Public Address | Cafe | Southerly: Could the Mysterious Agricultural Techniques of an Ancient Amazonian Civilization Make New Zealand Farming More Competitive?

Owen Watson

Thu, 14 Jun 2007 18:27:10 +1200

On behalf of Foss Leach:
I am surprised at the comments made by your correspondent because there was nothing primitive about these ancient gardeners at all; on the contrary. I have great admiration for the way that pre-European Maori so quickly adapted their horticultural practices to the harsh New Zealand…

alfred harris

Tue, 29 May 2007 06:45:43 +1200

Revisions of history, in the absence of critical thinking, are a dangerous things. I stand by my original comments and look forward to Foss Leach's reply after reading the reference cited in the earlier posting.
Alfred Harris

alfred harris

Tue, 29 May 2007 06:41:22 +1200

Foss Leach wrote:

There is no direct evidence that any Polynesians (including Maori) deliberately set out to improve the fertility of dryland soils by adding things such as charcoal...

Your comments are not supported by the archaeological literature. The critical paper, very kindly pointed out to me by Owen Wilkes,…

alfred harris

Tue, 29 May 2007 06:32:53 +1200

Yes, a very, very good point. Kumara was one of the foods of chiefs. Karaka may well have been another. As such, most records show that the kumara brought to Aotearoa by Maori were tended as individual plants.
In the Amazonia, a lot of the beneficial charcoal effect seems to…

Bart Janssen

Thu, 10 May 2007 15:04:48 +1200

Hemp biomass is highest in cellulose, as well as an excellent nitrogen-fixer. Grows like a weed.
And if this is correct, why aren't we growing more of it ?

Don't know if it is the highest but there are a lot of plants that are very high in cellulose. Often…

David Haywood

Wed, 09 May 2007 20:12:15 +1200

Foss Leach wrote:

There is no direct evidence that any Polynesians (including Maori) deliberately set out to improve the fertility of dryland soils by adding things such as charcoal...

Thanks for posting Prof Leach's comments, Owen. From the papers I'd read there seemed to be very good evidence that the…

Owen Watson

Wed, 09 May 2007 13:27:41 +1200

Posted on behalf of Foss Leach:

Regarding charcoal in pre-European Maori garden soils: What is important here is to consider the mental process involved. There is no direct evidence that any Polynesians (including Maori) deliberately set out to improve the fertility of dryland soils by adding things such as charcoal,…

Benjamin Franzmayr

Wed, 09 May 2007 10:21:25 +1200

Hi David

Thanks for setting up the RSS feed for PAS. It's now on the AgResearch podfeeder page alongside New Scientist, Science, Nature, Heredity and USDA podcasts!

This story was very interesting – I already knew people were proposing it for carbon sequestration but I did not realise it was…

Russell Brown

Tue, 08 May 2007 17:12:15 +1200

... could anyone confirm some anecdotal info I had lately – Hemp biomass is highest in cellulose, as well as an excellent nitrogen-fixer. Grows like a weed.
And if this is correct, why aren't we growing more of it?
While I love universal panaceas, hemp is not a nitrogen…

stephen walker

Tue, 08 May 2007 15:34:07 +1200

I wondered if there had been any link established between the incidence of Terra Preta soil sites and Maori cooking practices: i.e. hangi?

alfred harris

Tue, 08 May 2007 11:20:11 +1200

paulalambert wrote:

... could anyone confirm some anecdotal info I had lately – Hemp biomass is highest in cellulose, as well as an excellent nitrogen-fixer. Grows like a weed.
And if this is correct, why aren't we growing more of it?

While I love universal panaceas, hemp is not a…

alfred harris

Tue, 08 May 2007 11:03:14 +1200

One of the really important things, well borne out by our own experiments as well as other results presented at the IAI, is that indigenous use of biomass was site specific. Soils do vary and the soils in Brazil and Japan where the biggest effects have been seen are what…

alfred harris

Tue, 08 May 2007 10:56:36 +1200

Jo S wrote:

Do you know if Aotearoa biocarbon are actually looking at liscencing the flash-burner from UH to make carbon for agriculture?

Yes, licensing is one option we are investigating at Aotearoa Biocarbon.

paulalambert

Tue, 08 May 2007 01:41:09 +1200

Please excuse me for being off topic slightly, er perhaps more than slightly.
But could anyone confirm some anecdotal info I had lately – Hemp biomass is highest in cellulose, as well as an excellent nitrogen-fixer. Grows like a weed.
And if this is correct, why aren't we growing more…

Andrew Stevenson

Mon, 07 May 2007 14:41:46 +1200

Raymond A Francis wrote:

And it will be even more interesting to see how this would balence out in energy terms ie energy needed to produce charcoal, carbon released into the atmosphere compared with carbon locked up in the soil

Not only to produce the charcoal, but also energy (and…

stephen walker

Mon, 07 May 2007 12:06:46 +1200

Great post David!

And very topical considering the International Agrichar Initiative in Australia linked by Joe.

Would you be kind enough to add the energybulletin.net Terra Preta links page to your further information section?

cheers!

[REPLY: Thanks, Stephen, I've done that — DH]

Raymond A Francis

Mon, 07 May 2007 11:45:58 +1200

Really interesting
And it will be even more interesting to see how this would balence out in energy terms ie energy needed to produce charcoal, carbon released into the atmosphere compared with carbon locked up in the soil
And even more importantly how the deep burying of charcoal would effect…

Sarah Flynn

Mon, 07 May 2007 11:33:47 +1200

Finn Family Moomintroll! one of my favourite kids' series ever! I'd completely forgotten about them, thanks for the reminder David/ Joe...

Fascinating post, I'm willing to bet that solutions to global warming lie in the soil and the sea, as bacteria & fungi are the main regulators of global nutrient & energy…

David Haywood

Mon, 07 May 2007 11:17:41 +1200

Jo S wrote:

Do you know if Aotearoa biocarbon are actually looking at liscencing the flash-burner from UH to make carbon for agriculture?

I think there's a degree of commercial sensitivity about some of Aotearoa Biocarbon's plans — but I do know that they are very impressed with UH's work…

Jo S

Mon, 07 May 2007 10:59:30 +1200

I too am really enjoying the public address science transcripts.
Do you know if Aotearoa biocarbon are actually looking at liscencing the flash-burner from UH to make carbon for agriculture?
I was a bit worried about by-product pollution too, but it's nice to see that although they aren't claiming it…

Mark Thomas

Mon, 07 May 2007 07:10:59 +1200

Another great story. I'm enjoying these public address science transcripts.

its quite good to think of all the stuff you can use to produce charcoal, like green waste and tyres. thats killing a lot of birds with one stone (to mangle an analogy)

Joe Wylie

Sun, 06 May 2007 13:40:23 +1200

By my everlasting tail, you're right, it COULD be the muskrat – darn tiny gravatars – but it's meant to be the Groke:

Then – they saw the Groke. Everybody saw her. She sat motionless on the sandy path at the bottom of the steps and stared at them with…

Ben Austin

Sun, 06 May 2007 12:37:55 +1200

I've been reading a few books on pre Columbian America, the most recent of which went into a bit of detail about this charcoal technique, and some other interesting techniques used by the Mayans.

Generally a pretty depressing read, but then a genocide by disease is never going…

David Haywood

Sun, 06 May 2007 10:38:41 +1200

Rob:

Very interesting about Bank's peninsula. As I understand it, the charcoal has to be worked about 30-40 cm deep for significant effects. Apparently, the soils in the Amazon can have charcoal worked up to 2 metres deep (but presumably that occurred over several generations).

Yes, the new technique for…

Rob Stowell

Sun, 06 May 2007 09:05:33 +1200

Great story- and thanks for the Aussie link, Joe.
I guess you can produce charcoal in vast quantities reasonably cleanly? (Not like the old charcoal works...)
It's interesting to speculate about charcoal, Banks Peninsula and the cocksfoot boom. After indescriminately burning off the bush, the forest soils- presumably somewhat charcoal-enriched-…

Joe Wylie

Sun, 06 May 2007 08:19:43 +1200

Fascinating stuff, many thanks. Meanwhile, an interesting piece on a very similar Australian initiative:

http://www.truthout.org/docs_2006/050307R.shtml

Very encouraging to see current Australian of the Year Tim Flannery (The Future Eaters, The Weather Makers) giving his support.

Public Address

Sun, 06 May 2007 08:19:43 +1200

Discussion from blog post.