Hard News by Russell Brown

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Hard News: Switched on Gardener: to what purpose?

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  • Ian Dalziel,

    Christchurch • Since Dec 2006 • 7948 posts Report Reply

  • Sofie Bribiesca, in reply to Ian Dalziel,

    Can we get that decision to allow Key Inc to carry on with the Mighty River partial sale peer reviewed, too?

    And can we tell Hekia Parata to piss off as well?

    here and there. • Since Nov 2007 • 6796 posts Report Reply

  • Kyle Matthews,

    Now Collins has to go get a QC to give her what she wants and she wanted it before Xmas too – she should just write out what she wants and get the QC to pad it out a bit.

    Andrew Geddis wrote a fair post on pundit.

    Given that the report is likely to be made public after cabinet makes its decision, it's unlikely that he's done a good job and she just doesn't like the outcome. There probably is something wrong with his report beyond giving money away that she doesn't want to give. She basically slammed the minister who sat in her chair before her, quite extraordinary.

    Since Nov 2006 • 6243 posts Report Reply

  • Kyle Matthews,

    Justice Binnie's response - mostly about process.

    Since Nov 2006 • 6243 posts Report Reply

  • Chris Waugh, in reply to Sofie Bribiesca,

    And can we tell Hekia Parata to piss off as well?

    Reading your article and now this, I would rate "piss off" as a touch too polite.

    Wellington • Since Jan 2007 • 2401 posts Report Reply

  • DexterX, in reply to Kyle Matthews,

    So you believe Collins when she says

    [Binnie's] report appeared to contain assumptions based on incorrect facts, and showed a misunderstanding of New Zealand law. It lacked a robustness of reasoning used to justify its conclusions.

    The report could recommend no compensation be paid.

    I don't believe Collins - I feel she is creating a platform for her ambition.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 1224 posts Report Reply

  • Islander, in reply to DexterX,

    <q> don’t believe Collins – I feel she is creating a platform for her ambition.

    For what?

    A lot of my family – in Oamaru & Dunedin – dont think Bain is innocent.For many reasons, only some of which have been publically revealed in the 2 trials, and then incompletely.

    However, I totally support the exoneration of Peter Ellis – who never killed anyone-

    these matters are contingent-

    Big O, Mahitahi, Te Wahi … • Since Feb 2007 • 5643 posts Report Reply

  • Kyle Matthews,

    So you believe Collins when she says

    Oh no. We don't like her at all, bad family history.

    However if Binnie has gotten his report right, then she's just made an astonishing legal and political error, and probably killed her political career. It'll be backed up from comments from the solicitor general and others, so she must be fairly confident.

    Since Nov 2006 • 6243 posts Report Reply

  • BenWilson, in reply to Kyle Matthews,

    and probably killed her political career

    Is it that bad? She'll spin it that she had an opinion, a legal one, which, according to her boss, is something you can just make up.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 10657 posts Report Reply

  • Kumara Republic, in reply to Kyle Matthews,

    However if Binnie has gotten his report right, then she’s just made an astonishing legal and political error, and probably killed her political career. It’ll be backed up from comments from the solicitor general and others, so she must be fairly confident.

    That, or she's one of those types that Ross Meurant describes as believing "liberals are a menace to stability and are even more dangerous than unemployed Maori."

    The southernmost capital … • Since Nov 2006 • 5439 posts Report Reply

  • DexterX, in reply to Kyle Matthews,

    However if Binnie has gotten his report right, then she's just made an astonishing legal and political error,

    I don't think so - there is no accounting for the power of stupidity in all its guises. Collins has created this current situation of her own hand - it is so much bad form for a raft of reasons. Incompetence and Arrogance look Ugly.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 1224 posts Report Reply

  • DexterX, in reply to Islander,

    Collins is a future leader.

    The matter of what you or I consider of guilt or innocence is well past – it is not at the heart of he issue, which will become apparent when the reports and hopefully the briefs are released.

    Collins has had ample time to address any issue she has had with the Binnie Report, which has been on her desk since late August – the generation of speculation comes from Collins.

    For Collins to instruct Binnie, a leading international jurist, to do the report and then basically to say he is incompetent is not a good look - but is also more than just that.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 1224 posts Report Reply

  • Chris Waugh,

    Binnie's report and Dr Fisher's review have been released. Where's a lawyer when you need one? There's a lot in that that I don't understand.

    Wellington • Since Jan 2007 • 2401 posts Report Reply

  • Islander, in reply to DexterX,

    "

    or Collins to instruct Binnie, a leading international jurist, to do the report and then basically to say he is incompetent is not a good look – but is also more than just that."

    However, reading the released document, that seems to be the possible case. And referring to previous cases where innocence has been strongly suggested (Ellis) or proven (Thomas) also seems extremely relevant actually-

    Report

    Big O, Mahitahi, Te Wahi … • Since Feb 2007 • 5643 posts Report Reply

  • Rob Stowell,

    [redacted- can contained worms] :-)

    Whakaraupo • Since Nov 2006 • 2110 posts Report Reply

  • DexterX, in reply to Islander,

    David Bain has a right to his innocence – it is a basic right at NZ Law – one is presumed innocence until proven guilty – and similarily where a conviction is overturned or one is found not guilty by virtue of a retrail – one is entitled to one’s innocence.

    Under the Bill of Rights Act 1990, if you are charged with a crime, you have the right to be presumed innocent until proven guilty in a court of law. "The presumption of innocence" is a basic right under New Zealand's Bill of Rights.

    Simon Power chose an outsider Justice Binnie having regard to the inherent national controversy that surrounds the case – Collins through her behaviour has reignited the controversy (rather than address the compensation issue), in my view, for her political gain.

    I don’t consider Collins recent utterances to be sincere.

    Binnie spent a year reviewing the matter and his deliberations are not going to be flawed, haphazard, politically expedient or substantially wrong and presented by Collins and supported by Fisher QC – Justice Binnie addressed these issues.

    This is of worth - Justice Binnie. "Accordingly, if I am guilty of sinning, I do so in the good company of the five judges of the Privy Council." The Privy Council ordered a retrial for the many of the concerns that Justice Binnie has considered.

    It is not up to Collins to retrial the case in the media, in the house or in cabinet – had Simon Power remained the Minister of Justice I consider the matter would be close to settling.

    Collins has injected her personality and the hateful personality and motives of others into the mix – this should not have happened – it is ugly. Collin’s treatment of Justice Binnie is similar to Muldoon’s comment about US President Jimmie Carter, “What would he know he is a peanut farmer”.

    It is clear, to me, that in the “David vs. Goliath” scenario that is the NZ Criminal Justice system Goliath needs to clean up his act. I am not just referring to the Bain case in making this comment.

    If I could offer some support to Bain I would, he is suffering a substantial and grievous wrong in the manner Collins is playing this out.

    Collins is in a word "Dreadful".

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 1224 posts Report Reply

  • Sofie Bribiesca, in reply to DexterX,

    Collins is in a word “Dreadful”.

    Always is, always will be. What angle do you think Fisher is coming from though. Because straight away my thoughts enquired why he is eager to agree?
    No matter what anyone's personal belief is, Bain is now entitled to compensation and the Crown should just pay him already. I told that woman as much earlier this week.

    here and there. • Since Nov 2007 • 6796 posts Report Reply

  • Ian Dalziel,

    an aside...
    I've always wondered about the possibility of a completely random unknown psychopath murdering the Bain family...
    - or a vindictive and self serving time traveller!

    Christchurch • Since Dec 2006 • 7948 posts Report Reply

  • DexterX, in reply to Sofie Bribiesca,

    What angle do you think Fisher is coming from though.

    My first thoughts are he is reflecting "Collin's direction" - but I need to read more and reflect on both documents - to see what I really think.

    Binnie has spent a full year - he will have been very thorough.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 1224 posts Report Reply

  • Sofie Bribiesca, in reply to DexterX,

    Binnie has spent a full year – he will have been very thorough.

    I agree.

    here and there. • Since Nov 2007 • 6796 posts Report Reply

  • Sofie Bribiesca, in reply to Ian Dalziel,

    I’ve always wondered about the possibility of a completely random

    Here is an example of the police being random
    I immediately thought. What if it wasn't locked in the first place. Anyone could have been in there.

    here and there. • Since Nov 2007 • 6796 posts Report Reply

  • Kyle Matthews,

    Is it that bad? She’ll spin it that she had an opinion, a legal one, which, according to her boss, is something you can just make up.

    We'll never know now. It's looking like ending up somewhere between the two reports, which means that it's enough of a stalemate for her to get away with going for a redo, rightly or wrongly. The key point seems to be the approach that Binnie took, rather than any massive factual error, and I suspect most people could come down on either side of it.

    Since Nov 2006 • 6243 posts Report Reply

  • Kyle Matthews,

    Binnie sure is sharp though, and not reticent about speaking his mind. I don't know about Fischer, but I doubt Collins is up to debating him in any medium.

    Since Nov 2006 • 6243 posts Report Reply

  • DexterX,

    Going back to the subject - I'll say it again - Michael Quinlan is an excellent and generous bloke - unfairly treated for a range of reasons..

    When the Police/State cast their weight against you it is hard for a just outcome to previal.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 1224 posts Report Reply

  • Sofie Bribiesca, in reply to DexterX,

    I’ll say it again – Michael Quinlan is an excellent and generous bloke – unfairly treated for a range of reasons..

    He'll probably need visitors to remind him of that now and after sentencing

    here and there. • Since Nov 2007 • 6796 posts Report Reply

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