I agree entirely.

Some positions are quite clear enough – though as we've all seen and done at times, our personal urge to promote them may be less conscious.

I am very aware…

Like the two moderators who told her to stop?

An observation.

Methinks folk are not always properly reading and comprehending the comments of others.

Much less reading the links that are provided, or even quotes from links.

Perhaps, before launching in outraged…

how do your friends react when you dole out advice like this?

Hi folks. Sorry…

Nice idea, but made-to-order and drive thru generally don't mix. Unless the drive-thru was incredibly long.

I'd have a few chooks, feed them the lunch scraps and put the chook poo on…

Sort of. It is that simple, but finding how much energy went in and how much went out is very difficult and inaccurate, particularly in short term calculations.

Also, of course, there's way,…

Remember to slip, slop, slap.

http://www.radionz.co.nz/news/world/288389/antarctic-ozone-hole-grows

Your sentence is three words too long. :)

Also, thanks, Ben: that clarified things and now I am driven slightly less nuts. By your post, anyway. ;)

It's very difficult to lose weight through exercise alone.

But perhaps we could all go out and enjoy the sunshine today.

http://www.sciencemediacentre.co.nz/2011/08/18/nz-must-change-obesogenic-environment-researchers/

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tgKkBaXEvI8

Yes, I already write at far too great a length to have to reiterate points like that I reject that assumption constantly. I'm just moving ahead there with…

When someone is saying things that are genuinely upsetting to other people – and I hope it's clear to everyone that this is an 'emotionally hot' topic for some people – it's not the person who responds who is causing the problem. This…

I don’t think she was being bullied, but the fact that she was being rounded on by everyone else was a factor in giving her a rest.

She was, however, being obsessive and insulting to others and would…

Most of your post drives me nuts because it assumes that if you're obese you…

Hey I'm no dietician but I reckon there's enough protein in that bassline to sustain an entire family for a week on just one listen.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7HCX8D7KpdQ

Are you just taking the piss now? Let the sardines go! Also, you have offended a large portion…

that might be your problem.

stop.
looking.
at.
the.
individual.
person.

that as well

No, I won't let you. Where the fuck do you get off?

It's a doco about what happens if you eat so much McDonalds every day, for every meal, that you feel sick, but you force it down anyway, because you want to deliberately damage your health. I'm pretty sure…

Please, no more assumptions about who you are talking with. Russell, you may want to ponder this one.

She doesn't have any children, so I don't think that's going to work. :D

Out here in da hood, where us poor folk live :-). I didn't actually weigh the chips to be sure the serving was 400g, but it wouldn't have been far off – it was about the size of 2 cups. The whole package would have been…

Okay. Let me then appeal to you on behalf of your children. What's important is getting them to like sardines from an early age, and this relies on you eating them too.

So…

There are loads of poems about chips. And even more about fish and chips.

I can't eat sardines because they are full of purines and I am prone to…

My objection to that is mainly value-for-money.
If only there were drive-through chippies. Or kebabs, etc.

Eat everything in moderation and you won't.

Well yes, though unlike chocolate fish there's not the moral qualm about biting heads off, because someone's already done it for you.

heck – where? #cheap

really – how come?

Well on dialysis you pretty much can't eat fresh fruit or veg at all... wait, how did we get on to this?

And I have seen nobody doing that here. You may be arguing furiously with natural allies?

What about the green jelly? Isn't that basically just sugar? WHAT IF I GET ON THE DIALYSIS??

sorry

And I don't – that why we as a society have to change that aspect of our society – the environment. Defending the right to have a vending machine at the school and all-you-can-eat KFC under a banner of personal…

Unfortunately I must agree.

Some of us think life’s a bit like that, don’t we? But it isn’t. Life, you know, is rather like opening a tin of sardines. We all of us are looking for the key. And I wonder how many of you here tonight have wasted years of…

I agree with that paper. Removing any tax creates a gap in funding somewhere else. But adding a tax on a harmful product with no nutritional value whatsoever, generates revenue – new revenue that can be…

Katharine is doling out parenting and nutritional advice like it's going out of style. I don't remember seeing anyone ask for it.

Second most addictive substance on the planet. Not the same dynamic at all.

Amen. And for the third time, I’ll link to Dr Toomath’s article on this;

http://www.stuff.co.nz/life-style/well-good/5639913/Fighting-a-losing-battle-against-obesity

Where she puts her thesis on what the cause of the problem is:

__DR TOOMATH’S…

Verily

Sorry, I must have missed that. Any hint where in this thread I should look?

I know carbonated sugar drinks are opposed by healthy food advocates because they have zero nutritional value, thus only downsides. Our current govt is far more interested in…

You're not here to discuss anything. You are certain you are right and have no interest in engaging with other people's way of thinking, and seem to have no empathy for people with limited or no choices.

I think sarcasm…

amen

Indeed. Even my children know that is actually a drink.

Mussels and a baguette might be close, but that presupposes cooking gear.

Oh, and you have to eat your toast with a knife and fork too. That way you won't end up on dialysis.

You don't say!

I think what is peeving the shit out of me here is that we apparently have to lay bare our souls and lives for you to accept that we might know something about this and to stop…

Someone referred to fizzy drink as food.

No, cut out the sarcasm, this is a serious subject – ask anyone hooked up to a dialysis machine three times a week.

Had you started young – they'd be one of your favourites.

times every child :)

Fair enough. What led you to believe that other commenters here do not understand nutrition?

No, we wouldn’t "huddle" around it – as you might do around chips in paper – we’d put the sardines on toast on a plate, sit down at the table, require everyone to use their fork and knife…

Ironically, I personally…

It was earlier said that;

I know the cheapest way to fuel hungry people is hot chips.

That is a falsehood which I felt should be corrected – as someone might actually believe it to be true.

ILovePies?
(they rock)

http://www.weightlossresources.co.uk/calories-in-food/veg/chip-shop-chips.htm

Versus the nutritional value of sardines;

http://www.whfoods.com/genpage.php?tname=foodspice&dbid=147

$1.20 a tin (x3) plus a loaf of multi-grain bread = $4.60

Reckon.

Why? I do not see anyone asking for advice.

It used to be called a liberal argument.

I’m going to feed my children some fucking hot chips.
Bravo. May I suggest lashings of ketchup.

ETA: Oh awesome, we are having a bought pie for dinner. I couldn't have scripted this better.…

Eating habits are a complex mix of learned behaviour, education, food preparation and cooking skills, cultural and personal expectations, food availability and affordability, income, and personal preferences. Playing around the margins of one small aspect of…

Dude. 4 people. $4.

Also, I fed…

Floggings? We haven't tried those yet.

It's a complex issue. Oversimplifying it isn't really that helpful. We could simplify things even further to make this plain by pointing out that for the most part gaining weight…

"Bad" food is not free either. Something was paid for it. Take your example of hot chips. How much did they cost and how many people were you feeding them to? I'll then provide you with a healthier alternative for the same cost.

No. In fact look back – my first suggestion…

Fizzy drink is not food!!!!!!!!!!!

Yes. Food and tobacco are exactly the same.

I have no idea what is meant by “functional poverty” – but how can drinking free water, as opposed to not-free fizzy drink increase poverty?

But you're…

What? It would be horrible to put stuff that is slowly but surely poisoning them out of their reach financially? Do you think the same of the tax on tobacco?

__ I’m against it because it would increase the…

Yes, they do. Because we're arguing that narrowly focussing on "shame and tax the fat kids and their parents" is an unhelpful, simplistic strategy.

I did – and yes I'm all for all…

If you buy the teatowel, no one will ever know. ;-)

We haven't tried giving everyone ponies. It wouldn't work, but hey, we haven't tried it.

it’s not just their corporate friends that would scream foul

I'm against it because it's punitive – meaning punishing – and…

Did you even read Megan's amazing, beautiful post up there in which she lays out structural changes which have NOT been tried and are not even LIKELY to be tried and yet would make HUGE differences…

Except that they haven't been so far – as numerous health professionals have pointed out – a punitive tax seems to be the only thing we haven't tried thus far. And given the near total lack of support for such an initiative…

Why not buy a cute teatowel to support them? Perfect for Xmas.

I'm going to keep this very simple. Public health educational initiatives GOOD and EFFECTIVE (probably); accosting random parents at the dairy BAD and INEFFECTIVE (probably).

So wandering the…

For some reason I was reminded of my mother's Christchurch next door neighbour back in the Muldoon era, who was the public face of an organisation called CARP, aka Campaign Against Rising Prices. When she listed chocolate biscuits among the…

Yeah. And my home-made pasta sauce has wine in it.

Err, yes, kinda been talking about that....but...telling the actual parents not to do it appears to be all 'hand wavy' judgmental....

I did put up…

I did...comment no.6.

Tax sugary processed foods. Decrease GST on fresh fruit and veg. And fresh meat.

Just after continuing my personal 'fat shaming story' and before I led the thread down the path of cullinary unrighteousness by…

Yep...and tobacco products. And they do check. And they do yell from the checkout to the supervisor that someone's here with…

If it's any help, the last time I looked emergency vouchers issued by certain welfare agencies, redeemable at Pak'nSave, were endorsed to prevent their being used to purchase booze.

Thank you for that. Someone pointed me to it the other day, it's a superb piece of work.

More public housing affordable to those on benefits or in low-paying employment would give greater security of accommodation.

Prioritising pedestrian and cycle access…

Nope. It's the easiest way.

LOL.

My chocolate cake has no butter – 1/2 cup of vegetable oil instead. 2 cups of sugar – yes. No, it’s not particularly healthy food but it’s an extremely cheap treat weight/ volume wise if compared to say, candy…

But it is not irrelevant – too much sugar is a killer – a slow one, with a whole lot of misery along the way, but…

As opposed to This. Is. Something.?

I have made constructive suggestions. Perhaps you'd like to be constructive also.

You also mentioned delicious chocolate cake. Coincidentally, I made two of those last night between comments, and in doing so got a reminder about how much butter and sugar goes into them. Nobody here has so far mentioned the…

I'm not doing anything "for the sake of it". I'm perfectly sincere when I say that your approach to this issue makes me really uncomfortable.

That's because I think it's complicated; if you tax "crap", what else can people eat? Will other, healthier foods be forced to become correspondingly cheaper? Will primary caregivers be given time off work to cook healthier meals for…

Okay.

Let's. Do. Nothing.

SNAFU.

So, you want to make food more expensive for…

Deconstructing is not thinking – it's analysing, then criticising – and in this case, it seems to me, for the sake of it.

Who'd a thought homemade pasta sauce could become…

Your ideas on preventing serious tooth decay in preschoolers?

I hope you can see how insulting this is. Your life may be simple, probably because you have…

Could I suggest instead perhaps more thought could be used here? Your experiences are not the experiences of…

You will have to forgive me, I'm a fanatic in the kitchen.

Kill two birds with one stone. I make a point of cooking and baking with all my grandchildren – they love it…

I see bottled bolognese sauce as a kind of gateway drug to cooking for…

I find it hard to engage in many threads in which I am interested because I can't be bothered deconstructing large numbers of blanket assertions I find problematic. I'm not sure…

Again, the socio-economic gap is identified as a significant factor. Claiming that this is all about "education and awarenesss" implies that Maori are entirely the authors of their own misfortune.

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/lifestyle/news/article.cfm?c_id=6&objectid=11540665

It's not an age thing – I mentioned my sister earlier – she's 62. It's a convenience thing for her. And I kind of agree with the time poverty argument, but…

http://www.radionz.co.nz/news/te-manu-korihi/281014/intervention-vital-to-curb-maori-obesity

"We are modelling the sorts of foods we want our children to chose and limiting the marketing of unhealthy foods and drinks to children and families."
She also wanted the Government to tax sugary drinks.…

Whangarei woman Flo Higgins, 53, was diagnosed with type 1 diabetes only two years ago. She was not surprised Maori were more…

Which is a bit like claiming that the grotesque disproportion of Maori prison inmates is all due to their lack of "awareness" of good old middle-class busybody values. This from the link you've provided:
"Sam Bartrum, acting chief executive of Northland DHB, said the statistics…

Because not everyone has the time to chop everything and reduce a tomato sauce for 45 minutes after work while their kids…

Recently, there was a study about how eating healthily now costs three times as much as it would have done 10 years ago, but food prices are far from the only issue. For the purposes of…

right at the start I expressed my doubts about officially labelling kids as fat, there's a high probability of unintended consequences from that, far better to change the culture to one where most food is healthy and most people exercise routinely.…

You can make a one-off donation of any amount or provide ongoing support for a child for $15/month.

Perhaps, Danielle, you could elaborate on that? I would not want to take from that what was not intended.

And no-one one talking about accosting anyone.…