Hard News: Feminist as crazy old man
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Email Web
Porn movies work for this
Excuse me, but what happened to having sex?
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Probably harder to organise for some..
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Yes, I was making unwarranted assumptions wasn't I?
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Or a curry?
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Or all those things at once. Spare no expense, that's what I say.
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Excuse me, but what happened to having sex?
Nothing! That's what got you there in the first place.Once again, let me tell you 'bout the birds and the bees.....
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Email Web
You seemed to have trailed off. Tell me more about the birds and the bees.
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Email Web
Also - Baby on Board signs.
I used to think they might be read as "Baby! I'm bored". Just as long as it isn't the baby driving, they aren't too bothersome..
My wife and daughter have spent the day hauling 18+ years of stuff out of our basement (including boxes packed away when we went to Wales in 2003). They are now sitting in the carport, pouring over old photos and drawings. I fear it is going to be a long process! But I am sure there are some old tin toys stowed away down there.
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I used to think they might be read as "Baby! I'm bored".
My next door neighbour (and midwife) has that one.
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....the flowers and the trees and the moon up above, and the thing called love... then... BABIES! Basically G.T, the birds are wandering into my house and one shat on the rug. The bees are missing at the mo, save for the odd (not looking but odd none the less) bumble bee. Our birds were hatched in the trees out side the back and have hung around for 2 years now but boy, can the little ones shit.I've called one "little shit"
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telling me I was adopted
this thread has covered a huge range of stuff and I haven't kept up with it all. So sorry if this has been covered.
But do bear in mind there are also the involuntarily childless couples out there. Done the fertility treatment thing. Unsuccessfully. Dipped the toes in the (miniscule in NZ) adoption pool with no result. Etc.
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Oh Stephen C, am reading your Invisible Boy link, had to take a digestion break after a third, but so far it really hard hitting and I feel that I am learning something.
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Steady on, sir, there's no call for that kind of language.
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Phil Lyth - my mother was extremely fertile, but her mother and her aunts- werent. Nor were my sisters.
The reason for the intergenerational inferility almost certainly was
endometriosis.(And, almost certainly, from the Scots side of the whakapapa.) Which affected my 3 sisters' desire for large families.*
They produced 2 children, but raised 5 (one sister settled, after long & arduous IVF treatments, for much-loved pets.) And yep, they went the IVF & adoption routes...I know the anguish & heartbreak infertility can cause (bear in mind, 2 of my sisters are midwives.) But- I cant see anything in this thread that would cause them other than pleasure that people are sharing & caring about a matter close to their hearts.
*I also had endo for over 45 years. It made 5-6 days a month a real pain, but other than that, didnt matter at all. I've never wanted to breed little islands.
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Oh Stephen C, am reading your Invisible Boy link, had to take a digestion break after a third, but so far it really hard hitting and I feel that I am learning something.
Thankyou Kowhai, I appreciate your effort. Its not an easy read.
Yes, I read it too Stephen - heartbreaking stuff. Thanks for posting that.
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much-loved pets
What a jolly good idea. Many need a home right now, according to 3 news tonight.
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Steve B, yes, in any language, it is decidedly so.
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I started reading this thread late and have had a lot of catching up to do.
Going back to some earlier comments on this thread.I can understand, without agreeing with the policy, why some early feminists would not allow boy babies to be brought to their meetings.*
When I was an emerging feminist there was a lot of talk about the way women act around men. I'm not trying to start a discussion about that, it is just what was being talked about. There were studies that I'm sure were published in academic journals of the time (of course it was so long ago that I've long since disposed of any notes I might have had) that looked at how woman behave around men, including boys and boy babies, and how that effected their ability to have free and frank discussions. I recall reading about studies that showed in group discussions men thought that the women dominated the discussions and it was in fact the reverse. The discussions were anything but free for the women as the men tended to interrupt the women and steer the discussions. I'm not saying that these studies were definitive, just that they were what I, and other feminists, were reading about 20-30 years ago. Women were just beginning to realise, or have it pointed out to them, that men, even babies, hog the lime-light. Women could put their daughters on the floor to play and let them get on with it but they would be constantly distracted by their demanding sons. True? I don't know. I do remember watching a film of a study of women interacting with children, the women behaved very differently towards children they were told were boys. (Wish I kept my old text books and notes now.)
So in 1970s and 80s women were saying "we can't have free and frank discussions if men are present, and look even boy babies can make us behave in a way that will disrupt our meeting. So we wont have any boys at all".
I'm not saying that I believe this, frankly I'd organise a creche and keep all the little attention grabbers out of the meeting all together.
*As an aside to Emma, I will never be able to understand why anyone would tell a woman she shouldn't bring her sons to a refuge if that would delay her escape one minute longer than necessary.
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Dinah - was it that 'that men, even babies hog the limelight'? Or that some women - maybe a majority - let 'em?
I was brought up in a matriarchial family, and, in my own way, I am a matriarch. I've never yet met a male speaker, in an own-tribe marae situation, who will twice cross the Aunties...
I think - without rigorous scientific backing- some of the studies you mention (mea culpa- I havent read them yet, altho' I have read similar) are limited to certain racial/socioeconomic groups of women?
Things were - and very much still are - done quite differently among other groups. As anybody who was present at the launching/renewal of Te Rau Aroha marae is rather aware of- -
a study of women interacting with children, the women behaved very differently towards children they were told were boys
I remember that one from our first year Psychology textbook. Parents of both genders spent twice as long talking with toddlers who they thought were girls (pink clothing), holding them close and interacting attentively. They tended to put the 'boys' (blue clothing) out on the floor with toys and left them to it. Somewhat undercuts your argument, sorry, though its probably right for older boys.
are limited to certain racial/socioeconomic groups of women
Don't recall but it was conducted quite a while ago so I'd say you're right.
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This thread has come a long way.
Put us down for two home births, both breastfed for four years or more.
Hospital birth was out of the picture after we visited NatWomens and my love basically fainted. She doesn't like hospitals.
Both births were great. As Russel says - best thing is relaxing at home with your new one when everyone else leaves. That and the older one being at the birth.
When we had our first the local DHB gave us 6 weeks free nappy service as a bonus for saving them money.
He also got all the experiments: frozen expressed milk, sleeping in a cot, baby sitting. Takes a while to realise that the real benefit of breast feeding is convenience.
The second one slept in our bed from day one and still does. IMHO the prize for anecdotal grandstanding goes to the coroners.
Best birth book: Spiritual midwifery
Best baby book: LLL womanly art of breastfeeding (good for all parenting not just the feeding). -
Or all those things at once. Spare no expense, that's what I say.
I thought it was a hot curry, hot bath, hot sex.
Two out of three bought on labour with my oldest. Sadly labour took most of two days, so perhaps we got it started too early.
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Two out of three bought on labour with my oldest.
Kyle that could be taken ,well,let's say, a little creepy
Sadly labour took most of two days, so perhaps we got it started too early.
We?? With your oldest??
With all these difficult labour stories I can totally understand a delay in passing what must feel like a volley ball through the eye of a needle. Frankly I am not surprised! :) -
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Many years ago I helped facilitate ante and post natal groups. At the antenatal class we (the 'experts' who already had a small child each) talked a lot about post birth things like breastfeeding and getting enough rest. When we had the post birth reunions many of the new mothers asked us why we didn't tell them about how difficult and painful breastfeeding is to get established, what sleep deprivation and fluctuating hormones do to you, but most of all how the baby is a whole new fascinating,absorbing and unique person.
We did, but I think as first time parents they were so focussed on the birth itself that the rest didn't register.
At post natal groups there was always a lot of angst from mothers who felt they hadn't done the birth 'properly' ie baby popped out in a couple of hours with no pain, pain relief or stitches, and within hours smiling family is at home ready for the admirers, with a happily breast fed baby sleeping peacefully.
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