Posts by Sara Noble

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  • "The Terrorism Files",

    Oh and just to demonstrate my true status as Noobian Delux, could someone please tell me how to put my pretty little picture up, now that I've made one of myself???

    Auckland • Since Nov 2007 • 127 posts Report Reply

  • "The Terrorism Files",

    Oh, and by the way, if what Russell said was IF the accused were really planning an attack that could do damage to a person or people, I would condemn them utterly. Perhaps I misread, but I had always "heard" an undertone of assumption that the accused were guilty. I would condemn that utterly as well.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2007 • 127 posts Report Reply

  • "The Terrorism Files",

    The events that the 12 year old recounted 1st hand are completely unacceptable absolutely regardless of anything Tuhoe Lambert did or didn't do. The only question is, did they happen?

    The real politic of the situation, given the extreme imbalance of institutional, legal, financial and social power between the Police and the girl (and her family), is that her ability to present evidence, bring a case and get justice is severely constrained. This is not a level playing field.

    The Police are agents of the state. They have lots and lots of POWER. They are required to abide by certain professional and ethical standards - like clergy, therapists, judges etc etc. They are, therefore, supposed to be subject to higher levels of scrutiny than members of the public.

    As Kracklite says, it is part of our flawed nature that we "dehumanise" others, especially when in situations of conflict. Police are put in horrible situations every day, they are human and sometimes they do terrible things. We need to be very vigilant against acceptance of those terrible things being normalised. It is vital that possible abuses of power are examined scrupulously. I can certainly understand why the Police culture of loyalty extends into covering up at times - and I am sympathetic to the individuals concerned - but that doesn't mean that we should turn a blind eye to it.

    I accept that we are not objective - none of us. I am affected by the fact that I know the "Clown" who, at 5'2" and 45 kg, dressed as a bumble bee and holding a stick of french bread, was attacked with a baton by a police officer, was knocked out and had her collarbone broken. I know that my husband, clearly identified as a journalist was hit across the head with a baton by a police officer splitting his ear open and knocking him unconscious, while covering a protest.
    There are endless other examples of abuses of police power in the public domain.

    The Police neither need nor deserve the benefit of the public doubt - the public doubt should always be directed towards close scrutiny of those with the potential to abuse power.

    R: I am not particularly concerned that you accuse me of making up the cavity search. I believe the person who told me and she believes the accuser who told her. I just hope they do get their day in court.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2007 • 127 posts Report Reply

  • "The Terrorism Files",

    I haven't heard anything about a public strip search, what I understand of this complaint is that the 15 year old was taken into a room on her own and a cavity search was conducted by a male officer without a female officer present. I'm sorry but, as usual, the sources and details are subjudice. But I look forward to seeing you at the head of the queue when Peter Williams report is made public and IF the complaint is upheld. Sadly, if things are no better since, for instance, "the clowns" case, it will be in 10 years and the award to the claimants won't even cover their legal costs.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2007 • 127 posts Report Reply

  • "The Terrorism Files",

    Firstly, I think there is a world of difference between a real child reporting an act that she alleges she experienced at the hands of another real person during a real raid during which many other alleged acts of misconduct (to put it mildly) occurred, and possible interpretations and constructions of surveillance-based "evidence" of alleged plans to carry out illegal acts in the future. A very REAL difference.

    Secondly, I am not inclined to doubt complaints of police misconduct in this context. Yes, like you I am making a judgment call based on my experiences and beliefs. It is clear from many many past incidents that some police are sometimes far from perfect, and that in heated circumstances really nasty things go down. It is the responsibility of the Police to plan operations so as not to inflame situations, to cure the culture of misuse of power, and to train and support officers sufficiently so that these things don't occur. When they do occur, the Police should hold their own accountable (especially at the top of the hierarchy).

    No we don't know exactly what happened on any of the sides. We weigh the evidence and make our best guesses. I just think my guess is more realistic than yours.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2007 • 127 posts Report Reply

  • "The Terrorism Files",

    was (line one after "who")

    Auckland • Since Nov 2007 • 127 posts Report Reply

  • "The Terrorism Files",

    The National Radio interview with the 12 year old (who ordered to her knees with a GUN TO HER HEAD, in her pajamas, on the footpath of a busy road around the corner her house, which she and her mother, grandma and aunt, were removed from at dawn; who had earlier been taken around the corner of the house, alone, by a police officer with a gun, to be questioned, despite the women complaining that this was not allowed... etc etc) is in a link on one of the earlier pages of this thread.

    The "cavity search" complaint was forwarded to Peter Williams' team, and was referred to as an "intimate body search of a 15 year old female" either in the Herald or on TV news a few weeks ago.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2007 • 127 posts Report Reply

  • Hard News: Back in the mainstream,

    IMO, one of the very important aspects of a government apology is that it cracks open public denial - it mainstreams recognition - so the attitudes of the dominant culture might be shifted a bit.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2007 • 127 posts Report Reply

  • Hard News: Back in the mainstream,

    Absolutely, Che. This whole idea that racist and colonialist practices are historical is yet another mechanism of denial.

    How long ago was it that Howard announced his intention to make Australia rich by taking the world's nuclear waste off its hands and burying it in the Northern Territories? The geologists he brought in confirmed - from a geological perspective only of course - no, they weren't there to comment on policy - that the oldest, stablest land in the world, the most appropriate place to bury radioactive waste, was NT. The economists agreed - from a economic perspective - that this would be fiscally advantageous. The people screamed for awhile then all went quiet.

    Then, what? 18 - 24 months later, Howard's government decides that it has to disestablish tribal authority over many of the large areas of aboriginal land, disband tribal government etc because of a research report on the appalling and longstanding social problems apparent there. Howard's government's response was so at odds with the recommendations of the report that the research leaders themselves publicly condemned it.

    Golly, I wonder why Howard was so interested in reasserting control over the Northern Territories? INDIAN GIVER!

    Auckland • Since Nov 2007 • 127 posts Report Reply

  • "The Terrorism Files",

    It begins, I think, with the act of recognition. Recognition that it was we who did the dispossessing. We took the traditional lands and smashed the traditional way of life. We brought the disasters. We took the children from their mothers. We practised discrimination and exclusion.

    It was our ignorance and our prejudice. And our failure to imagine these things being done to us. We failed to make the most basic human response and enter into their hearts and minds. We failed to ask - how would I feel if this were done to me?

    As a consequence, we failed to see that what we were doing degraded all of us.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2007 • 127 posts Report Reply

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