Posts by ChrisW
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I've been reading too, taken on board a few things colouring the shades of grey in my thinking on the subject of the 'unfortunate experiment'. Professor Charlotte Paul's 2004 editorial includes a put down of the substantial article by (Emeritus) Professor Barbara Heslop a few months before as "theoretical". But I found compellling Heslop's perspective on the medical science practices of the post-WW2 era transitional to the modern funding and control of medical research - that there was minimal grasp of hypothesis testing and research design.
It looks very strongly so that (though the word "experiment" may have been used) what was happening was clinical practice and variations thereof, loosely monitored in all senses of the word. So an unfortunate experiment? Perhaps in some senses, but not those with the normally presumed connotations.
The brief exchange in the NZ Medical Journal following Heslop's article (the one link-referenced in the Wikipedia article) is notable for the spokesperson for the Auckland Womens' Health Council ticking all the boxes for a Godwin. And Tony Baird (familiar name) also deplored that attempt to shut down discussion, pointing out the baseless exaggeration of the number of deaths from cervical cancer at National Womens.
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What staggers me is that the Cartwright inquiry replicated the error of the original Metro story, and enshrined this terrible falsehood as fact.
Me too, and from the anecdotal snippets included in the Listener article it would seem Bryder's view is that this reflects the adversarial lawyer-driven process, against the media-political background. Extending that just a little, the implication is that the inquiry was not about establishing the truth, that Silvia Cartwright did what was expected of her by the influential, did it well,. And then went on to higher judicial honours and the Governor-Generalship.
The contrast with that other 1980s judicial enquiry, Peter Mahon on the Erebus disaster, is spectacular. That maverick Justice saw his mission as establishing the truth of what happened. He achieved that or a very close approximation brilliantly, and got hounded out of the judicial system as a consequence.
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Bryder's tiresome insistence on careful qualification (like exactly where she thought Coney and Cartwright were deficient rather than a crude soundbite like "they were wrong")
To be fair to Kim Hill, the way I heard it she'd pretty well read the book and knew what Linda Bryder had to say, but had to work hard to extract it from her in a mere 40 minutes - hardly a matter of soundbites.
And the central conclusion, apparently well documented, is that there was no 'unfortunate experiment' run by Herb Green, in fact no experiment. And a lot more, but not to say Coney-Bunkle and Cartwright got everything wrong, nor that there was no need for improvements in medical-research ethics and respect for patients; however that was happening anyway in accordance with the global trend. -
I hope Russell does something on this topic.
I do too, or one of the other maestros around here. It's a really important story, on how difficult it is for the truth to emerge in such a melee of media-politics-medical/science and lawyers ...
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This is off topic but I've just read the new Listener - the article about the Unfortunate Experiment. I'm stunned.
I guess you missed Kim Hill's interview with Linda Bryder on Saturday then - it would be worth listening to off the Radio NZ web-site. I get the impression Linda Bryder has been very careful and thorough, and trust her analysis of the history of wilful and ignorant distortion of what was going on will be affirmed, no doubt after much scrapping over peripheral matters and red herrings.
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Understood, agree almost entirely, except for that word certainly in
certainly not the one to leave
There's something like 'natural selection' going on - some victims of an abusive relationship get out and leave, no doubt in some cases relatively early in what might otherwise have become a deeper pit, sometimes later.
Others don't get out, until the degree of damage becomes intolerable and/or comes to our attention one way or another - and it's these people who we wonder about - why they didn't get up and go? rather than all the ones who had already left. -
the fate of people who like to compare me to Sarah Palin.
Sorry for the offence. I have to admit I was impressed by the apparent similarities, but I realise now we were all deceived, and that other redcoated one was really Tina Fey imitating Sarah Palin. So comparing you with TF - not so bad I trust :)
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Okay, coat photo. Is not so grate
But in gratitude, perhaps this one is clearer?
http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/slideshow/ALeqM5hQfmxOt-sEpGdVrmohlBYg28yJuQD99ACU6O1?index=0&ned=nz -
Mikaere, your story is beautiful.
And thanks too for the link back to the 2005 one from Slack and you, on significant dates in NZ history and the unveiling by the Queen Mother of Inia Te Wiata's pouihi at New Zealand House, London.
As a complimentary complement to that story on the other side of the world, may I nominate Tuesday 11 August 1914, when the Poverty Bay Herald included in its Editor's miscellany at this time six days after the outbreak of the First World War: "The usual meeting of the Gisborne Shakespeare Club will not be held on Wednesday evening, owing to the patriotic korero."
Yeah, WW1 not WWZ, but seems to encapsulate rather nicely an earlier point in the cultural linkage of British settler-descendants and Maori. (From the latest update of the National Library's digitised newspapers searchable on-line, where the Povery Bay Herald is one of the better ones for later coverage up to 1920.)
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Indeed, the photos and the writing beautiful evocations of the best bits of family through generations. And your grandfather seems a blend of my father and grandfather; his writing will be precious.
My father died last year aged 90 having written many stories and memoirs, mostly on a Commodore 64. He ran out of oomph for writing over the last 5 years or so, so there are gaps. His father built stuff that lasts, but said little and wrote nothing, leaving many questions unanswered.
So you'll be encouraging your grandfather to work on volume 2? The whys and wherefores of the transition to NZ and how he found the ongoing changes ...