Hard News by Russell Brown

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Hard News: Hobbit Wars

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  • BenWilson,

    I suppose this is why you and I both are contractors by choice.

    Yes, it's also why I hover right on the cusp of that even scarier capitalist institution, the Capitalist. Not long now...

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 10657 posts Report Reply

  • Russell Brown,

    Hmmm. It appears that The Standard has assigned me a side in the class war. Sigh ...

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 22850 posts Report Reply

  • Sofie Bribiesca,

    you can always bring up your entry in the IMDb.

    You gotta look once eh? There is only about 5 of my family, but a few others would be relatives also. :)

    here and there. • Since Nov 2007 • 6796 posts Report Reply

  • Nick Shand,

    Peter Jackson has perceived this saber rattling from the MEAA as a threat to all Hobbits. But perhaps what we are witnessing is the MEAA's NZ death rattle.

    That the MEAA have let their legal incorporated society status lapse may neither be a conspiracy or moronic incompetence, just simply a lack members willing to do the often thankless administrative work.

    As a staunch unionist through the years I have come to appreciate how unions and incorporated societies are only as strong as the quality of active members they have and can continue to attract.

    It is difficult for me to believe that the MEAA will attract significant new NZ members with this 'clumsy' attack on a film industry hero. It is also likely to lose members if its own internal communications have been as clumsy as its public ones. Therefore what we may be witnessing is the death of a union and my heart felt sympathies go out to all who have cared passionately for the MEAA and its NZ predecessors.

    auck • Since Aug 2008 • 79 posts Report Reply

  • Russell Brown,

    Nick, perhaps you could go and argue that at The Standard too. I've given up. And I'm actually feeling somewhat upset at the nature of my interaction there. Seriously, fuck that.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 22850 posts Report Reply

  • Jackie Clark,

    You sound pissed off, Russell. Come for a drink at the Neighbourhood bar.

    Mt Eden, Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 3136 posts Report Reply

  • BenWilson,

    Hmmm. It appears that The Standard has assigned me a side in the class war.

    I'm definitely feeling a thick fog of class war around this whole issue. As with most wars, the grunts are the ones who will actually die, and the civilians.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 10657 posts Report Reply

  • Nick Shand,

    Hmmm how unlike Russel Brown to be flustered by arguments on teh forums.

    Key to union participation is loyalty. As job loyalty has declined so have unions in New Zealand. This was the main premise of a paper I wrote for a sociology class I took a few years back.

    In my opinion Peter Jackson will command an insurmountable amount of loyalty for the good he has done in New Zealand.

    The MEAA is clumsy to challenge his loyalty. Our loyalty to one union should not automatically equate to loyalty for all. Unions should first prove competence before we stand by them.

    But now that the bandwagon has been rickety rolled out, the political point scoring circus begins and all perspectives (no matter how lucid) will receive the 'whose side are you on' distortion.

    Yet it is a fine thing that Russel Brown will retain the loyalty he has earned through years of service to bfm listeners and public address readers alike, no matter how he is now being framed at The Standard.

    auck • Since Aug 2008 • 79 posts Report Reply

  • Islander,

    Um, Nick Shand, I wouldnt be too sure that "Peter Jackson will command an insurmountable amount of loyalty for the good he has done for New Zealand."

    The 'good' is ephemeral (and has mainly been downstream for tourism interests - that's been fine for owners & workers in that industry BUT it has longterm local problems (ratepayers being stuck with charges for tourist-shit is how I bluntly put it.)) Yes: Weta has certainly heightened a profile for CGI workers- but it hasnt heightened any other art product that is made in ANZ.

    Quite a wee few of us dont see Peter Jackson as the great ANZ good-doer - but as someone who is extremely hardworking/good at a sort of teambuilding/ and really really self-indulgent. And we dont see him as actually *helping* ANZ films/film projects.

    Just his own.

    Big O, Mahitahi, Te Wahi … • Since Feb 2007 • 5643 posts Report Reply

  • Russell Brown,

    Hmmm how unlike Russel Brown to be flustered by arguments on teh forums.

    I'm tired and stressed, the house is literally in pieces around me and I have to drag myself out to read something quite personal to a whole lot of people I don't know at an earthquake relief fundraiser. Being called a class traitor when I'm trying to respond in good faith to an earlier slagging didn't make me feel great ...

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 22850 posts Report Reply

  • Russell Brown,

    And we dont see him as actually *helping* ANZ films/film projects.

    Just his own.

    I suppose his long-term financial and practical support for 48 Hours and other grassroots projects doesn't count, then?

    I've certainly had my criticisms of him, but, c'mon ...

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 22850 posts Report Reply

  • Jonathan King,

    @Islander " we dont see him as actually *helping* ANZ films/film projects."

    As someone who has made two feature films in NZ that would not have been made if not for support from Peter Jackson (and, for that matter, Richard Taylor) both in indirect ways -- service from Weta Workshop, Park Road Post, Stone Street Studios at dedication and rates FAR below their international 'worth' -- and in some extraordinary direct ways FAR, FAR above and beyond the call of duty I can categorically say that is complete bullshit.

    Since Sep 2010 • 185 posts Report Reply

  • Islander,

    Annnd, what precisely has come out of the 48 Hours (which is visible to the wider non-involved ANZ public?)

    "Grassroots projects"? Love to know about 'em.

    Answer apopo - or the next day - you're obviously feeling stretched, and I'm not all that hungry for the answers. (= Peter Jackson does not count in my world, at all.)

    Big O, Mahitahi, Te Wahi … • Since Feb 2007 • 5643 posts Report Reply

  • Islander,

    Jonathan King, I'm aware of your 2 films.
    And they did?

    My comment is NOT complete bullshit: it is the *perception* that quite a few people working in creative areas, have-

    and, o yes, I have my own opinion of Richard Taylor.

    Big O, Mahitahi, Te Wahi … • Since Feb 2007 • 5643 posts Report Reply

  • Jonathan King,

    What do you mean 'and they did'? What business did they do?

    Since Sep 2010 • 185 posts Report Reply

  • Jonathan King,

    Well, I've just told you they do help NZ films in significant ways ... so would that change your perception?

    Since Sep 2010 • 185 posts Report Reply

  • Craig Ranapia,

    Hmmm. It appears that The Standard has assigned me a side in the class war. Sigh ...

    The bad company we keep, ay mate. I know who my friends and my enemies are and the contempt of the Sub-Standard/Kiwibog Axis of Idiocy is a badge of honour. Don't let the d-bags get you down; you're top shelf.

    The 'good' is ephemeral

    ETA: Jonathan King put it better than I could. Snap and snaps!

    My comment is NOT complete bullshit: it is the *perception* that quite a few people working in creative areas, have-

    With all due and sincere respect, Islander, I don't think anyone is calling you a liar. But perhaps we could pay Jonathan the same courtesy? And to be honest, I'm sure there's been plenty of smack talked about you over the years which you're sensible enough to (as Barack Obama puts it) brush off.

    If you want a concrete example, Weta Digital and The Film Unit (along with a lot of other people) did post-production work on Two Cars, One Night and I understand did so at a heavily discounted rate negotiated with producer Ainsley Gardner. Please don't patronisingly dismiss that as "ephemeral" or meaningless.

    North Shore, Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 12370 posts Report Reply

  • Nick Shand,

    Islander, um, I am a film addict so please accept that my perspective is one of suspended disbelief at Peter Jackson's achievements.

    Loyalty can be insurmountable when defenders flock to a banner being raised from all the most unexpected places. I believe this is what will be achieved by Jackson's response to the threat to his project. He will receive an undercurrent of support that will quietly undermine the opposition from all sides.

    I predict he will receive more help from the New Zealand public than within the industry itself. Please know that I am not speaking of the Nats and anti-unionists but the more amiable voices of whanau and friends.

    A whispering of voices all pleading "Don't you want the Hobbit to be filmed in New Zealand? Don't you want to be in the Hobbit?"

    auck • Since Aug 2008 • 79 posts Report Reply

  • Craig Ranapia,

    A whispering of voices all pleading "Don't you want the Hobbit to be filmed in New Zealand? Don't you want to be in the Hobbit?"

    And for the second time today, I'm out of here before I say something really toxic that I'll live to regret.

    North Shore, Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 12370 posts Report Reply

  • Islander,

    All I can say- to both Craig R and Nick Shand - is, we will see.

    Jonathan King- no. You've told me that Peter Jackson (& Richard Taylor & associated studio bodies) have helped your 2 films to get made. Did they help with - what is truly the essential matter - in getting your films out onto the world's screens? Are your films in dvd format? Accessible as downloads?

    While I am truly ambivalent about e-books, film is another matter. It is much more controllable (you dont have bloody Google scanning your titles!) and could provide a good revenue stream for everyone involved.

    Big O, Mahitahi, Te Wahi … • Since Feb 2007 • 5643 posts Report Reply

  • Islander,

    Craig R - apropos your last post - I certainly wouldnt have dismissed
    Weta Digital's involvment with Two Cars, One Night if I had known about it.

    Big O, Mahitahi, Te Wahi … • Since Feb 2007 • 5643 posts Report Reply

  • Nick Shand,

    ha ha ha Craig Ranapia you take teh forums too seriously

    my comment you quoted was a bit of a wind up. My bad

    auck • Since Aug 2008 • 79 posts Report Reply

  • Jonathan King,

    No, they haven't directly helped get the films out there ... But, after the help they have given me, I don't really think that is something I could expect from them. (And, other than Peter Jackson, say, "presenting" one of my films, I don't know what they can actually do.)

    I'm not sure where you're going with the other stuff ... Yes, my films are out on DVD. Yes, they are accessible as downloads -- a lot more illegal, but easily available, ones than legal. We don't have Google scanning our books, but we do have people ripping our DVDs and putting up torrents of the films. Not controllable, not a revenue stream.

    But this aspect is an issue that I -- and lots of other filmmakers -- are thinking ( having to think ) about ... but the problem is grave for independent film and the answers still hard to find.

    Since Sep 2010 • 185 posts Report Reply

  • Jan Farr,

    While I am truly ambivalent about e-books,

    It's another topic I know - sorry Russell - but there has to be a way to compensate authors for e-books. It's incredibly cheap for the publishers - one copy to please them all (see I'm sort of staying on topic) - and it is SO convenient for the reader (I LOVE them - I have a library on my little ipod) - and also quite a bit cheaper. It should be possible to sell heaps more books - and therefore better returns for you and others, dear Islander.

    Carterton • Since Apr 2008 • 395 posts Report Reply

  • Samuel Scott,

    Oh dear - I don't know if I should have read those 5 pages of comments...

    a few things that I can't resist commenting on;

    Someone suggested that if actors unions were too strong it would put agents out of their jobs. I really don't have any connection to the world of actors but it takes only a distant interest in film to know that both SAG and Hollywood agents are both very powerful in the US film industry.

    Also, there have been a few comments about actors getting paid very poorly for these sort of films in the hope might lead to work on US productions. I have nothing against actor seeking collective contracts or better working conditions, that is any unions perogative (and I think Russell was pretty clear about not being against what MEAA is seeking, but its process and validity as a legal union at question)....BUUUUUT I really doubt supporting cast actors in the LOTRs films were getting paid peanuts, I know being a featured extra was a pretty well paid days work - not crazy money, but worth the horrible hours anyway.

    It was also suggested that being in these sorts of films doesn't lead to SAG membership or roles in US made features. Well, sure it might not, but it certainly did for a bunch of people in LOTRs. It probably doesn't hurt your chances of getting small roles in the next Lucas/Cameron megafilm to come downunder. And every actor loves dancing in spandex in front of a big green wall right?

    Obviously NZ actors deserve to be treated by respect by the US studios that come here to make films, but we should sensible in understanding why those films come here; value for money. If NZ crews were shit, they wouldn't come here, if they were expensive, they wouldn't come here.

    And NZ film rates (for crew, post-production, actors etc), while low compared to other countries perhaps, they are a bloody good payday for a lot of people .

    Man, I don't really feel like hitting reply. Its a subject I know very little about other than having a lot of very close friends working on these productions...and I apologise for not 'quoting' when responding to stuff, I am a lazy late to the argument lurker.

    South Wellington • Since Feb 2008 • 315 posts Report Reply

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