Public Address | Cafe | Hard News: The real problem with the #teapottapes decision https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/ en-us Copyright (c) 2026 Public Address Sacha https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=253051#post253051 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=253051#post253051 Wed, 28 Mar 2012 12:55:56 +1300 Craig Ranapia https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=253039#post253039 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=253039#post253039 alternative explanations for their timing most welcome

Some evidence that the Prime MInister directly, and illegally, interferes in operational Police matters would be even more welcome. You know, practicing what we all love to preach to the Oily Whales and Kiwibuggers etc.

]]> Wed, 28 Mar 2012 12:26:53 +1300 Sacha https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=253014#post253014 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=253014#post253014 evidence-free allegations

alternative explanations for their timing most welcome

]]> Wed, 28 Mar 2012 11:05:29 +1300 Craig Ranapia https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=253001#post253001 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=253001#post253001 In the context of the righteous indignation about the vicious slur on Bradley Ambrose's reputation (nay! actionable defamation!), I'm loving the evidence-free allegations that the Police rolled over in the face of blatant political interference from the Prime Minister.

Still I'm glad one result of the tapes is Winston in…

]]> Wed, 28 Mar 2012 09:08:50 +1300 Sue https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252995#post252995 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252995#post252995 would the recording that shared Madonnas hate of hydrangeas. – A public place but a private conversation be affected by this
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-45U8RYhOH0

Still I'm glad one result of the tapes is Winston in Parliament, he adds comedy flavour and keeps both sides on their toes, he's got axes to grind,…

]]> Wed, 28 Mar 2012 01:18:25 +1300 Chris Waugh https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252989#post252989 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252989#post252989 advice for Obama. I wonder how the US media and Republican contenders would react if Obama took a leaf out of our John's media management book. ]]> Tue, 27 Mar 2012 23:01:23 +1300 DexterX https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252987#post252987 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252987#post252987 What the hell were the police thinking?

They thought – "better keep First Citizen happy and do his bidding – this sucks – we have better things to do."

What would be worth seeing is the written complaint to see how it is written and whether it was prepared/signed by…

]]> Tue, 27 Mar 2012 21:48:44 +1300 Chris Waugh https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252976#post252976 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252976#post252976 What the hell were the police thinking?

Put those uppity journalists in their place? Nothing like a bit of random intimidation to keep the media in line.

]]> Tue, 27 Mar 2012 18:31:59 +1300 Russell Brown https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252975#post252975 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252975#post252975 That Ambrose wasn’t interviewed is more than ridiculous – it shows how much of a fit up the whole saga was and is

To be fair, Ambrose did provide a detailed statement via his lawyers four months ago, so it wasn't as if the police didn't know his side of…

]]> Tue, 27 Mar 2012 18:21:15 +1300 DexterX https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252972#post252972 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252972#post252972 That's just ridiculous.

That Ambrose wasn't interviewed is more than ridiculous – it shows how much of a fit up the whole saga was and is – it was back then all about stopping the tape coming out before the election and it had the advantage of muddying any sensible…

]]> Tue, 27 Mar 2012 17:55:25 +1300 DexterX https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252971#post252971 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252971#post252971 The HoS journalists weren't either, nor Winston Peters. But the police decided they needed to serve a search warrant on Radio New Zealand, which had done no more than cover the bloody story. It really is fairly bizarre.

But of course they are after all, first and foremost, First Citizen…

]]> Tue, 27 Mar 2012 17:49:25 +1300 Sacha https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252959#post252959 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252959#post252959 Ambrose was never interviewed to assess his intent.

That's just ridiculous.

]]> Tue, 27 Mar 2012 14:03:07 +1300 Graham Dunster https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252948#post252948 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252948#post252948 The one good thing that has come out of this imbroglio is that Winston is back as an MP.

Never thought I'd say that...

]]> Tue, 27 Mar 2012 12:13:16 +1300 Russell Brown https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252942#post252942 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252942#post252942 Ambrose was never interviewed to assess his intent. Funny that. Natural justice?

The HoS journalists weren't either, nor Winston Peters. But the police decided they needed to serve a search warrant on Radio New Zealand, which had done no more than cover the bloody story. It really is fairly bizarre.

]]> Tue, 27 Mar 2012 11:51:06 +1300 Ross Mason https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252941#post252941 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252941#post252941

No. There was an issue in this case because neither knew. As long as one party to a conversation knows, it’s fine.

Hmmm…so when he put the recorder on the table, he was “present” with the two Johns. They knew all the recorders was there. But once the crowd was…

]]> Tue, 27 Mar 2012 11:47:29 +1300 Ian MacKay https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252931#post252931 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252931#post252931 Tue, 27 Mar 2012 10:53:33 +1300 Russell Brown https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252926#post252926 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252926#post252926 The other thing I love in the Police statement is they say if Ambrose didn’t plant the mic intentionally, then he did so “recklessly”.
Reckless driving I understand; “recklessly” putting a mic on a table, not so much.

You know, I don't think they knew what they meant.

]]> Tue, 27 Mar 2012 10:10:48 +1300 Graeme Edgeler https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252921#post252921 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252921#post252921 Are conversations between a reporter and the ‘client’ now deemed private if one person does not know it is being taped?

No. There was an issue in this case because neither knew. As long as one party to a conversation knows, it's fine.

]]> Tue, 27 Mar 2012 10:03:33 +1300 Sacha https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252918#post252918 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252918#post252918 We on way to Police State

that is one of the implications if the Police and Key colluded over when to release their findings, yes.

]]> Tue, 27 Mar 2012 09:53:09 +1300 Sofie Bribiesca https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252917#post252917 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252917#post252917 Also secret customers carrying recording devices to bait retailers (etc) who may be doing naughty things.

Why, didn't you know, now it is only the Police who can entrap legally. Search and Surveillance. Let's go back to the Ureweras ......
We on way to Police State.Did they get those flash…

]]> Tue, 27 Mar 2012 09:41:44 +1300 Lilith __ https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252916#post252916 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252916#post252916 I think I read something similar in some blog yesterday ;-)

Public Address: leading opinion. :-)

The other thing I love in the Police statement is they say if Ambrose didn't plant the mic intentionally, then he did so "recklessly".
Reckless driving I understand; "recklessly" putting a mic on a…

]]> Tue, 27 Mar 2012 09:24:17 +1300 Ross Mason https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252915#post252915 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252915#post252915 What happens now to Fair Go and the "Secret filming"? Are conversations between a reporter and the 'client' now deemed private if one person does not know it is being taped?

Edit: Also secret customers carrying recording devices to bait retailers (etc) who may be doing naughty things.

]]> Tue, 27 Mar 2012 09:21:11 +1300 3410 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252914#post252914 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252914#post252914 "At the end of the day, his actions have been deemed unlawful." – Key

Awesome. Now I see why there was no need for a trial.

]]> Tue, 27 Mar 2012 09:01:26 +1300 Russell Brown https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252913#post252913 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252913#post252913 Lilith, that is a very able summary.

Meanwhile, the Herald reveals that police struck a deal with Key more than a week ago — but waited until he was out of the country to announce it.

And the paper's editorial column goes ballistic this morning:

It should not have taken the police…

]]> Tue, 27 Mar 2012 08:37:52 +1300 Lilith __ https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252894#post252894 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252894#post252894 Have just read the news story, along with Ambrose’s letter. I couldn’t reconcile all those statements from the police.

1. We think he’s guilty
2. Unless he isn't
3. He said he is innocent and sorry, so we’ll let him off this time
4. If anyone else does this thing…

]]> Mon, 26 Mar 2012 21:48:58 +1300 DexterX https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252893#post252893 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252893#post252893 Mon, 26 Mar 2012 21:47:54 +1300 FletcherB https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252887#post252887 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252887#post252887 So, I wonder if sometime you might choose to intentionally slap some egg on your own face on something comparatively inconsequential*, in the hope that it covers up or makes people forget all the other egg left over from the previous bigger or more serious debacle?

teapot tapes vs Tame…

]]> Mon, 26 Mar 2012 21:21:43 +1300 Kumara Republic https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252885#post252885 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252885#post252885 Mon, 26 Mar 2012 21:07:24 +1300 DexterX https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252875#post252875 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252875#post252875 Mon, 26 Mar 2012 19:26:44 +1300 Sacha https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252874#post252874 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252874#post252874 it is sign of greatness he make everything work like clockwork tick tock

me likee pidgin

]]> Mon, 26 Mar 2012 19:24:19 +1300 Sacha https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252873#post252873 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252873#post252873 should have said. ]]> Mon, 26 Mar 2012 19:23:09 +1300 DexterX https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252872#post252872 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252872#post252872 Mon, 26 Mar 2012 19:04:56 +1300 Sacha https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252870#post252870 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252870#post252870 face saving

or sucking up to the current govt. not reassuring in either case

]]> Mon, 26 Mar 2012 18:43:52 +1300 Russell Brown https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252864#post252864 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252864#post252864 Hmm, with all that crowd, one does wonder how he could “accidentally” leave a recorder on a table he could barely see.

He says he tossed his mic there (still in its bag), along with others', but was pushed out before he could retrieve it. Nothing in that video contradicts…

]]> Mon, 26 Mar 2012 18:11:46 +1300 andrew r https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252863#post252863 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252863#post252863 Mon, 26 Mar 2012 18:06:57 +1300 nzlemming https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252862#post252862 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252862#post252862 Mon, 26 Mar 2012 17:57:51 +1300 Russell Brown https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252861#post252861 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252861#post252861 The Herald has put up some of the raw vision Ambrose shot on the day. Man, that was a hard-core media scrum!

1. I'm struggling to spot the "reasonable expectation of privacy".

2. If Ambrose had really planned the recording, wouldn't he have been hell-bent on getting the pictures to…

]]> Mon, 26 Mar 2012 17:51:42 +1300 johnno https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252859#post252859 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252859#post252859 http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/video.cfm?c_id=1&gal_objectid=10794733&gallery_id=124741 ]]> Mon, 26 Mar 2012 17:30:20 +1300 mic weevil https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252858#post252858 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252858#post252858 Andrew Geddis on this: here

and free half-a-babies...

]]> Mon, 26 Mar 2012 17:17:51 +1300 Paul Brislen https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252857#post252857 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252857#post252857 I would say the police comment that he's committed an "unlawful act" without any opportunity to defend himself against those charges would and should become the basis for a defamation case against either the police the PM's office or both.

And given the number of times he was called a…

]]> Mon, 26 Mar 2012 17:14:13 +1300 John Morrison https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252856#post252856 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252856#post252856 Now, why should the police be concerned with anyone ‘saving face’?

I agree, but considering the politicians involved here, a so-called solution has been found for now but a mess has been left for someone else to resolve in the future.

]]> Mon, 26 Mar 2012 17:10:54 +1300 Michael Homer https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252853#post252853 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252853#post252853 Mon, 26 Mar 2012 16:56:10 +1300 3410 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252852#post252852 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252852#post252852 everyone saves face?

Except Ambrose, who's now painted as the perpetrator of a "clear[ly]... unlawful" act, and without any chance to defend himself.

]]> Mon, 26 Mar 2012 16:52:31 +1300 nzlemming https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252851#post252851 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252851#post252851 Don't you think this decision is the most 'helpful' to get the saga off the news cycle, and everyone saves face?

Now, why should the police be concerned with anyone 'saving face'? Their job is to enforce the law. Of course, now, without a test case, we have no idea…

]]> Mon, 26 Mar 2012 16:49:18 +1300 mic weevil https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252850#post252850 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252850#post252850 Don't you think this decision is the most 'helpful' to get the saga off the news cycle, and everyone saves face?

Not really sure why helping the Police and politicians involved to save face is important.
As stupid as this incident was, the circus around it majorly derailed the already…

]]> Mon, 26 Mar 2012 16:48:01 +1300 Russell Brown https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252849#post252849 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252849#post252849 More:

Mr Ambrose's lawyer Ron Mansfield said his client maintains that he never recorded the conversation on purpose and has not done anything illegal.

"The team of lawyers assisting Mr Ambrose were confident no offence was committed or could be committed in the circumstances, and this has been clearly conveyed…

]]> Mon, 26 Mar 2012 16:47:16 +1300 Sacha https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252848#post252848 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252848#post252848 somebody else will worry about that in the future

On the contrary, every media organisation has now been 'warned' that they may face the same action. Respect my authoritah, etc.

]]> Mon, 26 Mar 2012 16:45:18 +1300 Sacha https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252846#post252846 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252846#post252846 Mon, 26 Mar 2012 16:43:52 +1300 Russell Brown https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252845#post252845 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252845#post252845 There's your headline:

Police: Ambrose Innocent

Yeah, quite. Police fail to establish to themselves beyond reasonable doubt that an offence was committed.

]]> Mon, 26 Mar 2012 16:35:15 +1300 John Morrison https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252844#post252844 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252844#post252844 Don't you think this decision is the most 'helpful' to get the saga off the news cycle, and everyone saves face?
Regarding the real problem with these tapes, they're saying somebody else will worry about that in the future. A typical stance considering who the main players are.

]]> Mon, 26 Mar 2012 16:31:44 +1300 Graeme Edgeler https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252842#post252842 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252842#post252842 Don’t our courts make that sort of determination, rather than the police?

No. They make it as well, but if police don't think what you've done is unlawful, they won't charge you, so they have to answer that question.

]]> Mon, 26 Mar 2012 16:25:59 +1300 Graeme Edgeler https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252841#post252841 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252841#post252841

In the view of police investigators, the recording was “most likely” on purpose, but at the least “reckless”.

There's your headline:

Police: Ambrose Innocent

]]> Mon, 26 Mar 2012 16:24:46 +1300 Sacha https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252840#post252840 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252840#post252840 "we are clear that the actions of Mr Ambrose were unlawful."

Don't our courts make that sort of determination, rather than the police?

]]> Mon, 26 Mar 2012 16:23:45 +1300 Public Address https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252839#post252839 https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-real-problem-with-the-teapottapes/?p=252839#post252839 Discussion from blog post.

]]> Mon, 26 Mar 2012 16:23:45 +1300