Cunliffe.

    Since Sep 2009 • 444 posts Report Reply

  • izogi, in reply to Konrad Kurta,

    I’m mystified as to how ‘the general public’ don’t seem to give a shit about blatant lies being told to their faces. Key, Slater, Collins et al have been lying non-stop ever since the book came out. Is anybody keeping a tally? It’s unbelievable that people would actually swallow any of this.

    But it’s easy enough to find a trusted commentor (like Hosking or Henry or Key… not one of those commie ones like Campbell), who will explain why it’s all inconsequential. Once you have that, there’s really no need to even bother reading the book.

    I expect it’s a lack-of-perceived-alternative thing. If people really don’t want Labour+misc, whether for policy reasons or just because they don’t trust someone with Cunliffe’s face, they’ll justify to themselves why it’s still okay to excuse whatever’s going on in National’s tent. I’d love to see the National Party just clean out all its crap and get rid of the factions that have invaded it recently, because there are many involved in it who I think would have much higher ethics and are really being let down by others. Doing so probably isn’t trivial (or possible) though, and doing it now would probably mean a big hit on the election.

    Many people still forgave Clark’s government for a lot in its latter years. The alternative option was likely to be a government run by Don Brash!

    Wellington • Since Jan 2007 • 1141 posts Report Reply

  • giovanni tiso,

    The entirely predictable Listener editorial: "Hager, of course, is no less guilty than Slater of trying to exert influence on the political process."

    Wellington • Since Jun 2007 • 7473 posts Report Reply

  • matthew,

    Wow that's lame. Everyone that so much as votes is trying to exert influence on the political process. Some just choose different methods.

    auckland • Since Nov 2013 • 22 posts Report Reply

  • Trevor Nicholls,

    As befits a banker, John Key's lies are accruing interest.

    Wellington, NZ • Since Nov 2006 • 325 posts Report Reply

  • Kumara Republic,

    Just heard the podcast below*, and you couldn't make this up. Even by John "Iwi/Kiwi" Ansell's standards.

    John Ansell: "God is obviously a member of the National Party, 'cause he flattened the Peoples Republic of Christchurch, and that created the economic growth they're boasting about."

    * Morning Report, Thursday 21 August 2014 - Election ad released

    The southernmost capital … • Since Nov 2006 • 5441 posts Report Reply

  • blindjackdog, in reply to giovanni tiso,

    Ah, so it's trying to exert influence on the political process that Slater's guilty of. Least of his crimes, I would have thought.

    What an inane statement, in a equally inane editorial. The entire thing is just a sickening shrug, held together in the language of urbanity, gravitas and knowing. It's actually worse than an outright "nothing to see here": it treats Slatergate as if it were just some tv drama of vague, passing interest.

    Smug detachment is the sad, corrosive pose of the ever-fearful -- but it's quite effective regardless.

    Since Nov 2007 • 40 posts Report Reply

  • Steve Barnes,

    Wayne Mapp on Pundit...

    But over the last week any substantive policy issues were virtually drowned out. How many people know about the Greens' child and welfare policies, or National's cycling announcement? And without actually looking it up, I could not think of what Labour has promised in the past week. On checking, it was free doctors’ visits for those over 65.

    I can get over the obvious smear "could not think of what Labour has promised" and I suppose the mere fact that National has promised to spend $100 million on the cycle-way over the next 4 years or $50 million over 3 years depending on what JK thinks on that day, will please some but major policy it is not.
    With respect to those that like to cycle, personally I don't but that is just me not wanting to be hit by some self righteous right winger in a car that thinks I don;t deserve to be there because I might not be a Road Fund Licence payer or, even more ridiculous, a rate payer but I digress... I wonder if, in the back of his tiny mind, JK imagines us all on bikes in the style of early 20th century China and him as the Chaimam, Chairmonkey has a nice ring to it eh?. but I continue to digress.
    The argument that Hager's book has distracted the voting public from Policy is disingenuous at best and more likely to be yet another attempt to tell us that... "There is nothing to see here, now move along you plebs and get a job, I am sure a toilet needs cleaning somewhere, after all, at the end of the day that is what is important and I think everyone can see that this is all just a left wing smear orchestrated by a conspiracy theorist to make lots of money out of a book that has no truth in it whatsoever and I have never heard of whales, or Wales for that matter, unless you are a Prince of it and you have a baby to kiss unless its feral in which case I can't tell you about that but what I can tell you is that David Cunliffe has a scarf and that says a lot cos its red and that proves he is in with the Greens. Its all .com's fault........"
    As they do, but I digressed...

    Peria • Since Dec 2006 • 5521 posts Report Reply

  • Kumara Republic, in reply to giovanni tiso,

    The entirely predictable Listener editorial: “Hager, of course, is no less guilty than Slater of trying to exert influence on the political process.”

    As with some recent past Listener editorials, it’s possibly either Pam Stirling, Jane Clifton or Bill Ralston. Joanne Black fits, but she bolted some time ago.

    The southernmost capital … • Since Nov 2006 • 5441 posts Report Reply

  • Joe Wylie, in reply to Steve Barnes,

    Wayne Mapp on Pundit…

    Let's not forget the silly hat he was once made to wear.

    flat earth • Since Jan 2007 • 4593 posts Report Reply

  • Dismal Soyanz,

    As I think has been pointed out before, if we allow this subversion/corrosion of politics then any debate about actual policies becomes moot.

    Wellington • Since Nov 2010 • 310 posts Report Reply

  • Steve Barnes, in reply to Joe Wylie,

    Let’s not forget the silly hat he was once made to wear.

    Seeking out niggles in the woodpile.

    Peria • Since Dec 2006 • 5521 posts Report Reply

  • Rob Stowell, in reply to giovanni tiso,

    The entirely predictable Listener editorial: “Hager, of course, is no less guilty than Slater of trying to exert influence on the political process.”

    $^%&*^&*%#*^&*)(()_)&(*^&^%^^^%""**!!!!!!!
    I can't even.

    Whakaraupo • Since Nov 2006 • 2110 posts Report Reply

  • Sofie Bribiesca, in reply to Rob Stowell,

    $^%&*^&*%#*^&*)(()_)&(*^&^%^^^%""**!!!!!!!I can’t even.

    ....swear? ;)
    But, but, (my butt) he was on holiday now. say Harold

    here and there. • Since Nov 2007 • 6796 posts Report Reply

  • Russell Brown, in reply to Kumara Republic,

    As with some recent past Listener editorials, it’s possibly either Pam Stirling, Jane Clifton or Bill Ralston. Joanne Black fits, but she bolted some time ago.

    Not Pamela. She doesn't write them, but will have a a view on its conclusion.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 22848 posts Report Reply

  • Russell Brown,

    Sigh.

    Moreover, Hager’s supporters are no more entitled to claim the Whale Oil hacking was justified by Slater’s “feral” comments than those on the right could claim a Labour candidate’s recent despicable “Shylock” comments about Prime Minister John Key could ever justify such an action on their side of the ledger.

    One odious comment in a Facebook thread, withdrawn, apologised for and condemned by the party leader. Versus: callous headlined vilification of an innocent and inhuman hurt to his family, neither apologised for by the author or actually condemned by the Prime Minister.

    Indeed, this is what Slater told the Greymouth Star:

    At 7.21am on Saturday, Mr Slater’s Whale Oil blog site carried a brief story on the crash under the heading, ‘Feral dies in Greymouth, did world a favour’.
    When contacted by the Greymouth Star today, Mr Slater accepted that he did not know Mr Hall or his family, but justified the “feral” description by saying: “It is Greymouth, isn’t it? Didn’t Helen Clark say that you are all feral?”

    He said anybody travelling at 140kph in a car in a 50kph area was ‘feral’, whether on the West Coast or in south Auckland.

    He did not regret the headline and would not be apologising for it.

    “It’s a tragic situation but where is it written in the rule books that you have to take into account people’s feelings?” the blogger said.

    Also: I’m not aware that many people are actually claiming justification for the hacking, even though Slater brags of the same in the book and is currently embroiled in a defamation case where he’s fighting to avoid revealing the source of stolen computer documents.

    The point is that it has happened, and no investigative journalist would refuse these documents as evidence. Furthermore, the legal position is clear: public interest justifies the use of such material.

    That editorial is a trainwreck.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 22848 posts Report Reply

  • giovanni tiso, in reply to Russell Brown,

    That editorial is a trainwreck.

    If that editorial is a train wreck, then Jane Clifton's piece in the same issue is a plane crashing into an erupting volcano.

    Wellington • Since Jun 2007 • 7473 posts Report Reply

  • Lucy Telfar Barnard, in reply to Sofie Bribiesca,

    But, but, (my butt) he was on holiday now. say Harold

    Yes, because Prime Ministers on holiday don’t ever have arrangements in place in case their Director of the SIS needs to contact them.

    In this case, though, I doubt very much that the PM’s office would have thought this was something they needed to bother the PM about while he was on holiday. It was clearly in the PM’s interests to release the documents. If I were Key, and Tucker had phoned me on the encrypted line to ask whether it was OK to release the docs to Slater, I’d be saying “Really? You really needed to interrupt my golf game to ask me that?”

    However, I don’t think it lets Key off the hook for being involved, just off the hook on whether he talked to Tucker about it. Being on holiday on the dates given doesn’t mean he wasn’t in NZ when Slater was tipped off on the wording for how to ask for them.

    Wellington • Since Nov 2006 • 585 posts Report Reply

  • Sofie Bribiesca, in reply to Lucy Telfar Barnard,

    As Gower said to Key, casually, 'TV3 has had thousands of emails sent to them this morning" and then continued to press twat about Collins, my thought was ,those TV3 journos will be missing lunch today.... trawling ,trawling,trawling, keep those journos trawling.... need to understand them......those emails just keep comin'...raw hide!

    here and there. • Since Nov 2007 • 6796 posts Report Reply

  • Carol Stewart, in reply to Russell Brown,

    That editorial is a trainwreck.

    I might have to reinstate my subscription just to have the satisfaction of cancelling it again.

    Wellington • Since Jul 2008 • 830 posts Report Reply

  • nzlemming, in reply to Russell Brown,

    As with some recent past Listener editorials, it’s possibly either Pam Stirling, Jane Clifton or Bill Ralston. Joanne Black fits, but she bolted some time ago.

    Not Pamela. She doesn’t write them, but will have a a view on its conclusion.

    My money would be on Clifton. Not enough hyperbole for Ralston.

    Waikanae • Since Nov 2006 • 2935 posts Report Reply

  • Sofie Bribiesca, in reply to giovanni tiso,

    Jane Clifton’s piece in the same issue is a plane crashing into an erupting volcano.

    Da plane! Da plane! Da ....huh? boom!

    here and there. • Since Nov 2007 • 6796 posts Report Reply

  • SteveH, in reply to Lucy Telfar Barnard,

    In this case, though, I doubt very much that the PM’s office would have thought this was something they needed to bother the PM about while he was on holiday.

    Not only that, but the only justification for his staff not to bother the PM with this sort of thing is if they knew he would authorise it and would prefer not to be bothered, i.e. if his staff had standing orders to allow the SIS to release stuff to Slater. If there is any similar case where he was briefed then it's going to look pretty damning.

    Since Sep 2009 • 444 posts Report Reply

  • Rich of Observationz,

    Prime Ministers on holiday don’t ever have arrangements in place in case their Director of the SIS needs to contact them

    I'd actually believe that is the case, given that the NZSIS hasn't uncovered a single threat to national security in the 58 years it has existed, and has failed conspicuously to detect actual threats in their area of concern (Rainbow Warrior bombings, Israeli passport fraud).

    Back in Wellington • Since Nov 2006 • 5550 posts Report Reply

  • Lucy Telfar Barnard,

    Maybe, but I'm fairly certain that if something like the Rainbow Warrior happened now, there would be a way to at least let the PM know immediately after the fact.

    Wellington • Since Nov 2006 • 585 posts Report Reply

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