Posts by Lilith __
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Hard News: Belief Media, in reply to Matthew Poole,
no less offensive and obnoxious than the “in your face” theists of whom he is so derisive, and I know several atheists who consider him a cock.
I’ve probably said enough on this subject, but many of the people who complain that Dawkins is offensive seem very free with their insults when describing him.
If you think he’s wrong, fine, but is the personal abuse helpful? Would it be more constructive to say why you disagree with him, or what your own position is?
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Hard News: Belief Media, in reply to Will de Cleene,
the ism-schism game
I got chatting to a stranger the other week who is of the Eastern Orthodox persuasion. He told me how very angry he is with the Church of Rome for presuming to break away from the true path. “They are the hand, or the finger…the little finger…thinking they are the body !” he said.
The Great Schism was almost a thousand years ago, but for him the outrage remains fresh.
Needless to say he doesn't have much time for atheists either, although it's not our fault. Apparently there are atheists here in the West because the Church of Rome is the wrong one. :-)
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Hard News: Belief Media, in reply to Islander,
I have a card that says I am ordained in *spiritual* humanism
How sweet!! :-)
Perhaps as well as being a joke, it contains the notion that humanists can have dreams and insights beyond the immediate and material.And like you say, Chris, it’s possible to give all our attention to labels and semantics and forget to really talk to each other.
And if I can mention Dawkins again, I really liked what he says at the end of The Ancestor’s Tale about his sense of awe at the natural world, and how in that sense of wonder he has much more in common with theists than they realise.
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Hard News: Belief Media, in reply to NBH,
Dawkins’ use of the term ‘delusional’
But he doesn’t use the term “delusional”, he uses the term “delusion”. One refers to the believer, the other to the belief. I really think there’s a difference.
Re: brights: I don’t have a copy of The God Delusion to hand, but as I recall he was dismissive of the term as rather squirm-inducing even for atheists. It's possible I'm remembering a passage from some of his other writing.
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Hard News: Belief Media, in reply to Chris Waugh,
that’s really the best I could think of.
It’s a hard problem! I have been known to call myself a (secular) Humanist, although that term has its own history and complexities. See also Positivism.
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Hard News: Belief Media, in reply to Chris Waugh,
Materialist? As in “This material world that we can see, hear, touch, taste and smell is all there is”?
It's a pity that Materialist has other, less happy meanings. And I've got a Madonna earworm just thinking about it! ;-)
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Hard News: Belief Media, in reply to Craig Ranapia,
“Folks who go to church are psychos” and “Atheist fags are responsible for 9/11!” will get infinitely more play
I'm sure you're right, but who said these things??
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Hard News: Belief Media, in reply to NBH,
you don’t come up with a ridiculously pretentious term like ‘brights’ for people who agree with you if you aren’t an arrogant tosspot
He didn’t. And in fact he finds fault with the term in The God Delusion . But there is the ongoing problem for atheists that many of us would like a positive definition rather than a negative one (ie. calling ourselves "atheists" is defining ourselves by what we don’t believe)
I’m sure there are many religious folk who think Dawkins is deluded: that his belief system can’t be reasonably defended. I got no problem with the word delusion . Is there any other single word that describes “unfounded and mistaken belief system”?
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Hard News: Belief Media, in reply to Jackie Clark,
Nowadays, I’m less atheist, I find. Not that I believe in a god, mind. I just believe in something (details on application), as opposed to nothing .
Isn't that a problem with the label atheist , though? Although I don't believe in a deity, I am passionate about all sorts of other things (protecting the environment, pacifism, vegetarianism, equality, social justice...I could go on...)
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Hard News: Belief Media, in reply to Roger,
It's always perplexed me that Dawkins gets called militant or strident or aggressive . He's always seemed incredibly patient and calm to me, in the face of often bitter and hateful attacks by religious bigots.
And those bigots often are described as devout or committed .