Posts by andin
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Hard News: An open thread while I'm down…, in reply to st ephen,
sadly it proved to be unsingable by the masses
Well they could've made it easier for the masses.
Yaknow the chorus wearing T-shirts with the lyric written on it, animated voice bubbles. They always help.
Or scrolling lyrics and the ubiquitous ball. -
Hard News: An open thread while I'm down…, in reply to Hilary Stace,
Institutionalisation of disabled people was all done in the name of policy and with the best of intentions.
Cold Comfort indeed.
Sorry Hillary its pure coincidence. Your essay up thread was excellent tho.
And I just wanted to say how much the stories in the thread are beautifully thoughtful.
And to thank Joe for his story.
So with "the best of intentions" both of my parents when suffering from nervous collapse, at different times, received electro-shock therapy in 50's/60's NZ. The conflict of wanting to be free of obligation yet knowing it was impossible in that time(well to them maybe it would always be like that).
They couldnt find any other way through their suffering at the time is all I can offer by way of explanation.
I dont know what affect it had, but they both took their places back in society and as our parents and carried on. Not stoically, but resigned somehow ...I guess.
Still in a daze of shock. Tho' not deficient still there.. Its hard for me to describe with out bringing back a flood of memories. So excuse me. -
Hard News: Science: it's complicated, in reply to Danielle,
And Sacha
And outside where?
+1. So terribly sorry if it makes you uncomfortable, andin, but where on earth do you suggest claims should be heard?
Couldnt there just be a football game and the winner takes all. Yep I'm joking.
My apologies to you and Hillary, I was trying unsuccessfully to make a deep philosophical point. My bad, I failed.
I'll try again in a few months. In the meantime I'll be busy following the bouncing ball, like the rest of the country.
Yep one way or another every NZer will be and if they say anything different. Well I'd say their probably to stuck up for their own good.
Later...when the ball stops bouncing.................... -
Oh and another thing that really really fucks me off is this Hillary.
For pakeha in NZ this mainly means the Judeo Christian tradition
Well you make it sound like pakeha are one big fat amorphous blob and one wobbly flank is exactly like the wobbly arse. Well we ain’t all right!
Sometimes I feel like all the Waitangi disputes are an extension of the old English Pakeha/Maori conflict which is still being tussled out. And I wish you guys would just take it outside.
Oh whats the fucking point no one’s listening anyway. -
Hard News: Science: it's complicated, in reply to Hilary Stace,
research involving other humans, is about our moral and cultural traditions. For pakeha in NZ this mainly means the Judeo Christian tradition and the philosophical tradition about what it is to be human going back to the ancient Greeks,
If I may say, these are the exact same things that are often an impediment to large swathes of people not getting along. I respect that you as a researcher need an ethical framework in which to gain access to people in a way that doesnt exploit them. Though I would hazard to say, not that any one person or thing is specifically at fault there is a perverse effect. It reinforces those traditions and they come into play when it may be better not to stick too closely to the letter of some ancient writ.
I hope I am sensitive to realise this land means more to other people than it does to me because of the long connection their family have with it, and the traditions that infuse meaning in the relationship for them may seem like life or death. I am the first of my fathers lineage to be born here and the second of my mothers. So the kinship I feel for this place is fragile. (I am more at home in the birthplace of my father.) But FWIW I am here and want to add my voice to the chorus about how we all live together.
We need to find ways to come together. I don't know what to think of the indigenous of this country just having a renaissance of their culture but in a totally changed world. How will it all fare... is anyone's guess.
And many thanks Islander I hope I get the relationships built, and to be maintained, between people and place form the basis of many myths. And where this has not been irrevocably broken, life seems to be fare better.
But until a Maitreya turns up without the funny headgear and flowing robes thanks. I'll content myself in the delusion that eventually people will squabble their way to extinction. And even if we do stop killing each other, there's always screwing each other over monetarily. But damn, some will look while their doing it.
Sorry I cant resist. Always the dark comedian. -
Hard News: How much speech does it take?, in reply to nzlemming,
"If a child commits suicide, let us consider not celebrating their lives on our marae; perhaps bury them at the entrance of the cemetery so their deaths will be condemned by the people,” he wrote.
Boy that certainly doesnt look like responsible use of the communicative faculties. Does he think a child will be worried about where they are to be buried, so worried they wont top themselves. This man is an MP! Which people are supposed to be doing the condemning I wonder. He should be embarrassed, so shamed in fact he should go on a solitary pilgrimage to a cold mountaintop.
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Hard News: Science: it's complicated, in reply to David Winter,
I don’t see how it’s any more arduous or damaging to science for me to spend some time talking to these people, to understand why they value these animals and to explain to them what my result might mean. In fact, taking as many people on board as possible should be a goal for science
Well that sounds like it was very enjoyable. And I think back to what has been trodden over in the race to colonise the continents by those insensitive to the local culture and environment. Not one of humanity's finest hours.
I just wonder, with our highly developed ability to self delude, especially if some otherworldly entity can be conscripted to the cause, we should be careful when it comes to the baggage of past generations. Especially now as these ancient knowledge systems are shown to be riddled with fictions and inconsistencies, virtually with each passing week.
Hey I don't really care, anyone can have whatever comforting fantasy they like just so long as they know and acknowledge it as a comforting fantasy to them and other don't have to buy into it, if they don't want to. I better stop now in case someone thinks I'm a lone nut. Or am I too late! -
Hard News: Science: it's complicated, in reply to Lucy Stewart,
Creation myths have a legitimate cultural aspect, and tell you a lot about how people perceive the world around them.
I dont doubt that for a minute. So….does that lead anywhere apart from round in circles?
Taking that into account when dealing with the ethics of scientific sampling and practice is quite different
I’ll just have to take your word for that.
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Hard News: Science: it's complicated, in reply to Hilary Stace,
Tikanga
The primary indigenous reference for Māori values and ethics are the creation stories which highlight specific relationships deemed fundamental to the sustainability of life.Kind of a major stumbling block right at the beginning there. (there are others littered throughout the document.) Are they actually claiming some kind of legitimacy for creation stories? If they can, can everyone else?
And we're screwed...... -
I like the “PUNISHING THEM...IN WAYS ….THEY CANNOT UNDERSTAND”
Marvellous