Hard News by Russell Brown

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Hard News: Never mind the quality ...

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  • Sofie Bribiesca, in reply to Lucy Telfar Barnard,

    As Gower said to Key, casually, 'TV3 has had thousands of emails sent to them this morning" and then continued to press twat about Collins, my thought was ,those TV3 journos will be missing lunch today.... trawling ,trawling,trawling, keep those journos trawling.... need to understand them......those emails just keep comin'...raw hide!

    here and there. • Since Nov 2007 • 6796 posts Report Reply

  • Carol Stewart, in reply to Russell Brown,

    That editorial is a trainwreck.

    I might have to reinstate my subscription just to have the satisfaction of cancelling it again.

    Wellington • Since Jul 2008 • 825 posts Report Reply

  • nzlemming, in reply to Russell Brown,

    As with some recent past Listener editorials, it’s possibly either Pam Stirling, Jane Clifton or Bill Ralston. Joanne Black fits, but she bolted some time ago.

    Not Pamela. She doesn’t write them, but will have a a view on its conclusion.

    My money would be on Clifton. Not enough hyperbole for Ralston.

    Waikanae • Since Nov 2006 • 2933 posts Report Reply

  • Sofie Bribiesca, in reply to giovanni tiso,

    Jane Clifton’s piece in the same issue is a plane crashing into an erupting volcano.

    Da plane! Da plane! Da ....huh? boom!

    here and there. • Since Nov 2007 • 6796 posts Report Reply

  • SteveH, in reply to Lucy Telfar Barnard,

    In this case, though, I doubt very much that the PM’s office would have thought this was something they needed to bother the PM about while he was on holiday.

    Not only that, but the only justification for his staff not to bother the PM with this sort of thing is if they knew he would authorise it and would prefer not to be bothered, i.e. if his staff had standing orders to allow the SIS to release stuff to Slater. If there is any similar case where he was briefed then it's going to look pretty damning.

    Since Sep 2009 • 444 posts Report Reply

  • Rich of Observationz,

    Prime Ministers on holiday don’t ever have arrangements in place in case their Director of the SIS needs to contact them

    I'd actually believe that is the case, given that the NZSIS hasn't uncovered a single threat to national security in the 58 years it has existed, and has failed conspicuously to detect actual threats in their area of concern (Rainbow Warrior bombings, Israeli passport fraud).

    Back in Wellington • Since Nov 2006 • 5550 posts Report Reply

  • Lucy Telfar Barnard,

    Maybe, but I'm fairly certain that if something like the Rainbow Warrior happened now, there would be a way to at least let the PM know immediately after the fact.

    Wellington • Since Nov 2006 • 585 posts Report Reply

  • Chris Waugh, in reply to Rich of Observationz,

    and has failed conspicuously to detect actual threats in their area of concern (Rainbow Warrior bombings, Israeli passport fraud).

    Perhaps of tangential relevance.

    Wellington • Since Jan 2007 • 2401 posts Report Reply

  • blindjackdog, in reply to Russell Brown,

    trainwreck

    And comparing Hager to Assange is preposterous. Oh, they couch it nice and vaguely, but given their readership of increasingly befuddled and reactionary boomers, it seems to me like a pretty calculated slur against a member of their profession they might actually think to admire rather than slyly to defame.

    Since Nov 2007 • 40 posts Report Reply

  • blindjackdog, in reply to Carol Stewart,

    I might have to reinstate my subscription just to have the satisfaction of cancelling it again.

    +1

    (Lord, it's been nearly ten years since I ended that destructive relationship, and I've never felt better -- more confident, sure of myself, less consumed by rage and doubt....)

    Since Nov 2007 • 40 posts Report Reply

  • Craig Ranapia, in reply to giovanni tiso,

    The entirely predictable Listener editorial: “Hager, of course, is no less guilty than Slater of trying to exert influence on the political process.”

    Well, yes of course he bloody is. If anyone at The Listener is lurking hereabouts, I can state the blindingly obvious like it's a startlingly new insight into the meaning of life. And I'll lowball whoever is doing it now by at least 5%. My line is open...

    North Shore, Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 12370 posts Report Reply

  • izogi, in reply to Kumara Republic,

    Just heard the podcast below*

    Sheesh. That whole Morning Report interview could have been a National Party ad in itself. Suzie Ferguson might as well have just given him a podium.

    Wellington • Since Jan 2007 • 1139 posts Report Reply

  • WH,

    I just watched this John Campbell interview with Phil Goff. I've always thought of Phil Goff as a basically decent guy.

    John Key looks a bit rattled.

    Since Nov 2006 • 797 posts Report Reply

  • Tom Semmens,

    I might have to reinstate my subscription just to have the satisfaction of cancelling it again.

    The Listener used to be part of whatever it was that made up the fragile pickings of intellectual life in NZ, but no one even bothers discussing it anymore. It is just another "lifestyle" magazine printed on worse paper than North and South. I guess the people who wrecked it will claim they did it to save the magazine, but destroying the village to save it was, is and never will be good policy.

    Quite sad, really.

    Sevilla, Espana • Since Nov 2006 • 2217 posts Report Reply

  • Stephen R,

    Video of John Key (taken just after the SIS OIA was released to Cameron Slater) saying he'd been told by Tucker that he had to release it... It rather directly contradicts the "I was never told" message.

    http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/10411491/Keys-SIS-claims-contradicted-by-video

    Just .... I don't even.

    Wellington • Since Jul 2009 • 259 posts Report Reply

  • giovanni tiso, in reply to WH,

    I've always thought of Phil Goff as a basically decent guy.

    Okay, let's not say things we can never take back now.

    Wellington • Since Jun 2007 • 7473 posts Report Reply

  • izogi, in reply to Sofie Bribiesca,

    But, but, (my butt) he was on holiday now. say Harold

    And now Fairfax has dug up a video from days after the release, where John Key refers to having been briefed.

    "What happened is Warren Tucker didn't come to me, he went to his legal adviser and his legal advisers told him this is the process they have to follow and when he was going through that process it was at that point he told me he'd release it because he has to tell me that under the no-surprises doctrine," Key says on the recording.

    Wellington • Since Jan 2007 • 1139 posts Report Reply

  • izogi, in reply to Stephen R,

    Video of John Key

    Hey, you bet me too it. I should reload more frequently.

    Wellington • Since Jan 2007 • 1139 posts Report Reply

  • Stephen R, in reply to izogi,

    Hey, you bet me too it. I should reload more frequently.

    You added the damning transcript, so superior service slightly slower.

    Wellington • Since Jul 2009 • 259 posts Report Reply

  • Sofie Bribiesca, in reply to izogi,

    Hey, you bet me too it. I should reload more frequently.

    And I linked to the story at te Harold on t’other thread. I should reload more often!

    Also, we were saying the other day. Every day that JK says anything ,there will be another day he would have said a contradiction. If journalists dig they can find more I'm sure.

    here and there. • Since Nov 2007 • 6796 posts Report Reply

  • Pete George, in reply to WH,

    Phil Goff blatantly lied to Campbell.

    Campbell: Can I ask you a question? You were a leader of the Labour Party, up against and extraordinarily popular Prime Minister John Key.

    Did you ever seek to do what you’re accusing him of doing, or use your office to do it, which is to get really dirty behind the scenes, arms length?

    Goff: No no not at all…

    Campbell: Never, not once?

    Goff: No, no, because fundamentally to me the integrity of our political system is important.

    Goff has a history of misleading and leaking and accusing others of lying. He has been involved in:

    – Leaking and misleading over the Don Brash ‘gone by lunchtime’ statement in 2004.
    – His office leaks from MFAT in 2012 which led to a fight through the courts to hide the identity of the Labour associated leaker.
    – A Goff office leak led to the forced resignation of National MP Richard Worth in 2009.
    – Goff “appears to have broken the law by releasing pages from a suppressed Court of Inquiry report into the death of a Kiwi soldier in Afghanistan” in 2013.
    – Accused SIS director Warren Tucker of lying about briefing him in 2011.

    http://yournz.org/2014/08/22/goff-blatantly-lies-about-dirty-politics/

    Dunedin • Since Dec 2011 • 139 posts Report Reply

  • Pete George,

    Perhaps coincidental but the 'diry parties' - National, Labour and NZ First all went down in the latest NZ Herald poll.

    The 'clean' parties - Greens in p[articular, Conservatives, Maori Party, Act and United Future - all went up in the poll.

    Dunedin • Since Dec 2011 • 139 posts Report Reply

  • Lucy Telfar Barnard,

    Pete, I'm not sure that those leaks count as playing dirty behind the scenes. For a start, with the possible exception of the Richard Worth business, which I don't remember well, the other matters are all actually about politics. Those leaks were all things in which there was public interest.

    The problem with the SIS release of documents on Goff to Slater is not that the documents were released - it is with the fact they were released only to Slater, and that the PM's office was apparently involved in advising Slater on just how to ask to get them; and the current possibility that Key has lied about whether his office had anything to do with that release.

    I'm not arguing Goff is squeaky clean - I really never got a sense of what he was like at all, which was part of the problem with his leadership - but leaking doesn't count as dirty politics all on its own.

    Wellington • Since Nov 2006 • 585 posts Report Reply

  • Stephen R,

    My recollection is that nice Mr Key was saying that David Cunliffe couldn't be trusted to run the country because he couldn't remember a letter he wrote in support of Mr Liu 11 years ago, and was therefore shifty and unreliable.

    Since Mr Key now appears to be unable to remember a briefing five years ago, does that make him twice as shifty and unreliable?

    Wellington • Since Jul 2009 • 259 posts Report Reply

  • Pete George, in reply to Lucy Telfar Barnard,

    and that the PM’s office was apparently involved in advising Slater on just how to ask to get them;

    That is speculation only isn't it? Slater has just given his version of what happened.

    I watched Phil Goff on TV slam into the SIS about not being briefed about the situation with Israeli tourists. I thought to myself…that can’t be right, he is the Leader of the Opposition he must have been briefed. So I decided to write an OIA.

    In the meantime several sources, none of which work in the PM’s or any other Minister’s office or indeed any National MPs office contacted me, about the very same thing.

    When politicians dump on civil servants who cannot speak for themselves then sometimes they get pushed too far.

    I put in the OIA and within hours I was being pressured by the PM’s office and others senior in the government to withdraw the request. I refused. I was told that people wouldn’t speak to me etc. I said so what. I won’t be told what to do by anyone. About the only person who can even try to tell me what to do passed away two years ago.

    So I waited, and I waited. I was then phoned to be told that the release was coming and that It was being posted to me, it was also being released to other media the same day by post…I was livid. I was the first one to put in an OIA. Selwyn Manning was a couple of days behind me I’m told. I was livid because it was being posted…and being in Auckland I was at a distinct disadvantage.

    I received the letter the next day and scanned it and rang TV3, they agreed to a joint release and at 6pm that night the story broke.

    Far from the mad conspiracy theories of Phil Goff, the government actually tried to stop me asking the OIA.

    I am happy to swear under oath what happened, and then I expect a personal apology in writing for publication on the blog from Phil Goff for lying about me.

    I haven’t seen anything yet that contradicts this.

    While it’s possible the SIS leaked to him or someone in the Prime Minister’s office leaked to him (John Key emphasised that was an imprisonable offence it’s quite feasible that someone outside of those with experience of OIA and perhaps the SIS gave him advice on the best way to request the information.

    This possibility should at least be considered seriously.

    Dunedin • Since Dec 2011 • 139 posts Report Reply

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