ritualised (recorded & posted etc.) fighting & bashing

quite

One question: why aren't those teenagers motivated to do something more constructive?

From Paul Graham's "Why Nerds Are Unpopular":

__"I'm suspicious of this theory that thirteen-year-old kids are intrinsically messed up. If it's physiological, it should be universal. Are Mongol nomads all nihilists at thirteen? I've read a lot…

tax the hell out of sugar that way you'd hit both alcho-pop and carbonated sugar water drinks as well as a whole slew of really shitty "foods" with incredibly high levels of sugar.

Very smart idea

One question: why aren't those teenagers motivated to do something more constructive?

I think if you use the words/terms 'teenagers', 'motivated' and 'more constructive' in one sentence, it should be self-evident.

And the next question might be, like what? Personally I'm hoping to keep my three on the sporty track,…

Ban alco-pop.

Actually I'd probably just tax the hell out of sugar that way you'd hit both alcho-pop and carbonated sugar water drinks as well as a whole slew of really shitty "foods" with incredibly high levels of sugar.

Most kids don't really like alcohol drinks unless they are sweet…

@Islander

Teenage sexual experimentation was…

STDs did cause…

rebel stance against a wowser society

Isn't that a little contradictory? How can it be rebellion if it's something that society and mainstream culture endorse?

Banning drinks aimed at kids, yes, good idea. But not the problem: the problem was lowering the drinking age

Sorry, can't be that simple. Binge…

dyan campbell – there is some evidence that things were very much worse in the first 4 decades of concentrated European settlement here.

This is very true for NZs early history Islander, I certainly agree with that.

But the current cause for alarm is within a single generation. The behaviour…

In my home town a good proportion of the males in my age group are lying in the local cemeteries from motorcycle and car accidents, many involving alcohol. This happened before all the media coverage, guilt inducing nanny state legislation and justifications for curtailing civil liberties.

Your memories are like…

Dyan, you could apply the same argument to sex, though.
Wasn't around on the telly or in films much a few decades back, now it's everywhere. But that doesn't mean that people weren't getting it on back in the day.

Actually sexual behaviour has changed drastically – both in terms…

'Waiter!'

Heavyweight runaway star captured and no it isn't Kirsty Alley again.

Maybe you're gradually eroding it with all that cycling and it's getting less steep.

he says:
'e rode his bike up dis mount
you say:
his bike erodes dis mount
I say:
peak toil indeed...

"Imagine a gigantic rocky mountain at the beginning of kalpa,…

Same with drinking. Just cos it wasn't on telly, doesn't mean that young folk weren't partying till they puked.

Interestingly when all the hoopla happened around New years, my 'fatherly' tendencies fuelled my internal 'moral panic' and it all seemed terrible and so different from my yoof.

But since then,…

Wasn't around on the telly or in films much a few decades back, now it's everywhere. But that doesn't mean that people weren't getting it on back in the day.

Same with drinking. Just cos it wasn't on telly, doesn't…

I agree completely and have seen the same change in the style of alcohol advertising here in the UK as well.

the bodies natural defence mechanisms. I don't recall there being any evidence of an association with an alcohol company

My apologies for the complete statement of opinion not clarified as such – I didn't mean to say this was in any way proved or even an opinion shared by others...…

The rise of televised vomiting and the glorification of binge drinking culminating in vomiting ...

I agree with you that the liquor industry is directly targetting young people by providing alcohol that tastes like lollies, but I'm not sure where this televised vomiting and glorification of binge drinking takes place?

My personal wish is that the notions of 'obesity', 'premature maturation', 'diabetes', and a number of other conditions too extensive to list, are not looked at without due consideration of environmental factors.

This is being examined pretty closely...

I'm pretty sure when Peter Gluckman talks about "improved nutritional status" I…

I found them in an old sock.

You found a sock!?!?!

Also being able to see your toes again is kinda fun too.

I know what you mean, I was so pleased when I found them in an old sock.
:-S

I've been somewhat fascinated with improvements in my fitness via cycling

Which is why some folks become sports physiologists. The way the body adapts to exercise really is fascinating. I really loved the bit of biochemistry when I learnt why you stop being hungry after a while.

Also being able…

As for running (or any exercise) the trick is to withstand the first two weeks from unfit when it all just seems like too much hard work. Then when you have some fitness you find it can be enjoyable and you go from there.

I've been somewhat fascinated with improvements…

Humans have had voluntary contact with lead and its compounds for millenia

__Hence gout and stone afflict the human race;
Hence lazy jaundice with her saffron face;
Palsy, with shaking head and tott'ring knees.
And bloated dropsy, the staunch sot's disease;
Consumption, pale, with keen but hollow eye,
And sharpened…

Sorry for being dilatory in replying. Certainly you can say hi to me and mine. My email address is my initials (my middle name is Richard) ashby at blueyonder dot co dot uk. if you want to get in touch.

I'm keeping the option of buckwheat flour in reserve…

Like dying?

one of my personal gripes is with the use of copper in organic farming

Yup, that's a bit wierd. Copper sulphate is a fairly toxic susbtance, to humans and in the environment (though I guess it's mostly harmless in the quantities used). The theory that because something has been used…

Yesterday, the Prime Minister's Chief Science Adviser issued a warning that adolescents' bodies were maturing faster than their brains; good health meant 11-year-olds reached sexually maturity while their…

Because organic farmers don't use modern fungicides they rely too much on copper and the result is a progressive build up of copper which isn't all that great.

Or conversely our low selenium, also being studied here in relation to prostate cancer.

due consideration of environmental factors

I can explain why there really is only limited study of environmental factors in health, particularly human health.

There are a couple of major problems.
The biggest is that genotype dramatically affects the response to environment. So it becomes really hard to identify an environmental…

I am regularly accused in here of lecturing or setting myself up as some sort of superman ...

Peter I think "teased" would be a more appropriate word than "accused". It is affectionate, really.

My personal wish is that the notions of 'obesity', 'premature maturation', 'diabetes', and a number of other conditions too extensive to list, are not looked at without due consideration of environmental factors. This of course includes…

and is a sign of a physically healthy population
contradicts
doesn't exclude the influence of other factors such as novel chemical exposure etc

I don’t think so. Both things could be true at the same time.

Most people would not see persistent exposure to toxic environmental substances as compatible…

I get the impression that cracking down on the Wayward Yoof is the Key government's Big Idea.

What with the seemingly endless stories about dead drunk kids and after-ball parties, May does appear to be 'won't somebody think of the children' month at the herald.

ok, are you going to be using lean pork? Or pork with good pork fat component?

Because, if the latter, I think you've solved your pastry…

There is nothing wrong with takeaways, eaten occasionally. Everything in moderation, including moderation. My wife and I occasionally eat haddock and chips from the takeaway down the hill. We sit and watch the birds in the bay either from the car or the benches outside while eating them, the…

I get the impression that cracking down on the Wayward Yoof is the Key government's Big Idea. Drug scares,…

Sorry, it's been a bad day, and I'm ranting.

Happens to us all.

And it's not exactly hidden science for someone of Gluckman's resources.

That was sort of my beef. The statements were so categorical, it seemed to leave little room for broader discussion and understanding of the issues. Poor reporting seems likely, but when in 2 minutes I found 20+ references on…

It's not possible to be physically healthy while being exposed to new chemicals?

Most people would not see persistent exposure to toxic environmental substances as compatible with good health, no. And it's not exactly hidden science for someone of Gluckman's resources.

A more neutral expression could have been used, rather…

and is a sign of a physically healthy population

contradicts

doesn't exclude the influence of other factors such as novel chemical exposure etc

Gluckman knows best

Hmm unlikely. However at the risk of seeming to be a defender of Gluckman it's worth actually going to his actual speech rather than the hash made of it by the media.

Historically, the age of sexual maturation has fallen dramatically from about 16 to 17 years…

BS. You don't think the 80,000+ new chemicals introduced in the past 100 years had anything to do with it?

My knowledge of the subject is that it's still poorly understood. There's evidence of relationships and it would be wrong to discount these, but drawing strong inferences is premature.

But…

Younger sexual maturation, slow brain development and complex social networks are creating a "powder keg" likely to cause an explosion of unsafe sex, drugs and crime, warns the Government's chief science adviser.

and

Sexual maturation had sped up because of better child health and nutrition, and was…

All we need its a PM who is "Ambisshuss" to do something other than fossick for presshusss stuff.

And for that matter, trying to be a "bland plastic replica of suburban America".

As for the other countries…

The other thing here is presumably most of our science is focused on biology to assist our primary industries.

Our scientists are hardly going to be working on designs or innovations for mass production.

Interesting overview from Colin James here about Korea, which I…

Except that the Round 1 mentality also leads people to put in less serious punts, so that they might get the opportunity of the second round, which is also a time-waster.

But a lottery first round would lead to even more of that. So you would have applications that are…

Most firms I've worked for, or have been associated with, have factors of 1.5 – 3, even when expensive equipment is used. Factors of 3 – 5+ are more typical of high-thoughput QC and production laboratories, who usually also pay technician wages.

Most firms don’t factor in the cost of…

The old recruitment system targeted fresh, bright graduates, hired them for a year or two, and then funded their PhD or post-Doc at a overseas…

Taxpayers need to obtain good value from that investment, preferably in their lifetime. Funding scientists to keep them off the street to stop them being mugged by, or mugging, little old ladies, is no longer a national imperative, as NZ imports scientists on an "as required" basis.

You're going to…

Taxpayers need to obtain good value from that investment, preferably in their lifetime. Funding scientists to keep them off…

the results were just what we expected.

Buggerall.

And didn't we have this with the Knowledge wave? What was the result of all those increased science busaries and etc?

According to Gordon, Gluckman is presenting two public faces about this- one that is positive about government's science program with its lack of oversight, and another which suggests that…

Personally I think the current system isn’t bad and would work a lot better if more proposals could be funded overall. It’s because the overall money pool is so small that you get good proposals rejected.

I wholeheartedly agree with this. If there was more money, then I certainly wouldn't…

What I meant is that if they made the first round a random draw, it wouldn't produce discernably different outcomes with respect to quality

Ah I see. Yeah kinda. The reason for making some kind of science quality cut in the first round is to stop people sending in…

But at the least it prevents people wasting time where the panel knows they wouldn't fund any full application that came to them on this topic from these people.

Except that the Round 1 mentality also leads people to put in less serious punts, so that they might get the…

Thirdly, I'd be inclined to weight it so the longer your name has been in the hat, the higher your chances are. Perhaps with a guaranteed entry to Round 2 after X years if your luck has been out.

But that just makes it easier for people who have been…

What I meant is that if they made the first round a random draw, it wouldn't produce discernably different outcomes with respect to quality, and there would be a great time-saving for researchers and panellists alike (ie non-monetary cost)

I suspect this is not true. A lot of genuinely weak…

http://www.3news.co.nz/Tim-Groser-17-April-2010/tabid/1356/articleID/151528/Default.aspx

Groser didn't necessarily do the best job at explaining the concept (under some surprisingly hostile questioning) but the idea is this, in order for our science investment to sustain we are, on balance, better off releasing openly, getting…

What I meant is that if they made the first round a random draw, it wouldn't produce discernably different outcomes with respect to quality, and there would be a great time-saving for researchers and panellists alike (ie non-monetary cost)

I'm not sure if many academics would be impressed if they…

I know from our experience that proposals that appeal to neurophysiologists and to bacteriologists and to developmental biologists and to biochemists are the ones that get through. Broad appeal.

Marsden is like a two-phase wine judging.
Round 1 is like a wineshow (e.g., Liquorland Top 100). Winners are those that…

That isn't true. If you look at the results from the Royal Society who manage the Marsden's it shows they are actually very successful when measured in terms of papers, patents and even in generating new business ideas.

No no. I wasn't criticising the quality of Marsden funded projects at…

My point is that if you fail at the first round you have no idea if your proposal was viewed as brilliant, good, rubbish, science fiction or what

I agree Steve. The only advice I can give you is to ask panelists. they can't and won't be specific but they…

In some ways India's a bit ahead – half of the best chip designers I've worked with have…

why? it works well for China and Japan

Because if you are in that game you need to be faster than China and Japan. They can put 20 PhDs for every one of ours on any project we can think of and hence they are faster.

You can however, collaborate…

My point is that if you fail at the first round you have no idea if your proposal was viewed as brilliant, good, rubbish, science fiction or what. In such an environment, how is improvement possible?

If you fail this year, how do you know what to…

our CRIs are now full of good
(but not great) scientists who are focussed on
taking ideas from overseas labs and applying
them to New Zealand crops/industries.
Which is fine. But it can’t and won’t create new
industries,

why? it works well for China and Japan. Wasn't the LCD a…

Prior to this announcement, the only government support for business-led R&D was via Tech NZ (tax credits only lasted one year). This was 7% of the total govt science budget. (Tech NZ’s $47.4m of the total…

[Marsend's]

probably have a pretty similar hit rate in terms of funding actually good projects versus crap projects.

That isn't true. If you look at the results from the Royal Society who manage the Marsden's it shows they are actually very successful when measured in terms of papers, patents and…

everyone I meet and talk about Marsden with agrees that it is, in fact, just a lottery

Steve I understand your frustration but I do disagree. That first round of the Marsden is very hard because it is only one page and you need to excite most if not all…

The key is to fund quality science and fund enough. Where we've failed as a country over the last 30 years is by pretending we can do more with less money by picking winners. All we've proved is we can do less with less money.

If only we could treat…

In fact, everyone I meet and talk about Marsden with agrees that it is, in fact, just a lottery.

The trouble is, it sells itself as a sensible, defendable, reputable way to dole out public money for science.

So I guess the problem is the mismatch between…

But, some of the increased (in my dream-world) Marsden funding should be used to run it in a transparent and morally defendable way.

I'm not sure that I agree. I think if they could fund a sensible proportion of applicants, there would be no need for pointless hurdles. It's rather…

For me R&D is largely engineering, not science – it's all about people having bright ideas and getting them to market before anyone else does. So scrapping Labour's $600m R&D tax credit and replacing it…

I agree we just need to fund all the good science we can---and some of it---10% seems to be a figure that emerges from international experience over decades---will go on to make loads of money.

The rest, of course, will merely increase knowledge, educate more…

Yes, it puts the risk mostly on the taxpayer

And given the size of NZ and the fact that most big companies can more easily and efficiently do their R&D in Aus I can't see that changing. What this funding package is trying to do is encourage business to invest in…

I can't see it working any other way.

It does, after all, seem to be the way that science funding works in the USA. For a huge amount of it, the research is hidden in the military budget, which is enormous. If/when they come up with amazing things, as they…

There are good people in the labs and they do sometimes squeeze the time and money to do good novel work, but that work then gets ignored because there is no business plan with a clearly identifiable product.

I suspect this is most…

Good grief that's awful. Professor Gluckman may have his faults, who doesn't, but there can be no question he is a very good scientist and really does believe that science can and should contribute to society.

Indeed – perhaps someone should man-splain to 'Sprout' that advisers do exactly that. They…

Election cycle.

'nuff said.

Science in NZ is well and truly fucked, and this is deck chairs on the Titanic stuff.

a depressingly partisan slagging of Gluckman.

Good grief that's awful. Professor Gluckman may have his faults, who doesn't, but there can be no question he is a very good scientist and really does believe that science can and should contribute to society.

Science funding isn't a National v Labour thing.…

"The Sprout" at the Standard saw occasion for a depressingly partisan slagging of Gluckman.

And one other thing strikes me. I interviewed Gluckman shortly after his appointment and it was made clear at the time that his role would not extend to commenting…