Posts by BenWilson
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Speaker: Confessions of an Uber Driver…, in reply to Sacha,
the guests, surely
After the building collapses on them? :-)
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Speaker: Confessions of an Uber Driver…, in reply to Sacha,
If Expedia exhorted hotels to ignore employment laws or the building code, wonder who govt regulators would go after?
The employees and the builders probably.
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Speaker: Confessions of an Uber Driver…, in reply to goforit,
How can you be sure this is their thinking? I can’t see why Uber has any more reason to become an ATO in the future than it does now. It’s the law now, and it will be later, and they’re ignoring it now, without consequences. Why would they not ignore it later?
ETA: And why would you think NZTA doesn't realize this?
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Speaker: Confessions of an Uber Driver…, in reply to Alfie,
Uber’s stance that they only provide “leads” to independent contractors is inherently weak.
Oh, Yes. They dictate the entire job, and process all the payments, and enforce quality of service. They keep records not only of the origin and destination, but also the entire route traveled, and bill accordingly. They are running the actual meter. There's no way they really just provide leads.
On the rest, IANAL. It looks prima facie to me. I would not have even got involved with any of this organization if I didn't think there's a massive glaring case to answer, a huge violation of many aspects of the NZ legal system, not to mention the injustice that it naturally inflicts upon the main victims, the drivers. If they had literally turned up in pin-striped suits telling us that they'd sort the cops out for us if we just pay them from the till, it could hardly have been more obvious what was going on.
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Speaker: Confessions of an Uber Driver…, in reply to Ian Dalziel,
Just don't call me Caesar. Also, annoyingly, I can't find the Orangutan's comeback, it's very apposite to my current situation. He looks down to a couple of chimps brawling over a banana (while he and Caesar are having this deep and meaningful) and says "Apes stupid".
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Speaker: Confessions of an Uber Driver…, in reply to goforit,
its the people who drive for Uber whom are non compliant with the Act
I've never said any different. What I think you're not getting is that Uber themselves are not reachable because they are not an ATO. They don't even pretend to be an ATO in NZ. They simply ignore any requirements relating to that outright. They specifically claim not to be a transport organization at all.
Until the recent changes, they did this by putting the whole onus on proxies - either the PSL conduits, or drivers holding their own PSLs. Now, they can't even be arsed to do that, so unreachable have they become. It is clear from the inertia of the NZTA in this, that they literally have no place to grasp. I don't know why because the NZTA will never explain, other than to say that they have no option. If you know better than the people running the NZTA what their powers, brief and mandate are, please give me as much information as you have, and I'll press them, and encourage any and every other person who wants to as well.
Sure, it's possible that there's some massive scandal going on here, a government backhander. I'm not really conspiratorial enough to believe that. I think it's more that the NZTA really is telling the truth, that they have no answer to what Uber is doing. It's not in their jurisdiction. If it is a conspiracy, then I'm pretty sure that we'll be shining a bright torch on it pretty damned soon. Whichever politicians want that free shot can go for broke, one at a time, or all together. My own feeling is that at the moment we want to exhaust the non-partisan line first, because political division over our rights would be likely to harm them more. I want the government to be able to back down if they are in some dodgy conspiracy, and to do so without egg on their faces, but instead hurrying to help us out.
If they don't, however, and the window is closing fast on that, make no mistake, I fully intend this to be something that blows up in Nationals face right in the middle of an election year. For now, however, there's no evidence of wrongdoing beyond the bizarre inertia to enforcing NZ law that has been going on.
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TBH I think the contract is a front. It's not actually ever signed or agreed to by anyone. I don't even think Uber want to be held to it. It's a front to give the appearance that people who are essentially working outside of any formal arrangement at all are, in fact, contractors.
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Speaker: Confessions of an Uber Driver…, in reply to Brent Jackson,
do they expect the drivers to be picking up tips with each trip ?
No, quite the opposite. Even in America, they make it very clear that tips are not to be asked for and are not built into the pricing. You can tip, of course, and I’m yet to hear of the driver that would be offended to be tipped, it being quite literally the only way to reward them at all, since the rating system’s highest setting is “Acceptable”. There is no bonus system of any kind whatsoever for being a good driver. There is only the threat of completely arbitrary termination of your job when your rating falls below 4.5. There being no comeback or recourse of any kind whatsoever available to a driver, they naturally want to receive only 5 stars, or nothing at all.
As far as I can tell, it’s a stretch to even call us independent contractors. The contract that I can find, which I don’t recall ever being asked to sign, and which carries no signature or any other proof of authenticity from Uber, explicitly removes every possible right, including even the jurisdictional right for the contract to be subject to NZ law. We are, apparently, subject to the laws of the Netherlands. I presume that means the country in Europe, rather than some new realm in cyberspace, but it’s really quite impossible to be sure. It’s an amazing document really, I’m quite glad I made a copy of it. It would be hard to find a more convincing document of the sick nature of neoliberal contract mentality.
It begins with a long preamble about how they are not supplying a transport service at all, that they are merely a software organization supplying “leads” to the drivers. This goes on for several paragraphs to make the point really clear that they can’t possibly be held to account for anything that happens to anyone at all for anything anytime anywhere anyhow. Then it proceeds to spend the rest of the document outlining the specific nature of their transport system and how they have complete and total control over everything you do whilst driving for them. You can’t refuse the “leads” without risking termination. You can’t take any “lead” as a personal customer. You will never know the destination the “lead” wants to go to until you accept the sale. You will drive exactly how the customer wants. You will be polite, blah, blah, blah…on it goes for page after page of the rules of how their taxi service works.
So what are we? Contractors or employees? Or perhaps, peons? I don’t really know.
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Speaker: Confessions of an Uber Driver…, in reply to goforit,
I think it's unfair to suggest that they are dealing with the same problem. Uber is not a holder of any kind of transport license in NZ. They have been extremely careful not to be. Which leaves NZTA with only victims to bust. I think they've shown clemency, if anything, an admirable quality. Because the people they have to bust are literally people with nothing.
I don't know what other agency has the power to reach out and touch Uber itself. IRD? The MoT? At this point, we're left with pursuing justice the only way that is left for private citizens to do so, when the authorities either can't or won't do it, which is through prosecution on our own behalf. We will do it, but obviously it's not going to happen at the speed that a government agency with a huge budget and lawyers on the payroll could act.
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Speaker: Confessions of an Uber Driver…, in reply to goforit,
Hi Ben, I see you and your cause is back in the news.
Getting in the news hasn't really been difficult. What's really difficult is getting on with the business at hand, the legal process of society formation and building a case. It costs money and time, neither of which I have. Also, getting the data, which Uber has on tap, is a lengthy process. The other people working on it have been awesome too, there's a small team of highly committed people. But pretty soon we are going to hit the wall where we have to raise funds. Lots and lots of funds.
Presumably every fledgling worker group is beset like this at the start.