Speaker: Are there opportunities within the Government’s childhood obesity plan?
229 Responses
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Lilith __, in reply to
Here’s what I’m saying: accosting parents or fat people or fat parents or chip-eating students or people at the dairy or whoeverthefuck about their choices is probably the LEAST helpful thing anyone can do.
(I barely post here anymore, compared to previously, so take from that what you will about my opinions of the tenor of discussions lately.)
This.
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As well as being nasty, fat-shaming leads to weight-gain. Think about that, any reasonable people left on here.
“Previous studies have found that people who experience discrimination report comfort eating. Stress responses to discrimination can increase appetite, particularly for unhealthy, energy-dense food. Weight discrimination has also been shown to make people feel less confident about taking part in physical activity, so they tend to avoid it.”
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Katharine Moody, in reply to
is probably the LEAST helpful thing anyone can do.
I agree, as Dr Toomath suggests, Obese people did not choose to be that way. No-one would. Instead, they are at the whim first of their genes – especially those that control appetite – and then of an environment that is saturated in energy-dense, crappy food options.
But in the case of babies, I find it hard, really hard to just walk on by.
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Katharine Moody, in reply to
This breaks my heart.
I can understand why - I spent a month in out-patient dialysis when I trained as a nurse many years ago. When you know what life after 60 is going to be like for someone obese in their 20s - it is heartbreaking.
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Rosemary McDonald, in reply to
(I barely post here anymore, compared to previously, so take from that what you will about my opinions of the tenor of discussions lately.)
Perhaps, Danielle, you could elaborate on that? I would not want to take from that what was not intended.
And no-one one talking about accosting anyone. The potential desire to do so was floated. But...if you saw someone dragging a child by its ear...would you speak out at this abuse?
Or would you not see it?
In some circles, putting sugary drinks into the baby's bottle is tantamount to abuse.
Its about education and awareness...http://www.nzherald.co.nz/northern-advocate/news/article.cfm?c_id=1503450&objectid=11539761
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People who want to improve the health of Kiwi children can support KidsCan, which provides healthy food and other basics to kids who will otherwise go without.
You can make a one-off donation of any amount or provide ongoing support for a child for $15/month.
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Angela Hart, in reply to
As well as being nasty, fat-shaming leads to weight-gain
right at the start I expressed my doubts about officially labelling kids as fat, there's a high probability of unintended consequences from that, far better to change the culture to one where most food is healthy and most people exercise routinely. Easier to say than to do though.
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One of the key causes of poor nutrition and poor general health is poverty.
Recently, there was a study about how eating healthily now costs three times as much as it would have done 10 years ago, but food prices are far from the only issue. For the purposes of this article, let’s boil it down to money, more specifically, disposable income. Just for a change, let’s stop obsessing about impoverished obese people and their alleged heaving KFC buckets and look at some of the expensive lengths better-off people go to in the pursuit of “slim”.
Personal trainers, gym memberships, exercise classes, slimming clubs, home gym equipment, running gear, yoga gear, gym gear, (whatever the gear!), dieticians, nutritionists, diet food delivery services, electronic wristbands, books, DVDs, downloads, vitamins supplements. The list is endless before you even get to the food, because what says healthy more than a “simple peasant stew” made from an organic seasonal veg box, which is far beyond the reach of an ordinary family’s food budget?
There will always be some tedious blow-hard insisting that all they do to keep fit is run up and down on the spot, wearing their old school plimsolls – these people really should shut up. Most would concede that fitness, or regaining fitness, is an expensive and complicated business. Despite this, your average middle-class professional would probably argue that they need all this help to keep in shape. Fair enough, but then why criticise overweight people who couldn’t dream of affording it?
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B Jones, in reply to
I look at all those bottles of pre-made pasta sauce and wonder why anyone would pay what amounts to 4x the price of the simple set of ingredients.
Because not everyone has the time to chop everything and reduce a tomato sauce for 45 minutes after work while their kids beg for snacks and fight. I make almost all my food from scratch, but buggered if I'm going to turn down a ten minute dinner that the kids like, that is actually pretty good on the healthy eating scale when you stir in veges, pasta and a bit of bacon in the sauce.
Time poverty is a huge contributor to unhealthy eating patterns. Skills - the time and resources to learn to cook and the equipment for it. Better to recognise that and try and make policy changes that change that (more home ec in schools, say, or more flexible working hours) than than tutting about the youth of today and fighting humanity's innate tendency to like sweet, salty and fatty things.
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Joe Wylie, in reply to
Its about education and awareness...http://www.nzherald.co.nz/northern-advocate/news/article.cfm?c_id=1503450&objectid=11539761</q>
Which is a bit like claiming that the grotesque disproportion of Maori prison inmates is all due to their lack of "awareness" of good old middle-class busybody values. This from the link you've provided:
"Sam Bartrum, acting chief executive of Northland DHB, said the statistics were directly related to the social and economic determinants for health, and reflected that many Northland Maori tend to reside in the poorest communities. "Non-Maori in Northland are more advantaged than Maori across all socioeconomic indicators such as employment, income, education and housing, as well as health outcomes," he said."
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Rosemary McDonald, in reply to
"Which is a bit like claiming that the grotesque disproportion of Maori prison inmates is all due to their lack of “awareness” of good old middle-class busybody values."
Whangarei woman Flo Higgins, 53, was diagnosed with type 1 diabetes only two years ago. She was not surprised Maori were more likely to die of treatable illnesses, with a range of factors, including affordability, people being stubborn and lack of support.
"It costs me $17 for each doctor visit and about $5 for my prescriptions plus gas to get to appointments. While it does not affect me, if you're struggling to put food on the table to might be a struggle. I also have family members who have just decided not to take their medicine. I think some people think they don't need it so there needs to be more awareness on what illnesses do to the body," she said.
Ms Higgins said while she has nothing but praise for the public health system, some form of Maori support would be beneficial.
"I think it's ingrained in us to want the fattiest pork bone or to put so much sugar in coffee. I think there needs to be a change in attitude," she said.
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/northern-advocate/news/article.cfm?c_id=1503450&objectid=11539761
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And a very good piece from Te Manu Korihi a couple of months ago...
http://www.radionz.co.nz/news/te-manu-korihi/281014/intervention-vital-to-curb-maori-obesity
"We are modelling the sorts of foods we want our children to chose and limiting the marketing of unhealthy foods and drinks to children and families."
She also wanted the Government to tax sugary drinks.
"We need to send a clear message that sugary drinks are something that should not be consumed every day," she said.
Dr Te Morenga said if the message was continually made and made loudly and strongly enough, then eventually the Government would come on board.
"They did it with tobacco legislation, didn't they?" -
Katharine Moody, in reply to
than tutting about the youth of today and fighting humanity’s innate tendency to like sweet, salty and fatty things.
It's not an age thing - I mentioned my sister earlier - she's 62. It's a convenience thing for her. And I kind of agree with the time poverty argument, but if we just look at pasta sauce as an example, it can be made early and stored in the fridge for days. And it really only matters if you are on a stretched budget - that was the reason I used it as an example. Skills, I agree, I'm pretty certain learning to cook is a whole lot more beneficial than say, reading Shakespeare.
Thing about what humanity likes to eat - it is all about conditioning and I think the early years are really important. When you think about a grocery store, my guess is that 75% of the shelf space is taken up by "energy-dense, crappy food options".
When I was a kid growing up in the states, we couldn't afford store-bought cakes, cookies etc. I recall going back as an adult and thinking I'd try a Twinkie as I'd never had one. It was so sickly sweet that I took one bite and tossed it. I think that reaction was a part of my conditioning - not that I dislike sweet things, but there is unnaturally/overly sweet where my taste buds are concerned.
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Joe Wylie, in reply to
And a very good piece from Te Manu Korihi a couple of months ago...
Again, the socio-economic gap is identified as a significant factor. Claiming that this is all about "education and awarenesss" implies that Maori are entirely the authors of their own misfortune.
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Other people's problems are so easy to solve.
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For anyone with time to spare, there are many charities who collect and distribute food to those in need. There are also charitable organisations who help people learn to cook: one of these is SuperGrans. They are always looking for volunteers as well as donations.
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Danielle, in reply to
Perhaps, Danielle, you could elaborate on that? I would not want to take from that what was not intended.
I find it hard to engage in many threads in which I am interested because I can't be bothered deconstructing large numbers of blanket assertions I find problematic. I'm not sure whether the culture of the threads has changed, or if I have.
In some circles, putting sugary drinks into the baby’s bottle is tantamount to abuse.
Like this. I can't work out which bit of this I want to argue with first. If you don't tell off someone for giving their baby sugar, you're condoning what some people consider the moral equivalent of child beating. I mean... OK? Do you really think that's a helpful approach?
Or this:
And I kind of agree with the time poverty argument, but if we just look at pasta sauce as an example, it can be made early and stored in the fridge for days.
Maybe, if you work some shitty minimum wage job, you don't want to spend your day off making pasta sauce? Maybe you want to hang with your kids, or play social netball, or sit on your ass? I don't know, it's like we're constantly framing this as some sort of Moral Failing of the Poors, and at some point we're going to have to say that this is structural and socio-economic and... stop doing that finger-pointy tsk-tsk thing we, as a society, love to do.
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I don't want to spend my weekend making pasta sauce because I have better things to do with my time, and I don't have enough room in my fridge or freezer for lots of made-ahead things.
I see bottled bolognese sauce as a kind of gateway drug to cooking for yourself, for folk who have left home without much in the way of cooking skills, and would otherwise subsist on mince on toast. It's the only thing standing between a few lads (and lasses) and scurvy. Making it easier for low kitchen skilled people to cook rather than get takeaways is a good thing.
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Katharine Moody, in reply to
Maybe, if you work some shitty minimum wage job, you don’t want to spend your day off making pasta sauce? Maybe you want to hang with your kids
Kill two birds with one stone. I make a point of cooking and baking with all my grandchildren - they love it - as much as they love eating the finished product. And I've found lots of the tasks improve their coordination skills as well (de-seeding cucumbers was an interesting one the other day .. not that easy for a 10-year old, but he was so proud once he'd mastered it).
I don't think you need to spend as much thought on deconstructing things - in many ways, life is pretty simple and thoughts are straight-forward with no malice, prejudice or deep-meaning intended.
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Katharine Moody, in reply to
Okay, okay - forget the pasta sauce - should we instead move onto the easiest and most delicious chocolate cake ever?
You will have to forgive me, I'm a fanatic in the kitchen.
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Joanna, in reply to
I don’t think you need to spend as much thought on deconstructing things – in many ways, life is pretty simple and thoughts are straight-forward with no malice, prejudice or deep-meaning intended.
Could I suggest instead perhaps more thought could be used here? Your experiences are not the experiences of many others. Like, you've just said you're a fanatic in the kitchen, and that is fantastic - for you. There are many people for whom that is not the case, who don't have the skills or the money or the grandparents teaching their children to bake, or the easy access to supermarkets for ingredients, or the money to pay for them or the time - or possibly even the will. Why care about what you're putting into your body if society keeps telling you that you're a waste of too much space and not really a human, just a burden on the health and/or welfare system anyway, something to be pitied and mocked?.
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JacksonP, in reply to
I find it hard to engage in many threads in which I am interested because I can’t be bothered deconstructing large numbers of blanket assertions I find problematic. I’m not sure whether the culture of the threads has changed, or if I have.
This really saddens me. I wonder if somehow there has been a shift in the collective consciousness.
I wager it has something to do with being governed by a callous crowd of cronies for so long, driving the middle to self-interested oblivion. What happened to trying a little kindness?
Projecting our narrowly held belief systems on people we know little to nothing about, is seldom helpful.
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JacksonP, in reply to
I don’t think you need to spend as much thought on deconstructing things – in many ways, life is pretty simple and thoughts are straight-forward with no malice, prejudice or deep-meaning intended.
I hope you can see how insulting this is. Your life may be simple, probably because you have choices. For people with none, the most important thing can be retaining their dignity and personal safety. How much sugar they feed their kids is so irrrlevant, to punish them for it is in my opinion its own form of abuse.
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I get poverty. I get living on a low income with no hope of any improvement.
I get inequality. I get inequity. I get discrimination. I get feelings of total marginalisation. I get the deep sense of hopelessness from having tried and having your fingers stomped on by those above you on the 'ladder'.I can't see any of the causes of inequity, inequality and discrimination being addressed any time soon.
So...what do we do in the meantime?
The way I see it....every individual or family who is empowered to make choices that will improve their lives can be notched up as a win against the established order.
Not becoming a statistic, not feeding the narrative of the right that the poor are poor because they are stupid, or stubborn...
We can sit around and debate politics and framing and economics and neo liberalism until the cows come home....but the teeth will still be rotting in the heads of small children.
The complicated stuff is very interesting.
The day to day reality can be a lot simpler.
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