Public Address | Cafe | Southerly: The Astonishing New Car from Bavaria that Won't Cost the Earth. https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/ en-us Copyright (c) 2026 Public Address Anne M https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/southerly-the-astonishing-new-car-from-bavaria/?p=18482#post18482 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/southerly-the-astonishing-new-car-from-bavaria/?p=18482#post18482 Mon, 21 May 2007 01:35:51 +1200 David Haywood https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/southerly-the-astonishing-new-car-from-bavaria/?p=18479#post18479 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/southerly-the-astonishing-new-car-from-bavaria/?p=18479#post18479 Tim Kong wrote:

am on the lookout for a second car and would prefer to buy something that is sustainable and economical...

... on the list is the Prius

Your other option is to go for a small diesel like the Citroën C3 1.4SX 5DR, which is actually slightly more…

]]> Sun, 20 May 2007 23:47:46 +1200 tim kong https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/southerly-the-astonishing-new-car-from-bavaria/?p=18478#post18478 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/southerly-the-astonishing-new-car-from-bavaria/?p=18478#post18478 A practical question – am on the lookout for a second car and would prefer to buy something that is sustainable and economical.

On the list is the Prius – I've been looking at a second hand one, as on the website: http://www.cleangreencar.co.nz/

But not sure of the potential disposal…

]]> Sun, 20 May 2007 22:39:44 +1200 Bart Janssen https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/southerly-the-astonishing-new-car-from-bavaria/?p=18275#post18275 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/southerly-the-astonishing-new-car-from-bavaria/?p=18275#post18275

if there's one way to reduce the number of Remuera tractors on the road without punishing drivers who actually go dirt-bashing

Well you could take the attitude that folks who want to go "dirt bashing" should use their vehicles off road only. There really is no reason for a 4WD…

]]> Fri, 18 May 2007 09:34:21 +1200 Kumara Republic https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/southerly-the-astonishing-new-car-from-bavaria/?p=18254#post18254 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/southerly-the-astonishing-new-car-from-bavaria/?p=18254#post18254 This is less related to efficiency than it is to automotive sociology, but if there's one way to reduce the number of Remuera tractors on the road without punishing drivers who actually go dirt-bashing, it would probably take the form of a new driver's licence type for SUVs.

Motorbikes, passenger…

]]> Fri, 18 May 2007 00:27:45 +1200 Graeme H https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/southerly-the-astonishing-new-car-from-bavaria/?p=18164#post18164 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/southerly-the-astonishing-new-car-from-bavaria/?p=18164#post18164 Thu, 17 May 2007 13:13:02 +1200 James Green https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/southerly-the-astonishing-new-car-from-bavaria/?p=17777#post17777 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/southerly-the-astonishing-new-car-from-bavaria/?p=17777#post17777 Keith
You could also try a four stroke scooter. Or a small motorbike (which are cheaper to buy because they're less trendy). A Suzuki 125 is not too dissimilar to a scooter in terms of fuel economy I'd guess.

And as for 2 stroke diesels, I have fond memories of…

]]> Tue, 15 May 2007 19:20:32 +1200 Ben Austin https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/southerly-the-astonishing-new-car-from-bavaria/?p=17760#post17760 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/southerly-the-astonishing-new-car-from-bavaria/?p=17760#post17760 Tue, 15 May 2007 17:47:06 +1200 Bart Janssen https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/southerly-the-astonishing-new-car-from-bavaria/?p=17758#post17758 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/southerly-the-astonishing-new-car-from-bavaria/?p=17758#post17758 For your geeky pleasure
the geek test

]]> Tue, 15 May 2007 17:44:16 +1200 Bart Janssen https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/southerly-the-astonishing-new-car-from-bavaria/?p=17756#post17756 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/southerly-the-astonishing-new-car-from-bavaria/?p=17756#post17756 Hi Keith

So what are you trying to say you don't want to be a geek?!? You got something against us geeks?????

As for your scooter plans. I'm guessing how bad the pollution is relates pretty closely to price. Pay more probably get a better (more efficient) motor.

But on…

]]> Tue, 15 May 2007 17:42:33 +1200 David Haywood https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/southerly-the-astonishing-new-car-from-bavaria/?p=17750#post17750 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/southerly-the-astonishing-new-car-from-bavaria/?p=17750#post17750 Keith Ng wrote:

Is the two-stroke engine used because of size? i.e. Is there a minimum viable size for a four-stroke engine that limits how small vehicles can get?

Two-stroke engines are used mainly for their power-to-weight ratio and cheapness. They have good power-to-weight ratio because they produce one 'power…

]]> Tue, 15 May 2007 17:23:36 +1200 Keith Ng https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/southerly-the-astonishing-new-car-from-bavaria/?p=17734#post17734 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/southerly-the-astonishing-new-car-from-bavaria/?p=17734#post17734

Exactly... not to mention all the unburnt oil/hydrocarbons, carbon monoxide, and nitric oxide you could wish for (and before anyone gets excited: nitric oxide is the uncool one, which makes you dead rather than high).

Interesting. I totally get some geek cred deducted for not knowing this. Is the two-stroke…

]]> Tue, 15 May 2007 16:40:03 +1200 David Haywood https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/southerly-the-astonishing-new-car-from-bavaria/?p=17524#post17524 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/southerly-the-astonishing-new-car-from-bavaria/?p=17524#post17524 I see the petrol heads are coming out of the woodwork...

Keith Ng wrote:

I was gutted to discovered that my last (first and only) vehicle, a very humble 1984 Honda City, only rates at around 4-5L/100km. I use to be so impressed by its fuel efficiency...

... ultimately, isn't…

]]> Mon, 14 May 2007 23:14:50 +1200 Philip Wilkie https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/southerly-the-astonishing-new-car-from-bavaria/?p=17511#post17511 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/southerly-the-astonishing-new-car-from-bavaria/?p=17511#post17511 Sighs

I've been driving efficient European turbo-diesels for about 6 years now, mainly because I actually prefer diesel engines to petrol (they just "feel" better to me).

But for the average punter the gloss is wholly rubbed off by the Road User Charge thing that almost doubles the fuel cost.…

]]> Mon, 14 May 2007 21:44:55 +1200 Stephen Judd https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/southerly-the-astonishing-new-car-from-bavaria/?p=17501#post17501 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/southerly-the-astonishing-new-car-from-bavaria/?p=17501#post17501 Mon, 14 May 2007 20:28:42 +1200 Bart Janssen https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/southerly-the-astonishing-new-car-from-bavaria/?p=17467#post17467 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/southerly-the-astonishing-new-car-from-bavaria/?p=17467#post17467 The real problem with scooters and tuktuks is the weather. Especially in Auckland.......And even if you get rid of the urban terror vehicles from the roads you still don't have the protection on a scooter for when you do make an error and hit a fence/wall/pig/power pole.

Which raises a…

]]> Mon, 14 May 2007 17:37:54 +1200 Stephen Judd https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/southerly-the-astonishing-new-car-from-bavaria/?p=17464#post17464 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/southerly-the-astonishing-new-car-from-bavaria/?p=17464#post17464 The problem with scooters and tuktuks is that they generally have two-stroke engines with a very dirty exhaust as far as particulates go – as bad as a car, even though their engines are so much smaller.

No doubt some engineering love could go a long way there too.

]]> Mon, 14 May 2007 17:17:20 +1200 Keith Ng https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/southerly-the-astonishing-new-car-from-bavaria/?p=17456#post17456 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/southerly-the-astonishing-new-car-from-bavaria/?p=17456#post17456 Very, very cool, David. As for radical vehicles not being a reality in New Zealand, that a political/marketing problem that doesn't seem particularly insurmountable. The "Smart" cars are everywhere in Europe, afterall, and even straight men are allowed to drive them.

The idea of radical fuel efficiency is pretty cool,…

]]> Mon, 14 May 2007 16:28:03 +1200 Joe Wylie https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/southerly-the-astonishing-new-car-from-bavaria/?p=17401#post17401 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/southerly-the-astonishing-new-car-from-bavaria/?p=17401#post17401 The Mini is perhaps the greatest example of a well-designed fuel-efficient high-performance car that enjoyed wide popular success.
From the Microcar Museum website:

Sir Leonard Lord, head of Austin, had a pet peeve:
"Damn these bloody awful bubble cars. We must drive them out of the streets by designing a…

]]> Mon, 14 May 2007 13:15:16 +1200 Don Christie https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/southerly-the-astonishing-new-car-from-bavaria/?p=17395#post17395 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/southerly-the-astonishing-new-car-from-bavaria/?p=17395#post17395 Mon, 14 May 2007 12:58:24 +1200 Rob Stowell https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/southerly-the-astonishing-new-car-from-bavaria/?p=17387#post17387 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/southerly-the-astonishing-new-car-from-bavaria/?p=17387#post17387 Small cars can be fun too- I had more fun in a mini 800 than any other car I've owned. Quite fuel efficient, and surprisingly nippy- and so low to the ground you felt you were almost driving a go-cart.
The vastly over-weight passenger vehicle thing seems very US somehow.…

]]> Mon, 14 May 2007 12:26:08 +1200 Joe Wylie https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/southerly-the-astonishing-new-car-from-bavaria/?p=17383#post17383 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/southerly-the-astonishing-new-car-from-bavaria/?p=17383#post17383 Mon, 14 May 2007 12:12:40 +1200 Mark Thomas https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/southerly-the-astonishing-new-car-from-bavaria/?p=17377#post17377 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/southerly-the-astonishing-new-car-from-bavaria/?p=17377#post17377

but the smallest-ever Minor engine (shared with the Austin A30)was rated at 803 cc

yeah... whoops. i wish i could remember where i heard that quote – maybe it was a different car. but my general drift is that cars today are so much heavier, so they need bigger engines,…

]]> Mon, 14 May 2007 11:51:32 +1200 andrew llewellyn https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/southerly-the-astonishing-new-car-from-bavaria/?p=17375#post17375 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/southerly-the-astonishing-new-car-from-bavaria/?p=17375#post17375 Heh. I remember we had an A30 when we were kids. I remember having to hop out & push it over those railway bridges South of Levin.

We had to be towed over the Mangawekas... (my dad was optimistic about what the car could do.)

]]> Mon, 14 May 2007 11:44:29 +1200 Joe Wylie https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/southerly-the-astonishing-new-car-from-bavaria/?p=17371#post17371 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/southerly-the-astonishing-new-car-from-bavaria/?p=17371#post17371

i think i read somewhere, that a 600cc morris minor was more efficient than a corolla or prius or something

I guess it's all down to how you define efficiency, but the smallest-ever Minor engine (shared with the Austin A30)was rated at 803 cc.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Morris_Minor

]]> Mon, 14 May 2007 11:35:23 +1200 Mark Thomas https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/southerly-the-astonishing-new-car-from-bavaria/?p=17367#post17367 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/southerly-the-astonishing-new-car-from-bavaria/?p=17367#post17367 Another great article david, cheers!

us humans only seem to move when we're pushed. if you look at the little motorbikes and cars that came out after WW2, they were quite a lot more frugal than today's cars (i think i read somewhere, that a 600cc morris minor was more…

]]> Mon, 14 May 2007 11:24:13 +1200 Rich of Observationz https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/southerly-the-astonishing-new-car-from-bavaria/?p=17347#post17347 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/southerly-the-astonishing-new-car-from-bavaria/?p=17347#post17347 Most gullwing/roof door designs have run into safety approval problems – you can't get out when the car rolls. Getting round this requires complex (and heavy) escape mechanisms.

Personally, I'd be happy to trade the deaths of those dumb enough to roll the car for the survival of Bangladeshi peasants…

]]> Mon, 14 May 2007 09:46:29 +1200 Stephen Judd https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/southerly-the-astonishing-new-car-from-bavaria/?p=17332#post17332 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/southerly-the-astonishing-new-car-from-bavaria/?p=17332#post17332 Oh dear, I read the transcript too fast, and didn't notice that David had already clarified Uli's meaning.

I don't know whether I'm adressing David or Uli here, but:

Das englische 'consequent' ist eine wörtliche Übersetzung [...] ich bin nun ein wenig verwirrt, was ich verkehrt gemacht haben soll.

Normalerweise…

]]> Sun, 13 May 2007 21:38:53 +1200 David Haywood https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/southerly-the-astonishing-new-car-from-bavaria/?p=17324#post17324 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/southerly-the-astonishing-new-car-from-bavaria/?p=17324#post17324 Plum wrote:

[The Loremo is comparable to] cities on the sea floor... a jet pack for everybody... an elevator to the moon...

Sorry, but this story just was a bit detached from political reality for me.

Wow, is a more fuel efficient car really in the same category as the…

]]> Sun, 13 May 2007 20:34:53 +1200 Stephen Judd https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/southerly-the-astonishing-new-car-from-bavaria/?p=17323#post17323 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/southerly-the-astonishing-new-car-from-bavaria/?p=17323#post17323 false friend. ]]> Sun, 13 May 2007 18:55:53 +1200 Joe Wylie https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/southerly-the-astonishing-new-car-from-bavaria/?p=17320#post17320 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/southerly-the-astonishing-new-car-from-bavaria/?p=17320#post17320 More eco-friendly vehicles from yesteryear than you've ever seen without going blind:

http://www.microcarmuseum.com/

If all of these failed to revolutionise transport, someone's got to get it right eventually, no? Good luck to Loremo.


Meanwhile, a microcar to tickle your reptilian brain:

http://www.microcarmuseum.com/tour/whattadrag.html

]]> Sun, 13 May 2007 18:21:35 +1200 James Green https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/southerly-the-astonishing-new-car-from-bavaria/?p=17319#post17319 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/southerly-the-astonishing-new-car-from-bavaria/?p=17319#post17319 Sun, 13 May 2007 17:48:55 +1200 James Green https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/southerly-the-astonishing-new-car-from-bavaria/?p=17318#post17318 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/southerly-the-astonishing-new-car-from-bavaria/?p=17318#post17318 Sun, 13 May 2007 17:48:22 +1200 James Green https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/southerly-the-astonishing-new-car-from-bavaria/?p=17317#post17317 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/southerly-the-astonishing-new-car-from-bavaria/?p=17317#post17317 And although the smart is small and cute, it uses a lot more fuel, and presumably doesn't go as fast. AA won't tell me how much a smart… ]]> Sun, 13 May 2007 17:44:27 +1200 plum https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/southerly-the-astonishing-new-car-from-bavaria/?p=17311#post17311 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/southerly-the-astonishing-new-car-from-bavaria/?p=17311#post17311 Stories like this engender mixed emotions in me. On the one hand, I grew up a geek and mostly am. And the otaku in me is waiting with bated breath for the breakthrough that will make worrying about global warming a thing of the past.

On the other hand, I…

]]> Sun, 13 May 2007 15:55:19 +1200 Public Address https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/southerly-the-astonishing-new-car-from-bavaria/?p=17310#post17310 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/southerly-the-astonishing-new-car-from-bavaria/?p=17310#post17310 Discussion from blog post.

]]> Sun, 13 May 2007 15:55:19 +1200