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		<title>Public Address | Cafe | Hard News: The United States of Surveillance?</title>
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		<description><![CDATA[A talking shop where we put the questions and our community illuminates the issues.]]></description>
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				<title>Ross Mason</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=288583#post288583</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=288583#post288583</guid>
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						<p>This has turned up on Facebook.</p><p><a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&amp;v=UrOZllbNarw " target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer"> Good Will Hunting's rant at the NSA</a></p>
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				<pubDate>Fri, 21 Jun 2013 07:31:33 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Rich Lock</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=288568#post288568</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=288568#post288568</guid>
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						<p>Cheers Anth.  A real-life Kobayashi Maru.</p><p>I've dug up a couple of references for Chinese hacking of delegates laptops and phones <a href="http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/news/nation/2008-05-29-US-china-laptop-copied_N.htm" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">here</a> (from 2008) and <a href="http://www.stuff.co.nz/world/australia/7050616/Australian-minister-out-to-evade-Chinas-spies" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">here</a> (from 2012, with references to earlier visits and leaving compromisable items behind).</p>
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				<pubDate>Thu, 20 Jun 2013 21:13:28 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>anth</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=288552#post288552</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=288552#post288552</guid>
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						The war game that a couple of posters referred to, which got reset and the opposing force ordered not to do anything unexpected, was <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Millennium_Challenge_2002" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">Millennium Challenge 2002</a>.
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				<pubDate>Thu, 20 Jun 2013 19:34:49 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>BenWilson</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=288294#post288294</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=288294#post288294</guid>
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						Heh, very good. The post event interviews were a bit short, though, and no one cried. At least one guy should have got stage fright. Then they could do a post production interview of him talking up how excited he was beforehand (which they'd show beforehand), and then one afterward…
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				<pubDate>Wed, 19 Jun 2013 09:47:40 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>linger</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=288291#post288291</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=288291#post288291</guid>
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						<p>Or they could have their contest on a hill, overseen by Konnie Huq. <br />( <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1eJtQOca8lU" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer"> <em>Screenwipe</em> S05E04</a>, from around 25:00. NB: Some nudity, so the <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qTddBiNEPPw" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">YouTube of the exact section</a> is age-restricted.)<br /><a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qTddBiNEPPw" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qTddBiNEPPw</a></p>
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				<pubDate>Wed, 19 Jun 2013 08:06:48 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>BenWilson</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=288289#post288289</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=288289#post288289</guid>
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						They should have their contest on an island, someway off the mainland, inviting only the elite fighters from all around the world. We could send Sonny Bill Williams, who wouldn't even notice when he's beat because he'll be too busy looking <em>good</em>. I'd like to see Winston Peters play the…
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				<pubDate>Tue, 18 Jun 2013 22:49:07 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Rich Lock</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=288285#post288285</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=288285#post288285</guid>
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						<p><q>What a ridiculous way to organize things.</q></p><p>Well, yes. But also ridiculous to expect humans to act dispassionately, logically and reasonably rather than treating absolutely everything as some sort of adrenaline-fuelled game of one-upping brinksmanship.</p><p><q>Ironically, the government could deploy secure comms on an ordinary smartphone, but don’t, because they…</q></p>
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				<pubDate>Tue, 18 Jun 2013 20:45:14 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>BenWilson</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=288284#post288284</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=288284#post288284</guid>
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						The advantages are a little underwhelming. Their intelligence meant they kept the Pacific Fleet small. Not sure if that was a sound strategy in the end. But hell, the Peace to end all Peace wasn't played well by anyone.
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				<pubDate>Tue, 18 Jun 2013 20:23:49 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>David Hood</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=288281#post288281</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=288281#post288281</guid>
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						<p>Some history on spying on negotiation partners, and advantages<br />From <a href="http://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2013/06/gentlemen-reading-each-others-mail-a-brief-history-of-diplomatic-spying/276940/" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">the Atlantic</a></p>
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				<pubDate>Tue, 18 Jun 2013 19:27:42 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Russell Brown</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=288260#post288260</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=288260#post288260</guid>
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						<p><a href="http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/jun/17/edward-snowden-nsa-files-whistleblower" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">Snowden’s new Q&amp;A with Guardian readers</a> was both interesting and frustrating. Someone did try for clarification:</p><p><q> <em>1) Define in as much detail as you can what “direct access” means.</em></p><p>More detail on how direct NSA’s accesses are is coming, but in general, the reality is this: if an NSA, FBI, CIA,…</q></p>
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				<pubDate>Tue, 18 Jun 2013 12:34:33 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Sacha</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=288251#post288251</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=288251#post288251</guid>
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						<p><q>So who on earth could be is spying on him</q></p><p>corporate money traders :)</p>
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				<pubDate>Tue, 18 Jun 2013 11:47:01 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Rich of Observationz</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=288248#post288248</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=288248#post288248</guid>
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						<p>It’s not hard to make a cryptographically secure system. It’s harder to make one that’s usable, especially in communicating with arbitrary people.</p><p>I’d imagine that NZ has some sort of secure inter-embassy communication system, but it’s cumbersome – the user has to go to a secure place in the embassy,…</p>
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				<pubDate>Tue, 18 Jun 2013 11:39:43 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>BenWilson</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=288244#post288244</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=288244#post288244</guid>
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						<p><q>I helps if you know their negotiating postions as you go.</q></p><p>I guess so. But really, when you're holding the cards, you're holding them. Eventually, they all get played. Most of the real sorting into who gets what happens at the deal, not during the playing. If you have a…</p>
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				<pubDate>Tue, 18 Jun 2013 10:41:54 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Kumara Republic</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=288243#post288243</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=288243#post288243</guid>
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						<p><q>So who on earth could be is spying on him……obviously not the British…. cos we’re mates.</q></p><p>Nicky Hager, maybe? Oh wait, he doesn’t surveil, he just receives leaks, which is not the same thing.</p>
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				<pubDate>Tue, 18 Jun 2013 09:53:24 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Ross Mason</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=288240#post288240</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=288240#post288240</guid>
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						<p>Oh the irony.  JK says that he has <a href="http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/8807105/Key-vigilant-about-spying-possibilities  " target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer"> "high levels of encryption on my phone"</a> and his Ipad.</p><p>So who on earth could be is spying on him......obviously not the British.... cos we're mates.</p><p>"But he was less worried about his host governments than others who might seek…</p>
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				<pubDate>Tue, 18 Jun 2013 09:09:20 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Sacha</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=288215#post288215</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=288215#post288215</guid>
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						<p><q>Surely nations turn up with their list of wants and find some compromise.</q></p><p>I helps if you know their negotiating postions as you go.</p>
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				<pubDate>Mon, 17 Jun 2013 17:31:04 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>BenWilson</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=288212#post288212</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=288212#post288212</guid>
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						<p><q>I’m not sure what they want to keep quiet, but it’s one of the ostensible reasons for giving GCSB all that money and power.</q></p><p>Not having anything to keep quiet is an ostensible reason to remove that money and power. And that's the least of the reasons not to have…</p>
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				<pubDate>Mon, 17 Jun 2013 14:03:21 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Rich of Observationz</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=288208#post288208</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=288208#post288208</guid>
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						I'm not sure what they want to keep quiet, but it's one of the ostensible reasons for giving GCSB all that money and power. It's another reason for a future government to replace them with an accountable and under-control body.
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				<pubDate>Mon, 17 Jun 2013 12:35:25 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Kumara Republic</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=288205#post288205</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=288205#post288205</guid>
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						<p><q>The latest is how the UK bugged delegates email at G20 conferences.</q></p><p>On that note, what if it happened, say, to the World Economic Forum or the Bilderburg Group? Unstoppable force meets immovable object?</p>
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				<pubDate>Mon, 17 Jun 2013 11:50:58 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>BenWilson</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=288204#post288204</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=288204#post288204</guid>
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						Do we even have anything we'd be trying to keep secret from Cheltenham/Langley? I don't know how these conferences work, what the great need for secrecy even is. Surely nations turn up with their list of wants and find some compromise. How much of that is really secret? If it…
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				<pubDate>Mon, 17 Jun 2013 10:18:08 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Rich of Observationz</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=288202#post288202</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=288202#post288202</guid>
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						<p>The latest is how <a href="http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2013/jun/16/gchq-intercepted-communications-g20-summits" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">the UK bugged delegates email at G20 conferences</a>.</p><p>Given NZ isn't in the G20, we wouldn't have been there. But I wonder how well GCSB defends our people against similar bugging when they visit UK, given their status as a branch office of Cheltenham/Langley. (Not to…</p>
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				<pubDate>Mon, 17 Jun 2013 09:04:44 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Rich Lock</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=288195#post288195</link>
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						<p><q>enjoy it while it is still allowed</q></p><p>Blocked on copyright grounds.  Curse you, erm...Someone!</p><p><a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MjMCaw4qzjg" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MjMCaw4qzjg</a></p>
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				<pubDate>Sun, 16 Jun 2013 21:39:47 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Ian Dalziel</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=288185#post288185</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=288185#post288185</guid>
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						<p>...and then there's the signal to noise solution...<br />(warning contains humour that may be confused with insurrection &ndash; enjoy it while it is still allowed)<br /><a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n2Ml6gvYveg" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n2Ml6gvYveg</a></p>
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				<pubDate>Sun, 16 Jun 2013 08:14:03 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Ian Dalziel</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=288184#post288184</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=288184#post288184</guid>
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						<p><strong>Dr Strangelove redux…</strong><br />Meet <a href="http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/2013/06/general-keith-alexander-cyberwar/all/" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">Emperor Keith</a> – commander of the US Cyber Command.</p><p>So that’s why copper is so expensive these days!</p><p>Here's a flashback to <a href="http://www.computerworld.com/s/article/9164978/Narus_develops_a_scary_sleuth_for_social_media?taxonomyId=18&amp;pageNumber=1" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">earlier surveillance system</a> start ups...</p>
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				<pubDate>Sun, 16 Jun 2013 07:55:51 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Ian Dalziel</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=288076#post288076</link>
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						<p><q>my paranoia clearly needs a tune up .</q><br /><strong>ask and you shall receive...</strong><br />;-  )<br /><a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NZyVZFJGX5g" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NZyVZFJGX5g</a><br />I can't believe it's Friday again already!</p>
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				<pubDate>Fri, 14 Jun 2013 07:18:41 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>BenWilson</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=288002#post288002</link>
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						<p><q>The general way things are considered “safe” against spying is by being open to scrutiny- for example the code used is open to inspection otherwise trust will not get built.</q></p><p>Or you have in-house expertise who verify it all, and keep the details as secret as possible because they don't…</p>
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				<pubDate>Thu, 13 Jun 2013 14:48:58 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>David Hood</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287944#post287944</link>
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						The general way things are considered "safe" against spying is by being open to scrutiny- for example the code used is open to inspection otherwise trust will not get built. I think this is not a bad article from last year that highlights the culture and some of the issues…
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				<pubDate>Thu, 13 Jun 2013 11:17:58 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Richard Aston</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287935#post287935</link>
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						<p><q>    Anyone seen this site offering protection from network surveillance.</p><p>Wouldn’t that be the perfect business model / front for a savvy / sneaky intelligence gathering operation that wanted to corral a lot of ‘people with something to hide’?</q></p><p>Oh dear Ian , I hadn't thought of that , my paranoia…</p>
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				<pubDate>Thu, 13 Jun 2013 10:42:19 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Ian Dalziel</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287909#post287909</link>
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						<p><strong>Ear America?</strong><br /><q>Anyone seen this site offering protection from network surveillance.</q><br />Wouldn't that be the perfect business model / front for a savvy / sneaky intelligence gathering operation that wanted to corral a lot of <em>'people with something to hide'?</em></p>
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				<pubDate>Thu, 13 Jun 2013 06:59:47 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Ian Dalziel</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287908#post287908</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287908#post287908</guid>
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						<p><strong>the fecal finger of fate...</strong><br /><q>Turning toilets into geysers of poo just isn’t feasible, fortunately.</q><br />There were instances of 'bubbling over / blowback' in Chchch due to earthquakes or sewer repairs &ndash; but that was probably localised pressure problems within a street...</p>
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				<pubDate>Thu, 13 Jun 2013 06:48:22 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Rich Lock</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287899#post287899</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287899#post287899</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p><q>What have you been watching? </q></p><p>Mostly I use youtube as online radio to listen to music in the background. So, recently: Chopin, Rachmaninov, drum’n’bass, dubstep, old-school goa trance, sludge/stoner/doom, thrash.  Also for watching the IoM TT races and some martial arts stuff.  And cartoons with my daughter.</p><p><q>you the target…</q></p>
					]]></description>
				<pubDate>Wed, 12 Jun 2013 21:44:42 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>David Hood</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287877#post287877</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287877#post287877</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p>On the need for PRISM, or not<br /><a href="http://www.theatlanticwire.com/national/2013/06/nsas-only-terrorist-defense-prism-didnt-even-last-week/66143/" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">mostly not</a></p>
					]]></description>
				<pubDate>Wed, 12 Jun 2013 19:12:30 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>&quot;chris&quot;</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287865#post287865</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287865#post287865</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p><q>Should we be less acquiescent about the bill going through under urgency to legitimise illegal surveillance of New Zealanders?</q></p><p>Being indifferent, distracted (by I-don’t-know a rugby test), practising non-confrontational behaviour, embarrassment, fear of public speaking, possessing insufficient English, politely not wishing to disrupt anyone-else’s rugby watching, not having a formed…</p>
					]]></description>
				<pubDate>Wed, 12 Jun 2013 17:44:59 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Brent Jackson</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287830#post287830</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287830#post287830</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						I encountered targeted advertising for the first time a couple of months ago.  I checked out some online airfares for flying to Sydney to see an international concert act.  The following week I got targeted online ads from Webjet on two different websites for airfare specials for flying to Sydney…
					]]></description>
				<pubDate>Wed, 12 Jun 2013 14:55:49 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>BenWilson</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287829#post287829</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287829#post287829</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						Classic, so the NSA have been reading my Hotmail. Just as well I have never considered anything about Hotmail to be secure. If I wanted to send secure things over Hotmail, I'd encrypt them myself first. I don't think this has ever actually happened. NSA might be able to crack…
					]]></description>
				<pubDate>Wed, 12 Jun 2013 14:55:14 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Russell Brown</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287827#post287827</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287827#post287827</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						Also, this guy <a href="http://www.slideshare.net/EmilandDC/dear-nsa-let-me-take-care-ou" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">fixed up those ghastly Powerpoints</a>. Brilliant.
					]]></description>
				<pubDate>Wed, 12 Jun 2013 14:33:45 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Russell Brown</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287824#post287824</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287824#post287824</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<a href="http://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2013/06/what-the-nsa-can-do-with-big-data/" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">Must-read Ars Technica analysis</a> of Prism and the data mining behind it. Best thing I've read on the topic so far.
					]]></description>
				<pubDate>Wed, 12 Jun 2013 14:20:08 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Russell Brown</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287823#post287823</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287823#post287823</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p><q>So even if terrerists took total contol of the computers, the consequences aren’t going to be anything more than a heavy rainstorm. Turning toilets into geysers of poo just isn’t feasible, fortunately.</q></p><p>What a poo party-pooper you turned out to be.</p>
					]]></description>
				<pubDate>Wed, 12 Jun 2013 14:18:48 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>BenWilson</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287820#post287820</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287820#post287820</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p><q>From public accounts (in the cases where there have been public accounts) it has mostly been from people thinking someone was getting a bit extreme, alerting the authorities, and the authorities actually investigating.</q></p><p>So then we still don't have any evidence that data mining has had any success in this…</p>
					]]></description>
				<pubDate>Wed, 12 Jun 2013 13:59:20 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Rich of Observationz</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287812#post287812</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287812#post287812</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p>I wouldn't worry too much. It's a bit like trying to determine what people bought at the supermarket by weighing their shopping and matching that up with the till rolls. (but much more &ndash; like they had a semi-trailer full of shopping from every shop in town).</p><p>One way to…</p>
					]]></description>
				<pubDate>Wed, 12 Jun 2013 13:04:20 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Richard Aston</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287811#post287811</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287811#post287811</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p><q>While Tor offers a theoretical level of true anonymity, people using it are vulnerable to traffic analysis as information enters and leaves it. Which in turn allow the “metadata” kind of relationship analysis.</q></p><p>Bugger</p>
					]]></description>
				<pubDate>Wed, 12 Jun 2013 12:47:23 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>David Hood</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287803#post287803</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287803#post287803</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p>So many things to reply to, so let's aggregate:</p><p>Kyle wrote:<br /><q>there should be laws against allowing him access to big data</q><br />Heh. I was just near the front of the curve realizing that if you have a time series of marriage records and a time series of electoral records,…</p>
					]]></description>
				<pubDate>Wed, 12 Jun 2013 11:28:15 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Martin Lindberg</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287800#post287800</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287800#post287800</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p><q>Turning toilets into geysers of poo just isn't feasible, fortunately.</q></p><p>Unfortunately.</p>
					]]></description>
				<pubDate>Wed, 12 Jun 2013 11:04:26 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>David Hood</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287796#post287796</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287796#post287796</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p><q>Do we know how they got their intel for it, though?</q><br />From public accounts (in the cases where there have been public accounts) it has mostly been from people thinking someone was getting a bit extreme, alerting the authorities, and the authorities actually investigating.</p>
					]]></description>
				<pubDate>Wed, 12 Jun 2013 10:55:08 +1200</pubDate>
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			<item>
				<title>Rich of Observationz</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287794#post287794</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287794#post287794</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p>Shifting poo is actually something I know about, having worked for an industrial automation firm in my first grad job.</p><p>What generally happens in a pumping station (unless they've changed vastly in thirty years, which I doubt) is that there is a computerised controller box that runs the pumps at…</p>
					]]></description>
				<pubDate>Wed, 12 Jun 2013 10:44:43 +1200</pubDate>
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			<item>
				<title>Richard Aston</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287792#post287792</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287792#post287792</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p><q>A deep pattern linking people watching instructable videos on worm farming and mathematical proofs, and a fear of ill health abroad</q></p><p>Must be the mathematical proofs Ben , I watched a few worm farm vids and got ads for cell phones and Mitre 10.</p>
					]]></description>
				<pubDate>Wed, 12 Jun 2013 10:31:53 +1200</pubDate>
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			<item>
				<title>Richard Aston</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287791#post287791</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287791#post287791</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						It seems the net is kicking back . Anyone seen <a href="https://www.torproject.org/" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">this</a> site offering protection from network surveillance.
					]]></description>
				<pubDate>Wed, 12 Jun 2013 10:27:54 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Sofie Bribiesca</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287790#post287790</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287790#post287790</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p><q> based on their shopping behaviour trends for non-baby gear several months beforehand. It was fascinating, if a little scary given how much data we provide for free to facebook and google.</q></p><p>I noticed years ago how I was getting deals in the mail promoting dog food at Countdown and yes…</p>
					]]></description>
				<pubDate>Wed, 12 Jun 2013 10:15:15 +1200</pubDate>
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			<item>
				<title>BenWilson</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287785#post287785</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287785#post287785</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p><q>Well, 9 times out of 10 the targeted ads I get on youtube are for pop albums by acts like one direction or beyonce, hair conditioner, female skin cream, and creams for…other problems that only women get.</q></p><p>What <em>have</em> you been watching? My annoying YouTube crap is mostly travel insurance.…</p>
					]]></description>
				<pubDate>Wed, 12 Jun 2013 09:32:03 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Sacha</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287783#post287783</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287783#post287783</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						He has just said some really silly things on Nine to Noon too. Claiming that the GSCB has 'always operated within the law' as if the last year of revelations never happened. Head in sand stuff.
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				<pubDate>Wed, 12 Jun 2013 09:29:19 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Russell Brown</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287781#post287781</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287781#post287781</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<q>And we have the former head of the GCSB saying that we either play their game or unnamed enemies (“a very generic grouping of straight-out jihadists and terrorists through to nation states who may have some evil or incorrect intent against New Zealand”) will take away our freedoms, or –worse…</q>
					]]></description>
				<pubDate>Wed, 12 Jun 2013 09:15:54 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Rich Lock</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287780#post287780</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287780#post287780</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p><q>It’s nearly all thoughtcrime, though, like the case of the “Lyrical Terrorist”. Very few people have actually been caught with explosives or guns. When wingnuts engage in similar fantasising, which they do all the time, the cops don’t bother them at all.</q></p><p>True, but it’s interesting to note that even…</p>
					]]></description>
				<pubDate>Wed, 12 Jun 2013 09:13:51 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Simon Grigg</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287779#post287779</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287779#post287779</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						And we have the former head of the GCSB <a href="http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&amp;objectid=10889918" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">saying</a> that we either play their game or unnamed enemies ("a very generic grouping of straight-out jihadists and terrorists through to nation states who may have some evil or incorrect intent against New Zealand") will take away our freedoms, or –worse –…
					]]></description>
				<pubDate>Wed, 12 Jun 2013 08:44:59 +1200</pubDate>
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			<item>
				<title>Rich Lock</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287778#post287778</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287778#post287778</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p><q>It was fascinating, if a little scary given how much data we provide for free to facebook and google.</q></p><p>Well, 9 times out of 10 the targeted ads I get on youtube are for pop albums by acts like one direction or beyonce, hair conditioner, female skin cream, and creams…</p>
					]]></description>
				<pubDate>Wed, 12 Jun 2013 08:43:07 +1200</pubDate>
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			<item>
				<title>Rich of Observationz</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287777#post287777</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287777#post287777</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						It's nearly all thoughtcrime, though, like the case of the <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Samina_Malik" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">"Lyrical Terrorist"</a>. Very few people have actually been caught with explosives or guns. When wingnuts engage in similar fantasising, which they do all the time, the cops don't bother them at all.
					]]></description>
				<pubDate>Wed, 12 Jun 2013 08:39:42 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Kyle Matthews</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287776#post287776</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287776#post287776</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p>As a side note, I took over responsibility for keeping David's database online and available for the public after he left our common workplace, and there should be laws against allowing him access to big data. The maps for starters...</p><p>I attended a talk last year by a NZ expert…</p>
					]]></description>
				<pubDate>Wed, 12 Jun 2013 07:58:59 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Ian Dalziel</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287775#post287775</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287775#post287775</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p><q>I wonder whether our rulers actually <strong>wanted</strong> to release this stuff. </q><br />My thoughts, too.<br />Smoke and mirrors &ndash; looky here, looky here, while the hidden assistants shift the furniture,  and that glitzy new NSA complex in Utah is your classic illusionist's box...<br />...where were they gonna get the data to…</p>
					]]></description>
				<pubDate>Wed, 12 Jun 2013 07:33:16 +1200</pubDate>
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			<item>
				<title>Rich Lock</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287773#post287773</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287773#post287773</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p>Simultaneously supporting and undercutting my point (hey, it's how I roll), <a href="http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2013/jun/10/six-would-be-terrorists-edl-jailed?INTCMP=SRCH" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">this story</a> from yesterday wasn't major news &ndash; <a href="http://www.thepaperboy.com/uk/front-pages.cfm" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">it made none of the front pages of these papers</a>.</p><p>However, as is mentioned several times in the story, the only reason they were stopped in the first place was because…</p>
					]]></description>
				<pubDate>Wed, 12 Jun 2013 00:02:15 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Simon Grigg</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287772#post287772</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287772#post287772</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p>Our General Clapper (good name) from the NSA has <a href="http://www.nytimes.com/2003/10/29/world/the-struggle-for-iraq-weapons-search-iraqis-removed-arms-material-us-aide-says.html" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">quite a history</a> of his own:</p><p><q>The official, James R. Clapper Jr., a retired lieutenant general, said satellite imagery showing a heavy flow of traffic from Iraq into Syria, just before the American invasion in March, led him to believe that…</q></p>
					]]></description>
				<pubDate>Tue, 11 Jun 2013 23:55:06 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>BenWilson</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287754#post287754</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287754#post287754</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p><q>There’s been half a dozen separate stories in the UK press over the last year or so about the arrests, prosecution and sentencing of various small groups.</q></p><p>Do we know how they got their intel for it, though? It is an unfair thing I'm claiming, in one regard &ndash; they…</p>
					]]></description>
				<pubDate>Tue, 11 Jun 2013 22:11:27 +1200</pubDate>
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			<item>
				<title>Rich Lock</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287752#post287752</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287752#post287752</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p><q> Currently, on the success rate of apparently nothing whatsoever</q></p><p>Well, to be fair, the sucesses get a lot less press than the failures. There’s been half a dozen separate stories in the UK press over the last year or so about the arrests, prosecution and sentencing of various small groups.…</p>
					]]></description>
				<pubDate>Tue, 11 Jun 2013 21:58:07 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Rick Shera</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287737#post287737</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287737#post287737</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						I may have missed it, but in all the discussion around "metadata" I've not seen any mention of the fact that, presumably, an important piece of data being collected will be the IP address.  Even the Wired founder guy's recanting of his "nothing to see here" initial reaction, on the…
					]]></description>
				<pubDate>Tue, 11 Jun 2013 16:56:18 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Brent Jackson</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287736#post287736</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287736#post287736</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p><q>Heh, Big Data to find criminals and terrorists. It’s hilarious how silly the idea is. How much money could be expended on computers, taken away from actual coppers and intelligence agents, how much it will actually reduce their chances of finding what they’re looking for.</q></p><p>The amount of money spent…</p>
					]]></description>
				<pubDate>Tue, 11 Jun 2013 16:38:44 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Russell Brown</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287718#post287718</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287718#post287718</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<q>I don’t think TPTB are happy with this leak, as such, but I also don’t think many people are all that surprised about the scope or intent of the data collection. The leak itself might be the most surprising part of thus story; most of us have assumed the rest…</q>
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				<pubDate>Tue, 11 Jun 2013 13:59:23 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Andre Alessi</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287715#post287715</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287715#post287715</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<q>I wonder whether our rulers actually *wanted* to release this stuff. The rationale would be that by letting the fact of their access to corporate data into the public domain, a row will ensue, and unless legislators move to prevent this, that access will become the “new normal”. In the…</q>
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				<pubDate>Tue, 11 Jun 2013 13:38:28 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Rich of Observationz</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287709#post287709</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287709#post287709</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						That wouldn't let you see much Gmail, as Google defaults to https and Gmail-Gmail comms would be internal. Also, you'd need to recreate a lot from scratch, as opposed to having access to Google's own data structure.
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				<pubDate>Tue, 11 Jun 2013 13:15:53 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Russell Brown</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287706#post287706</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287706#post287706</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p><q>Your flick of dirt in his direction is nothing compared to what he will be up against, but disappointing all the same. It’s telling and somewhat encouraging that those exploiting his “rape a nun” metaphor couldn’t find something more recent.</q></p><p>I've acknowledged and corrected the error. I do have some…</p>
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				<pubDate>Tue, 11 Jun 2013 12:54:23 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Angus Robertson</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287705#post287705</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287705#post287705</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						There is a suggestion the NSA taps directly into the hub <a href="http://qz.com/92369/why-nsa-has-access-to-80-of-online-communication-even-if-google-doesnt-have-a-back-door/" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">networks</a> of the USA.  It would make more sense for them to do this physical spying than for them to act through the likes of Google or Yahoo, because the access would be more reliable and exclusive.
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				<pubDate>Tue, 11 Jun 2013 12:48:41 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Richard Aston</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287704#post287704</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287704#post287704</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p><q>I did once get an enquiry to the effect of “My great grandmother and great grandfather seem to be listed as living in separate parts of town” and all I could do was agree that yes, they were</q><br />That's a nice little example of the limits and issues with metadata.…</p>
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				<pubDate>Tue, 11 Jun 2013 12:42:14 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Richard Aston</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287703#post287703</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287703#post287703</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						Thanks for that link David a great eye opener
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				<pubDate>Tue, 11 Jun 2013 12:35:22 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>David Hood</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287702#post287702</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287702#post287702</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p><q>That's what those of us who do genealogy live for ;-)</q></p><p>I did once get an enquiry to the effect of "My great grandmother and great grandfather seem to be listed as living in separate parts of town" and all I could do was agree that yes, they were.</p>
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				<pubDate>Tue, 11 Jun 2013 12:20:05 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Nick McBride</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287701#post287701</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287701#post287701</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						I really don't think an off-colour (or vile, if you like) comment made 18 months ago has any bearing on anything raised in your wider post. Classic playing the man, not the ball. Greenwald is a talented, ideological and very prolific writer and there would be many out there motivated…
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				<pubDate>Tue, 11 Jun 2013 12:14:30 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Russell Brown</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287700#post287700</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287700#post287700</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p>More on <a href="http://theweek.com/article/index/245391/is-the-nsa-prism-leak-much-less-than-it-seems" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">what Prism probably is and isn't</a>:</p><p><q>So, if PRISM doesn't give the NSA unfettered access to all our online files, Gmail messages, Facebook posts, and tracking metadata, what does it do?</p><p>Basically, "PRISM is a kick-ass GUI [graphical user interface] that allows an analyst to look at, collate,…</q></p>
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				<pubDate>Tue, 11 Jun 2013 12:04:56 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>BenWilson</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287699#post287699</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287699#post287699</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						That's brilliant.
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				<pubDate>Tue, 11 Jun 2013 11:58:10 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Russell Brown</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287698#post287698</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287698#post287698</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p>Tom Pullar-Strecker <a href="http://www.stuff.co.nz/business/opinion-analysis/8781054/Big-scoop-smaller-than-it-first-appeared" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">voices doubts in his column today</a>:</p><p><q>Those snooping powers themselves, while controversial, have never been secret however. There is a gulf between them and the implications of the original reports concerning Prism, which strongly suggested the NSA could simply help itself to whatever it wanted, whenever it liked.…</q></p>
					]]></description>
				<pubDate>Tue, 11 Jun 2013 11:46:11 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>BenWilson</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287697#post287697</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287697#post287697</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p><q>Whether those patterns reveal criminal or terrorist activity has less to do with the ability to extract patterns, than with the presence of patterns in that dataset.</q></p><p>That's a good way of putting it. Currently, on the success rate of apparently nothing whatsoever, I don't rate their chances of finding…</p>
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				<pubDate>Tue, 11 Jun 2013 11:41:15 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>nzlemming</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287696#post287696</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287696#post287696</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p><q> What you can know about from tracking relationships (or as it is being called “metadata”) is huge.</q></p><p>That's what those of us who do genealogy live for ;-)</p>
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				<pubDate>Tue, 11 Jun 2013 11:41:01 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Rich of Observationz</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287692#post287692</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287692#post287692</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						I wonder whether our rulers actually *wanted* to release this stuff. The rationale would be that by letting the fact of their access to corporate data into the public domain, a row will ensue, and unless legislators move to prevent this, that access will become the "new normal". In the…
					]]></description>
				<pubDate>Tue, 11 Jun 2013 11:16:05 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Russell Brown</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287691#post287691</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287691#post287691</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p><q>The link you posted is dated 2 January 2012 and doesn’t appear to be related to Greenwald’s recent activities.</p><p>Have you got better evidence that he used a rape metaphor over the weekend?</p><p>Very cheap shot.</q></p><p>My mistake, absolutely, and I had corrected it before I saw your comment. It…</p>
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				<pubDate>Tue, 11 Jun 2013 11:02:57 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Rob Stowell</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287690#post287690</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287690#post287690</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p><q>I’ve sat and listened to morons in suits spouting off about what this data will provide and they are full of shite. </q><br />viz Hekia and JK on National Standards. Yes,it's data. But both how accurate it is and what exactly it measures are murkier than Murkwood. <br />Sadly, 'standards are up'…</p>
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				<pubDate>Tue, 11 Jun 2013 11:00:53 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Nick McBride</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287689#post287689</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287689#post287689</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p><g>In part, this may be down to Greenwald himself. His dreadful invocation of a rape metaphor to respond to his critics over the weekend fell well short of the conduct we might expect of a public-interest journalist.<g></p><p>The link you posted is dated 2 January 2012 and doesn't appear to…</p>
					]]></description>
				<pubDate>Tue, 11 Jun 2013 10:51:05 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Russell Brown</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287688#post287688</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287688#post287688</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p>It's no reflection on the action Snowden decided to take, but <a href="http://www.slate.com/blogs/future_tense/2013/06/09/edward_snowden_why_did_the_nsa_whistleblower_have_access_to_prism_and_other.html" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">Farhad Manjoo has a point</a>:</p><p><q>Edward Snowden sounds like a thoughtful, patriotic young man, and I’m sure glad he blew the whistle on the NSA’s surveillance programs. But the more I learned about him this afternoon, the angrier I…</q></p>
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				<pubDate>Tue, 11 Jun 2013 10:36:25 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Ross Mason</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287683#post287683</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287683#post287683</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						@ David Hood: Beautiful!!! But.....scarily so simple...........
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				<pubDate>Tue, 11 Jun 2013 10:00:46 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>David Hood</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287679#post287679</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287679#post287679</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p>About a decade ago, I was doing reasonably clever work in its day on linking together late 19th century/ beginning of 20th century historical records to build pictures of peoples lives. What you can know about from tracking relationships (or as it is being called "metadata") is huge.<br />For a…</p>
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				<pubDate>Tue, 11 Jun 2013 09:45:53 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Bart Janssen</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287676#post287676</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287676#post287676</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p><q>Agreed. Lack of respectful relationships with other agencies seems a bigger barrier in cases like Boston and 9/11 than lack of data.</q></p><p>Again by analogy to the science I work in &ndash; it is when groups collaborate that progress is made. Research groups working in isolation rarely make breakthroughs. That…</p>
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				<pubDate>Tue, 11 Jun 2013 09:32:08 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Bart Janssen</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287675#post287675</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287675#post287675</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p><q>Just laying my own credentials on the table</q></p><p>Not doubting your experience.</p><p>Just saying that the datasets we access, genomic data, are very similar to the kind of large datsets of metadata that are being described. To give an idea of scale the bioinformatacists routinely describe genome datasets as the…</p>
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				<pubDate>Tue, 11 Jun 2013 09:29:05 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Bart Janssen</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287674#post287674</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287674#post287674</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						This seems appropriate given the discussion <a href="http://www.scientificcomputing.com/news/2013/06/making-sense-patterns-twitterverse?et_cid=3300364&amp;et_rid=41408082&amp;type=cta#.UbY__pyykSw" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">some science about studying social media</a>
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				<pubDate>Tue, 11 Jun 2013 09:13:22 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Ian Dalziel</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287669#post287669</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287669#post287669</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p><strong>Masonic Couth?</strong><br /><q>While still creepy and weird, it may seem fairly <br />usual symbolism to many Americans.</q><br />All part of the rich Masonic underpinnings and heritage of their upper power echelons &ndash; in the current climate of simmering fear, verging on a rolling, roiling boil, there will be many of the…</p>
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				<pubDate>Tue, 11 Jun 2013 06:59:35 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Caleb D&#039;Anvers</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287668#post287668</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287668#post287668</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						Is anyone else getting a sense from that logo that there may be other startling revelations about PRISM waiting to be deciphered in certain Lady Gaga music videos?
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				<pubDate>Tue, 11 Jun 2013 02:44:31 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Chris Waugh</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287667#post287667</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287667#post287667</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p><q>I ran out of time to work in a Huawei mention.</q></p><p><a href="http://bloodandtreasure.typepad.com/blood_treasure/2013/06/a-new-accord.html" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">How's this instead</a>?</p>
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				<pubDate>Tue, 11 Jun 2013 00:35:07 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Lilith __</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287666#post287666</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287666#post287666</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						Greenbacks have <a href="http://www.wisegeek.org/what-do-the-symbols-on-the-us-one-dollar-bill-mean.htm" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer"> a pyramid with an eye on top.</a>  It's one side of <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Seal_of_the_United_States" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">The Great Seal of the United States</a> . While still creepy and weird, it may seem fairly usual symbolism to many Americans.
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				<pubDate>Tue, 11 Jun 2013 00:33:01 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Ian Dalziel</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287662#post287662</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287662#post287662</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p><strong>flow my tears thru a scanner darkly…</strong><br /><q> <em>Minority Report</em> could be de-fictionalising sooner than we think.</q><br />Worse, we could be heading towards a Phillip K. Dicktatorship….</p>
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				<pubDate>Mon, 10 Jun 2013 23:32:54 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Rich Lock</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287656#post287656</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287656#post287656</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<q>It was a story about some US army war games, in which they were running some Total Information Awareness system through its paces, against one of their more experienced generals. The general came up with a bunch of simple low-tech workarounds so that his side weren’t reliant on the technology…</q>
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				<pubDate>Mon, 10 Jun 2013 23:02:38 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>andin</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287655#post287655</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287655#post287655</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p><q>IBM would sell this knowledge to corporate customers with an interest in knowing what was about to happen before it actually happened.</q><br />Only stupid dicks in corporations need to pay for this kind of information</p>
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				<pubDate>Mon, 10 Jun 2013 22:58:50 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Craig Ranapia</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287647#post287647</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287647#post287647</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p><q>In part, this may be down to Greenwald himself. His dreadful invocation of a rape metaphor to respond to his critics over the weekend fell well short of the conduct we might expect of a public-interest journalist.</q></p><p>Yeah, but it wish it was at all surprising from someone who went…</p>
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				<pubDate>Mon, 10 Jun 2013 21:25:23 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>BenWilson</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287633#post287633</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287633#post287633</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p><q>I love it when you get all operational</q></p><p>Who, me?</p><p><q>good to remember most of this stuff is about analysis and graft…</q></p><p>Mind you, I wouldn't know if there aren't thousands of people charged with reading the outputs of the various data trolling surveillance algorithms, and doing footwork to follow…</p>
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				<pubDate>Mon, 10 Jun 2013 19:47:41 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>B Jones</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287629#post287629</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287629#post287629</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p><q> in pursuit of what DARPA called Total Information Awareness.</q></p><p>I read something about this recently, but unfortunately my retention of ideas is better than my ability to dig up a proper citation &ndash; maybe it was Gladwell's thing about thin-slicing.  It was a story about some US army war games,…</p>
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				<pubDate>Mon, 10 Jun 2013 18:47:36 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>slarty</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287628#post287628</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287628#post287628</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						public sector CEs are deemed to have TS clearance by default. have a look at SIGS
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				<pubDate>Mon, 10 Jun 2013 18:42:43 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Sacha</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287625#post287625</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287625#post287625</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						Agreed. Lack of respectful relationships with other agencies seems a bigger barrier in cases like Boston and 9/11 than lack of data.
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				<pubDate>Mon, 10 Jun 2013 18:00:48 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>slarty</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287624#post287624</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287624#post287624</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p>Google "intelligence led policing".  And look at popcenter.org <br />Its not about the data so much as applying some thought. Extreme surveillance is lazy and counterproductive: 9/11 happened despite all the data being known to the FBI. Giving more to organisations that cannot handle what they already have just makes it…</p>
					]]></description>
				<pubDate>Mon, 10 Jun 2013 17:54:18 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Kumara Republic</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287623#post287623</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287623#post287623</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p><q>Ah. I was just about to mention the LAPD project.</q></p><p><em>Minority Report</em> could be de-fictionalising sooner than we think.</p>
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				<pubDate>Mon, 10 Jun 2013 17:53:18 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Russell Brown</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287622#post287622</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287622#post287622</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p>WaPo reporter Bart Gellman's <a href="http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/national-security/code-name-verax-snowden-in-exchanges-with-post-reporter-made-clear-he-knew-risks/2013/06/09/c9a25b54-d14c-11e2-9f1a-1a7cdee20287_story_1.html" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">side of the story</a> is quite interesting. Snowden's communications asserted a strong moral and intellectual basis for his actions.</p><p>Otoh, Glenn Greenwald is now blowing up on Twitter and saying:</p><p><q>Bart Gellman's claims about Snowden's interactions with me &ndash; when, how and why &ndash; are all…</q></p>
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				<pubDate>Mon, 10 Jun 2013 17:50:41 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>slarty</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287621#post287621</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287621#post287621</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						I love it when you get all operational. Far too much CSI driven policy nowadays... good to remember most of this stuff is about analysis and graft...
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				<pubDate>Mon, 10 Jun 2013 17:47:06 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>BenWilson</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287620#post287620</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287620#post287620</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						Yes, that's just the kind of thing it should be used for. We have similar things in operation here in Auckland, routing ambulances. It's standard operations research stuff, backed up by a big robust set of map data. I interviewed for a job there a few years ago. Gotta scoot…
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				<pubDate>Mon, 10 Jun 2013 17:31:09 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Russell Brown</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287619#post287619</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287619#post287619</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<q>Also, ironically, I was eventually replaced by a large group of people who sort the spam by hand, in an outsourced situation, writing hand rules to block the latest trick. It worked better. Turns out that it’s easier to get a super high block rate by having approximately as many…</q>
					]]></description>
				<pubDate>Mon, 10 Jun 2013 17:24:57 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>BenWilson</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287618#post287618</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287618#post287618</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p><q>But to argue that it won’t happen because it’s too hard now is something I’ve learned not to do</q></p><p>I'm sure it will happen. 20 years ago I was one of the people designing resource allocation systems and getting laughed at. I make my comment entirely because I actually remember…</p>
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				<pubDate>Mon, 10 Jun 2013 17:19:26 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Russell Brown</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287617#post287617</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287617#post287617</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p><q>On a lighter note Obama has just completed a summit with Xi Jinping where the American complained loudly about an on-going violation of cyber security.</q></p><p>I ran out of time to work in a Huawei mention.</p>
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				<pubDate>Mon, 10 Jun 2013 17:09:22 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Angus Robertson</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287616#post287616</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287616#post287616</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						On a lighter note Obama has just completed a summit with Xi Jinping where the American complained loudly about an on-going violation of cyber security.
					]]></description>
				<pubDate>Mon, 10 Jun 2013 16:55:49 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Russell Brown</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287615#post287615</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287615#post287615</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p><a href="http://editors.talkingpointsmemo.com/archives/2013/06/doj_no_comment_on_snowden.php" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">The DOJ says</a> it is in “the initial stages of an investigation into the unauthorized disclosure of classified information by an individual with authorized access.”</p><p>Which appears to say that he had authorised access to what he has leaked.</p><p>Booz Allen has acknowledged that Snowden was their guy, but says…</p>
					]]></description>
				<pubDate>Mon, 10 Jun 2013 16:55:12 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Bart Janssen</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287614#post287614</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287614#post287614</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p><q>That’s not really the same thing.</q></p><p>Agreed, but 20 years ago even that would have been a laughable suggestion.</p><p>I've worked with big datasets and modern biology is now a mixture of combining large datasets with in depth detailed knowledge to make progress. As important as the in depth understanding…</p>
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				<pubDate>Mon, 10 Jun 2013 16:54:48 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>nzlemming</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287613#post287613</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287613#post287613</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p><q>There are architectural solutions (involving end-end encryption) that do avoid giving some or even all of the sysadmins the ability to read the CEOs email.</q></p><p>There weren't in the mid-90's on NT4 and Exchange.</p>
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				<pubDate>Mon, 10 Jun 2013 16:50:21 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Russell Brown</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287612#post287612</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287612#post287612</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p><q>Stupid technocrats. Next thing they’ll be promising computers predicting crimes before they happen</q></p><p>Ah. I was just about to mention the LAPD project.</p>
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				<pubDate>Mon, 10 Jun 2013 16:49:20 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>nzlemming</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287611#post287611</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287611#post287611</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p><q>The look on his face have been a thing to behold.</q></p><p>It was.</p>
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				<pubDate>Mon, 10 Jun 2013 16:49:07 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>BenWilson</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287609#post287609</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287609#post287609</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p><q>Stupid technocrats. Next thing they’ll be promising computers predicting crimes before they happen</q></p><p>That's not really the same thing. It's just distributing coverage of resources, exactly like the cops already have to do. That is actually a somewhat appropriate job for a computer. To some extent, obviously there still needs…</p>
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				<pubDate>Mon, 10 Jun 2013 16:39:29 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Rich of Observationz</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287608#post287608</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287608#post287608</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						There are architectural solutions (involving end-end encryption) that do avoid giving some or even all of the sysadmins the ability to read the CEOs email.
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				<pubDate>Mon, 10 Jun 2013 16:33:59 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Bart Janssen</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287605#post287605</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287605#post287605</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p><q> It’s just the kind of thing technocrats would think of.</q></p><p>Stupid technocrats. Next thing they'll be promising computers predicting crimes <a href="http://www.technologyreview.com/news/428354/la-cops-embrace-crime-predicting-algorithm/" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">before they happen</a></p>
					]]></description>
				<pubDate>Mon, 10 Jun 2013 16:22:59 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Bart Janssen</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287604#post287604</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287604#post287604</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p><q>I said “I can read your files and email. How do you know you can trust me?”</q></p><p>The look on his face have been a thing to behold.</p>
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				<pubDate>Mon, 10 Jun 2013 16:20:04 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>BenWilson</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287603#post287603</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287603#post287603</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						Heh, Big Data to find criminals and terrorists. It's hilarious how <em>silly</em> the idea is. How much money could be expended on computers, taken away from actual coppers and intelligence agents, how much it will actually reduce their chances of finding what they're looking for. It's just the kind of…
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				<pubDate>Mon, 10 Jun 2013 16:10:51 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>nzlemming</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287602#post287602</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287602#post287602</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p><q> it's impossible to do your job as a sysadmin without being entrusted with access to things you wouldn't otherwise have access to.</q></p><p>Correct. When I started running IT for a small government agency (which meant me and a tech), I had no security clearance and I raised the matter with…</p>
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				<pubDate>Mon, 10 Jun 2013 15:56:09 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Russell Brown</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287601#post287601</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287601#post287601</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<q>I have observed these to include requiring a staff member to keep a matter from their superiors. So don’t be too harsh on firms that may well try not to be evil. It could be that their security staff (often recruited from the public sector) may simply not have told…</q>
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				<pubDate>Mon, 10 Jun 2013 15:52:32 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Russell Brown</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287600#post287600</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287600#post287600</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p><q>Part B isn’t going to be a small task easily managed by few people, think collating the equivalent of the NZ census every what? Day, hour, minute… on a continual real time basis.</q></p><p>It's possible that the bigger private data-houses are doing some of the feds' chewing for them. [[http://research.google.com/pubs/pub40571.html|This…</p>
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				<pubDate>Mon, 10 Jun 2013 15:51:03 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>slarty</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287599#post287599</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287599#post287599</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p><q>In the end, WebFountain didn’t go far</q> Maybe...</p><p>Anyway, if the purpose of an activity would be defeated by making it public, then there is a long standing principle of law enforcement that secrecy can be required. Such powers were traditionally strongest in matters of national security.</p><p>I have observed…</p>
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				<pubDate>Mon, 10 Jun 2013 15:45:36 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Paul Campbell</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287598#post287598</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287598#post287598</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						didn't I already see <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Falcon_and_the_Snowman" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">this movie</a>? ... except it was about Australia
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				<pubDate>Mon, 10 Jun 2013 15:44:21 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Stephen Judd</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287595#post287595</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287595#post287595</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p><q>they tend not to start out as systems administrators.</q></p><p>No doubt the NSA runs a tighter ship than most people, but it's impossible to do your job as a sysadmin without being entrusted with access to things you wouldn't otherwise have access to.</p>
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				<pubDate>Mon, 10 Jun 2013 15:33:58 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>David Russell</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287593#post287593</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287593#post287593</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p>Have you seen this ?</p><p>"Why didn't tech company leaders blow the whistle?"</p><p><a href="https://mailman.stanford.edu/pipermail/liberationtech/2013-June/008815.html" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">https://mailman.stanford.edu/pipermail/liberationtech/2013-June/008815.html</a></p>
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				<pubDate>Mon, 10 Jun 2013 15:17:18 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Angus Robertson</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287592#post287592</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287592#post287592</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p><q>Although Snowden carefully distinguishes his own actions from the indiscriminate leaking of Pfc. Bradley Manning, one observation can be made of both of them: how on earth could relatively junior staff (more so Manning than Snowden) apparently have access to everything? It is quite extraordinary.</q></p><p>Their intelligence gathering appears to…</p>
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				<pubDate>Mon, 10 Jun 2013 15:08:21 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Russell Brown</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287590#post287590</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287590#post287590</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p><a href="http://overland.org.au/2013/06/prism-and-bill-gates-documented-life/" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">Interesting post by Giovanni Tiso</a>:</p><p><q>The map suggests that intelligence is still being gathered with a degree of selection, but bear in mind that the Utah data centre is not finished yet. When it comes on line, in September of this year, it might be possible to fulfil the vision…</q></p>
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				<pubDate>Mon, 10 Jun 2013 14:35:15 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Emma Hart</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287589#post287589</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287589#post287589</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p><q>I loved that logo. It screamed to me of some of the actual geeks (the ones doing the work) designing a logo by which everyone in management would ultimately be embarrased.</q></p><p>It looks remarkably like a <em>Paranoia</em> role badge.</p>
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				<pubDate>Mon, 10 Jun 2013 14:32:31 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Russell Brown</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287588#post287588</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287588#post287588</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p>So <a href="http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/intelligence-leaders-push-back-on-leakers-media/2013/06/09/fff80160-d122-11e2-a73e-826d299ff459_story_1.html" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">I’m not the only one astonished by the access Snowden seems to have had</a>:</p><p><q>Some former CIA officials said they were troubled by aspects of Snowden’s background, at least as he described it to The Post and the Guardian.</p><p>For instance, Snowden said he did not have a high…</q></p>
					]]></description>
				<pubDate>Mon, 10 Jun 2013 14:30:46 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Ben Gracewood</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287585#post287585</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287585#post287585</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						Can we go back and tear up that contract we signed agreeing to free services in return for advertising and privacy?
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				<pubDate>Mon, 10 Jun 2013 14:01:14 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>BenWilson</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287582#post287582</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287582#post287582</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p><q>Clearly that's just what the illuminati want you to think!</q></p><p>Dude, he's a deep mole for the Illuminati.</p>
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				<pubDate>Mon, 10 Jun 2013 13:36:58 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Bart Janssen</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287581#post287581</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287581#post287581</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						I loved that logo. It screamed to me of some of the actual geeks (the ones doing the work) designing a logo by which everyone in management would ultimately be embarrased.
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				<pubDate>Mon, 10 Jun 2013 13:31:59 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>steve black</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287579#post287579</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287579#post287579</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p>see also:</p><p><a href="http://www.statschat.org.nz/2013/06/09/what-the-nsa-cant-do-by-data-mining/" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">http://www.statschat.org.nz/2013/06/09/what-the-nsa-cant-do-by-data-mining/</a></p>
					]]></description>
				<pubDate>Mon, 10 Jun 2013 13:27:55 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Christopher Nimmo</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287578#post287578</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287578#post287578</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						Clearly that's just what the illuminati want you to think!
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				<pubDate>Mon, 10 Jun 2013 13:26:38 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Sacha</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287577#post287577</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287577#post287577</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p><q>I take it SCIENTIA EST POTENTIA is "Knowledge is Power"?</q></p><p>or "Hey, that Science thing seems promising"<br />#nolatin</p>
					]]></description>
				<pubDate>Mon, 10 Jun 2013 12:53:14 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Russell Brown</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287574#post287574</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287574#post287574</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p><q>Don’t overlook the Telecommunications Interception Bill, described in admirable and hair-raising detail by Thomas Beagle on the Tech Liberty blog here .</q></p><p>Indeed. Yikes.</p>
					]]></description>
				<pubDate>Mon, 10 Jun 2013 12:38:15 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>HORansome</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287573#post287573</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287573#post287573</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						I'm of the firm belief that there are a host of people in the security sector who delight in coming up with logos and names which reflect contemporary conspiracy culture. In part I think they're playing games with certain conspiracy theorists but I also think it's just the natural result…
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				<pubDate>Mon, 10 Jun 2013 12:30:36 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>David Hood</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287572#post287572</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287572#post287572</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						And let us not forget the 1980's era  United States Electronic Communications Privacy Act, with it's provision that email that has stayed on the providers servers for more than 180 days is "abandoned" so does not need a warrant (Note: there is some legal dispute about the status of messages…
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				<pubDate>Mon, 10 Jun 2013 12:25:01 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Stephen Judd</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287571#post287571</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287571#post287571</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						BTW I take it <em>SCIENTIA EST POTENTIA</em> is "Knowledge is Power"?
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				<pubDate>Mon, 10 Jun 2013 12:23:43 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Christopher Nimmo</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287570#post287570</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287570#post287570</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p><q>And in case anyone wasn’t unnerved by this concept, it adopted this extraordinary logo:</q></p><p>That is the <strong>only</strong> surprising thing about this entire affair. What were they thinking?</p>
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				<pubDate>Mon, 10 Jun 2013 12:23:39 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>The Ruminator</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287568#post287568</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287568#post287568</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						I just want to say that at your big reveal where you tell us the logo they chose, I scrolled down and saw an ad for a Nautilus One Touch coffee machine. Which in some ways was a better gag.
					]]></description>
				<pubDate>Mon, 10 Jun 2013 12:18:27 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Russell Brown</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287566#post287566</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287566#post287566</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p>David Simon has <a href="http://davidsimon.com/" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">reconsidered a bit</a>:</p><p><q>For my part, I remain convinced that the Verizon call data should be used as a viable data base for counter-terror investigations and that its misuse should be greeted with the hyperbole that currently adorns the present moment.  On the other hand, the arguments…</q></p>
					]]></description>
				<pubDate>Mon, 10 Jun 2013 11:58:15 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Stephen Judd</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287565#post287565</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287565#post287565</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						Don’t overlook the Telecommunications Interception Bill, described in admirable and hair-raising detail by Thomas Beagle on the Tech Liberty blog  <a href="http://techliberty.org.nz/tag/tics/" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">here</a> .
					]]></description>
				<pubDate>Mon, 10 Jun 2013 11:58:05 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Public Address</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287564#post287564</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-united-states-of-surveillance/?p=287564#post287564</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p>Discussion from blog post.</p>
					]]></description>
				<pubDate>Mon, 10 Jun 2013 11:58:05 +1200</pubDate>
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