Up Front: Towards a Sex-Positive Utopia
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a male singer marketed to teenager *girls* as aggressively masculine. There must be some
I'm thinking Usher, early 2000s.
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Peter Darlington, in reply to
Not that he wasn't hot, in a 'I will eat fried eggs off a hooker's ass' kind of way,
Teh awesome.
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Sacha, in reply to
perfect skin
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Russell Brown, in reply to
Well, not if moppetry is what’s being actively marketed to them, no. I’m struggling to come up with a male singer marketed to teenager *girls* as aggressively masculine. There must be some.
Not all that many -- Elvis would be the outstanding example, but he was pretty too. But 13 yo boys aren't exactly hairy-chested beasts either. Maybe that's just what girls are comfortable with at that age.
BTW, I had a Twitter conversation a while ago with a teenaged trans-man (who I'd mistaken for a lesbian) who was sporting both a Justin Bieber haircut and a Justin Bieber t-shirt. That was quite meta.
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Tom Beard, in reply to
I’m struggling to come up with a male singer marketed to teenager *girls* as aggressively masculine.
While I'm not exactly an expert on the subject, weren't most boy bands of the last 20 years carefully constructed to include at least one "bad boy" alongside the pretty ones? Not so much a square-jawed Clutch Cargo stereotype of robust mature masculinity, but at least a less unthreatening quasi-rebel in the James Dean/early Brando mold?
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Moz, in reply to
> what would happen if this semi-fulfilment was deconstructed?
Occupy?Which did actually have its share of young teenagers hanging around gazing wistfully at people. There was also a certain amount* of youthful hormone-driven behaviour in the older teenagers.
I'm torn between the idea that teenage silly-sexuality is a product of our recent prolonged childhood, and that it's inherent in being that age. I suspect how it comes out is much more socially affected than whether it exists, but I'm not sure.
* lots
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George Darroch, in reply to
BTW, I had a Twitter conversation a while ago with a teenaged trans-man (who I’d mistaken for a lesbian) who was sporting both a Justin Bieber haircut and a Justin Bieber t-shirt. That was quite meta.
Beautiful. Existing in that wonderful meta-zone, bebians are an ironic meme.
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Sacha, in reply to
at least one "bad boy" alongside the pretty ones?
Scary Spice
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BenWilson, in reply to
We know that in families and countries where sex is openly discussed and less taboo, teenagers have sex later, rather than earlier.
As one such teenager, I can honestly say that part about it really sucked.
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^correction: biebians.
I suspect that much of the bile that gets sent the way of Bieber is in part because he doesn't act out the narrow definition of what a successful male (at even a young age) is supposed to fit.
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Bart Janssen, in reply to
We know that in families and countries where sex is openly discussed and less taboo, teenagers have sex later, rather than earlier.
My mother cruelly told me that sex was much more enjoyable when you loved the person you were bonking. I missed out on much meaningless cheap sex because of that!
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Aidan, in reply to
Mass hysteria, whatever the focus, makes me fucking uncomfortable.
Oh I dunno. I recall being one of many in a frankly fucking awesome Violent Femmes gig in Wellington (1992?). The energy in that crowd was incredible. All singing along ... they'd hold off on a line, we'd sing, they'd laugh, the crowd was euphoric.
I don't understand others obsessions, but I can relate to the experience.
Not that this has a great deal to do with the topic of this post ....
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Emma Hart, in reply to
The energy in that crowd was incredible. All singing along ... they'd hold off on a line, we'd sing, they'd laugh, the crowd was euphoric.
Yeah, but you'd sing, right? You weren't screaming so hard you couldn't actually hear any of the music.
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Sacha, in reply to
the crowd was euphoric
dancefloors
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Euan Mason, in reply to
Our culture is still adjusting to decoupling sex from reproduction, and it has a long way to go yet. The project is only 50 years old, after all. Two generations. My parents were the fourth generation out of England and still called it home.
"My mother cruelly told me that sex was much more enjoyable when you loved the person you were bonking."
Call me old fashioned, but I still find that's true, all other things being equal. The key word is "more", however. I'm not dissing sex without love, but there's a helluva lot more to sex than just physicality and love adds spice (as do some other things). So why did your mother say that this notion justified waiting for love before dispensing with your virginity?
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Sorry to jack your thread. Back to Roman-porn...
I like the idea of a utopian, inclusive, sex-positive society (even if I quibble over some of the details), but I'm not sure how we get there. A series of thousands of minor steps, or a sexual revolution. The former seems more likely, but then I think about how far towards a society that accepts queer and other sexual practices we've come in just a few decades. These are long decades, of course, and we're a very long way from where we need to be. But in the scope of human history (thousands of years), rather rapid changes.
I'm looking forward to male hormonal contraception being widely available. While I don't think it will have anywhere near the effect of female contraception - which I hold responsible for invigorating the great majority of post-1950 change - I think it will further our ability to reconceptualise sex. Other technologies which reconfigure the body, such as gender reassignment technologies (surgery, hormones, and others) are further expanding our scope. I'm not a techno-utopian by any means, and the Romans certainly made do without, but different things change the pressures felt by different members of society.
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Emma Hart, in reply to
Call me old fashioned, but I still find that's true, all other things being equal.
"All other things being equal" is a pretty bloody big caveat though, isn't it? And doesn't it basically make that statement both impossible to disagree with and basically meaningless?
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Emma Hart, in reply to
but I'm not sure how we get there.
I am seriously considering moving on to this next week. I have some ideas. So, I'm betting, do you guys.
I'm looking forward to male hormonal contraception being widely available.
The best birth control in the world is for men. But yes, it's not available yet.
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Euan Mason, in reply to
It couldn't possibly be true without the caveat, otherwise we're signing up to a "love trumps all" argument, which is doomed. Bart's mother was right, but she left a lot out, and delaying sex in order to wait for love wasn't a logical conclusion. In my view the "wait for love" argument hails from a time when sex carried a high risk of pregnancy. She would have been better to add something like, "Use contraception until such time as your relationship is so tight that you and your partner agree to have a child. In the meantime, enjoy yourself".
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Gee, in reply to
If we can combine that with a socialist utopia in which everyone gets paid properly & protected in their work environment, and those with specific needs who can't otherwise afford it are taken care of via government vouchers, it'll be perfect!
+1
I'm struggling to come up with a male singer marketed to teenager *girls* as aggressively masculine. There must be some.
Kurt Cobain? Trent Reznor? Axl Rose? tho admittedly both aimed at boys/men too...
maybe Anthony Keidis and Flea? Or was that just me? -
Aidan, in reply to
dancefloors
squeegee-mops
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Mass hysteria sexual mashup:
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Aidan, in reply to
Yeah, but you’d sing, right? You weren’t screaming so hard you couldn’t actually hear any of the music.
The music was very loud.
I've tut-tutted with the best of them about stupid teen obsessions, but it occurred to me that one of the most memorable experiences in my ever-lengthening life was that concert, and the group dynamic was very much part of that.
Maybe that shared experience thing is what they're in it for as well?
Random obligatory anecdote: my aunt told me she went to see The Beatles in Wellington (50s?). She screamed and she didn't really know why, at the time, or 40 years later.
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3410,
The Beatles in Wellington (50s?)
22nd & 23rd June, 1964. :)
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There would still be sexually-explicit imagery. There always has been and there always should be. I just don't know if you still call it "pornography" when it's not stigmatised.
I have a genuine question. In a sex-positive utopia, would the content of pornography be any different?
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