Hard News: A few (more) words on The Hobbit
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But I think people are going to tire of it in a big way - simply because it isn't real.
My impression was they already had. I certainly have. And even with the new film (s), whether or not they succeed, in whatever sense you choose, my (almost certainly naive) wish is that Boy will do more to attract people to our shores over the coming years than a bunch of hairy... whoops.
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But if you're right, then surely that undermines a major part of the rationale for subsidising this particular industry so heavily - which is why I brought it up. I think the claims that The Hobbit willl be good for tourism are very optimistic.
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recordari, in reply to
I think the claims that The Hobbit will be good for tourism are very optimistic.
This I agree with. The Vikram wedding at the weekend is more likely to bring tourists here. Certainly more so than the cricket.
You keep thinking, surely we must have bottomed out, and then we discover a whole new false bottom. So much for our satisfaction of England disseminating Australia.
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BenWilson, in reply to
I think one could probably build a pretty good case based on Return of the King alone.
Go for it. As far as racial stereotyping goes, I think Jackson drew inspiration for the Corsairs of Umbar from Arabian styles. That makes him a racist?
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The only bad humans are of Middle Eastern stock, just as the men of the West invade the Gulf? I don't know, you tell me.
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Che Tibby, in reply to
Corsairs of Umbar from Arabian styles.
probably not unjustifiably. i think Tolkien described them as 'swarthy", via their blood relation with the haradrim.
deborah could likely correct us on that one.
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recordari, in reply to
The only bad humans are of Middle Eastern stock, just as the men of the West invade the Gulf? I don't know, you tell me.
And? The fact that 'Hollywood' panders to the 'American popular psyche' is of no great surprise, or particularly newsworthy, is it? Irritating, yes, but there are far more sinister and subversive forces in place than a group of people whose primary goal is get bums on seats in Cinemas. Never misunderestimate [sic] the commercial power of patriotism. However misdirected.
Oliver Stone? Well, that's another matter.
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giovanni tiso, in reply to
And? The fact that 'Hollywood' panders to the 'American popular psyche' is of no great surprise, or particularly newsworthy, is it?
No, it is not. The good thing about Hollywood movies however is that generally I don't pay to make them. And I'm not one for considering the peddling of such ideologies irrelevant, much as I agree that it's been going on for a while longer than Jackson has been directing.
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Russell Brown, in reply to
What about the spin-off negatives? Like fostering the perception that our employment protections laws are for sale, and that we can be held to ransom on little more than a pretence? What about the long-term sustainability of branding the country as a Middle Earth knock-off, a derivative, tacky remake of old England? Quite beside how dispiriting it all is, for a country that no longer than fifteen years ago boasted a tourism interested in Maori and Pakeha culture, it could have fiscal consequences as well when the narrative becomes exposed for the fraud that it is, as it most likely will.
I'm not sure the reality is as you describe it. The same Tourism NZ that hitched onto the LOTR buzz has also played its part in a flowering of Maori tourism ventures, run by Maori, over the past decade -- and the Maori Tourism Council was founded and helped produce the Rough Guide to Maori New Zealand. The sector is bigger, more diverse and more sophisticated.
I don't think there's any evidence that taking advantage of the awareness driven by LOTR harmed indigenous tourism. The two were complementary. Tourism NZ certainly seemed very keen for The Hobbit to stay.
What LOTR helped sell was the same thing New Zealand has sold in tourism for more than a century -- our scenery. I think there's room for debate as to how effective cinematic tourism is, but I would think LOTR/The Hobbit is more likely to bring visitors than certain other recipients of the large budget grant scheme: Power Rangers, for example.
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The only bad humans are of Middle Eastern stock, just as the men of the West invade the Gulf? I don't know, you tell me.
That's all you've got? The men of the West in LOTR are actually from the west. That's why they're called that. The people from the South-east are described as bad only once, by Gollum, who also describes men from Gondor the same way, and he especially dislikes Elves. He dislikes everyone, that's part of the curse of the Ring.
They're fighting with Sauron, sure. But they've been hostile to Gondor for many centuries. As far as "evil" goes, they're about as evil as the Italian Army in WW2 - they're just fighting on the wrong side, probably because of corrupt leadership.
Indeed, Tolkien is quite keen to humanize them, having actually lived through the horror of war, he gives his own take:
It was Sam's first view of a battle of Men against Men, and he did not like it much. He was glad that he could not see the dead face. He wondered what the man's name was and where he came from; and if he was really evil of heart, or what lies and threats had led him on the long march from his home; and if he would not really rather have stayed there in peace.
Jackson has Faramir deliver this as a speech in the extended version as Sam stands near the dead body of a very handsome young "Arab"* solider, with the final note: "This war will make corpses of us all".
*Edit: Actually, he looked Maori to me, but there you go.
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Russell Brown, in reply to
My impression was they already had. I certainly have. And even with the new film (s), whether or not they succeed, in whatever sense you choose, my (almost certainly naive) wish is that Boy will do more to attract people to our shores over the coming years than a bunch of hairy… whoops.
Nope. Boy is a film for us. Whale Rider on the other hand probably did attract visitors.
The Tourism NZ site has a good page on the film and the culture it embodies, quoting Niki Caro:
"Traditionally, in the Maori culture, an important meeting or hui would often involve visitors staying on the marae. Firstly you are welcomed onto the marae in the traditional manner - the powhiri - then everybody gathers to do a mihi, which is a short speech about who you are, where you come from, who your parents are, your whakapapa (ancestry) and what you are interested in. It's very moving."
Marae stays are an option for visitors to New Zealand who want an altogether authentic experience of Maori culture. Tasks like food preparation are shared, then you eat together, enjoy an evening of kapa haka entertainment and sleep as a group in the meeting house.
One of the most moving scenes in Whale Rider was Paikea's song during a school kapa haka performance. The term kapa haka encompasses a wide range of Maori performance arts - from peaceful waiata-a-ringa (action songs) and waiata tawhito (ancient songs that tell of historic events) to poi dances (a poi is a swinging ball used to train for dexterity) and haka (war dances).
These people aren't idiots, you know.
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giovanni tiso, in reply to
The same Tourism NZ that hitched onto the LOTR buzz has also played its part in a flowering of Maori tourism ventures, run by Maori, over the past decade
I'd bloody well hope so.
I think there's room for debate as to how effective cinematic tourism is, but I would think LOTR/The Hobbit is more likely to bring visitors than certain other recipients of the large budget grant scheme: Power Rangers, for example.
Reassure me that the choice between how to promote New Zealand is more between Keri Hulme and JRR Tolkien, than Tolkien and Power Rangers. Please.
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Also, I'd like to point out that The Hobbit if reasonably true to the book, pits race against race again, over treasure. It shows a particularly poignant view of how it corrupts people, Thorin turns quite nasty, as does the Elven king. Add that into the summation of Tolkien's racism.
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Russell Brown, in reply to
Reassure me that the choice between how to promote New Zealand is more between Keri Hulme and JRR Tolkien, than Tolkien and Power Rangers. Please.
See above re Whale Rider, also a grant recipient. The point was that not all beneficiaries of the large budget production grant scheme have tourism spin-offs, but Tourism NZ seems extremely sure that LOTR/The Hobbit is one that does.
The keynote event this year will be the Rugby World Cup. Tourism NZ has been suggesting to people in other countries that that might be an ideal reason to visit our country for about 18 months now.
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Maybe that will compensate for the non-rugby tourists who will give NZ a wide berth next summer. (Rugby is a minority sport in all of the countries that play it except NZ and the Pacific Islands. Outside those countries, it's a completely marginal sport).
Is there any actual academic evidence that spending public money on glamour projects, like movies and sporting events, actually produces a return? Or compares that return with money spent on education, housing and public transport?
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recordari, in reply to
And I'm not one for considering the peddling of such ideologies irrelevant,
FTR, me neither. Suffice to say, when I seek ideological resonance, Hollywood is second only to Faux News in being my last port of call.
At least The Onion has self-parody on it's side.
ETA: In light of Gio's comment below, I meant self-parody in the positive sense of a satirical news site, not the New Zealand tourism industry. I think.
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giovanni tiso, in reply to
Tourism NZ seems extremely sure that LOTR/The Hobbit is one that does.
I'm happy for them, I just think it's misguided in the long term. I've gone from people back home telling me and being interested in all sorts of diverse things about New Zealands, to it being Middle Earth and nothing else. It can't last. The fact that the Onion zeroed in on that is symptomatic I think of how it could turn into unintended self-parody, if it hasn't already.
I'd also question that Boy is a story that is just for us. The Film Commission in the early 90s organised a gem of a film festival in Milan (and I'm sure plenty of other places as well) that showcased New Zealand cinema and its ability to reflect its culture. This may have been on the back of the success of The Piano, I'm not sure, but it certainly raised the profile of New Zealand amongst the people who saw it.
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The fact that the Onion zeroed in on that is symptomatic I think of how it could turn into unintended self-parody
Or that they're unoriginal. Flight of the Conchords got there first.
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Maybe there's just nothing else to say about New Zealand, eh?
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It makes a change from sheep. Seriously.
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Actually it makes a change from Jane Campion and Janet Frame and Keri Hulme, speaking of the time when I became aware of New Zealand. (And rugby and Black Magic, to be fair. And yes, sheep.)
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Nope. Boy is a film for us.
I'd also question this.
This Sundance Festival reviewer didn't think Boy was just 'a film for us' either.
Though I have spent the past few days trudging through the snow of Park City, BOY transported me to a seaside summer in the Southern Pacific, but warmed my heart before my body. It is, by far, my favorite film of the festival thus far.
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Yes, because I was always being teased about Jane Campion and Janet Frame and Keri Hulme. Everyone always brought them up.
Actually, practically the only cultural references to NZ (apart from rugby and sheep) I ever heard abroad were about Once Were Warriors. "Is it really like that?". Hard one to answer. "I don't know, might be for some people, pretty much like here?" was my usual.
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giovanni tiso, in reply to
I ever heard abroad were about Once Were Warriors.
Speaking as somebody who spent a great deal more time abroad than you did: An Angel at My Table and The Piano were way bigger than Once Were Warriors. And so was The Bone People. Just FYI.
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In the South, a lot of tourism ventures have been driven by one tribe...not always successfully, I have to add. We didnt attach much importance to LOTR, and the way "The Hobbit" is being publicised presently - Frodo in that prequel@#$!!!-
we'll be attaching none to it either. I rather think diehard Tolkien fans wont fall over themselves to see such adulterations either.
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