Posts by mark taslov
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Grant, why did you take a job somewhere that has a higher abortion rate than New Zealand? Isn't it grating to work amongst a larger proportion of murder supporters? How do you reconcile actively enhancing the instance of murder supporters under the wing of teh gentlemens' sport's officiating body?
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murder?
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Mark. I know you didn't. I said you did based on what you defined as a person. I assumed that you just didn't have a clue what you were saying. I think I was right.
but not all killing of people is murder,
i didn't say i support murder.
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who needs an electric scooter?
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Grant, I didn't say I support murder.
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Grant, try validate, it may work better for you, use a little vindicate where necessary.
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My favourite aspect of this whole argument - and, in fact, these arguments in general - is the way the woman hosting the all-important foetus is apparently a total afterthought. I can imagine her, this Everywomb: 'Hi! I'm over here! A person, any way you slice it! Remember me? I'll just be sitting quietly in this corner. Cool. Let me know what you decide, 'kay?'
damn straight. I'm pissed off that where I live somehow makes me accountable to Mr Language.
Now Grant,
"Perhaps if you do not wish people to accuse you of things you do not like then you should use words that do not contradict your standards.
you are accusing me of supporting murder. I don't believe all killing is murder. and you backed me up on that.
I don't believe euthananasia is murder, i don't believe abortion is murder, i don't believe killing time on a wednesday afternoon is murder. You may believe all the above are murder, but it's still a long distance from me supporting murder.It's like I support smoking, you could from that take, by the various logic you subscribe to, that i support suicide, but again i don't.
Your leap from me supporting killing to your assessment of that i am supporting murder, renders your dismissals of me/mine, inexact.
so i'll be clear, again, for you Grant. I don't really think in terms of personhood, as I said previously, over here it could be anywhere between conception and death, It's irrelevant to my perception, I support euthanasia, I support abortion. I see neither as murder, but i support them for what they are.
I do not accept your justification for your actions just as every other person on Earth has standards by which they will not accept every action by other people. I do not accept your idea that justification is relative. That's the most easily dismissed assertion in the history of bad assertions. Let me clue you in - when your worldview can be dismantled in three words it is a good clue that perhaps you need to rethink what you believe...
you do not accept my justification, just as you don't accept the reality that while your typing here you could be out trying to convince actual females to follow your own worldview of how to manage their bodies.
but my justification exists all the same.
you do not accept my idea that justification is relative, just as you don't accept the relativity of justification.when my worldview can be dismantled in three words, it's a good clue that I have a very portable worldview. But for my money, I don't see my world view being dismantled or begging for a rethink by you: the confuser of murder and killing. As I said before, I am justified in supporting a woman's right to abort a pregnancy, regardless of whether you see me as supporting murder or not.
For my money I don't believe the law on abortion in NZ is bad, I suggested a tweek but on the whole I feel it allows freedom where due, I wasn't aware that almost everyone here agrees that it's bad.
I guess I'm in the minority, that feels ok, in that I still think it's better than calling abortion practitioners murderers. I support that law, and I support the people who are bequeathed the freedom to choose. Despite your assertions that they are murderers. You don't have to accept my justification, It's my justification, but regardless of whether you accept it or not, it's still a justification.Basically Grant, much as you'd like to think so, there are no universals on this issue.
justification - dictionary.com
1. a reason, fact, circumstance, or explanation that justifies or defends: His insulting you was ample justification for you to leave the party.
2. an act of justifying: The painter's justification of his failure to finish on time didn't impress me.justify
1. to show (an act, claim, statement, etc.) to be just or right: The end does not always justify the means.
2. to defend or uphold as warranted or well-grounded: Don't try to justify his rudeness.there is no mention of mandatory consensus in these definitions.
I do not accept your idea that justification is relative. That's the most easily dismissed assertion in the history of bad assertions.
my sympathies.
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/justification
You can't keep backtracking like a blind orienteerer, to me it still seems like you're out of your depth with this word. Any murderer can provide justification for their actions, any murderer can justify their actions, no acceptance or agreement is required.Whether there justification is accepted, The state is still justified in sending them to jail. you don't have to accept my justification that justification is relative. denying my justification doesn't relegate it to being a 'nonjustification',
Murder is not defined as unjustified killing, it's justified as illegal killing.Not all laws are justified, not all justifications are legal
"Justification is entirely not relative"
to you
So careful now Grant, I'm not whinging about anything, I've been attempting to defend various charges you've laid on me including: I support murder, I have taken lives, i believe i have supported someone committing murder, etc.
these are serious charges, and I simply refute them Grant. I never made any of those statements. You are wrong in contending so.
"Mark! How much more satisfying if you actually had the ability to say I was wrong rather than only being able to whinge that I do not agree with you."
I'm not whinging that you don't agree with me. I'm defending myself.
As you are the type that equates telling someone they're wrong with satisfaction, I can only imagine that me telling you that you are wrong would be as satisfying as the satisfaction you would get from physically restraining and incarcerating a woman to prevent her from getting an abortion.
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I don't believe i have supported someone committing murder, as you said Grant
Killing is not necessarily murder.
If you reread, you'll find I never said i supported someone commiting murder, You should keep your reading glasses on at all times, and really make an effort to stop putting words in my mouth, when possible.
"**You** said you believe it is murder. " I see it as killing a fetus, a stage of personhood as you like to put it. Though i stressed I don't really like to put it in any such keyhole,
You believe my justification is not acceptable, but i feel I am justified in supporting someones' right do as they want with their body. Under better circumstances, that's where you step away from the computer, woken to the relativity of justification.
But then we are not living in a society that bases its legal system on what you think is OK.
Yeah well OK Grant. What is the law with regards to abortion?
your arguing about relative perceptions, it's a dead end street,<quote>A murderer clearly is not justified. A soldier clearly is.<quote>
in your mind
clearly
I disagree with this generalization on the grounds that i haven't heard the specifics. Is the killing by the soldier justified to this allies and enemies alike?
I think you need to use a dictionary before you use any more words.
dictionaries are maps Grant, to some people dictionaries are the gospel, to others, dictionaries are old dogs that refuse to keep up. To people that can read, dictionaries are very convenient things, and to people who can feel the language, dictionaries are well trained butlers.
You've tangled yourself up in words.
am i justified in saying that?
i feel i am
my justification is that you are a twit
murdering the language. -
I hear ya Peter, I just want to see if this ball of twine unravels.
Grant, I don't believe I am taking lives, in fact I'm not. and if i were taking lives, i'd most likely feel i was justified, because most actions we take are justifiable to the self. And that's a simple fact, there are murderers sitting in jail, soldiers sleeping in trenches, euthanasiaists making tea who will still justify what they did, and by justifying themselves, they are duly justified.
And furthermore one of the the exact justifications they will use to justify themselves is that It was necessary to kill. That's a justified killing.
you feel it's not justified,
but that's because you're an idealist. -
convenience, obligation, necessity.