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		<title>Public Address | Cafe | Hard News: The question of Afghanistan becomes more urgent</title>
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		<description><![CDATA[A talking shop where we put the questions and our community illuminates the issues.]]></description>
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				<title>Chris Waugh</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=268037#post268037</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=268037#post268037</guid>
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						<p><q>But they cost shitloads, it is unfair to criticise politicians for being stingy with the funds.</q></p><p>No it's not. They're involved in the decision-making process, and they decide how much money to give to MoD and the military.</p><p><q>For example one Canadian made LAV costs the same 10 Australian made…</q></p>
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				<pubDate>Wed, 22 Aug 2012 11:01:55 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Angus Robertson</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=268034#post268034</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=268034#post268034</guid>
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						<p><q>If we’re going to have a military, can we not just fund them enough to do their jobs properly with decent gear?</q></p><p>The NZ Humvee and LAV vehicles are death traps to mines, with flat bottoms and stuff all armour underneath.  But they cost shitloads, it is unfair to criticise…</p>
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				<pubDate>Wed, 22 Aug 2012 10:31:41 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Rich of Observationz</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=268015#post268015</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=268015#post268015</guid>
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						<p>The <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FV101_Scorpion" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">Scorpion light tank</a> is aluminum, also. Did fine in the Falklands, although the ones NZ bought apparently didn't stand up to our drivers.</p><p>The problem with a lot of Cold War era weaponry, at least in the UK, was that it was designed around a strategy of "fight like…</p>
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				<pubDate>Tue, 21 Aug 2012 21:30:39 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Islander</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=268014#post268014</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=268014#post268014</guid>
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						<q>Ah, New Zealand, continuing that fine old tradition of leaving our soldiers to beg, borrow or steal if they want any decent equipment, otherwise just leaving them to make do with whatever shit the meagre pittance of a budget our tightwad governments allow them. If we’re going to have a…
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				<pubDate>Tue, 21 Aug 2012 21:11:36 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Chris Waugh</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=268012#post268012</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=268012#post268012</guid>
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						<p>On the subject of our soldiers' security in Afghanistan, I trust you've all seen <a href="http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&amp;objectid=10828338" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">this</a>:</p><p><q>The vehicle's fatal flaw, a 2008 Pentagon inspector-general's report found, was that its "flat bottom, low weight, low ground clearance and aluminum body" left it vulnerable to IEDs.</q></p><p>Aluminuim! Jeez! </p><p>Didn't the Royal Navy experiment…</p>
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				<pubDate>Tue, 21 Aug 2012 19:57:08 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Steve Barnes</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=268009#post268009</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=268009#post268009</guid>
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						<q>9/11 short summary – 15 Saudi Arabians (+ 4 other Arabs) from an organisation headed by a Saudi Arabian, that was financed by Gulf State (Saudi) Arabs and dedicated to impostion of a Wahhabist religious cause crashed 4 planes in America.It is a complete mystery who did what and who…</q>
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				<pubDate>Tue, 21 Aug 2012 19:23:50 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Kyle Matthews</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267984#post267984</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267984#post267984</guid>
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						<p><q>amerika</p><p>Whoa! Retro.</q></p><p>I was disappointed not to see ameriKKKa myself.</p>
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				<pubDate>Tue, 21 Aug 2012 12:29:58 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Sofie Bribiesca</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267976#post267976</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267976#post267976</guid>
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						I read on the weekend in some comment section of someit (really don't remember where) that Key could have been at the funerals on Saturday then on to his son's Baseball game by  Monday when the game was to be. Seeing as we are around 24 hrs ahead of parts…
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				<pubDate>Tue, 21 Aug 2012 11:44:04 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Richard Aston</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267972#post267972</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267972#post267972</guid>
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						<p><q>My first names are Graeme Kenneth.<br />Kenneth Grahame wrote The Wind in the Willows.<br />Coincidence?</q></p><p>There are no coincidences Graeme, but what is the link ?<br />The main conflict in Wind and the Willows is man verses society, a conflict you as a lawyer must be very familiar with. <br />Your…</p>
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				<pubDate>Tue, 21 Aug 2012 10:30:20 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Sacha</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267971#post267971</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267971#post267971</guid>
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						<p>Unfortunate <a href="http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&amp;objectid=10828343" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">PR twist</a>.</p><p><q>One of the three soldiers killed in Afghanistan on Sunday had criticised the Prime Minister for not attending the funerals of two soldiers killed earlier this month.</p><p>...</p><p>Just days before he was killed, Corporal Tamatea voiced his belief that the Prime Minister should have stayed in New…</q></p>
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				<pubDate>Tue, 21 Aug 2012 10:10:18 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Rob Stowell</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267969#post267969</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267969#post267969</guid>
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						<p>Was it ever a realistic proposition that a strong Afghani state be created, and the Afghan Army take over security? Maybe I'm too cynical, but it always looked to me as if eventually the UN/NATO forces would leave, and the Taliban would be back. <br />That always meant whatever good NZ…</p>
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				<pubDate>Tue, 21 Aug 2012 10:02:52 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Chris Waugh</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267932#post267932</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267932#post267932</guid>
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						He had some very interesting and quite worrying comments on the security situation.
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				<pubDate>Mon, 20 Aug 2012 18:18:46 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Russell Brown</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267931#post267931</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267931#post267931</guid>
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						The extended version of the interview with Jon Stephenson is <a href="http://ondemand.tv3.co.nz/Media-3-Interview-with-Jon-Stephenson/tabid/78/articleID/7726/MCat/540/Default.aspx" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">online now</a>.
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				<pubDate>Mon, 20 Aug 2012 18:00:53 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Rich of Observationz</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267918#post267918</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267918#post267918</guid>
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						Unlike (e.g.) Germany, Italy, Spain or France.
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				<pubDate>Mon, 20 Aug 2012 13:47:43 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Rich of Observationz</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267917#post267917</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267917#post267917</guid>
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						<p>I'll have you know the d'Rich's are an ancient and noble family of Norman-English-Icelandic lineage.</p><p>Of course, I go by another name for purposes that involve earning money. If I posted stuff that wouldn't offend those who give me said money, my posts would be decidedly dull, sadly.</p>
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				<pubDate>Mon, 20 Aug 2012 13:46:16 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Graeme Edgeler</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267914#post267914</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267914#post267914</guid>
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						<p>My first names are Graeme Kenneth.<br />Kenneth Grahame wrote The Wind in the Willows.<br />Coincidence?</p>
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				<pubDate>Mon, 20 Aug 2012 13:30:08 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Angus Robertson</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267912#post267912</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267912#post267912</guid>
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						<p><q>So you know who really did it, then? Do tell.</q></p><p>9/11 short summary &ndash; 15 Saudi Arabians (+ 4 other Arabs) from an organisation headed by a Saudi Arabian, that was financed by Gulf State (Saudi) Arabs and dedicated to impostion of a Wahhabist religious cause crashed 4 planes in…</p>
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				<pubDate>Mon, 20 Aug 2012 13:26:32 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Bart Janssen</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267911#post267911</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267911#post267911</guid>
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						<p><q>Rubbish. Go educate yourself</q></p><p>Try reading your own link<br /><q>From the Middle Ages to around 1750 part of today's Afghanistan was recognized as Khorasan.[32] Two of the four main capitals of Khorasan (Balkh and Herat) are now located in modern Afghanistan. The country of Kandahar, Ghazni and Kabul formed the…</q></p>
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				<pubDate>Mon, 20 Aug 2012 13:20:09 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Steve Barnes</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267908#post267908</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267908#post267908</guid>
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						<p><q>There is a Maori author called James George.</q></p><p>One of my neighbours up North is John George. So I suppose it's not that unusual. My point was  that the more "enthusiastic" opinions here are, more often that not, from people with "two first names" spooky huh? ;-)</p>
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				<pubDate>Mon, 20 Aug 2012 12:53:34 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Islander</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267906#post267906</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267906#post267906</guid>
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						<p><q>mm, two first names eh, that’s “unusual”</p><p>There is a Maori author called James George. I dont know whether this one is him...</p>
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				<pubDate>Mon, 20 Aug 2012 12:34:15 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Steve Barnes</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267902#post267902</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267902#post267902</guid>
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						<p><q>My old man who got sucked into fighting for englanders for 6 years would have rolled in his grave,</q></p><p>Garth?<br />Hmmm, two first names eh, that's "unusual"</p>
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				<pubDate>Mon, 20 Aug 2012 12:05:04 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Joe Wylie</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267897#post267897</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267897#post267897</guid>
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						<p><q>So you know who <em>really</em> did it, then? Do tell.</q><br />Last time I asked that question I was directed to a website which in turn directed me to a series of other websites. Along with a megaload of mind-numbing minor detail, all featured popup ads with messages such as "Are…</p>
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				<pubDate>Mon, 20 Aug 2012 11:24:22 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>andin</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267890#post267890</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267890#post267890</guid>
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						<p><q>Here’s the episode on-demand.</q><br />Yeah informative, great show</p>
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				<pubDate>Mon, 20 Aug 2012 10:42:54 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Russell Brown</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267888#post267888</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267888#post267888</guid>
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						<p><q>the bunch of Saudis that the US had framed for the job</q></p><p>So you know who <em>really</em> did it, then? Do tell.</p>
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				<pubDate>Mon, 20 Aug 2012 10:11:12 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Danielle</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267885#post267885</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267885#post267885</guid>
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						<p><q>amerika</q></p><p>Whoa! Retro.</p>
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				<pubDate>Mon, 20 Aug 2012 09:40:19 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Sacha</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267884#post267884</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267884#post267884</guid>
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						<p><q>englander </q></p><p>?</p>
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				<pubDate>Mon, 20 Aug 2012 09:38:01 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Rich of Observationz</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267883#post267883</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267883#post267883</guid>
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						<p>It occurs to me that if a few soldiers didn't die in wars, we wouldn't have the justification to spend $75mln on the Buckle St tunnel/memorial park.</p><p>Although we'll always have a steady stream of troops killing themselves in accidents, a 'military accident memorial' doesn't have the same ring.</p>
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				<pubDate>Mon, 20 Aug 2012 08:57:09 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>James George</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267882#post267882</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267882#post267882</guid>
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						<p>Let me get this straight, the legitimate Mullah Omar lead government are the baddies eh Russell?   Even though amerika invaded Afghanistan in 2001 because amerikans wanted an easy head to kick after the anti-globalist world trade centre action and they picked what they thought was an easy target.  </p><p>Forget that…</p>
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				<pubDate>Mon, 20 Aug 2012 08:45:27 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Lilith __</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267812#post267812</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267812#post267812</guid>
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						<p><q> It’s just a shame it’s on so early, but hey, there’s always TV3OD</q></p><p>Before the crack of noon!  Ungodly. ;-)</p>
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				<pubDate>Sat, 18 Aug 2012 18:17:58 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Matthew Littlewood</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267810#post267810</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267810#post267810</guid>
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						<p><q>Grant Duncan is great talent &ndash; an academic who tells it like it is. More. And I admire how fair and respectful Nicky Hager is on this topic.</q></p><p>Yes, two very worthwhile segments, as was Tracy Watkins talking about polling- which I suppose will become more important for me to…</p>
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				<pubDate>Sat, 18 Aug 2012 18:11:12 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Russell Brown</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267805#post267805</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267805#post267805</guid>
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						<p><q>a technical/production matter however…. the lighting seemed lacking to this non-expert viewer.</q></p><p>I know. It's actually better than it was last week. This stuff is surprisingly difficult in this sort of setting.</p>
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				<pubDate>Sat, 18 Aug 2012 16:15:18 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>FletcherB</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267802#post267802</link>
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						<p>The content of the show was great....</p><p>a technical/production matter however....  the lighting seemed lacking to this non-expert viewer.</p><p>I know its not a studio but a converted venue, and you've mentioned the budget is tight... but the guests faces were at best, only marginally well lit, and yours (Russell)…</p>
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				<pubDate>Sat, 18 Aug 2012 15:05:06 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Steve Barnes</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267801#post267801</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267801#post267801</guid>
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						<p><q>It’s almost always the centre of a large state covering it’s current ground and some extent of the surrounding nations, all the way back into pre-history</q></p><p>That is surely more to do with geography rather than political influence. It begs the question of what exactly is a country, is a…</p>
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				<pubDate>Sat, 18 Aug 2012 13:25:39 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Cecelia</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267800#post267800</link>
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						<p>I enjoyed all the interviewees: Jon Stephenson, Grant Duncan (a new face to me) and especially Nicky Hager. Did anyone see The Nation beforehand? <br />I admire Rachael Smalley but she did let Stephen Joyce go on and on, so much so that it became very boring.</p>
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				<pubDate>Sat, 18 Aug 2012 12:13:44 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Sacha</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267798#post267798</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267798#post267798</guid>
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						<p><q>Grant Duncan</q></p><p><a href="http://grantduncan.blogspot.co.nz/" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">his blog</a> seems more philospophical in tone.</p>
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				<pubDate>Sat, 18 Aug 2012 11:24:58 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Sacha</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267794#post267794</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267794#post267794</guid>
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						Grant Duncan is great talent &ndash; an academic who tells it like it is. More. And I admire how fair and respectful Nicky Hager is on this topic.
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				<pubDate>Sat, 18 Aug 2012 11:16:06 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Russell Brown</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267793#post267793</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267793#post267793</guid>
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						<p><q>Brilliant programme this morning Russell.</q></p><p>Thanks! Here's <a href="http://ondemand.tv3.co.nz/Media-3-Season-1-Ep-2/tabid/59/articleID/7705/MCat/540/Default.aspx" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">the episode on-demand</a>.</p>
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				<pubDate>Sat, 18 Aug 2012 11:13:21 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Cecelia</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267790#post267790</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267790#post267790</guid>
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						Brilliant programme this morning Russell.
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				<pubDate>Sat, 18 Aug 2012 11:02:31 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>tussock</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267779#post267779</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267779#post267779</guid>
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						<p><q>Um just because some European drew a circle around that bit on a map and called it a single name does not mean it was a single country. The people within that circle still considered themselves mortal enemies of their neighbours.</q><br />Rubbish. Go educate yourself.<br /><a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Afghanistan" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Afghanistan</a></p><p>It's almost always the…</p>
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				<pubDate>Sat, 18 Aug 2012 03:38:14 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>tussock</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267776#post267776</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267776#post267776</guid>
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						<p><q>But I guess we can agree it’s clear that not all Taliban are the same, and any remotely orderly withdrawal from Afghanistan will require negotiation with the “good” Taliban.</q><br />At some point the US will "declare victory" and withdraw, as they could have done any time since about 10 days…</p>
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				<pubDate>Sat, 18 Aug 2012 02:01:35 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Russell Brown</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267747#post267747</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267747#post267747</guid>
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						<p><q>It was much better than the guys that came before them, who it’s difficult even for me to talk about in polite company.</q></p><p>Effectively, there weren't any guys immediately before the Taliban, just warring militias backed by the Saudis and Iran respectively. The interim government never really had a chance.…</p>
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				<pubDate>Fri, 17 Aug 2012 13:46:36 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Angus Robertson</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267737#post267737</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267737#post267737</guid>
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						<p><q>Syria is an insurgency, Afghanistan is not.</q></p><p>When the government is shelling cities with tanks and artillery &ndash; not an insurgency.</p>
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				<pubDate>Fri, 17 Aug 2012 12:59:41 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Steve Withers</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267698#post267698</link>
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				<description><![CDATA[
						Tussock: Thanks for posting. Occasionally more accurate vocabulary intrudes into the flow of the approved narrative....which tends to have captured the language even among people who do not agree with the approved narrative. I don't use the world "insurgents". It's the new version of "radicals" and "extremists"......which used to be…
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				<pubDate>Fri, 17 Aug 2012 09:19:36 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Bart Janssen</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267695#post267695</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267695#post267695</guid>
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						<p><q>and had it’s current borders since 1823</q></p><p>Um just because some European drew a circle around that bit on a map and called it a single name does not mean it was a single country. The people within that circle still considered themselves mortal enemies of their neighbours. </p><p>I get…</p>
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				<pubDate>Fri, 17 Aug 2012 09:14:33 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Bart Janssen</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267694#post267694</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267694#post267694</guid>
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						<p><q>Including Alexander’s (after being whopped.)</q></p><p>There IS a reason people still talk about him. Seriously how loony do you have to be to think that was a good plan.</p>
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				<pubDate>Fri, 17 Aug 2012 09:06:25 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>tussock</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267688#post267688</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267688#post267688</guid>
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						<p><q>But it’s delusional to imagine that the Taliban are some high-minded freedom fighters. Their record in power was truly hideous.</q><br />It was much better than the guys that came before them, who it’s difficult even for me to talk about in polite company. The support for the Taliban then and…</p>
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				<pubDate>Fri, 17 Aug 2012 04:47:34 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Islander</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267682#post267682</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267682#post267682</guid>
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						<p><q>t's the reason historically armies stopped before incorporating Afganistan into whatever empire they happened to be forming at the time. Army rides up looks at the mountains and says "yeah, nah".</p><p>Report</q></p><p><br />Including Alexander's (after being whopped.)</p>
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				<pubDate>Thu, 16 Aug 2012 21:58:34 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>mark taslov</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267656#post267656</link>
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						<p><q>The terrain is impossible. That's one of the things that divides the country into so many segments.</p><p>It's the reason historically armies stopped before incorporating Afganistan into whatever empire they happened to be forming at the time.</q></p><p>Hasn't stopped them Kiwis, brave little blighters.</p>
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				<pubDate>Thu, 16 Aug 2012 17:02:27 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Simon Grigg</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267651#post267651</link>
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				<description><![CDATA[
						<p><q>One thing that struck me was the bizarreness of how the fairly minimally equipped, outgunned and technologically primitive insurgents could hold the might of the US at bay not just for weeks or months, but years. E.g. The americans had helicopter gunships and the insurgents had rifles and radios.</q></p><p>Been…</p>
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				<pubDate>Thu, 16 Aug 2012 16:26:16 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Bart Janssen</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267649#post267649</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267649#post267649</guid>
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						<p><q>the bizarreness of how the fairly minimally equipped, outgunned and technologically primitive insurgents could hold the might of the US at bay</q></p><p>They did the same to the Russians and the same to the British and the same to each other.</p><p>The key to understanding how that is possible comes…</p>
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				<pubDate>Thu, 16 Aug 2012 15:55:41 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>dc_red</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267646#post267646</link>
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				<description><![CDATA[
						<p>The doco 'restrepo' is well worth a look for a bit of insight into the fucked-up-ness of the afghanistan war and the fuzziness of who the resistance/insurgents and taleban might be. </p><p>One thing that struck me was the bizarreness of how the fairly minimally equipped, outgunned and technologically primitive insurgents…</p>
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				<pubDate>Thu, 16 Aug 2012 15:28:53 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Russell Brown</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267642#post267642</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267642#post267642</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						A number of the conversations I've had with Jon Stephenson about Afghanistan could be summarised as "it's complicated".
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				<pubDate>Thu, 16 Aug 2012 14:43:08 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Richard Aston</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267637#post267637</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267637#post267637</guid>
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						<p><q>But...</p><p>    the author revealed that the US in fact did not directly fund or create the Taliban. CIA funds went directly to the ISI the Pakistani security forces, who funneled the funds to the Taliban.</p><p>J. Kalomiris, reviewing 9/11 Wars.</q></p><p>I don't know who is right here but George Friedman…</p>
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				<pubDate>Thu, 16 Aug 2012 14:02:50 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Simon Grigg</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267634#post267634</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267634#post267634</guid>
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						<p><q>Afganistan is not and never has been one unified country.</q></p><p>Indeed, and the bloodiest part of recent history was not the Russian or the US invasions but the civil wars of the 1970s.</p><p>I suspect the aftermath of the withdrawal will look much the same.</p>
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				<pubDate>Thu, 16 Aug 2012 13:49:13 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Simon Grigg</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267633#post267633</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267633#post267633</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p><q>Saudi Arabia is a fundamentalist religious society. It chooses to impose its cultural imprint on Pakistan/Afghanistan region. Pakistan/Afghanistan has become increasingly religious. Simple.</q></p><p>It's a little more complex than that. The increasingly educated and wealthy Pakistani middle class &ndash; with years of westernised secular schooling &ndash; has also become radically…</p>
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				<pubDate>Thu, 16 Aug 2012 13:47:01 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Steve Barnes</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267631#post267631</link>
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						<p><q>Either we leave and accept that religious zealots will take over.  Or we stay as long as neccessary – estimates say Saudi Arabia might run out of oil in 2070.</q></p><p>With <a href="http://www.alarabiya.net/articles/2011/07/12/157247.html " target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer"> Saudi oil revenues</a> approaching 1 billion a day the oil may run out but the cash will…</p>
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				<pubDate>Thu, 16 Aug 2012 13:34:21 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Bart Janssen</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267629#post267629</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267629#post267629</guid>
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						<p><q>They’re not insurgents, they’re the resistance.</q></p><p>This is just as much of a simplification as the opposing view.</p><p>Afganistan is not and never has been one unified country. The people in each region view themselves as distinct from people in other region. It is not simply a religious distinction, it…</p>
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				<pubDate>Thu, 16 Aug 2012 13:32:22 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Russell Brown</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267624#post267624</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267624#post267624</guid>
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						<p><q>Either we leave and accept that religious zealots will take over. Or we stay as long as neccessary – estimates say Saudi Arabia might run out of oil in 2070. Or we try somethingelse.</q></p><p>If there were ever any "good" options, there certainly aren't now.</p>
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				<pubDate>Thu, 16 Aug 2012 13:14:15 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Angus Robertson</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267623#post267623</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267623#post267623</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p>Richard &amp; Steve,</p><p>That is an American-centric book and American-centric review, when America is not central to the political culture of the region.  The Western conceit is that it and it alone bestrides the world causing things to happen &ndash; playing to that sells books.  But  America merely got involved and…</p>
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				<pubDate>Thu, 16 Aug 2012 13:12:47 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Steve Barnes</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267610#post267610</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267610#post267610</guid>
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						<p><q>He basically says the US created the Taliban to fight the Russians , to the extent of equipping them with the full CIA manuals and a lot of hard cash.</q><br /><a href="http://www.amazon.com/review/R2FGJ0ZHEDY90S/ref=cm_cr_pr_perm?ie=UTF8&amp;ASIN=0141044594&amp;linkCode=&amp;nodeID=&amp;tag= " target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer"> But...</a><br /><q>the author revealed that the US in fact did not directly fund or create the Taliban. CIA funds…</q></p>
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				<pubDate>Thu, 16 Aug 2012 11:51:13 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Richard Aston</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267606#post267606</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267606#post267606</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						+1 to Russell , yes there may have been some farmers in the "resistance" but it's far more complex than the Tangata Whenua wanting their land back .
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				<pubDate>Thu, 16 Aug 2012 11:26:54 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Richard Aston</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267605#post267605</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267605#post267605</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p><a href="http://www.amazon.com/Americas-Secret-War-Worldwide-Struggle/dp/0385512457" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">America's Secret War</a> by George Friedman is also a good source. <br />I heard him speak at a readers and writers event. He basically says the US created the Taliban to fight the Russians , to the extent of equipping them with the full CIA manuals and a lot of hard…</p>
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				<pubDate>Thu, 16 Aug 2012 11:24:07 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>David Chittenden</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267580#post267580</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267580#post267580</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p>Changing topic to Paul Ryan's selection for the Media3 show ...</p><p>The US election rhetoric is unbelievably tribal and mainly full of loud shouting.  </p><p>Here are some facts* on <a href="http://www.upworthy.com/5-things-every-voter-needs-to-know-about-paul-ryan-and-women" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">Paul Ryan and women</a>.</p><p>And the media coverage is usually very biased.  Here's a rare case [[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2A4YOfj0qaw&amp;feature=player_embedded|of a reporter actually knowing her…</p>
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				<pubDate>Thu, 16 Aug 2012 09:56:48 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Russell Brown</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267572#post267572</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267572#post267572</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<a href="http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2012/aug/15/afghan-civilians-wounded-mosque-market" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">Twenty-odd civilians killed</a> in bombings of a mosque and a city market overnight.
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				<pubDate>Thu, 16 Aug 2012 09:23:12 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Kumara Republic</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267553#post267553</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267553#post267553</guid>
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						<p><q>The actual government under Karzai is hardly any better, of course. It's deeply corrupt and has further eroded the credibility of the occupation. But it's delusional to imagine that the Taliban are some high-minded freedom fighters. Their record in power was truly hideous.</q></p><p>It seems to be a plague on…</p>
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				<pubDate>Thu, 16 Aug 2012 01:11:08 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>andin</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267538#post267538</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267538#post267538</guid>
				<description><![CDATA[
						<p><q>Jason Burke’s 9/11 Wars</q><br />That looks very good</p>
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				<pubDate>Wed, 15 Aug 2012 21:15:47 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Chris Waugh</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267530#post267530</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267530#post267530</guid>
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						<p><q>maybe if it had been Stalin rather than Brezhnev, they might have done, and we'd have a pacified, relatively liberal state inhabited almost entirely by Russians</q></p><p>Umm... like the other 'stans or the Caucasus? Places where Stalin did get up to all sorts of shenanigans like deporting the entire population…</p>
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				<pubDate>Wed, 15 Aug 2012 20:06:18 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Simon Grigg</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267515#post267515</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267515#post267515</guid>
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						<p><q>Their record in power was truly hideous.</q></p><p>Quite, and their time in power is often poorly understood. For a long time they clearly had broad popular support, even for their most heinous actions. Of course if you openly didn't support you were marked.</p><p>We look at something like the demolition…</p>
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				<pubDate>Wed, 15 Aug 2012 17:39:49 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Angus Robertson</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267510#post267510</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267510#post267510</guid>
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						+ 1
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				<pubDate>Wed, 15 Aug 2012 17:00:40 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Russell Brown</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267507#post267507</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267507#post267507</guid>
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						<p><q>They don’t melt back into being farmers, they are farmers. We’re killing farmers, because they make up the resistance. </q></p><p>If you're talking about the Taliban (who are a diverse group, granted) it's much more accurate to call them students than farmers. They partially fund themselves by "taxing" poor farmers. Most…</p>
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				<pubDate>Wed, 15 Aug 2012 16:51:02 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>tussock</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267502#post267502</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267502#post267502</guid>
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						@Rich. They're not insurgents, they're the resistance. We (as servants of the US) are the occupation, the government there are our puppet quislings flown in from the US and Britain, former employees of large oil companies, and the locals are resisting our continued presence with the standard guerrilla warfare tactics…
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				<pubDate>Wed, 15 Aug 2012 16:33:39 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Sacha</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267498#post267498</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267498#post267498</guid>
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						<p><q>all agreeing it was time to get NZ out of Afghanistan like now</q></p><p>Surpising unanimity really &ndash; and they all seemed to have a good grasp of the topic too. Native Affairs does a cracking job for all of us.</p>
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				<pubDate>Wed, 15 Aug 2012 16:13:13 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Rich of Observationz</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267488#post267488</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267488#post267488</guid>
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						<p><q>Bamiyan, an area supposedly controlled</q></p><p>I think the insurgent groups have an ability to throttle the amount of trouble in any area, including allegedly 'peaceable' ones, as they wish. If things get hot for them, they can hide their weapons and melt back into being farmers. When they need to,…</p>
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				<pubDate>Wed, 15 Aug 2012 15:19:53 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Richard Aston</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267485#post267485</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267485#post267485</guid>
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						<p>Mon 13/8 , Maori TV <a href="http://www.maoritelevision.com/default.aspx?tabid=636&amp;pid=212" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">Native Matters</a> , they had Winston, Greens, Hone, Labour and Maori parties all agreeing it was time to get NZ out of Afghanistan like now. <br />At 34:20 in the video . <br />The whole piece was good to see the level of agreement ( and debate) amoung…</p>
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				<pubDate>Wed, 15 Aug 2012 15:02:17 +1200</pubDate>
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				<title>Public Address</title>
				<link>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267484#post267484</link>
				<guid>https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-the-question-of-afghanistan-becomes/?p=267484#post267484</guid>
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						<p>Discussion from blog post.</p>
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				<pubDate>Wed, 15 Aug 2012 15:02:17 +1200</pubDate>
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