I just read in Newsweek that Obama wrote the speech himself.

It had so much personal experience in it I think he was the only one that could do the job. A speech writer no matter how good would have introduced a few false notes and he had to nail…

Obama's chief speech writer, is Jon Favreau.

I just read in Newsweek that Obama wrote the speech himself. (I'm sure Favreau helped him, but still... pretty impressive.)

that era is just a bit of an anomaly

Oh, I think Clinton was a badass speaker too. By 'era' I'm just talking about the latest dude. Seven-plus years is a long enough goddamned time to listen to the dubious vocal stylings of George W. Bush.

The era of ridiculous simplistic repetitiveness in presidential speechmaking can't end soon enough.

If you consider Democrats that era is just a bit of an anomaly.

But it is a beautifully written and balanced attempt to take a much loftier view of the issue, while framing it in words that all sides of the divide can (should?) understand.

I am so pathetically grateful to have someone running for president who can carry off a speech that…

Sure, but I was more impressed by the substance under the rhetoric.

Absolutely – sorry I didn't mean to imply it was a triumph of style over substance at all. But it is a beautifully written and balanced attempt to take a much loftier view of the issue, while framing…

Dunno if it will make any difference with regards to the bruising fight to the death that he is engaged in with Hillary, but that is one mighty fine piece of rhetoric.

Sure, but I was more impressed by the substance under the rhetoric. Sorry for using a disgraceful cliché,…

Not bad really.

Dunno if it will make any difference with regards to the bruising fight to the death that he is engaged in with Hillary, but that…

But I see very little criticism of Clinton based on her policies, rather it's she's supposedly divisive, she'll cause the Dems to lose etc.

Well, I think we're going to have to agree to disagree on the first part of that — because after running the '3 am' ad, I…

And I prefer to get my fiction from novelists not pollsters.

I completely agree to an extent, Kerry was 14% ahead of Bush at this stage of the election cycle, but besides our own personal preferences, the polls are the only form of factual evidence in any Who Will Beat…

OK, the polling got that one right according to most sources. The Supreme Court however...

Well, since you brought that up — you'd think the 2000 election, and Bush v. Gore, would have put paid to the notion that 'small' states don't matter. After all, if Gore had carried his…

we'd be eagerly awaiting President Gore's valedictory.

OK, the polling got that one right according to most sources. The Supreme Court however...

You can go by the Readers Digest version, I perfer some facts.

And I prefer to get my fiction from novelists not pollsters. Remember, Neil, if the polls at this point in an electoral cycle were reliable Neil Kinnock would have become Prime Minister of Great Britain in 1992, John…

Just maybe having a woman as President of the most powerful country in the world might do something for the disenfranchised and savagely oppressed women of some of those countries.

Oh yes, quite possibly. And that would be a good thing.

But the original article was talking about the perception…

Do you mean dailykos? There's always been a strong anti-Clinton faction out there but there are pro-Clinton sites (or at least not so partisan) too such as TalkLeft.

I mean Americablog, Huffpo, Buzzflash and Kos: a really big netroots bloc between them — three of them are probably in the…

Both Obama and Clinton ahead of McCain by 1.5% but Clinton gets more votes than Obama. (That's matched by a slight corresponding increase in votes for McCain).

So the famous divisiveness that the Obama camp claims to be…

Who's the big winner from all the crap flowing from the Clinton campaign.

McCain.

Now, as long as he doesn't lose his mind and select Romney as his running mate, I can live with a world in which John and Cindy are the tenants of 1600…

I think not, Craig.

Seems to me she said [paraphrase]: If our opponents are going to run with an "experience counts" message, why would we want to stand a rookie up against them?

Perhaps, daleway, but I decided to take what she said at face value. And perhaps I'm a…

Partially because no country is 90% women, partially because most world leaders are male, and partially because of who she is and who she's married to, there won't be so much interest from countries in having Clinton get elected.

And in terms of major…

His election would also – far, far more than the election of another war-mongering white man, and yes, even considerably more than the election of a woman – send an unimaginably powerful message to the rest of the world, where most…

But you and Tomasky offer no evidence that this would be true.

I think we've covered this ground. So, up to you what you think really.

I find the mix of wildly extravagent claims of Obama's future success combined with quite vicious attacks on Clinton such as by Michael Tomasky…

So either having a better perception at the country level is going to help...

But you and Tomasky offer no evidence that this would be true.

Obama could very well have an edge over Hillary in offering something positive to some conflicts in Africa. But it's not like there haven't…

Seems to me she said [paraphrase]: If our opponents are going to run with an "experience counts" message, why would we want to stand a rookie up against them?

And as for Muslim reaction to either Clinton or Obama, it's anyone's guess whether they would rather…

but Toamsky is also making the claim that there would be that perception. I'd just like som evidence.

Well it seemed fairly logical to me. But if someone runs around surveying world leaders... good on them.

But you could agrue that someone that could transcend national boundaries might do more…

And according to Nancy Pelosi, Clinton also wrecked any chance of the "dream ticket".

Did anyone really take it seriously in the first place? Perhaps it might have worked, but not less than a week after the 'it's 3am, a phone rings in the White House' ad. For me, the…

Do you mean dailykos? There's always been a strong anti-Clinton faction out there but there are pro-Clinton sites (or at least not so partisan) too such as TalkLeft.

she'd have destroyed all the goodwill and motivation in the base.

Do you mean Obama supporters? Of…

Yes but it's not a fact therefore I can disagree. Do you have any evidence that a Pres Obama being black would be better for the world than a Pres Clinton being female? I'd certainly scoff if Clinton supporters made such a claim for her.

You were poking at someone…

This is beyond 'scorched earth', and into Cathargo delenda est territory.. Her and her campaign have certainly given the McCain camp and the far-right enough soundbites to last all the way through to November, so she better win the nomination. Not least for the sake of her own reputation.

If…

Kyle, you're missing the point. Many observers have pointed out that Ferraro dismissed as 'sexism' any suggest that she wouldn't have been on the Democratic ticket in '84 if she had a penis between her legs instead of a vagina.

No I don't think I am missing the point. This…

In politics, analysis is opinion.

Yes but it's not a fact therefore I can disagree. Do you have any evidence that a Pres Obama being black would be better for the world than a Pres Clinton being female? I'd certainly scoff if Clinton supporters made such a claim for her.…

But it's just his opinion, it's not analysis.

In politics, analysis is opinion. Unless someone has done some polling of world leaders as to who they think is going to send a stronger message to the world, it's all just opinion, but it sounded like accurate analysis to me.

Why…

And to be perfectly gender balanced, I'm also shaking my…

vYou're criticising Tomasky for accurate analysis.

But it's just his opinion, it's not analysis. Why wouldn't the election of a woman send as strong a signal? I keep on thinking that the biggest signal is electing a Democrat of whatever gender or race. It will be the policies of the…

That's far more than a woman coming from an Obama supporter. What would be the reaction if a Clinton supporter said far more than a black man.

That's nonsense, clearly the election of Obama would send a very strong message on the world stage, particularly to countries whose populations are…

...I am here to…

I'd have been slightly terser in you in Clinton's position: "What a fucking stupid question, Steve, and one I won't dignify with an answer. But I'd just like to add that I'm proud to represent one of the most diverse cities on Earth."

And Ferraro isn't only a race-baiting…

They're probably not deals for your mum, but for communications-happy households they're a welcome innovation.

WTF? I thought we were past this sort of stereotyping these days. Bad Russell! Go sit on the naughty step and have a long think about what you've said. Time starts now...

Steve Kroft: “You don't believe that Senator Obama's a Muslim?”

tussock: “I find the whole notion of questioning people's religion to be insulting, but the Senator has made unequivocal public statements regarding his Christian faith and I'm not here to call him a liar.”

Steve Kroft: “You'd take Senator Obama…

"... as far as I know."

I don't support Clinton, but this one's been blown out of all proportion. Here's the full text:

Steve Kroft: “You don't believe that Senator Obama's a Muslim?” Steve Kroft asked Sen. Clinton.

Hillary Clinton: “Of course not. I mean, that, you know, there is…

It will be independents that by and large decide most presidential elections in America, in those battle-ground states.

I don't know, Kyle. It seems to me that McCain has his own 'Limbaugh Effect' to deal with — because there's no guarantee the Dittoheads and Ann-droids are going to hold their…

Plus, are you sure it was Bill'O? Not Limbaugh? Taking such a partisan position doesn't really seem like Bill'O

Doh! – you are correct.

If the Dems were determining this, Clinton would likely be winning.

Yeah. There's an interesting debate over that, given most democrats/republicans are going to vote for their own candidate in the general. It will be independents that by and large decide most presidential elections in America, in those battle-ground states.…

Craig, I just can't fathom the degree of hostility that Obama supporters have for HRC. On the basis of policy – where there are very slight differences between them – I can't see the justification.

Neil: And I don't get the pissy sense of entitlement that exists among Clinton supporters…

I think the point may have been that although Obama is leading in the popular vote, he's not leading among Democrats. He's leading once independents and Republicans who can vote in some contests are taken into account.

If the Dems were determining this, Clinton would likely be winning.

If you're…

It makes interesting reading. No wonder there's a bit of debate over Florida.

...it would also be interesting to see some stats on Dems who turned out to vote this year only because there was…

I've heard plenty of people point out that this allows tactical voting from Republicans, who have been exhorted by the likes of Bill O'Reilly to vote for Clinton to ensure she wins the nomination (on the basis that many Republicans believe HRC will be easier to beat)

I think that's…

If the Dems were determining this, Clinton would likely be winning.

Hmmm, thats an interesting claim Graeme, if true, I'd love to see the evidence.

While its true that Republicans and Independents can vote in some states (which is bizarre) I've heard plenty of people point out that this allows…

I think that the interests of the Dems should be determined by the Dems themselves and at present around 50% of them want Hillary.

And may I point out that more than 50% of those who voted want Barrack? He's leading in the popular vote

I think the point may…

Sure she's gone after Obama – but he's done exactly the same, that's politics. But…

I should add, regardless of the outcome of this fascinating race, I'd have no issue with Clinton or Obama (or McCain for that matter) as Prez – I'm sure any one of them would be infinitely better than the incumbent :)

Well, I'd like to think the bar is set…

But certainly the Obama camp is promoting the idea that her even running is an attack on democracy.

Oh, theatre. Do you think "the Clinton camp" and various proxies could stop screaming 'misogyny' every time she's criticised on policy grounds? That pointing out her voting record on issues of concern…

From where I've been standing, it seems fairly clear that the vast majority of the dirty pool and negative politics has been coming from the Clinton camp -

Obama made a series of TV ads attacking Clinton's health policies. Those ads were exact copies of ads the insurance industry used…

Perhaps Skynet will be tougher on crime than our current representative democracy?

And Obama is above all that – he's going to bring a fresh approach to Washington.

Except that while he was telling the workers of Ohio how much he opposed NAFTA he had his people meet with the Canadian govt to…

If Obama was a white man, he would not be in this position. And if he was a woman (of any color) he would not be in this position. He happens to be very lucky…

vintage Craig, thinly vieled misogyny wrapped in thick blanket of piousness

Oh, Snowy. Two penny minds shouldn't use fifty cent words without looking them up in the dictionary. I'd almost be offended if you weren't so painfully ridiculous.

you've got to have a sneaking admiration for just how shameless Clinton is

vintage Craig, thinly vieled misogyny wrapped in thick blanket of piousness

Completely off-topic, and without vouching for its veracity, I am finding the current Clinton spin about a change in momentum interesting to say the least in light of this

Richard:

OK, I've made it pretty clear my preference is for a McCain/Obama general, but you've got to have a sneaking…

Completely off-topic, and without vouching for its veracity, I am finding the current Clinton spin about a change in momentum interesting to say the least in light of this

Isn't that a Jimmy McGovern script?

It happened to a friend of a friend, in a California town. Madness.

There are US states where taking a leak down an alley at night can get you on a sex offenders' register.

Isn't that a Jimmy McGovern script?

Count your blessings. There are US states where taking a leak down an alley at night can get you on a sex offenders' register.

I didn't think the kind of people who hung around alleys at night looking for dick were easily offended. My sheltered upbringing shows again...

It's the…

Hey you. Stop piddling on the lamppost! Yes, everyone is looking at you now! Yes you look like a dick! Thank you.

more like: MUAHAHAHAHAAHA.... tiny, YouTube will love this one... fark! is this thing on!

Choose a lampost away from any letterboxes....

Hey you. Stop piddling on the lamppost! Yes, everyone is looking at you now! Yes you look like a dick! Thank you.

more like: MUAHAHAHAHAAHA.... tiny, YouTube will love this one... fark! is this thing on!

No not a conspiracy, just a really bad story that they should be embarrassed about.

i'll never be able to urinate in a public place again

Count your blessings. There are US states where taking a leak down an alley at night can get you on a sex offenders' register.

Rich, I don't think using them as proof is the idea. It's using them for clues.

I'm pretty sure they were used as evidence in the Wellington case O'Connor was talking about.

And the cops certainly (and understandably) wanted to use them in the Te Qaeda cases — in fact,…

Here's some of the story – unfortunately the entire story has been 'erased' from the Stuff website.

Someone else might know better, but I don't think stuff archives all news stories. They tend to disappear after some period of time. I don't know if that has to do with stuff,…

Just another demonstration of how our monopoly newspapers have a built-in bias towards authoritarianism, if not explicitly towards the National party (until recently).

Incidentally, I'm surprised that defence lawyers don't question the admissability of text messages as evidence, considering they can be easily forged: http://www.smsspoofing.com/

Call me a wet liberal pussy

Can I do it in a txt? ura wet libz puss.

The average person can be caught on CCTV 300 times a day. An innovation about to be piloted in 20 areas is talking cameras, enabling anyone misbehaving to be told off by a loudspeaker.

i'll never be able to urinate in a public place again

LOL, that's funny.

Thanks for the compliment, merc, but I wish O'Connor would bloody cut it out. Call me a wet liberal pussy, if you must, but I actually think there's some relationship between the extremely high levels of public respect for the Police (which the overwhelming majority deserve, IMO),…

Sleepwalking into a surveillance society
By PATRICK CREWDSON – The Dominion Post | Tuesday, 10 April 2007
New Zealand risks descending into a surveillance society like Britain where people are continually monitored as…

To an extent I could accept it in the role of an advocate where he had to always support the officer in question, until he chose to go against…

I like to think our police would still have the acumen to capture some of these criminal masterminds without the availability of archived texts.

SJ said; And should I turn myself in?

The magic internetball says...Yes.

But does he need to constantly engage in the not so subtle moral blackmail of "either you're with me, or you're a hoodie-cuddling cop hater"

LOL, that's funny.

I don't regard Mr O'Connor as a great servant of liberty, and I wouldn't expect him to grasp the potential for abuse of such an archive.

Russell, I'd go a damn sight further — I don't regard O'Connor as a great servant of the members of the Police Association. In…

BTW: Kudos to Vodafone's Paul Brislen for having the skills and sense to post information in his official capacity, as he did on Stephen's blog. I wish comms people did that more often, rather than insisting on routing the information through a third party in the news media.

He does…