Makes the even numbered person pointless in every vote. If it's…

Not necessarily. A jury of 12 requiring a 7 / 5 split to pass would be perfectly acceptable. The fact that they are called juries,…

One of the reasons our…

Guardian angels are indeed editors, but here in NZ we have Herald angels who have outsourced their editors to overseas sweatshops.

A year is a nano second to a an obfuscating bureaeacrat acting on "behalf" of a Minister..

Otherwise the "aye Jeemy" idea has some merit.

And you chose to use the most offensive tone possible to make your point.

And if you'd actually read what was written instead of what you wanted to argue against you would have…

Not sure what’s going on here, but I’m sure it’s not called for.

I’d have to agree with Lilith Steve. This is not helping.
If you…

And this was a fun thought experiment.

I'd have to agree with Lilith Steve. This is not helping.

But not the one you went to though... eh.

Well be careful because it has sharp little teeth and may be “Infekshuss” as JK would say.
Also there is clear supporting evidencec that hormones play an…

This is of interest to this thread as their Senate seems to have some interesting ways of electing members, including members elected by university graduates, appointed by the Taosiach…

Add the Juries to this list!!!! They too would be watched!

And, um, can I just point out that "somebody think of the children" clauses think of the CHILDREN, rather than their parents, who being adults are…

I think the post will have to get in line behind the Limpet.

Don't be silly* – it's because they will only vote the way their husbands/fathers/brothers tell them to vote.

*which I am patently being now

Isn't that like the argument that women don't need the vote because they have the ear of their husbands/fathers/brothers?

1. Mothers SHOULDN’T think about anything but looking after their children;
2. Mothers are not actually CAPABLE of thinking about anything but the fate of children.

I could not disagree more thoroughly with your post. In fact, I would…

Ahem. Actually, I do.

So no I do not believe in democracy.

Nice to have this on record, finally.

AS does this current bunch of fiscal felons. "We need constant surveillance of the populace because... al-Qaeda... terrorists.... blah... mums and dads... business confidence ...bl;ah blah blah. revenue stream ... loony Left ... blah...

No of course not. Democracy is not something you "believe in". It isn't a religion, contrary to the way the US treat it. It is simply a system of governance with advantages and disadvantages over other systems.

The very reason the jury…

Someone suggested that maybe they should be a virtual grouping only. So they don't have to leave their homes but simply get information and vote online.

Of course if you are going that far you may as well allow everyone…

It's the voting that actually matters, not the talking. Some people who say nothing at all make perfectly good decisions.

I’m not saying…

Deadly serious. 12 is too many in a room. If, god forbid, they all express their opinions it is utter chaos, but much more common is that three or four dominate and the rest just nod. When you have fewer it becomes more likely that…

Won't somebody think of the poor baby cheeses?

Let me address this in reverse order.
1. Parents of young children, especially young…

I don't think so, any more than I think a criminal jury would take a year to get to grips with the criminal law code, rather than the…

That would be the definition of ironic.

They could easily become the focus for public opinion.

Hmmm that raises issues about the safety of…

... and seemingly unwavering public support for the Govt as a whole. Wtf, NZ.

But – it’s too hard. No really. The detail and legal process to create something like this … sheesh.

Aw. Go oooooon. Are there any recent equivalent changes…

While in Opposition (2008):
“Why is the Prime Minister so opposed to New Zealanders exercising their democratic rights to be heard that she is using alleged technical difficulties to suppress the will of the New Zealand people?”…

it would be an arrogant government that went against it

fixed

I know you weren't and I wasn't either!

What would the juries say about the GCSB legislation eh? To protect themselves they might be wise to be under the new, fresh, cleaned out, re-minted Parliamentary Services that looks set…

Non-binding and will be completely ignored. Expensive though.

Now especially. This government has been pretty up front about treating the election as a mandate to do whatever – in the face of widespread strong public opposition.

But – it's too hard. No really. The detail and legal process to create something like…

What chance us actually getting this off the ground? People would support it, I think; politicians meanwhile, perhaps not. Perhaps one of the Labour hopefuls is…

They worked very hard to lean on politicians and failed – eventually.

Your point is valid though. But I think the one year term makes such influence difficult. It may be easy to buy off two juries but having to…

Accepting that small is good. I’d almost argue that 12 is too large. There have been very few meetings I have ever been in where the decision reached by 12 could not have been reached by 6.

But I’d also argue…

29 post of people thinking about government. Don't dismiss it. The possibility that you might develop an idea that might improve the country is worth the risk of a few electrons dying under a blanket of stupid.

I love the idea and the intent, fewer laws and less of the tendancy to treat the three year term as a right to do anything.

I think it would take most of a year for the juries to get to grips with what goes on in…

;- )

Let's take as an example the introduction of plain packaging for tobacco.…

They’re professional in so far as they get paid, but the line’s not far from there, really. And these jurors would be paid, hence professional.

Sorry, I didn't put that very well. I should have said "career politicians".

I don’t think the idea of age stratifying the…

It didn’t take long for the exceptions to turn up. Lets see what 29 posts have turned up already.

When the salaries get changed; Part time or full time; A majority in/on/by both juries; Move…

can't lose that game

David Garrett always struck me as conscientious as far as legislation was concerned. Brendan Horan also seems to be taking his responsibilities seriously, with campaigns on particular issues (e.g. support for people with diabetes is a big one presently).

Images of David Garrett and Brendan Horan flash through my mind. They're professional in so far as they get paid, but the line's not far from there, really. And these jurors would be paid, hence professional. I'd be amazed if…

There are also reputable studies showing altrustic behaviour as normal. Google is our friend.

Hope you dont mind if just pick that apart.

By welfare do you mean how monetarily well off they are? The level of physical…

Indeed it could. This, and the "where to seat it" could both be helped by having them…

If only we had robot overlords.

Jurors can’t be manipulated by an established government bureaucracy or civil service.

– bet they can, especially if bureaucrats only have to bamboozle em for a year at most.

I'm not sure that's true. The concept has been used before, with citizens' juries or citizens' assemblies essentially taking the place of Royal Commissions.

That would be a very sensible investigative approach, it seems to me...

The GSCB, Gay Marriage and Electoral Finance Act bills would have…

Oh dear, now I'm wondering if I have made a good translation from the Glaswegian!…

One might get an estimate…

And what is it in your opinion?

Yes, my grandfather intended the…

I’m also aware that appointing an upper house by sortition has recently been proposed for the House of Lords and the Canadian Senate (but without the double-upper-house twist…