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		<title>Public Address | Cafe | OnPoint: Beyond &#039;a bad look&#039;</title>
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		<description><![CDATA[A talking shop where we put the questions and our community illuminates the issues.]]></description>
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				<title>Katharine Moody</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=342234#post342234</link>
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						<p>On the state of the Fourth Estate in the States;</p><p><a href="http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-06-17/today-financial-journalism-suffered-epic-failure" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-06-17/today-financial-journalism-suffered-epic-failure</a></p>
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				<pubDate>Thu, 18 Jun 2015 16:40:00 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>izogi</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=341387#post341387</link>
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						<q>By refusing to put their own judgements as human beings into a story, they create a narrative vacuum, and then they fill that vacuum with people like Jordan Williams. There’s an entire industry of people like him who set themselves up to fill that vacuum, so they can control the…</q>
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				<pubDate>Mon, 01 Jun 2015 16:08:13 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Sacha</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340418#post340418</link>
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						Unfortunately Karl Rove showed us that the tactic works &ndash; attacking a political opponent for your own weaknesses neutralises their criticism. Politics is not a rational thing.
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				<pubDate>Thu, 14 May 2015 22:42:18 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Katharine Moody</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340413#post340413</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340413#post340413</guid>
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						<p><q>Audrey Young somehow manages to repeat the phrase five times in today’s Herald.</q></p><p>The real hilarity in Audrey's article was this para:</p><p><q>Referring to Mr Little as "angry Andrew, Mr Key told reporters the public would not take Mr Little seriously while he was "just bashing out slogans" and not…</q></p>
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				<pubDate>Thu, 14 May 2015 21:37:10 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>william blake</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340412#post340412</link>
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						I think the fragmentation occurring across media must be taken into account. Yes commercialisation of TV, radio and print also the sheer number of stations and channels, add to that ‘rolling news’ and the attention/ratings suck from electronic media. It may not just be dumbing down but also spreading too…
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				<pubDate>Thu, 14 May 2015 21:33:43 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Joe Wylie</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340411#post340411</link>
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						<q>...there has never been a further investigation into what really went on at ACC...I have a very bad feeling about the media these days, I simply have very little trust in the media as we have it now, it is certainly not doing the job it is meant to be…</q>
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				<pubDate>Thu, 14 May 2015 21:20:22 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Marc C</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340410#post340410</link>
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						With journalism in New Zealand there is something very, very disturbing going on. This is not just for the fact that most mainstream media is now under tight private commercial controls, or at least totally dependent on commercially earned advertising revenue, there are other forces at work, that have raised…
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				<pubDate>Thu, 14 May 2015 20:50:47 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>izogi</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340403#post340403</link>
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						<p><q>I definitely don’t contribute by ever telling people they should use the MSM to get their opinions</q></p><p>On that, where are the best places for most people to get their opinions when not the MSM, or at the very least reliable analysis towards helping them to form them?</p>
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				<pubDate>Thu, 14 May 2015 14:21:08 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Rob Stowell</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340401#post340401</link>
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						<p><q> journalism in this country is dead. </q></p><p>My sis is a journalist and wrote this &ndash; I liked it :)<br /><a href="http://www.nzherald.co.nz/wanganui-chronicle/news/article.cfm?c_id=1503426&amp;objectid=11446532" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">Visiting speaker Bryan Bruce knocked the stuffing out of neo-liberal economics in his Wanganui lecture on Saturday night.</a></p>
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				<pubDate>Thu, 14 May 2015 13:42:03 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>william blake</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340400#post340400</link>
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						Jaded Jonny v  Angry Andy
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				<pubDate>Thu, 14 May 2015 13:31:53 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>BenWilson</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340399#post340399</link>
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						<p><q>And then realise that means that when or if the left returns to power it wil have carte-blanche to return the favour, in spades.</q></p><p>I find it hard to get excited by the idea of that. Apart from being wishful thinking that might not eventuate, it's not that good of…</p>
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				<pubDate>Thu, 14 May 2015 13:27:07 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Sacha</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340398#post340398</link>
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						Asking a PM for comment is one thing. Letting them determine your angle is another.
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				<pubDate>Thu, 14 May 2015 12:44:44 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>izogi</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340397#post340397</link>
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						<p><q>It was mildly amusing in that it made both leaders look like plonkers.</q></p><p>From watching that report I thought she made Andrew Little look like much more of a plonker than John Key.  Right back to the introduction which set the stage by saying "it hasn't necessarily worked in his…</p>
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				<pubDate>Thu, 14 May 2015 12:41:13 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Tom Semmens</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340394#post340394</link>
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						<p><q>Audrey Young somehow manages to repeat the phrase five times in today’s Herald.</q></p><p>This is an illustration of Keith’s point that objective reporting is never objective. There is no such thing in not taking a position, because not taking a position is a position all of its own. Journalists like…</p>
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				<pubDate>Thu, 14 May 2015 12:02:32 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Bart Janssen</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340393#post340393</link>
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						<p><q>We’ve come from a $18 billion deficit five or six years ago ...</q></p><p>A deficit they created by their ridiculous tax cuts</p><p> <q> to pretty much a surplus.</q></p><p>Which would be pretty much the truth, much like being mostly a virgin.</p>
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				<pubDate>Thu, 14 May 2015 11:40:34 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Alfie</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340392#post340392</link>
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						<p><q>...the “Angry Andy” nonsense...</q><br />Audrey Young somehow manages to <a href="http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&amp;objectid=11448185" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">repeat the phrase five times</a> in today's Herald. And she has this quote from Key.<br /><q>We've come from a $18 billion deficit five or six years ago to pretty much a surplus. I think most New Zealanders would say that's the right…</q></p>
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				<pubDate>Thu, 14 May 2015 11:25:34 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Kumara Republic</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340391#post340391</link>
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						<q>I asked her on Twitter and apparently she did ask Key for a response to Little’s claim – and the “Angry Andy” nonsense was the response. Sure, “PM refuses to respond to allegation that public was misled over Budget” is a much better story than the silly one that went…</q>
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				<pubDate>Thu, 14 May 2015 11:14:22 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Russell Brown</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340390#post340390</link>
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						<p><q>It was mildly amusing in that it made both leaders look like plonkers.</q></p><p>I asked her on Twitter and apparently she did ask Key for a response to Little’s claim – and the “Angry Andy” nonsense <em>was</em> the response. Sure, “PM refuses to respond to allegation that public was misled…</p>
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				<pubDate>Thu, 14 May 2015 10:39:41 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Bart Janssen</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340389#post340389</link>
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						<p><q>Tova O’Brien’s “Angry Andy” report on 3 News last night might as well be a picture of what Keith is talking about in the post.</q></p><p>It was bizarre. It was like she'd read Kieth's post and thought he was promoting that kind of content free reporting.</p><p>It was mildly amusing…</p>
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				<pubDate>Thu, 14 May 2015 09:59:34 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Russell Brown</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340388#post340388</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340388#post340388</guid>
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						<p><a href="http://www.3news.co.nz/nznews/andrew-little-embraces-angry-andy-tag-2015051318#axzz3a3Y8agc0" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">Tova O'Brien's "Angry Andy" report on 3 News last night</a> might as well be a picture of what Keith is talking about in the post.</p><p>She doesn't actually even put the main claim in Little's speech – that the government knew well before last year's election that a surplus was…</p>
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				<pubDate>Thu, 14 May 2015 09:47:13 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Rich of Observationz</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340387#post340387</link>
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						That's broadly it. See, an honest argument against doing anything about climate change would run along the lines of NZ having the capacity to produce 20 times as much food as we eat, so even if that capacity is (literally) decimated by climate change, we'll still have enough food. And…
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				<pubDate>Thu, 14 May 2015 09:22:45 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>simon g</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340384#post340384</link>
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						<p><q>It is pretty common for PMs to be asked to comment on whatever is in the news. People are interested in their attitude to the topic of the day.</q></p><p>That may be true, and in itself does no harm. But increasingly the Prime Minister is the media replacement for the…</p>
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				<pubDate>Wed, 13 May 2015 23:47:46 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Katharine Moody</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340379#post340379</link>
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						<p><q>Because are they really hungry? </q></p><p>Very poignant indeed. Sadly, I've heard this argument, or inferences likewise, put up and reported so many times, we almost detach ourselves from the actual cruelty of the question.</p>
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				<pubDate>Wed, 13 May 2015 21:14:04 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Matthew  Hooton</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340376#post340376</link>
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						And by Muldoon before her. It is pretty common for PMs to be asked to comment on whatever is in the news. People are interested in their attitude to the topic of the day.
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				<pubDate>Wed, 13 May 2015 20:53:11 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>izogi</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340372#post340372</link>
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						<p><q>We have people in government who do not believe in evidence or science in general, that it’s all just someone’s opinion, that’s a matter of public record.</q></p><p>This may be true sometimes, but I’m guessing that for as much of the time it’s not a case of not believing in…</p>
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				<pubDate>Wed, 13 May 2015 20:17:37 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Sacha</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340370#post340370</link>
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						<p><q>When it's said he might lose his job because of all that "crusading", what is meant is that media who say things in the public interest will lose those same sponsors and their employers will have little choice but to shut them down.</q></p><p>Campbell Live retains the support of its…</p>
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				<pubDate>Wed, 13 May 2015 18:45:20 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Sacha</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340369#post340369</link>
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						thank you for clarifying.
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				<pubDate>Wed, 13 May 2015 18:42:41 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>tussock</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340368#post340368</link>
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						<p>When it is said that John Campbell is on a crusade about something or another, what is meant in traditional English is that John Campbell has said a few things in the public interest instead of just blithely quoting the lines provided by PR companies for their advertisers.</p><p>When it's…</p>
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				<pubDate>Wed, 13 May 2015 18:40:48 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Grant Taylor</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340367#post340367</link>
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						<p><q>Are you saying that’s not the case here? </q><br />Well, as I have said, I don't think they did/are doing a particularly good job but I think they are doing a <em>good enough</em> job (a la Pareto Principle), such that a better job would not have made a huge difference to…</p>
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				<pubDate>Wed, 13 May 2015 17:32:57 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Grant Taylor</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340366#post340366</link>
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						You might be right, Lilith. I really don't know what is behind the falling voting rate, here or elsewhere. Perhaps the news media have a big role to play in this &ndash; but I also get the impression that fewer and fewer people are consuming conventional news media and I…
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				<pubDate>Wed, 13 May 2015 17:28:20 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Lilith __</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340362#post340362</link>
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						<q>You don’t like them, I don’t like them, I didn’t vote for them – but a decisive segment of the population did. And I don’t see how the journalism we got, flawed though it was, could have been the decisive factor in either the election result or the behaviour patterns…</q>
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				<pubDate>Wed, 13 May 2015 14:16:53 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Sacha</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340361#post340361</link>
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						<p><q>Labour is only saved from similar criticism by their incompetence not their intent.</q></p><p><a href="https://dimpost.wordpress.com/2015/05/11/elections-in-the-anglo-sphere/" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">Danyl ponders</a> whether that is a permanent state of affairs.</p><p><q>The Conservative Party’s strategy in the UK election was pretty much the same as National’s strategy last year. It’s because they have the same strategic advisers of…</q></p>
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				<pubDate>Wed, 13 May 2015 13:54:03 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Sacha</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340359#post340359</link>
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						<p><q>Journalists can only be held accountable for the outcomes you describe if they have failed to inform the public of the facts, their meaning, implications and context </q></p><p>Are you saying that's not the case here? I have great respect for what informed citizens decide. That requires, as you say, reliable…</p>
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				<pubDate>Wed, 13 May 2015 13:48:37 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Bart Janssen</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340356#post340356</link>
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						<p><q>And I don’t see how the journalism we got, flawed though it was, could have been the decisive factor in either the election result or the behaviour patterns of the current government.</q></p><p>Except it is pretty clear that elections are now won and lost on the media-driven perception of the…</p>
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				<pubDate>Wed, 13 May 2015 13:27:16 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Ngaire BookieMonster</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340354#post340354</link>
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						<p>Wow. Remarkable piece, thank you for posting it. Very much made me think of the ideas here <a href="http://pressthink.org/2011/08/why-political-coverage-is-broken/" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">http://pressthink.org/2011/08/why-political-coverage-is-broken/</a> and <a href="http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2011/08/what-if-journalists-stopped-trying-to-be-political-insiders/244167/" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2011/08/what-if-journalists-stopped-trying-to-be-political-insiders/244167/</a> which builds on the same idea.</p><p>NZ political journalism is suffering exactly the same sort of problems.</p>
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				<pubDate>Wed, 13 May 2015 13:03:11 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Grant Taylor</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340353#post340353</link>
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						<p>Let me clear that I agree that journalists have not served us well. I cancelled my Herald subscription during the last election campaigning (and haven't reinstated it) precisely because of this. </p><p>But we can't, perhaps even <em>musn't</em>, take responsibility away from the electorate for the government we get. You don't…</p>
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				<pubDate>Wed, 13 May 2015 12:38:57 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Bart Janssen</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340350#post340350</link>
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						<p><q> I think it is a bit of a reach to ascribe the behavior of the current government to journalistic ineptitude.</q></p><p>If you watch the TV news and read the daily newspapers then you'll see story after story that supports and enables the behaviour of this current government.</p><p>The few times…</p>
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				<pubDate>Wed, 13 May 2015 12:10:37 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Grant Taylor</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340349#post340349</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340349#post340349</guid>
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						<q>After the election last year, I wrote this post on why the media failed over Dirty Politics. Not just because Key won the election, but also because Katherine Rich is still sitting on the Health Promotion Authority, because Jason Ede got swept under the carpet, and because Judith Collins didn’t…</q>
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				<pubDate>Wed, 13 May 2015 12:01:51 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Rich of Observationz</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340348#post340348</link>
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						<p>So basically, in your ideal utopia, there would be no need for elections, as all decisions would be made through proper peer-reviewed scientific process to achieve optimal results for desired outcomes.</p><p>In the case of designing a new flag for instance, international focus groups could be shown a range of…</p>
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				<pubDate>Wed, 13 May 2015 11:00:36 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Samuel Buckman</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340346#post340346</link>
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						<p><q>Public policy isn’t [objective] though.</p><p>Driver behaviour is a lot less predictable [than physics]. Will people obey the law? Will drivers slow down where they expect enforcement and drive badly elsewhere? Or take less care generally?</q></p><p>These are all objective questions, that can certainly be answered by experiment and can…</p>
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				<pubDate>Wed, 13 May 2015 10:30:55 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Jimmy Southgate</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340340#post340340</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340340#post340340</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p><q>The best journalism these days is on Comedy Central</q></p><p>That crown has been taken by HBO with Last Week Tonight.  Born of Comedy Central, but goes much deeper into a single story each week.</p>
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				<pubDate>Wed, 13 May 2015 06:20:52 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Joe Wylie</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340339#post340339</link>
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						<p><q>Great post and discussion – thanks Keith. Thanks PAS :)</q></p><p>+1</p>
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				<pubDate>Tue, 12 May 2015 23:40:21 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Rob Stowell</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340338#post340338</link>
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						Great post and discussion &ndash; thanks Keith. Thanks PAS :)
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				<pubDate>Tue, 12 May 2015 23:24:42 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Ross Mason</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340337#post340337</link>
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						<p>Phil Kitchin??</p><p>NNNNNNOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!  AAAAAGGGGGHHHHHHH!!!!!!</p><p>Bugger.</p>
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				<pubDate>Tue, 12 May 2015 22:29:41 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Sacha</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340336#post340336</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340336#post340336</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p><q>Phil Kitchin (our last print journo dedicated to investigative work) has left the building and gone over to Ministerial PR for Paula Bennett.</q></p><p>and people wonder why she did so well on this last weekend's <a href="http://tvnz.co.nz/q-and-a-news/govt-social-housing-target-3000-homes-video-6310455" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">Q&amp;A show</a>.</p>
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				<pubDate>Tue, 12 May 2015 21:09:05 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Sacha</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340335#post340335</link>
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						<p>Wonder if NZonAir funding the investigative aspects of TV3's '3D' programme this year is a model across media more broadly? </p><p>Let commercial media run its Glucinas and Hoskings without any 'journalistic' pretensions (or protections, in my view). Use targetted public funding for the expensive, non-lucrative journalism that commercial media is…</p>
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				<pubDate>Tue, 12 May 2015 21:01:37 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>andin</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340334#post340334</link>
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						<p><q>It’s a vacuous circle.</q><br />Yeah but its not life threatening.<br />Not yet to those in the spin cycle.<br />Whats that other circle thing ?</p>
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				<pubDate>Tue, 12 May 2015 20:25:32 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Lilith __</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340333#post340333</link>
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				<description><![CDATA[
						<p>Does anyone else actually remember Helen Clark’s years as PM? Yes she made herself available for comment on all sorts of issues. But <strong>she made damn sure she was briefed</strong> by officials first, so she could speak knowledgeably and answer questions meaningfully.</p><p>Remember Corngate? Clark was so angry because she…</p>
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				<pubDate>Tue, 12 May 2015 20:22:43 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Bart Janssen</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340329#post340329</link>
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						<p><q>Continuing to ask the PM for comment, regardless of which political stripe they may be, is ludicrous.</q></p><p>No it isn't. It's good job security. </p><p>Our PM actively excludes reporters who ask hard questions, so reporters are trained to never ask hard questions and never challenge the ignorant comment given. More…</p>
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				<pubDate>Tue, 12 May 2015 17:25:00 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>izogi</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340328#post340328</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340328#post340328</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p><q>its creators live in an infernal eternal “now”,<br />trapped in an ever-more rabidly, rapidly, spinning howling maw<br />demanding more and more quantity,<br />and delivering less and less quality.</q></p><p>If only we could vote one the journalists off every week.</p><br /><br /><p><br />Actually, to be honest, if we could then I'm not sure…</p>
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				<pubDate>Tue, 12 May 2015 16:36:58 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Phil Wallington</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340327#post340327</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340327#post340327</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						This is a great piece from Keith and an incisive dissection of our problem. Those who follow the investigative journalistic dredging of the swamp of NSW corruption would know of SMH journalist, Kate McClymont and her work exposing the Obeid family's decades of dodgy political dealings. Would that we has…
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				<pubDate>Tue, 12 May 2015 16:26:59 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>linger</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340326#post340326</link>
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				<description><![CDATA[
						<p>I think it’s become worse as the news cycle has contracted. <br />Today’s news cycle is so short as to leave <br />no room for memory, no time for reflection; <br />its creators live in an infernal eternal “now”,<br />trapped in an ever-more rabidly, rapidly, spinning howling maw<br />demanding more and more quantity,…</p>
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				<pubDate>Tue, 12 May 2015 16:10:24 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>fraser munro</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340325#post340325</link>
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						<p>therres a second aspect to the "ill give you a quote" aspects of both key and clarke</p><p>its not just the quote in and of itself &ndash; its the media news cycle that then runs from that quote</p><p>Just how often have we seen day one of a story as"…</p>
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				<pubDate>Tue, 12 May 2015 16:02:14 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Joe Wylie</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340324#post340324</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340324#post340324</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p><q>witness Gordon Campbell’s continual petitions for sainthood for Jim Anderton.</q></p><p>??? <br />Got a link? Just one example would be fine.</p>
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				<pubDate>Tue, 12 May 2015 15:35:10 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Tinakori</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340322#post340322</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340322#post340322</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						Well, David Fisher and Patrick Gower might have different ways of going about things and different motivations for what they do but to this viewer/reader the end result is exactly the same &ndash; sensationmongering. On Mathew Hooton there are left wing journalists with agendas just like there are liberal pundit/…
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				<pubDate>Tue, 12 May 2015 14:54:04 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Russell Brown</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340320#post340320</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340320#post340320</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p><q>it’s a planned tactic involving lying about figures, knowing that most of our media will regurgitate them unchecked without the slightest qualms.</q></p><p>It does remind me of <a href="http://publicaddress.net/hardnews/media-mathematics/" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">the long, strange struggle to get the Herald to stop using false figures on TVNZ 7’s audience</a> that were cited in the first…</p>
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				<pubDate>Tue, 12 May 2015 13:53:39 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>mic weevil</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340318#post340318</link>
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				<description><![CDATA[
						<p>Great post, thanks Keith.</p><p>Something else relevant to the discussion of John Key as pundit du jour:</p><p>It is part of the strategy of the Nats to make Key an everyday guy who you could have a beer with.  By constantly asking his opinions of all and sundry current affairs,…</p>
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				<pubDate>Tue, 12 May 2015 13:43:22 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Sacha</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340314#post340314</link>
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						<p><q>i think the interviewer knew he was bullshitting</q></p><p>She did. Here’s <a href="http://pundit.co.nz/content/party-of-no-vs-council-of-go" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">her producer’s take</a> on the matter.</p>
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				<pubDate>Tue, 12 May 2015 13:20:39 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Sacha</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340313#post340313</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340313#post340313</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						Generosity of interpretation is not warranted here. The consistency between Bridges’ and Key’s lines (and Brownlee and Joyce’s before that) tells us this is no accident; it’s a planned tactic involving lying about figures, knowing that most of our media will regurgitate them unchecked without the slightest qualms. Currie would…
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				<pubDate>Tue, 12 May 2015 13:19:25 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Tom Semmens</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340312#post340312</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340312#post340312</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						The best journalism these days is on Comedy Central, which kinda tells you everything you need to know about the state of contemporary journalism and the value of having an informed opinion behind your reporting.
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				<pubDate>Tue, 12 May 2015 13:10:05 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Tristan</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340309#post340309</link>
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						<p><q>  it was important that someone pointed it out. As far as I know, only Niall did so </q> </p><p>I think it was the nation who had Bridges on at the weekend and they asked him if he was 100 percent behind the figures he was quoating, i think the interviwer knew…</p>
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				<pubDate>Tue, 12 May 2015 12:39:42 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>James W</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340308#post340308</link>
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				<description><![CDATA[
						The "we just report the facts" argument is disingenuous, at best. It suggests the journalist is unaware of agenda setting or priming, or the simple fact that not everything is reported all the time – there's always judgement calls being made. "Just the facts" is their way of saying "we're…
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				<pubDate>Tue, 12 May 2015 12:35:16 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Russell Brown</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340307#post340307</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340307#post340307</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p>The government’s current tack in its cold war with Auckland Council has been interesting.</p><p>Yesterday Radio NZ’s Todd Niall wrote <a href="http://www.radionz.co.nz/news/regional/273293/ministers%27-figures-off-the-mark" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">a very measured column</a> pointing out that the figures brandished by Simon Bridges and Nick Smith on council transport spending were entirely fictitious. Whether they were quoting the numbers maliciously…</p>
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				<pubDate>Tue, 12 May 2015 12:14:26 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Katharine Moody</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340306#post340306</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340306#post340306</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p>You are so right &ndash; there are umpteen examples of JK usurping experts (or in the above case disingenuously conflating scientific method with legal representation).</p><p>In fact, I'm lecturing undergrad science students today and I use that interview as the best example I know of the politicization of science.</p>
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				<pubDate>Tue, 12 May 2015 12:05:26 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Alfie</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340305#post340305</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340305#post340305</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p><q>Continuing to ask the PM for comment, regardless of which political stripe they may be, is ludicrous.</q></p><p>You have to remember that in the same way ministers ask patsy questions during PM's question time, Prime Minister Ponytail was being <em>interviewed</em> by Paul Henry. Do sycophantic interviews with pretend journalists really…</p>
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				<pubDate>Tue, 12 May 2015 12:03:33 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>JonathanM</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340304#post340304</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340304#post340304</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p><q>Driver behaviour is a lot less predictable. Will people obey the law? Will drivers slow down where they expect enforcement and drive badly elsewhere? Or take less care generally?</p><p>Then there are other, unintended, effects. How much does resentment at social control measures like zealous road traffic enforcement lead to…</q></p>
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				<pubDate>Tue, 12 May 2015 11:48:16 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>izogi</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340303#post340303</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340303#post340303</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p><q>Road safety is an objective science</q><br /><q>Public policy isn’t though.</q></p><p>Water quality could be a better example.</p><p>"<a href="http://www.listener.co.nz/commentary/john-keys-unhappy-week-at-the-bbc/" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">He’s one academic, and like lawyers, I can provide you with another one that will give you a counterview.</a>", and all that.  And anyone who wants to agree with that line of reasoning…</p>
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				<pubDate>Tue, 12 May 2015 11:42:01 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Eddy Mason</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340302#post340302</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340302#post340302</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						I am still waiting for someone in the media to ask John Key "In your role as road safety expert, and being that reducing the speed limit is not a solution, then what other solution do you have?" And after he answers "Dunno", then ask him "How come you know…
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				<pubDate>Tue, 12 May 2015 11:40:09 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>linger</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340301#post340301</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340301#post340301</guid>
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						<p>@DeepRed<br />That and the priority placed on “accessing” over “critically assessing” politicians (or their functionaries) means much of the Fourth Estate functions as a gated community.</p>
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				<pubDate>Tue, 12 May 2015 11:35:45 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Kumara Republic</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340299#post340299</link>
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						<q>By refusing to put their own judgements as human beings into a story, they create a narrative vacuum, and then they fill that vacuum with people like Jordan Williams. There’s an entire industry of people like him who set themselves up to fill that vacuum, so they can control the…</q>
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				<pubDate>Tue, 12 May 2015 11:28:30 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Russell Brown</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340298#post340298</link>
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						<p><q>Sensationmongers like David Fisher and Patrick Gower eventually have the same problem.</q></p><p>Actually, their practices are completely different, and lie largely on opposite sides of the line Keith draws in the post.</p><p><q> He doesn’t have a left wing equivalent and that’s the Left’s loss. Danyl McLachlan at the Dim Post…</q></p>
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				<pubDate>Tue, 12 May 2015 11:10:29 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>izogi</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340296#post340296</link>
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						<p><q>I think this play was actually perfected by Helen Clark who was famous for always being available for a quote</q></p><p>Maybe, but if Helen Clark had a difference in this area it was that she could usually at least give the impression of knowing what she was talking about and…</p>
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				<pubDate>Tue, 12 May 2015 11:04:15 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Rich of Observationz</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340295#post340295</link>
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						<p><q>Road safety is an objective science</q></p><p>Public policy isn't though.</p><p>Sure, engineers can work out the survivability in various forms of crashes at various speeds and conclude that if all vehicles are travelling slower, there'll be less deaths and at some speed like 40kph, deaths will tend to zero (for…</p>
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				<pubDate>Tue, 12 May 2015 11:04:01 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Alfie</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340294#post340294</link>
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						<p><q>...we get things like Mike Hosking and Paul Henry put into prominent places which are normally associated with journalism.</q><br />Well said Izogi. </p><p>Guardian journalist Nick Davies spoke about media distortion and manipulation at the <em>Dunedin Writers and Readers Festival</em> last weekend. His main focus is the unfettered power of Murdoch's…</p>
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				<pubDate>Tue, 12 May 2015 10:42:23 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Tinakori</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340293#post340293</link>
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						<p>"Back in the day John Campbell and his team chased some of the Dirty Politics stuff really hard, yet nothing really seemed to change as a consequence, and eventually the story just died."</p><p>The impact of shows like Campbell Live is blunted because what they do and say is so…</p>
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				<pubDate>Tue, 12 May 2015 10:34:58 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>linger</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340292#post340292</link>
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						<p>Though those quotes weren’t then reported <em>uncritically, as the soundbite for the story</em> to the same extent we’re currently seeing.</p><p>Nevertheless, the problem of issues being buried in rentaquotes is hardly new: I once did an analysis of a story from 1990 (involving a case in which an Auckland homeowner…</p>
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				<pubDate>Tue, 12 May 2015 10:34:53 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Damian Christie</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340291#post340291</link>
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						I actually have less of an issues with JK commenting on road safety or whatever, than being the go-to pundit for comment on issues within the Labour Party or what-have-you.  It's like John Drinnan always going to Mark Jennings for comment about problems at TVNZ &ndash; well, what do you…
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				<pubDate>Tue, 12 May 2015 10:32:48 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Tristan</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340290#post340290</link>
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						<p><q> This is a big problem with this PM &ndash; he'll comment on any topic (regardless of the level of his actual </q> </p><p>I think this play was actually perfected by Helen Clark who was famous for always being available for a quote</p>
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				<pubDate>Tue, 12 May 2015 10:18:21 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Craig Ranapia</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340289#post340289</link>
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						<q>It’s not enough for journalists to assure us in the abstract that they make these judgements when Cameron Slater comes to them with a tip. Their rationale for why stories should matter to the public need to become a part of the output of journalism as well, both as a…</q>
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				<pubDate>Tue, 12 May 2015 10:18:02 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Ianmac</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340288#post340288</link>
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						Powerful stuff Keith. You articulate what many of us think/believe but we lack the venues to say so. Thankyou.
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				<pubDate>Tue, 12 May 2015 10:12:43 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>izogi</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340285#post340285</link>
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						<p>Thanks for the excellent write-up, Keith.  I have trouble with what seemed to happen to traditional journos when they spoke out, though.  What does it take to be confident of actually having an effect?</p><p>Back in the day John Campbell and his team chased some of the Dirty Politics stuff…</p>
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				<pubDate>Tue, 12 May 2015 09:54:36 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Sacha</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340282#post340282</link>
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						<p>Beautifully explained, thank you. I have been disgusted by the failure of NZ journalism to address its obvious failings in the light of #dirtypolitics. </p><p>Saying so on Twitter has led to a few journos blocking me, and others complaining that how dare the public hold them accountable to the standards…</p>
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				<pubDate>Tue, 12 May 2015 09:27:45 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Katharine Moody</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340281#post340281</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340281#post340281</guid>
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						<p>And additionally they fill that vacuum with John Key himself, in this country.  It's been coined the 'Minister of everything' effect, but it's more than that. He has become the journalistic substitute for seeking out actual experts on highly technical/regulatory matters.</p><p>For example, following the 10 road deaths this past…</p>
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				<pubDate>Tue, 12 May 2015 09:01:28 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Russell Brown</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340279#post340279</link>
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						<q>The other thing that they use as a replacement for their own judgement are proxies. They quote anyone who’s willing to answer the phone and say “yeah that’s a bad thing”, regardless of what the question is. There’s the issue of false balance, which again is well-trodden territory. But I…</q>
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				<pubDate>Tue, 12 May 2015 08:43:50 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Public Address</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340278#post340278</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/onpoint-beyond-a-bad-look/?p=340278#post340278</guid>
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						<p>Discussion from blog post.</p>
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				<pubDate>Tue, 12 May 2015 08:43:49 +1200</pubDate>
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