The printers find erect cocks offensive but they're perfectly happy to print magazines which serve

...to procure said erections. Not, it's not at all ironic.

I find these double standards infuriating. Really

I'm almost afraid to link to this in case Jackie explodes, but here's the double standard in jarring clarity.

Note the idea of a "women's sector" which would be opposed to a magazine for women put out by a woman doing something women asked them to do.

Women's sector? Sound like a harem for fem-bots... I'm kind of conflicted about this: The printer should be under no obligation to…

update

Dear Emma. Stop reading Guardian comments threads.

Long story short; Suraya checked with the Home Office itself, I believe, and was told that what they wanted to do was legal. Even with that reassurance, the printer refused to print the second edition with 'tumescence' because it would be offensive…

I think it's in the very same line of the play, I'd have to go and check. It's been a while.

It sounds entirely plausible, and you could hardly fault old school drag queens for their excessive sensitivity. :)

That was Fierstein's, right?

Ol' Deep Throat indeed. But 'Bang Bang La Desh? Oy... that's about as disturbing as a Bruno trailer.

Virginia Hamm is a trannie name.

That was Fierstein's, right? Along with Anita Man and Bang Bang Ladesh.

Kate Copstick does sound like a transvestite name.

Virginia Hamm is a trannie name. Bertha V. Nation. Lady Bunny.

Kate? Not so much.

It seems incredible to suggest that David Boreanaz's shirt used to come off in about every second episode of Angel because it kept the female fans happy, and yet also incredibly obvious.

Or how about True Blood where Ryan Kwanten (Jason Stackhouse) appears to have an nudity clause in his…

Emma, just lie back and think of Engl...on second thoughts, maybe you could just look at the pictures in Wisdens while sitting upright?

Oh stephen, you know me so well. Mmm, Kevin Pietersen...

she said she would have almost exclusively male writers as they knew a lot more about sex.

Ow, my brain...

http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/crime/2502716/Soldiers-involved-in-pub-brawl

Yeah that sounds about right, if you do hear on the grapevine who the factions prepared to raise that kind of hell were, I'd be keen to know.

The fight started in the Bush Inn Tavern in upper Riccarton before spilling out onto the street.

LOL. Given that's the nearest pub to varsity, I can just imagine how try-hard that haka was.

Not having been there, or noticed it given I live several blocks away, I"m blaming ENSOC.

http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/crime/2492257/All-hell-broke-loose-at-Chch-pub

Though I did have a very strange dream last night in which I appeared to be Christine Keeler.

Nice ... chair?

Suraya on Nine to Noon this morning (streaming 9mins, MP3 3MB).

Oh thanks Sacha. Megan pointed me at that this morning, I meant to put it up.

Shouldn't we be _counterpointing_ the surrealism of the underlying metaphor?

And hands up who here celebrated Towel Day?

Hope your cold is receding, Emma.

Getting there slowly. Though I did have a very strange dream last night in which I appeared to be Christine Keeler.

Good ol' Vogon Poetry.

Which is particularly weird given that (on my screen) the troll has somehow posted 42 times.

Have to admire the surrealism of the underlying metaphor.

You Bugger. The origin of that line has been bugging me all day, because I knew I should know it. Eureka moment walking up Mt Vic this arvo.

Good ol' Vogon Poetry.

what a weird and totally f**ked up situation..

just whose is the solace then
the 'kids' or the 'adults'?

As it turns out, we got Quantum of Solace out today, for viewing tonight, after les enfants are in bed, of course.

do i have your active dissent…

it's gotta be like lavishing volcanic baboonerites on the very instrument

of yr finest, firmest self-emanation..

Regarding gazes – many years ago my husband looked at a picture of Claudia Schiffer in the newspaper, and then turned to me and said, "You know, Claudia Schiffer is a very intelligent woman."

I would just like to say that Daniel Craig is a very intelligent man.

That's all.…

You don't actually have to love porn to find a woman universalising her own experience in order to erase other women's really fucking annoying.

Just so.

But... umm... try telling that to someone like Cactus Kate. Though the Queen of Thorns has an admirable takedown.

The author then goes on to say that if women do…

plz tell me how this differs x-actly from that revelation uniquely provided us by what amounts to the…

I'm just surprised it's taken this long to fill the void…

It is the 144-pack abs that are really gross.

Ba-doom tish!

Is a chillibin better?

Or a swappa crate even...

Six-pack abs are kind of gross.

Is a chillibin better?

I'm not a ripped ab fancier, though. Six-pack abs are kind of gross.

... this tasty item ?

What's he doing with his hands?

But for the record, I'm not sure, but I do think the combination between Smith and Nonu is better.

Yeah, but I bet you can't wait for a 10-12-13 of Carter, McAlister, Kahui, amirite?

Unfortunately, I think the point is now moot.

Yeah.

But for the record, I'm not sure, but I do think the combination between Smith and Nonu is better.

And no, I am not a nurse, and no, that question wasn't at all pervy.

OK, so you're in W'gton – do you prefer Kahui at centre over Conrad Smith?

Unfortunately, I think the point is now moot.

Are you in nursing by any chance?

He's a good footie player, but I suspect that is not the attribute that you want to focus on

I would love to focus on that. Emma won't let me.

Afraid I can't help you with Richard Kahui chatter. He's a good footie player, but I suspect that is not the attribute that you want to focus on.

And yes, early starts come with starting work at 4am.

I am concerned about the dearth of Richard Kahui chatter, though. Anyone would think you people had actual serious stuff to discuss, or something.

I trust/hope that you are OK with yesterday's effusiveness. Thought about it afterwards & hoped it didn't come across too creepy.

I aspire to be that person.

Kowhai, you are that person, except also hot in photographs.

"arthouse stud monkey"

Does his name being uttered tonight in the Auckland Museum by Russell enhance Steven's credentials?

You weren't in the group of girls that passed notes to the tall, long-haired guy suggesting he go goth?

Suggesting he wear PVC, more like. Starting young..

Consider, people who are not attractive in photographs, but in person always attract attention and never appear to be 'short of options'.

I aspire to be that person.

I hope she has some success with the mag, a magazine for women that does not harp on about dieting or celeb…

Never been much on religious matters but I doubt it was affected by that.

(I also, as a child, believed that there was a verb "to misle", meaning "fool or deceive", which I inferred from what I thought was an obvious reading of "misled").

Mine was "unched" tears, instead of the unshed ones I girlfully held back.

Oh dear. He looks like he's about to do something with that hammer that Warren Ellis would link to.

Something like this?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P7BsTRvYc30

Which Greek god, though? Aephestus was supposedly very ugly indeed (although, great buns according to the old Italian 50 Lire coin).

Oh dear. He looks like he's about to do something with that hammer that Warren Ellis would link to.

Does that make people who are non-breeders by choice the epitome of civilisation?

Given you can trace almost all the environmental problems with the planet to "too many people" it's not far wrong.

It's also the subject of some good and some not-so-good science fiction exploring the social implications of…

You weren't in the group of girls that passed notes to the tall, long-haired guy suggesting he go goth?

Nah, we'd have been the group of girls that reeked of cigarette smoke.

Finding comments from Jack who I used to flat with while people pranked called the Minister of Police, on a blog post about the magazine published by a woman who I once played in a band with, it all points to the same honest…

(I also, as a child, believed that there was a verb "to misle", meaning "fool or deceive", which I inferred from what I thought…

(Heard it pronounced as 'epi-tome' by a newsreader this week – cracked up.)

I have always felt that is a very dangerous proposition to agree to. It is giving in to the fallacy that only what is "natural" is permissible.

I agree, as I bet does Danielle.

The point was the argument being tossed around was that it should be illegal because it…

Au contraire, dude, I was at that. My English teacher was a) an old friend of Kevin's from our local theatre group, and b) gay, so oddly enough our class made the trip up.

Shit, small world. You weren't in the group of girls that passed notes to the tall,…

I certainly wouldn't want to imply that biological imperatives are an excuse to do what is culturally or morally wrong and uncivilised.

There is pretty good evidence for some kind of biological drive to do some pretty horrible things. The mark of civilised folks is that they can…

But not so. Just serendipitous timing.

< swoons >

My apologies for even the merest suggestion that Megan is anything other than ravishing.

I go away for four hours, and look what bloody happens.

Man, bet you're upset that you missed the version of 'A Streetcar Named Desire' that my English class went to in 6th or 7th form.

Au contraire, dude, I was at that. My English teacher was a) an old friend of Kevin's from our local theatre group, and b) gay,…

Okay, now see, that's hardly fair when in one's head Ares looks like this.

Man, bet you're upset that you missed the version of 'A Streetcar Named Desire' that my English class went to in 6th or 7th form. The bit where Kevin Smith, as Stanley, appeared on stage sans…

hard-wired

This is on a shortlist of Words I Hate Seeing in Any Internet Forum.

(Sorry Bart. I know you're not being one of those 'it is naaaaatural for me to spray my seeeeeeed far and wide, while you, timid loyal lady, stay at home nurturing my many behbehs!!!' dudes.…

If gays really were biologically different then it would be wrong to discriminate

I have always felt that is a very dangerous proposition to agree to. It is giving in to the fallacy that only what is "natural" is permissible.

Fundamentally it's an issue of civil rights. We cherish and…

If gays really were biologically different then it would be wrong to discriminate

Much as it shouldn't be, 'choice' is still an issue, and a major argument against equal rights in the US. It was obviously still a Big Deal for John Barrowman when he made the BBC documentary __The…

And that's controversial for whom? His Holiness?

Hell yeah. The first studies were done in the netherlands and caused all sorts of crap to start flying in the Catholic community.

It undercut one of the major arguments against gay rights and so played a political role as well. If gays…

Ah, but the first look doesn't tell the whole story.

Sure. Happy to agree with you about that second look and especially about the look that lingers after the third date. But of course that's all about pheromones :P.

that was controversial because it showed really clearly that gay people actually really were "attracted" to the same sex. That is, it wasn't just a "choice".

And that's controversial for whom? His Holiness?

Sorry Gio didn't realise you'd had this conversation before.

Not at all. I enjoy it.

So I'm happy to stand by the studies that show regardless of what people say makes them attracted to other people, when you do the studies, what makes them look and makes them look for…

It's not about long term relationships or anything like…

At the risk of arguing semantics what I was referring to was the initial attractiveness, if you like ... "the made you look" factor. So I'm happy to stand by the studies that show regardless of what people say makes them…

It would be really interesting to do the same eye movement studies with people in their 40s and 60s and see if we become more interested in indicators of people we might like to talk to and live with rather than just those with which we want to reproduce.

Or,…

See, women tell you they want a thinker, and someone who's good around the house, but then they're off making eyes at some well-chisled murdering munter in a nicely-tailored uniform.

Okay, now see, that's hardly fair when in one's head Ares looks like this.

I can certainly think of a lot of people I know, men and women, whose modest conventional attractiveness was greatly supplemented by their personality, intelligence, dress sense and savoir faire.

Consider, people who are not attractive in photographs, but in person always attract attention and never appear to be 'short…

I absolutely believe that when a large group is sampled, these tendencies in preference emerge. But how strong is that preference? What is the deviation in the range of preferences? I suspect that any given person's preferences are likely to differ from these statistical averages substantially.

Er... you know whom he was married to, right?

Indeed, a woman who was not averse to a bit of take-out.

Arranged marriage.

Hey, it just came back to me: Oliver Reed and Uma Thurman! Boy, was that a genius piece of casting, or what?

Er... you know whom he was married to, right?

Arranged marriage.

And that didn't stop her sneaking off with that beefcake Ares behind his back.

See, women tell you they want a thinker, and someone who's good around the house, but then they're off making eyes at some well-chisled murdering…

for it is my belief that the most attractive thing about a woman is an air of confidence.

yeah right

Oh yes, please, if I get to have this conversation one more time I think I'm due to win a motorboat.

You veer dangerously towards the evolutionary biologist's view of…

for it is my belief that the most attractive thing about a woman is an air of confidence.

yeah right

So the same eye movement studies Emma mentioned show that those who like women like the hourglass proportion. Size make little difference and neither does an air of confidence, if…

What about men in suits?

Depends entirely on how he's wearing the suit. If he's feeling good and having fun with his suit wearing then it is hottt but if he's looking all itchy and restricted and like he wants to race home and put on something, anything, else then…

Always ragging on the engineers for their hideous deformities and lack of success with teh wimminz.

Er... you know whom he was married to, right?

Aephestus was supposedly very ugly indeed

Typical. Always ragging on the engineers for their hideous deformities and lack of success with teh wimminz.

What about men in suits?

A well-cut suit can do wonders for a man's 50 Lire region. Nummy.

I also like, however (and I'm not quite sure how to describe this) a sense in either a man or a woman that they've largely dressed to please themselves, that they have…

... but I can say that Panasonic definitely make hi-fi headphones that are too small for a man-sized head.

As do Technics.

(Good luck with the mag too)

great buns according to the old Italian 50 Lire coin

Okay, now there's a country that knows how to make coinage! I say we agitate for a newly redesigned dollar coin with Kevin Smith on it. (Actually, come to think about it, he'd be better on a bill – something…

He had the body of a Greek god.

Which Greek god, though? Aephestus was supposedly very ugly indeed (although, great buns according to the old Italian 50 Lire coin).

which I would describe as "so many hot young long-haired men in PVC, so little time."

I very slightly pre-dated the PVC, but the general principle is the same and the task more overwhelming if one substitutes the word 'people' for 'men'. And I think KAOS is so insidious that…

A friend of mine back in high school had a name for the projecting confidence thing: walk around pretending you're a turkey.

Excellent. So you pour a jar of cranberry sauce over your bonce and suddenly its babe magnet time.

That may not be the effect you're after here, but he assures the world it gets you served quicker at the bar.

Actually – and this is quite interesting – he was very unattractive indeed, whichever way you looked at him, but he did project an air of confidence. Not…

unsexiest word

That would be "Richard" or "Worth" wouldn't it?

I put that in for Megan, but I'm sure she'll share.

Oi! I bloody will not! Hands off...

Oh, alright, go on then.

Ah, Richard. But surely he's a bit too beefcakey for Filament? (Shame that what I watched of the S14 final it looked like he didn't have a…

I'm not sure if I was ever an official member of KAOS, but I certainly went to the parties, which in the late 90s, which I would describe as "so many…

I would just like to say that Daniel Craig is a very intelligent man.

That's all.

If KAOS were to field a cricket team I'm fairly sure this would be in the by-laws.

Regulating this would give the Orange Boys something to do.

A magazine of women fantasies about men with body shapes similar my own, is intriguing. Or to see a mans photo in an erotic women's magazine, that resembles my own body, would make me feel sexy. I like to be ogled, discreetly.

You know steven, that might be the nicest…

Or changes them between innings.

If KAOS were to field a cricket team I'm fairly sure this would be in the by-laws.

my boyfriend knew her cos she'd flatted with an ex-girlfriend of his last century.

Your boyfriend has had more than one hundred girlfriends? Kudos.

Feel free to post your alternatives.

Menstruation.

Nothing to do with what it denotes, just the phonology of the word – four consonant sounds in a row, followed by a vowel and a diphthong. I fear I'm going to dislocate something every time I say it.

Feel free to post your alternatives.

As with everything else in, for & pertaining to the mag, the title (and the strapline) were pretty well-researched. There were a stack of other suggestions ("Spitfire" and "License" were popular suggestions) but most of them were either already taken, or didn't quite evoke the…

Good divisive word: "moist". People either think it's sexy or revolting.

"To be gorgeous and high and true and fine and fluffy and moist and sticky and lovely, all you have to do is to believe that one is gorgeous and high and true and fine and fluffy and moist…

Happy to ogle your richard kahui link though, Emma. I don't know him :)

I put that in for Megan, but I'm sure she'll share.

Happy to ogle your richard kahui link though, Emma. I don't know him :) (although in a very NZ-ish way, one of my friends did go to school with him in Tokoroa).

Good divisive word: "moist". People either think it's sexy or revolting.

is Filament in fact the *least* sexy word in the English language?

It would have to be WAAAYYY behind words like 'infrastructure' or 'depreciation' or 'polypropelene'.

I actually had the opposite response – what a great name. Nothing to do with the actual meaning, all to do with the way…

Me: Yeah, women lie.

Males had a hunch.

The frankest admission that size does matter I've come across to date.

Male Friend: I thought size didn't matter.

Me: Yeah, women lie.

the largest structure in the known universe.

The frankest admission that size does matter I've come across to date.

This may just about definitively prove that I'm not a woman, but is it me, or is Filament in fact the *least* sexy word in the English language?

Feel free to post your alternatives.

I'm quite curious to see what people suggest.

Now that's class.

This may just about definitively prove that I'm not a woman, but is it me, or is Filament in fact the *least* sexy word in the English language?

Not quite – that'd be 'moist', or 'turgid' or something, but I did wonder. Suraya says:

A filament is:

• the bit…

Frankly, I am not the typical phenotype for models from this publication. I'd be a bit more suited to appearing in publications with titles like "Big and Beardie" or "Long-Haired Hippy Layabouts".

Ah. You're a bear.

My friend Dave in London used to look with great lust at pictures of…

Heh, also in the interests of full disclosure I should mention that I got this interview in the most Kiwi of ways. Suraya is an old friend of an ex-flatmate of mine, and like Corset-Making Jo, she's ex-KAOS. I'm starting to think that organisation is actually GOOD for people.

Not…

Not that there's anything wrong with that, but I've wondered if they're really that interchangeable.

Personal experience suggests not.......

Chicks don't dig me but........

Hot.

Not wishing to be objectifying or anything, but fucking ay.

I seem to recall consenting provided I got a few bob when the pictures inevitably ended up on the internet.

Awesome. Which one is you?

(In the large photos there you'll be able to tell that the guy on the cover has dirty bare feet. Woof.)

I think Singh may be from New Plymouth, not Palmy.

(Don't want the `Naki to feel .. umm .. shafted ..)

Oh shit, you're right, it says so right there. I'll go fix that. And, um, put it down to the fever I'm currently running.

Interesting point about what chicks…

(Don't want the `Naki to feel .. umm .. shafted ..)

It does sometimes seem to me that what gets presented to women as porn/erotica for them actually looks like porn/erotica for gay men, at least in its solo form.

Not that there's anything wrong with that, but I've wondered if they're really that…

Wasn't there a theory that Playgirl was never in fact aimed at women but rather at gay men, and that the proof was in the advertising?

Ah, big gay fan base... I believe for a while Playgirl was the only source for naked man pics, ergo I'm sure it got…

And not too sure about niche magazines being recession proof.

I'll defer to people with more industry experience on that one. It was what her research seemed to show, though as she said (I have screeds of great stuff from Suraya I couldn't fit in) there wasn't really anything doing…

In a recessing market, where Playgirl has recently gone under

Wasn't there a theory that Playgirl was never in fact aimed at women but rather at gay men, and that the proof was in the advertising? I never had occasion to verify, just throwing it out there.

No one's asked me yet.

And not too sure about niche magazines being recession proof.