Public Address | Cafe | Island Life: The One Minute Stadium

Kyle Matthews

Mon, 20 Nov 2006 09:24:23 +1300

No, it's like buying a big-ass TV for your neighbour, and then going over every weekend to watch the game, and being charged $100. And $5 a beer.

And he never has decent parties there because the old lady on the other side complains about the noise. Man, if you'd…

Russell Brown

Mon, 20 Nov 2006 07:53:55 +1300

Imagine buying yourself a huge-azz plasma TV set costing $20k for the sole purpose of having your mates come over and watch one rugby game on it. Ever.

But that's exactly what you're talking about for Eden Park. Eden Park will never be able to to be used for any…

Jason Kemp

Sun, 19 Nov 2006 22:18:26 +1300

I heard an ex Mayor (Les Mills on radio) say (to the effect) that when the Port company starts supporting the waterfront he would take it more seriously.

I may have missed some of the debate – but I don't think the single most affected parties – being the Port…

stephen walker

Sat, 18 Nov 2006 21:33:45 +1300

nah, just use the money to build robbie's rapid transit, 40 years late is better than never

Rongotai

Sat, 18 Nov 2006 15:58:52 +1300

if you want to worry about money we would build anything publicly but in 20 years time we will be saying gee that was a good idea and that wasn't a lot of money
Sir dove wanted to build a rapid transit system 30 years ago
now that would have…

Lee Wilkinson

Sat, 18 Nov 2006 12:23:44 +1300

Its not a tricky call really. Put the tall poppy choppers aside and look.
There are many more existing infrastructural pros in favour of Carlaw park and the waterfront than Eden park, but the bottom line is that Eden park will only EVER be for a couple of games of…

Craig Ranapia

Fri, 17 Nov 2006 16:56:45 +1300

Mark:

I've looked at both the Government and The Auckland Council sites you link to. My problem isn't that there's a pretty obvious "bias" involved, but that someone appears to just be pulling numbers out their arse. Sorry for sounding like a broken record, but if these were pitches from…

Tomorrowpeople

Fri, 17 Nov 2006 12:30:20 +1300

Oh, and here's a vote for teh container port – I actually like the physical look of it. The ships are cool, the hum of the port.

I live overlooking all this and am constanty seeing pieces of crap that are passed off as building littering the waterfront area.
The…

Tomorrowpeople

Fri, 17 Nov 2006 12:20:04 +1300

Spend the money on getting Auckland's transport sorted out or some other worthy cause.

Hold the rugby game at Jade Stadium in Christchurch.
Such a lovely town for all the tourists to visit etc....
:/

These guys should know by now that budget blowouts on construction projects are de rigeur.…

Mark Thomas

Fri, 17 Nov 2006 12:05:27 +1300

...there's next to no hard details on the table...

you're totally correct, there's no hard info out there, but there's never going to be unless we wait six months for detailed designs and pricings for either option. And i totally understand that people are pi**ed off because the whole thing…

Clarke

Fri, 17 Nov 2006 11:37:46 +1300

in the words of brian,
enough is enough!

Yes, but the only reason Brian uses that particular phrase is that (a) there are only three words for his spectacularly dim supporters to remember, and (b) two of them are the same, making point (a) just that teensy bit easier.

antv

Fri, 17 Nov 2006 08:48:35 +1300

in the words of brian,
enough is enough!

Craig Ranapia

Fri, 17 Nov 2006 08:30:48 +1300

David wrote:
__I was just saying to someone in an email this afternoon:

I'm a bit irked that anyone who objects to the thing is damned as a dithering visionless wowser. Generally, I'm up for a punt. But just 14 days to resolve this? Do me a favour.

One useful…

Dave Nicholas

Fri, 17 Nov 2006 07:22:07 +1300

I was a big fan of Carlaw Park as an option, but this Herald graphic
persuaded me that the space for a stadium simply doesn't exist on that site.

Look at the size of the Carlaw Park area and the surrounding buildings and Domain (SE corner of graphic). Compare that…

Rongotai

Thu, 16 Nov 2006 21:57:04 +1300

here is a strange idea.
give the world cup to Japan,
they should have got it in the 1st place if the powers that be want to incourage rugby globally.
Then the government put aside a great dollop of money ($100m) so we could all go to a pub and…

David Slack

Thu, 16 Nov 2006 20:40:13 +1300

Ha, David, this is the first time I can recall us strongly disagreeing about anything ...

That's probably because I play only a careful selection of the country section of my iPod when you come to visit.

You're right, there are significant distinctions to be made. If Bob Clarkson's right,…

Russell Brown

Thu, 16 Nov 2006 20:20:41 +1300

Stadium Australia's not a good comparison at all. It's about 15km (in a straight line) from the Sydney CBD and there's nothing there. It would be like going to, well, North Harbour Stadium. The firm promised to develop amenities around it and couldn't. The better comparison is with Melbourne.

I don't…

Yamis

Thu, 16 Nov 2006 19:26:06 +1300

Oh, Lang Park = Suncorp Stadium.

Yamis

Thu, 16 Nov 2006 19:25:30 +1300

wikipedia link for Suncorp Stadium

That there be a link to the wikipedia entry for lang Park, destination for Rob Fisher and some journalists on a free lunch to the max.

Never been to Lang Park but I notice from the text: "Suncorp Stadium is within walking distance of the…

David Slack

Thu, 16 Nov 2006 18:56:42 +1300

Fancy that!

From Stuff:

SYDNEY: It was billed by then Olympics boss Juan Antonio Samaranch as the best stadium he had seen.

.......

But a decade after the disastrous float of Stadium Australia Group its banker, ANZ, will take control of the debt-laden stadium for next to nothing. In effect…

Mark Graham

Thu, 16 Nov 2006 18:40:53 +1300

Surely the decision to go ahead with the waterfront is not reliant on what happens above the platform to be built. Can we not decide to go with the waterfront option and then spend a couple of years debating the design of the stadium itself while the platform is built?…

David Slack

Thu, 16 Nov 2006 18:18:03 +1300

I was just saying to someone in an email this afternoon:

I'm a bit irked that anyone who objects to the thing is damned as a dithering visionless wowser. Generally, I'm up for a punt. But just 14 days to resolve this? Do me a favour.
One useful aspect, though:…

Jeremy Andrew

Thu, 16 Nov 2006 16:26:57 +1300

I'm reminded of a tried and true parenting technique that I've used on many an occasion (don't tell my kids...). Give them the illusion of a choice: Don't ask "What would you like to do today?", give them a short list of options – "Would you like to go to…

John Francis Logan

Thu, 16 Nov 2006 15:54:23 +1300

I think Rod Oram said it all:

"Everything is wrong about this decision: the choice of location; the choice of funding; the wishful thinking about its impact on Auckland's economy; and the processes – marked by a lack of analysis and candour – by which the government is sucking itself…

Liz

Thu, 16 Nov 2006 08:53:15 +1300

Kia ora tatou from Christchurch. I think the rational way to resolve the issue would emerge from an accurate answer to three questions, namely: 1. If the waterfront stadium is built, will it be the best possible use (for the public) of an area that currently has extraordinary potential? 2.…

Dave Nicholas

Thu, 16 Nov 2006 08:40:44 +1300

Stadium Australia is not a great example for Auckland to follow: with a debt of A$140m it's just been sold to its bankers (ANZ) for A$10m...
http://www.smh.com.au/news/business/debt-sinks-stadium-australia-anz-to-take-control-for-10m/2006/11/15/1163266637056.html

David Slack

Wed, 15 Nov 2006 20:44:27 +1300

Genius! I can't believe no-one thought to do this before now. What's the one thing Bob 'The Builder' Clarkson is an expert on? Building a stadium, of course. He's done it, and he's done it in a hurry. And what does he reckon this one would cost? Plenty

How much…

Moz

Wed, 15 Nov 2006 17:28:23 +1300

From Sydney the perspective looks a bit different. The Opera House is up for major refurbishment because it's never actually been suitable for opera and the users are getting sick of it. So after years of controversy as it was being built, heaps of whining afterwards because it's a better…

Dave Nicholas

Wed, 15 Nov 2006 17:10:51 +1300

Here's a genuinely visionary design statement for a waterfront stadium

www.wakastadium.co.nz

not sure how the cost would stack up, but hey, why not

David Slack

Wed, 15 Nov 2006 16:52:14 +1300

Ready for another option?

Via Peter Cresswell, check out the Waka Stadium

Russell Brown

Wed, 15 Nov 2006 14:26:57 +1300

The Auckland City Council's comparisons page is interesting:

http://www.aucklandcity.govt.nz/stadium/comparison.asp

I'm not sure if I believe the waterfront costings, but this part is especially interesting:

"Special legislation to bypass Resource Management Act needed for both options."

Can't recall reading that in the paper ...

Ben Christie

Wed, 15 Nov 2006 11:18:07 +1300

This is so depressing. I can just see this oppurtunity to create something truly great for Auckland city, being ruined once again by wowsers and petty politicking.

Whether or not you like the All Blacks or rugby, the All Blacks are a global brand recognised around the world for their…

Dave Nicholas

Wed, 15 Nov 2006 11:17:19 +1300

Where ever the new stadium is it will look a little silly (and half empty) if the All Blacks don't make the 2011 Final...

Rhys Lewis

Wed, 15 Nov 2006 09:27:20 +1300

There are some very important questions about process and opportunity here. The waterfront is one of Auckland City's prime assets, and it is incredible that we are being forced into rubber stamping either a hastily thought out stadium, or sinking more money into Eden Park.

If we're finally allowed to…

David Slack

Tue, 14 Nov 2006 21:06:12 +1300

Imagine the fun and games that would be going on right now if John Banks was still Mayor of Auckland... Fire, Aim, Ready perhaps?

I see him as more of a Fire, Fire, Fire kind of guy.

All this because of a 12,500 seat shortage at Eden Park?

Indeed. And…

Jeremy Andrew

Tue, 14 Nov 2006 20:23:57 +1300

One thing no-one seems to have speculated upon yet – Imagine the fun and games that would be going on right now if John Banks was still Mayor of Auckland... Fire, Aim, Ready perhaps?

Bryan Dods

Tue, 14 Nov 2006 19:19:43 +1300

All this because of a 12,500 seat shortage at Eden Park?

Surely the NZRFU can run its business in our brave new free-market world without having to hold its hand out to the public.

I can't see the profits being shared back to the 'investors'.

Get on with some sound…

Paul Williams

Tue, 14 Nov 2006 18:30:03 +1300

Melbourne's sport precinct is possibly the best in Australia because it is both accessible by public transport and close to the city.

Olympic Park in Sydney on the other hand struggles to make ends meet outside of major sporting and cultural events. It's too damn far away for one event…

Chris Beer

Tue, 14 Nov 2006 17:35:28 +1300

Is it paranoid to suggest that the waterfront stadium proposal is really just a decoy?

A few months ago there was outrage at spending $300m to upgrade Eden Park. Now that we are faced with paying a $700m bill for a ridiculously impractical harbourside monolith, the Eden Park option suddenly…

Dave Leech

Tue, 14 Nov 2006 15:53:43 +1300

I'm waiting to see all of the tabled proposals in one place, with costings and statistics in such a form that will allow a proper, balanced comparison.

There so much impassioned rhetoric flying about at the moment that its hard to see the facts through the spittle. Deep breaths and…

peter mclennan

Tue, 14 Nov 2006 15:14:56 +1300

I am sick and tired of the media turning the waterfront Vs Eden park story into some sort of conflict, rather than doing some solid work on this issue – especially the string of worthless, highly unscientific polls. The media spend money on gauging the nation's political pulse, yet they…

Mark Thomas

Tue, 14 Nov 2006 14:58:51 +1300

wow, the first photo of whitecaps stadium looks almost identical to "our" waterfront stadium.

aerial photograph 1

if it comes down to spending money on doing up an old stadium in the 'burbs, or putting a new one in next to a train/ferry/bus station and the motorway, i think i…

Gary Hutchings

Tue, 14 Nov 2006 14:42:42 +1300

Getting back to the proposed "design" for a moment, I googled "waterfront stadium" and the first thing that pops up is a proposed soccer ground for Vancouver BC, granted it is smaller, 15 to be possibly scaled to 30,000 later , its essentially a 2 sided ground with a low…

Craig Ranapia

Tue, 14 Nov 2006 14:03:50 +1300

Yes, Russell, I'm very fond of Melbourne too – but mostly because they didn't manage to FUBAR all their splendid Victorian and Edwardian architecture, despite the heroic efforts of cowboy developers and state and local government quite happy to bend planning regulations into quite ingenious shapes. I don't usually agree…

Michael Stevens

Tue, 14 Nov 2006 14:01:39 +1300

Marx once said "The government is simply the executive committee of the bourgeoisie" (or words pretty darn close).

Who really profits here? Taxpayers fork out, and the construction firms, the IRB, the NZRFU, and al their assorted lackeys and parasites, get the goodies. And we in Auckland get a stadium…

LegBreak

Tue, 14 Nov 2006 13:56:35 +1300

This fable, originally published over 2 months ago, is starting to look more likely by the minute.

http://www.sportsfreak.co.nz/show-column.asp?ID=195

Robyn Gallagher

Tue, 14 Nov 2006 13:49:17 +1300

I'm not buying the argument that the stadium is a bad thing because it looks like a haemorrhoid cushion, flat tyre or a donut.

The Sky Tower is considered by some to resemble a hypodermic needle, and yet it hasn't made Auckland or New Zealand the laughing stock of anywhere.…

Anne M

Tue, 14 Nov 2006 13:43:50 +1300

We don't need a new stadium. New Zealand is full of places to play rugby. Auckland alone has enough of them. If the International Rugby Board is not content with Eden Park or the Jade Stadium they should hold their tournament somewhere else like Canada or Italy. We should not…

Russell Brown

Tue, 14 Nov 2006 13:35:24 +1300

Even the crass Aussie's, despite screams of protest from the philistine rump, managed in the end to build their spectacular opera house.

And that was considered a scandal for years ...

They've also managed Darling Harbour, which is shopping and hospitality; and Melbourne's brilliant sports precinct by the Yarra, home…

John Francis Logan

Tue, 14 Nov 2006 13:18:24 +1300

Aside from the question: 'is another rugby pitch really necessary' and the fanatical rugby-mad Mallard's bullying, the thought that the Waitemata harbour, acknowledged as one of the most beautiful in the world, should be blighted by a rugger pitch resembling a flat tyre is appalling. Even the crass Aussie's, despite…

Richard Aston

Tue, 14 Nov 2006 12:52:52 +1300

Stadium smadium who cares... Large amounts of money being spent on another sports venue it seems an appalling waste of public money.
I smell another Britomart ie large public building project set up for dubious reasons when all we needed was trains running on time.
Rugby should be played on…

Rich of Observationz

Tue, 14 Nov 2006 12:43:33 +1300

Comparing the size of the economies, the $500mln for the stadium is the equivalent of $3bln for the Aussies, or $12bln for the UK.

I don't believe the UK government would stump up that sort of money to get the rugby world cup (Twickenham was actually rebuilt using debentures raised…

Paul Litterick

Tue, 14 Nov 2006 12:12:59 +1300

We don't need a new stadium. New Zealand is full of places to play rugby. Auckland alone has enough of them. If the International Rugby Board is not content with Eden Park or the Jade Stadium they should hold their tournament somewhere else like Canada or Italy. We should not…

Craig Ranapia

Tue, 14 Nov 2006 12:02:57 +1300

Oh come on, like G&S's Mikado, don't you find Dick Hubbard a source of innocent merriment. My eyes almost popped out when I saw him intone in the Herald, "I come from the business community where to get things done sometimes circumstances dictate a reasonable amount of speed. Sometimes instead of…

Public Address

Tue, 14 Nov 2006 12:02:57 +1300

Discussion from blog post.