Hard News: Through the Looking Glass
131 Responses
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Personally, it struck me as a contest that told me a bit about where the respective candidates are at personally, but remarkably little about where they're going politically
I doubt even if they did say things of substance that I'd believe them. It boils down to this - vote for Labour and get more of the same. Vote for National and who knows? Which is better? No one knows for sure, nor could they.
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As you can see from my "Posts:" count I am a fresh-faced newbie here at PAS and not yet adept at reading the sub-text.
There's a subtext here? That's it, Im off :)
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Jim I certainly agree that our debt-to-GDP ratio is appalling and needs work, but you can't lay the blame at Cullen's feet for people spending up like that. I've certainly seen plenty of comments from him lamenting the nature of our foreign debt, but to expect those comments to completely change the nature of people's spending is a little unusual.
And then to dismiss the things he CAN impact as Minister of Finance (retirement savings, surpluses etc) as pointless and worthless?And it goes well beyond this "all coming to a head" - it's been a problem for some time, independent of any existing credit crunch (our "spending ways" aren't the problem there frankly).
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Stewart, any subtext is completely of my own making - and the day you (or anyone) decodes it I'm pretty sure my wife would appreciate a phone call explaining it... =>
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'it's not about being "told how to spend your money", it's being honest with your constituents that debt relative to GDP cannot improve when people continue to live beyond their means with funds borrowed offshore"
i agree. we just don't seem to have that dialogue happening , I don't know why because if the housing market burns people its a plainly broken market that needs instant focus .
We're housing a population here, we've got multiple concerns here.
We don't communicate well on market distortions, we sit in awe and wonder at what the invisible hand is doing.....and ultimately when we do see the hand it appears its giving us the finger.
we need smarter market information.
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A capital gains tax on property speculators? Bring it on!
You mean like sCB6 of the Income Tax Act 2007, which says:
Income
(1) An amount that a person derives from disposing of land is income of the person if they acquired the land—
(a) for 1 or more purposes that included the purpose of disposing of it:
(b) with 1 or more intentions that included the intention of disposing of it.It's already possible for the IRD to tax gains on property speculation, but it's a section that's not really enforced. If the IRD started walking around with that particular stick, and remember that it's the taxpayer's duty to prove that they didn't buy with the intention or purpose of resale, property'd become a far-less-attractive "investment".
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Isn't it just the nexus of capitalism and human nature that makes people go for the short-term gain and the soonest gratification? They saw the housing market taking off and other people 'making money' at it and they wanted in themselves. A bit of easy money that doesn't involve a whole lot of work and, in the short-term, it works.
But in the longer term it becomes another pyramid scheme where the last people to get into it are the ones who get their fingers burned the most severely. I suspect that politicians know well enough not to go upsetting the electorate too much in terms of telling them not to chase that easy money. They can make quiet noises to that effect but daren't make too much of it as, in a democracy like ours, thwart the people & they will vote you out. It doesn't matter if it is "for their own good".
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"It's already possible for the IRD to tax gains on property speculation."
people forget the beatlemania of the housing market. It was a frenzy and was fueled by numerous "you may never ever own a house if you don't buy now" stories and people read that and think the heralds giving them a fatherly tip and investors were thinking "gold", a subservient renting market forever .
Everyone was housing, it was like that time in the 1980's when everyone had shares, when everyone dives in the pool its hard not to want to follow but after the pool is chaos it's hard not to want to have a rule about jumping into pools together.
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John Key's just said he'll form a "razor gang" to slash bureaucracy.
Christ on a bloody bike, could he not think of a more dumb-arse expression to use ?Is he unaware that when the Bolger govt was elected, the likes of Jenny Shipley, Bill Birch, Simon Upton, etc, were the "razor gang" then and slashed social welfare, health, housing, this, that and the next thing. And what did it achieve ? Sod all, apart from misery.
You can bet that Labour will immediately react to that comment by saying "We all know what happened last time National had a 'razor gang'...".
If Key wants to reduce spending on bureaucracy (and our civil service is a very small amount of govt spending compared to other OECD countries), well, he's free to aedvocate it.
But to phrase it that way is just stupid and plays into Labour's hands.
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what the hell are razor gangs ..weren't they like 1950 motorcycle gangs ? it's such an ugly image.
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Grant McDougall from Wgtn Journo school 1994 or 95-ish? (Al Wilkinson's (TV3) year?)
Anyway, Matthew wrote:
...remember that it's the taxpayer's duty to prove that they didn't buy with the intention or purpose of resale,
I could be wrong - I can't think where I heard this - but don't a lot of advocates for a capital gains tax often suggest the first property be exempt? Start buying and selling multiple properties and yeah, the onus goes on you to show why you shouldn't be subject to the tax.
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It's not about being "told how to spend your money", it's being honest with your constituents that debt relative to GDP cannot improve when people continue to live beyond their means with funds borrowed offshore.
I think you're confusing Minister of Finance with Minister Responsible for the Economy, which we don't have. Cullen is responsible for what the government does with its money. His responsibility for managing the economy is much more limited, and comes more under the heading of "if you screw up the economy you're unlikely to get re-elected".
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As soon as I saw that "Razor Gang" headline I thought "How dumb do National think we are?" I reckon they must be going for the "Yoof" vote who would not remember what "Teh Razor Gang" was. Either way Gran is correct, the term sux big time and just illustrated Shon Key's lack of understanding. We don't actually want to slash bureaucrats literally.
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Sorry, Grant not Gran ;-)
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Totally in keeping with the "slash the bloated bureacracy" meme he's been riding for a while.
This was the first thing that sprung to mind:
Lyrics here if you can't be arsed listening to the whole song.
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Minister Responsible for the Economy, which we don't have.
Isn't that what we have the governor of the reserve bank for? Who is, kinda like a nod and a wink away from the Finance Minister, which is why the interest rates went up to slow the housing market. Is it not?
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John Key's just said he'll form a "razor gang" to slash bureaucracy
i think he actually said, 'cabinet expenditure control committee' and the papers re-worded it.
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Isn't that what we have the governor of the reserve bank for?
Nope, certainly not under our regime anyway. The Governor can only very indirectly affect the economy via interest rates, but regardless is actually legislated to ignore the economy and focus solely on inflation.
They're remaining responsibility is around the banking and financial sectors... -
Governor of the Reserve bank has no part to play in fiscal policy, and the Minister of Finance is more hands off with monetary policy, as a rule...not completely hands off, but they do pass a lot of responsibility to the RB when they set interest rates.
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The world needs a great project worthy of innovative prowess. That project is leading the green revolution, being the country that sets the example in the world by growing rich, respected, entrepreneurial, competitive, energy-secure, nationally secure by becoming the greenest country in the world. Some countries are slowly waking up to the real need for investment in this.
NZ needs to invest in R&D green technologies, for a new economy.My money is on this.Energy technology will be the next great thing for the world.Key or Clark should support NZ inventors and companies that are focusing this way.Spend money on real engineering rather than financial engineering! -
In due respect, where was Micheal Cullen warning NZers to tighten their belts when it was blindingly obvious that this was all coming to a head?
Well, he was. Don't you remember all the "it's our money" calls that Cullen seemed deaf to for so long. Turns out maybe he was right, eh?
And to be fair he *has* been predicting a series of deficit years, just not so deep or so long. I would also note that the headlines of recent days have mainly been based on "worst case" scenario forecast, which suits Cullen right now.
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So. As I see it. Fiscal policy is what the Minister of finance enacts with approval of cabinet. Monetary Policy is what the Governor of the Reserve bank enacts under legislation (Reserve bank Act)
and the Economy is controlled by an invisible hand. Yes, that all makes sense now ;-) -
I could be wrong - I can't think where I heard this - but don't a lot of advocates for a capital gains tax often suggest the first property be exempt? Start buying and selling multiple properties and yeah, the onus goes on you to show why you shouldn't be subject to the tax.
Yup. Because generally, if you're living in a house, it hasn't been purchased with the primary aim of resale.
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NZ needs to invest in R&D green technologies, for a new economy.My money is on this.Energy technology will be the next great thing for the world.
Now, that is the most sensible thing I have heard, 'cept National wants us to stop helping out with anything like Research and Development, rid us of those "expensive" energy conservation measures and put a few bucks in our pockets to go out and spend to "stimulate the Economy" (presumably by buying imported goods, Tui moment)
We could start with something like this.Solar panels supplied at a small cost to each home through Govt loan scheme. Network interface enabled by private enterprise to connect homes to network Excess power generated by homes bought by generating companies and stored by pumping water back to lakes thus eliminating expensive batteries and control equipment.
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Anyone who thinks every government policy as a "political plaything" is being cynical in the extreme.
Paul: I think the last week has given this fiscal conservative ample reason to be entirely cynical. Perhaps there is some sound reasoning and credible costings to come in the fullness of time, but I'm sick of waiting. I shouldn't have to wait.
And Mr Williams, as a general rule of thumb the person who says "something needs doing" is precisely the last person I want doing a damn thing. Let's just a little bit of reality into the room here -- the Cullen Fund was not the only option. It was created through an intensely political process (parliamentary democracy works like that), and nothing is written in stone. You can argue it shouldn't be.
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