Polity by Rob Salmond

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Polity: Refugees and aid - we’re laggards

143 Responses

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  • Gould S, in reply to linger,

    You have a valid point – that the purpose of this outlet is to form discussions. My perspective aligns perfectly with Lucy’s above perspective.

    Are you able to directly answer my questions linger? That is what I seek by participating in this online discussion.

    * the spark in debate, especially on the public address forum, has bought me to question –

    *what do you do to help when they get here?

    It is all very good to say you “want” NZ Govt to help more refugees,

    * but once they arrive do you do anything?
    *Do you do anything to assist the government and NGO’s to integrate these strangers into a ‘foreign’ society?

    It takes a village to raise a child, right? Well walk the talk you talk! You do know these are human lives, so its not an instant fix. It takes a lifetime to build a life!

    * But do you dedicate any of yours to helping theirs?

    auckland • Since Sep 2015 • 5 posts Report Reply

  • linger,

    Do I, for example, spend any of my free time volunteering as a teacher to help migrants develop their English skills and thereby land suitable jobs? Funny you should ask. But it’s not that relevant. You exaggerate the amount of ongoing effort required to help refugees – who, by and large, make a huge amount of effort themselves to integrate, and need, first, our acceptance in order to allow them to succeed in that.

    Tokyo • Since Apr 2007 • 1938 posts Report Reply

  • Steve Barnes, in reply to Gould S,

    Maybe with the 750 refugees arriving over the next two years, people could stop playing keyboard warrior and actually do some work.

    You keep making these assumptions when you have absolutely nothing to back them up with, you haven't a clue as to what I do and I resent your attitude.

    Peria • Since Dec 2006 • 5521 posts Report Reply

  • Steve Barnes, in reply to linger,

    Oh, not again! This argument wasn’t sound the first time it appeared in this thread.

    From the same troll. I have reported the tosser, he will keep coming back though, he has nothing better to do with his time obviously.

    Peria • Since Dec 2006 • 5521 posts Report Reply

  • Ian Dalziel, in reply to Gould S,

    what do you do to help when they get here?

    Gee Daman, how can I ever prove to you that I too have my place in the scheme of things, perhaps not as proactive as Bishop Brian Tamaki, who couldn't wait for them to get here - he just flew directly to Greece to sort things out - What a guy! What a Christian! What a dick...

    Christchurch • Since Dec 2006 • 7948 posts Report Reply

  • Joe Wylie, in reply to Ian Dalziel,

    flat earth • Since Jan 2007 • 4593 posts Report Reply

  • Shona Francis, in reply to Saud Al,

    Accepting refugees who have something to contribute to our country such as qualified skills - I'm okay with that.
    We could do with an economic boost. However accepting 600+ at one time will strain our current economy until refugees find work or are efficient in English.

    Auckland • Since Sep 2015 • 1 posts Report Reply

  • Saud Al, in reply to Shona Francis,

    I agree with you I do not think it should be at once but, in less time frame than two years.
    Government can make a deal with the refugees to send them to work in the labor work, where there is lack or workers, such as, Christchurch to help in the re built and pay them slightly less than the normal worker but not to the stage that it will make them have a poor life.

    Auckland • Since Sep 2015 • 3 posts Report Reply

  • Steve Barnes, in reply to Shona Francis,

    However accepting 600+ at one time will strain our current economy until refugees find work or are efficient in English.

    As many have said before most Syrians already speak English, among quite a few other languages too. If 600 people will strain our economy then our economy is already in dire straits, which it may well be but our current Government is adamant that it is OK, in fact it is a Rock Star economy, which would, I guess, make it Mark Knopfler, a Rock Star in Dire Straits.

    Government can make a deal with the refugees to send them to work in the labor work, where there is lack or workers, such as, Christchurch to help in the re built and pay them slightly less than the normal worker but not to the stage that it will make them have a poor life.

    "The German slogan 'Arbeit Macht Frei' is somewhat tainted by its connection with Nazi concentration camps, but its essential message, 'work sets you free' still has something serious to commend it."
    Almost a Godwin...

    Peria • Since Dec 2006 • 5521 posts Report Reply

  • chris, in reply to Steve Barnes,

    As many have said before most Syrians already speak English, among quite a few other languages too.

    Incidentally migrants on partner visas or family reunification visas aren’t required to speak English. Our family reunification visa system may have its issues but the lack of English language proficiency is not chief amongst them. Were English not the global lingua franca these persistent trivial objections you're patient enough to respond to might be less comical:

    In one recent two-hour class, a twentysomething American teacher led a dozen advanced students through their grammar lessons by asking them to recount how they spent their weekend. There was a familiar refrain in the classroom as one student after another said she spent her time watching television—tuned not to Al Jazeera or another of the Arabic satellite channels, but rather to that juggernaut of daytime TV, The Oprah Winfrey Show.

    Deena, a veiled 20-year-old Damascus University student, cheerfully explained the extent of Oprah’s influence over Syrians both male and female. To them, the queen of American pop culture, who sits down with politicians and Brad Pitt alike, represents everything that’s missing in Syrian society today. “On Oprah, everyone speaks freely about whatever they like,” Deena said. “They talk about sex, politics, family, all their problems in life. In Syria, we also all have these problems, but we can’t talk about them—that’s our biggest problem."

    Even ISIS are in on it.

    As Maz said 8 days ago:

    Net migration to NZ was approx 60000 last year. “Where are they all going to live? What will they do? What about the language barrier?”
    And we’re squabbling about a few hundred refugees; shameful and pathetic. We could take tens of thousands, if we just cut back a little on normal immigration.

    Mawkland • Since Jan 2010 • 1302 posts Report Reply

  • eo1993,

    I believe that New Zealand can defiantly handle more than 600 refugees taking these 600 over the next few years is not the impact we need. I believe we need to take more of an immediate action. I agree with the above comment from Steve suggesting that if our economy is going to become to strain from 600 people we are already in a dire situation. I find it hard to believe that if these country’s that have been mentioned above are able to take these large amounts of refugees and New Zealand is not. In 28 years we have not changed our quota for the number of refugees we take each year. The fact that we are also spending a pathetic amount in regards aid to the refuges. Our country has plenty of space for more people. These refuges are willing to work. They are capable people that are in need of a place to live safely. We as a country need a to make a choice to make a difference and convince the government to make more changes. People are always willing to volunteer and help. If there is a debate about weather they can speak English it has been made clear that many of them already speak English. It is up to the public now to make sure that as the news begins to shy away from this issue that we keep it active. The public must continue to put pressure on the government to make more changes and help these people.

    auckland • Since Sep 2015 • 1 posts Report Reply

  • steven crawford, in reply to Shona Francis,

    Accepting refugees who have something to contribute to our country such as qualified skills – I’m okay with that.
    We could do with an economic boost. However accepting 600+ at one time will strain our current economy until refugees find work or are efficient in English.

    Considering you have no idea what the word refugee means, you might want to brush up on your own speaking English ability before neglecting other people to death.

    Atlantis • Since Nov 2006 • 4442 posts Report Reply

  • linger, in reply to steven crawford,

    But isn’t it wonderful to suddenly have so many newly-registered first-time posters? (The irony of not feeling automatically able to welcome them all, on this thread especially, is not lost on me. Post-Troll Suspicion Disorder, eh.)

    Tokyo • Since Apr 2007 • 1938 posts Report Reply

  • Amy Gale,

    Important lesson (take note, Unitec): if you are a communications department setting an assignment to "go online and damage a brand", do be careful to specify "not our brand, though!".

    tha Ith • Since May 2007 • 471 posts Report Reply

  • linger, in reply to Amy Gale,

    I suspect the assignment was something like “join an online argument”, rather than anything going more directly against the institutional code of conduct; but it would have been nice if they’d also provided some clear guidelines for what constitutes a constructive argument, and it would have been even better if their tutors had helped provide moderation. I don’t necessarily blame the students, but there’s been a failure of oversight in setting them loose here. There are strict ethical guidelines for community-based fieldwork, and those should apply to online communities too.

    Tokyo • Since Apr 2007 • 1938 posts Report Reply

  • David Hood,

    And so we mark our calendars for September 2016 to see what next years iteration of the class brings.

    Dunedin • Since May 2007 • 1445 posts Report Reply

  • Bart Janssen, in reply to Amy Gale,

    Important lesson (take note, Unitec): if you are a communications department setting an assignment to “go online and damage a brand”, do be careful to specify “not our brand, though!”.

    I'd like some alone time with the teacher that set that assignment to discuss the pros and cons of such a project.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 4460 posts Report Reply

  • Steve Barnes,

    “Give me your tired, your poor, your huddled masses yearning to breathe free.”

    Well, that worked out just fine for the US, the country that John Key idolises but, Nah, we can't afford it. Apparently we need more billionaire businessmen, regardless of who they are or where they come from.

    Taumarunui needs refugees.

    Peria • Since Dec 2006 • 5521 posts Report Reply

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