Hard News by Russell Brown

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Hard News: Sunday newspaper prints informative and well-researched story

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  • Don Christie,

    As well as being a West Ham fan (which automatically makes him a good bloke)

    It probably also makes him a bloke who after this season's shenanigans by the Hammers, is crying into a warm pint of flat beer.

    Ah, sport, sense the relief.

    Wellington • Since Nov 2006 • 1645 posts Report Reply

  • Craig Ranapia,

    Peter Darlington wrote:
    Between JB and Pamela Stirling, the Listener needs a bit of a sort out tbh.

    Yes, and if some people in the comments box have their way Jane Clifton and Joanne Black need a good purging because of the ideologically unsound jobs of their respective spouses/long-term partner. Which strikes me as relevant as the recent revelation (courtesy of the DomPost) that Helen Clark's chief press secretary and former RNZ chief reporter Kathryn Street is not only *gasp* a LESBIAN, but the partner of MP/unionist/'close friend and political ally' of the PM (nudge nudge, wink wink)/and mistress of the vast left-wing lesbian conspiracy Maryann Street.

    I know Wellywood is a small town, and there's always some inter-breeding going down, but let's get a grip. It is 2007 isn't it - and we do let women think for themselves and hold jobs without a permission slip from their father or husband/de facto/CUP-cake/'friend with benefits'?

    Not for the first time, I have to wonder if the loony left and the rabid right were separated at birth - and the surgeons had to split a brain that wasn't that active to start with.

    North Shore, Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 12370 posts Report Reply

  • Russell Brown,

    There is also the fact that because it's a now issue, delaying it would miss the point of it.

    This was the reasoning, IIRC, for the decision not to conduct Stage 3 trials.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 22850 posts Report Reply

  • James Green,

    This was the reasoning, IIRC, for the decision not to conduct Stage 3 trials.

    It harks back further as well. (I didn't have time to add this to my post earlier.) Austin Bradford Hill's (co-discoverer of the smoking-lung cancer link, and reknowned epidemiologist) famous paper concludes that there are times for acting boldly. As summarised elsewhere his paper argued "Policy actions that appear to create a net benefit (on average, considering all costs and benefits) should be taken, even without statistical "proof" of an association, while actions that entail great costs should only be taken with sufficient certainty of substantial benefit". Also, in that same article, and of relevance to the PHARMAC discussion "The alternative to carrying out the policy analysis is to leave the weighing of costs and benefits to an unreliable post-science political process".

    As to whether the substantial cost of MeNZB outweighs (it's yet to be firmly ascertained) benefit, I can't comment. But basically, the message is that sometimes action can be justified before statistical evidence is collected.

    Limerick, Ireland • Since Nov 2006 • 703 posts Report Reply

  • Peter Darlington,

    Yes, and if some people in the comments box have their way Jane Clifton and Joanne Black need a good purging because of the ideologically unsound jobs of their respective spouses/long-term partner.

    Well, I live in the sticks and wouldn't have a clue who her belly warmer is. But God she's dull.

    Nelson • Since Nov 2006 • 949 posts Report Reply

  • Peter Darlington,

    It probably also makes him a bloke who after this season's shenanigans by the Hammers, is crying into a warm pint of flat beer.

    Crisis, I wish! This morning it descended into total farce. You do know our club song includes "..fortune's always hiding, I've looked everywhere..."?

    Honestly, we've only ourselves to blame.

    Nelson • Since Nov 2006 • 949 posts Report Reply

  • Heather Gaye,

    As well as being a West Ham fan (which automatically makes him a good bloke)

    You do know our club song includes "..fortune's always hiding, I've looked everywhere..."?

    It's vaguely heartening to discover I'm not the only one in this hemisphere grieving into my coffee. Group hug?

    Morningside • Since Nov 2006 • 533 posts Report Reply

  • Stephen Judd,

    On the MenzB front - that really troubled me. I downloaded the reports from the Ministry of Health, and it was very apparent from the breakdown of area, age, and ethnicity that basically a middle-class Pakeha child at primary school had a very low chance of contracting the disease, at least an order of magnitude less than the equivalent Polynesian child. (If I can dig up the numbers I ran, I'll post them).

    They didn't record the socio-economic status of those who did get the disease but I remember wondering whether the root cause wasn't inadequate and crowded housing, and wondering whether that just wasn't too much of an admission for a Labour government to make. In other words, we don't have a meningitis epidemic, we have a housing crisis, with meningitis as its symptom.

    Wellington • Since Nov 2006 • 3122 posts Report Reply

  • Peter Darlington,

    It's vaguely heartening to discover I'm not the only one in this hemisphere grieving into my coffee. Group hug?

    Heh, I'm shocked.

    Hugs are definitely called for, and a gentle pat, and a "there, there" wouldn't go amiss either.

    *sniffs*

    Nelson • Since Nov 2006 • 949 posts Report Reply

  • James Green,

    Stephen, if you can did out those numbers, I'd be extremely interested. My understanding is/was that MeB was transmitted the old-fashioned way (airborne bacteria/sharing drinks etc.), although I guess that doesn't preclude poor housing. Certainly, there seemed to be enough Pakeha cases iin the media (although perhaps that's skewed reporting!).

    Limerick, Ireland • Since Nov 2006 • 703 posts Report Reply

  • Stephen Judd,

    James, I can't find the spreadsheet I downloaded last time, but there is a lot of stuff still on the MOH site.

    I was just looking at this PDF. Go to page 25, "Incidence by Deprivation". In the under-fives, Decile 10 has a rate 5 times as high as decile 1 - even worse in the North Island.

    And a little light googling reveals that crowded housing and poor hygiene are risk factors. Yes, it's airborne, and no, the bacteria don't live long - that's precisely why overcrowding can make a big difference.

    I did find an old email I wrote to my ex, where I did some figuring:

    According to the graph in the PDF from the MOH of meningitis rates in NZ, Europeans 5-9 were about 5 in 100,000. The death rate is 4 out of 100 cases (leaving aside other complications). That means X's lottery chance of death is about 1 in 500,000.

    This is was in the context of an argument about the risks of vaccination. Basically, the risk of dying from bacterial meningitis IF you are an older Pakeha child is very low - although the risks of adverse reaction are even lower.

    *I am not a health person, I just to like read source material*.

    Wellington • Since Nov 2006 • 3122 posts Report Reply

  • Riddley Walker,

    yeah craig, but i don't think a PM's press sec is actually pretending to their audience that they're non-partisan?

    as for wholesale public particpation in pharmac decisions! have you noticed how attentive to fine detail the majority of the public is? they nearly voted The Don in as PM for the hope of an extra $10 back in tax. citizen's juries on the other hand might well be a good thing (if you're talking about the process of having a sample that are presented with all the arguments over a considerable period of time before they decide). it's true Pharmac need to improve their public image aplenty.

    AKL • Since Feb 2007 • 890 posts Report Reply

  • Craig Ranapia,

    BTW, when it come to bizarro Clint Rickards-related media, did anyone watch 60 Minutes and count the number of times he referred to himself in the third person? Unless you're the Queen or the Pope, that hits my ear as simply bizarre. If his media trainer is reading this, pass Clint a note.

    North Shore, Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 12370 posts Report Reply

  • Riddley Walker,

    maybe rickards is actually helen clark? it's rumoured that fran o'sulivan is actually garth george you know.

    but anyway, i hear ms coddington is about to get rather seriously whacked by the press council over her asian invasion hysteria piece.

    i wonder if she might be partisan?

    AKL • Since Feb 2007 • 890 posts Report Reply

  • Craig Ranapia,

    Riddley Walker wrote:
    yeah craig, but i don't think a PM's press sec is actually pretending to their audience that they're non-partisan?

    You're missing the point, Ridley - and I don't blame you. I think it's pretty fucking patronising - and more than a little sexist - to suggest Kathryn Ryan, Jane Clifton and Joanne Black are such mindless bimbos all they need is an orgasm and a bit of pillow talk, and they're putty in the hands of their evil significant others. What is this, Riddley, 1957 - when the way to man's heart is through his stomach; and the way to liquefy a woman's mind (if she ever had one) is through her knickers?

    North Shore, Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 12370 posts Report Reply

  • Craig Ranapia,

    Sorry, that should read Kathryn Street. Kathryn Ryan, of course, is the current host of Nine to Noon, and former National Radio political editor not current chief press secretary to the Prime Minister, and former RNZ chief reporter. (Sorry, not doing the rebranding. If you don't know what station I'm talking about, you probably don't care in the first place.)

    North Shore, Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 12370 posts Report Reply

  • Russell Brown,

    but anyway, i hear ms coddington is about to get rather seriously whacked by the press council over her asian invasion hysteria piece.

    Really? Wow. You actually have to mess up pretty badly to have the Press Council get angry at you.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 22850 posts Report Reply

  • Danyl Mclauchlan,

    Really? Wow. You actually have to mess up pretty badly to have the Press Council get angry at you.

    I believe the Press Gallery refused to give her accreditation to report from Parliament on the grounds that she cannot be considered a real journalist - I don't think she's wildly popular with her colleagues.

    Wellington • Since Nov 2006 • 927 posts Report Reply

  • Craig Ranapia,

    I believe the Press Gallery refused to give her accreditation to report from Parliament on the grounds that she cannot be considered a real journalist

    What next? Britney Spears doing psych assessments and drug/alcohol counselling for CYPFS? :) To be bluntly cynical, there's probably more 'real journalists' in the room when Kathryn Street has a staff meeting than there are accredited to the Press Gallery.

    North Shore, Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 12370 posts Report Reply

  • Neil Morrison,

    Pharmac's approach seems to be a good compromise but they wouldn't be doing this if there hadn't been the lobbying. The 52 weeks is an issue but the basics of the pro-Hercetpin case, that it should be used here in NZ for the early treatment of breast cancer, has been shown to have merit. And even though Dr Daniel Hind praises Pharmac his study did point out the economic justification for the 52 week treatment period.

    Since Nov 2006 • 932 posts Report Reply

  • Riddley Walker,

    it's a bit ironic that those who champion themselves as protectors of women's independence should then feel the need to sexualize the refutation. ho hum.

    none of this has anything to do with gender or the possible influences of 'an orgasm and a bit of pillow talk'. it would be just as crap if you had an outlet pretending to be non-partisan only its political reporter was helen clark's husband, its business columnist was a 'former' PR man for the CTU and its senior journalist and frequent political commentator was Margaret Wilson's husband.

    why Craig, you feel the need to assume this is somehow about the inferiority of women, or their supposed inability to to think independently of their partners is beyond me, unless its meant as an obfuscation, which i expect it is. the very presumption that this is about gender rather than conflict of interest is pretty patronizing to my mind.

    AKL • Since Feb 2007 • 890 posts Report Reply

  • Riddley Walker,

    having said all that, the Listener could avoid all these problems if they didn't just appoint cryptoconservative permanent staff with National or ACT associations.

    i'm sure it's just coincidence that Young still toes a freemarketist line to the letter, often to the point of absurdity.

    i'm sure it's just coincidence that Black trudges through anti-government redneck populist takes on every issue (from hitting kids to global warming to the joys of SUVs) and that the inaccuracies and misrepresentations she employs are really just reflections on her ability rather than ideology.

    and i'm sure it's just coincidence that while Clifton pretends to be 'even handed' in her cynicism, some how the anti-Labour criticisms are more vicious even when they're quite misleading or unfounded, while her 'anti'-National criticisms are comparatively mild and only surface when the scale of the cock-up being commented can nolonger be ignored if she is to maintain any fascade of credibilty.

    the whole issue of promoting political cynicism and voter disengagement, which she seems to do weekly (I wonder why she stays in the job if she hates it so much) is another bigger ball game, but can you guess which voters are most susceptible to alienation from vote participation? can you guess which parties benefit from the lower vote turn-outs engendered by ongoing exposure to hyper-cynical reportage? again, this is probably coincidence and drawing way too long a bow to assume any consciousness of this on Clifton's behalf, but it nonetheless suits the interests of her publishers.

    AKL • Since Feb 2007 • 890 posts Report Reply

  • Stephen Judd,

    Whenever I read finance journalism, I expect to see a disclosure of interest -- "Stephen Judd holds shares in Megacorp. Stephen Judd has been a consultant to Acme Industries." Readers can then make up their own minds as to the independence of the author.

    I would love to see that for political journalism. "X has shagged or may currently be shagging a person referred to in this article." That would go a long way towards transparency on an equally important topic.

    Wellington • Since Nov 2006 • 3122 posts Report Reply

  • ross f,

    > There is also the fact that because it's a now issue, delaying it would miss the point of it.

    But the so-called epidemic was already waning. Furthermore, half of the population could've been given the vaccine and the other not. So we'd have seen whether it worked or not. But that wasn't the case. The fact is, the death rate from meningococcal disease has skyrocketed since the introduction of the vaccine, and the MOH continues to mislead and decieve the public. Still, Chiron made a cool $140 million and one can only assume that some of the boffins associated with rollout of the vaccine here also made a tidy sum.

    wairarapa • Since Mar 2007 • 45 posts Report Reply

  • Lyndon Hood,

    Incidentally, did we see this from October?

    A pan-European cancer campaign was under intense scrutiny last night over the scale of involvement of the world's leading maker of cancer drugs.

    Cancer United, which is due to be launched with a fanfare in Brussels tomorrow, is being presented as a pioneering effort by a coalition of doctors, nurses and patients to push for equal access to cancer care across the EU. However, the campaign is being entirely funded by Roche, the maker of Herceptin and Avastin. A senior company executive sits on the board. The company's PR firm Weber Shandwick is the secretariat and has been heavily promoting it to clinicians and journalists. And the principal study on which it is based has been hotly contested - and was also funded by Roche.

    Wellington • Since Nov 2006 • 1115 posts Report Reply

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