Public Address | Cafe | Hard News: The new establishment

Ian Dalziel

Thu, 17 Aug 2017 08:14:18 +1200

Here is some illuminating reading on many relevant matters – The latest issue of CAFCA's Watchdog is now on-line.
http://www.converge.org.nz/watchdog/44/index44.html

izogi

Wed, 16 Aug 2017 23:03:31 +1200

Also, anyone with a reasonable lawyer on NZ legislation, and Barnaby Joyce's basic family history, could confirm as much info as DIA were ever going to provide.

The main important thing DIA might add is if Joyce had registered renunciation of his citizenship, but it was never going to because…

Rich of Observationz

Wed, 16 Aug 2017 21:03:09 +1200

Well no, NZ citizens or permanent residents can just email.

(I'm not sure why they even bothered putting those clauses into the Act about who has standing to make a request as they're so easily circumvented. If you were an overseas corporation, you'd just have a lawyer do it and…

mark taslov

Wed, 16 Aug 2017 19:01:39 +1200

just sayin'. Please don't @ me now I'm watching The Project (NZ version).

mark taslov

Wed, 16 Aug 2017 19:01:29 +1200

extra business for Ancestry.com

That’s pretty much exactly what I did. I learned my great-great-great-grandma Margaret was not only a staunch defender of Te Kooti but also an early critic of colonial psychoactive substances practice.

"like spiders webs to catch flies"

As for a contribution to Antipodean Lamarckism…

Henry Barnard

Wed, 16 Aug 2017 16:52:10 +1200

Since the person who talked with Chris Hipkins is a New Zealand citizen, would hopping on planes even be necessary?

izogi

Wed, 16 Aug 2017 16:50:42 +1200

Yeah. Or they could have just read NZ law with some legal expertise, clarified Joyce's family history, even used the online tool, then asked Joyce in the Australian parliament to confirm in light of the evidence that he definitely wasn't a citizen. I don't even see why asking DIA should…

Rich of Observationz

Wed, 16 Aug 2017 16:32:40 +1200

But the same effect could have been achieved, just a bit more slowly, if a member of the Australian Labour Party had hopped on a plane and as a person who is in New Zealand lodged an OIA asking for Joyce's citizenship status, if any?

They might not even need…

izogi

Wed, 16 Aug 2017 13:56:28 +1200

... an international mess that's tangled up NZ, and its election, in Australian politics, instead of just a domestic Australian mess.

(Sorry. I don't know what happened to the end of my previous comment.)

izogi

Wed, 16 Aug 2017 13:10:57 +1200

Same here and I agree with you about the dumbness of this constitution clause for Australia, but it remains their problem to deal with and fix.

Even though citizenships are public info, and so is the law which defines them for that matter, my concern's really more about why MFAT,…

Ian Dalziel

Wed, 16 Aug 2017 13:10:30 +1200

So does the husband of a dame get some sort of title?
Teal deer – No!
That link above does say this:
Husband of a dame
The husband of a dame is not accorded a courtesy title. A dame and her husband would jointly be addressed as: Dame Joan and…

Ian Dalziel

Wed, 16 Aug 2017 13:03:20 +1200

Politik has given a lengthier sequence of events between DIA and MFAT and Ministers
in which it says:
Labour Leader Jacinda Ardern says that Hipkins had been asked to ask the question by an acquaintance in the Australian Labor Party.
Just heard Penny Wong on the radio saying that they…

Rich of Observationz

Wed, 16 Aug 2017 13:03:16 +1200

So does the husband of a dame get some sort of title?

And what about David Furnish, who is the wife (or husband if he prefers) of a knight?

Rich of Observationz

Wed, 16 Aug 2017 12:57:58 +1200

The details of anyone's citizenship isn't secret or private information as far as I'm aware. Certainly the register of births is a public document and consequently you can get an idea on anyone's status by birth or descent. I'd think it would be OIA-applicable for that reason?

I'm opposed to…

izogi

Wed, 16 Aug 2017 12:54:07 +1200

Thanks to Russell posting a link on Twitter I see Politik has given a lengthier sequence of events between DIA and MFAT and Ministers, but I still can't see a clear explanation of why MFAT decided it should tell Joyce about his citizenship at all.

http://politik.co.nz/en/content/politics/1168/

Ian Dalziel

Wed, 16 Aug 2017 12:29:41 +1200

I’d really like to see Peter Dunne and Gerry Brownlee quizzed for their perspective on why DIA and MFAT acted as they did.
Considering Brownlee is Bishop's lapdog (judging by his interactions so far) perhaps he thought he was 'helping'...

izogi

Wed, 16 Aug 2017 12:09:16 +1200

As long as we're onto this topic, can someone explain to me what caused DIA and MFAT, via the NZ High Commission, to inform Barnaby Joyce of his citizenship when he never asked about it? Even moreso, why did they inform him of who was asking hypothetical questions about NZ…

John Farrell

Wed, 16 Aug 2017 12:05:47 +1200

They must be getting their news leads from the national party posters on the Trademe messageboard.

simon g

Wed, 16 Aug 2017 11:46:08 +1200

The Barnaby Joyce scrap has really shown up the difference between the Australian (plus international) media, and some of our own local hacks. Basically everyone outside NZ (from the NYT to the BBC) has reported the story as "Aussie Foreign Minister loses plot", because that's the bigger player making the…

Ian Dalziel

Wed, 16 Aug 2017 11:44:04 +1200

Sir ordinary, everyday guy,
Even out of office Key doesn’t heed his own department’s advice…
"The thing I like about the knighthood is more that it become Lady Bronagh….
uh John – check this first
The wife of a knight may use the courtesy title of “Lady” before her surname,…

Ian Dalziel

Wed, 16 Aug 2017 10:54:30 +1200

His world-view relies on a classic strategy of ignorance.
Much like some Australian politicians I can think of...

Ian Dalziel

Wed, 16 Aug 2017 10:53:19 +1200

my ancestry,
I'm thinking that the real upside of this whole Barnaby Joyce citizenship row will be extra business for Ancestry.com – I can picture their new ad campaign now...

Kumara Republic

Wed, 16 Aug 2017 10:44:54 +1200

David Seymour takes the cake with his claim that Labour’s plan to teach kids Civics at school is an ‘Orwellian’ and ‘dodgy’ way to indoctrinate young people to Left-wing views!!
Maybe it challenges his beloved Charter Schools.
Or maybe he realises his ‘Market- driven’ policies won’t stack up to young…

John Farrell

Tue, 15 Aug 2017 14:43:35 +1200

I'm not. I do have a convict who wasn't transported in my ancestry, though.

mark taslov

Tue, 15 Aug 2017 14:23:43 +1200

…they do seem to have a thing about prisons….

yeah about that...

Ian Dalziel

Tue, 15 Aug 2017 09:28:10 +1200

Ya don’t need to be a weatherman/woman to know which way the wind blows…
Interesting to note that while TVNZ wants to use Mike ’subliminal National billboard’ Hosking for the Leader debates – their weather dept is running with subtle Labour / Green imaging, ending the bulletin with a red…

Ian Dalziel

Tue, 15 Aug 2017 09:19:44 +1200

an ACT of madness…
David Seymour takes the cake with his claim that Labour’s plan to teach kids Civics at school is an ‘Orwellian’ and ‘dodgy’ way to indoctrinate young people to Left-wing views!!
Maybe it challenges his beloved Charter Schools.
Or maybe he realises his ‘Market- driven’ policies won’t…

Craig Young

Sun, 13 Aug 2017 12:52:56 +1200

No thanks- I was in Oz in 1995 during the sledging of Koorie and Murrie women over Hindmarsh Island land claims. In Queensland. Ugh. My parents live there and I love them dearly but I never could :/

Craig Young

Sun, 13 Aug 2017 12:50:42 +1200

Judging by the level of state and federal government and corporate corruption across the ditch, what do you think? (NB: Anti-Australia joke) ;)

Moz

Sun, 13 Aug 2017 10:39:19 +1200

their descendants are proving true to their genetic heritage and behaving in a similar manner

I think it's cultural heritage rather than genetic. Australia was set up by a bunch of toffs on the basis that "I stole it, it's mine now" (seriously, look at Torrens Title) and anything else…

Ian Dalziel

Sun, 13 Aug 2017 09:56:04 +1200

Holmesburg prison
great photo reminds me of a panopticon

Ian Dalziel

Sun, 13 Aug 2017 06:38:33 +1200

penal envy...
(Australian) criminal behaviour is genetically based
Maybe it's more of a societal imperative...
...they do seem to have a thing about prisons....

linger

Sun, 13 Aug 2017 00:19:35 +1200

You're really saying that criminal behaviour is genetically based?

Craig Young

Sat, 12 Aug 2017 10:33:00 +1200

Well, they were settled by convicts. Problem is, their descendants are proving true to their genetic heritage and behaving in a similar manner.

Moz

Fri, 11 Aug 2017 13:00:07 +1200

Moz, you do realise that at the rate Oz is going, we’ll probably be legislating for legal recognition of polyamory by the time...

I wish.

Australia... sigh. Morals, laws, ethics... don't come here for those.

I just did a feedback form for my bank and the question "would you recommend…

Ian Dalziel

Fri, 11 Aug 2017 10:35:02 +1200

Gower is like a homeless beaver, who always states the bleeding obvious.
Praised by feint dams?

Rob Stowell

Fri, 11 Aug 2017 09:51:13 +1200

there’s a hefty female gender gap tilt that favours Jacinda Ardern.
Reckon this could be spot on. Looking at eg the student population, there's a lot of soft National vote in young women. Many could be double-happy to vote for not just a woman, but someone under 50 who looks…

Craig Young

Thu, 10 Aug 2017 19:36:51 +1200

Here's the link: http://www.newshub.co.nz/home/election/2017/08/newshub-poll-women-key-driver-behind-jacinda-ardern-s-surge.html

Craig Young

Thu, 10 Aug 2017 19:17:40 +1200

Geoff, that's needlessly insulting to beavers ;)

Craig Young

Thu, 10 Aug 2017 19:16:29 +1200

Moz, you do realise that at the rate Oz is going, we’ll probably be legislating for legal recognition of polyamory by the time our western nutbars- oops, neighbours :/ eventually get around to marriage equality…? And that we’ve had two female Prime Ministers while Oz has only had one, and…

Moz

Thu, 10 Aug 2017 18:21:49 +1200

Apparently, according to Newshub this evening, there's a hefty female gender gap tilt that favours Jacinda Ardern.

And we can pay her less, too. Don't forget that :)

Craig Young

Thu, 10 Aug 2017 18:08:06 +1200

Now that's interesting. Apparently, according to Newshub this evening, there's a hefty female gender gap tilt that favours Jacinda Ardern. A predecessor of which kept Helen in power for most of the Noughties.

Ian Dalziel

Thu, 10 Aug 2017 08:47:37 +1200

High paid lobbyists and advisers are no guarantee of anything:
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/aug/08/tories-paid-crosbys-firm-millions-advising-mays-disastrous-election-campaign?
– nice work if you can get though eh, Lynton?

Ian Dalziel

Thu, 10 Aug 2017 07:46:09 +1200

Meanwhile, The Chchch Progressive Network also works to keep the issues to the fore.

Geoff Lealand

Wed, 09 Aug 2017 22:02:11 +1200

Gower is like a homeless beaver, who always states the bleeding obvious.

Katharine Moody

Wed, 09 Aug 2017 19:37:48 +1200

LOL- a blue supporter on another site has accused Paddy Gower of having an orgasm on live TV;

http://www.newshub.co.nz/home/election/2017/08/newshub-reid-research-poll-jacinda-ardern-brings-labour-back.html

Ah, well, game on. Wonder what kind of note in an envelope he'll be getting in the Parliamentary foyer tomorrow?

Bill Bennett

Tue, 08 Aug 2017 08:45:41 +1200

This is an excellent point, well articulated and it goes way, way beyond transport policy. It's as if we punish political leaders for not having pyschic powers.

Sacha

Mon, 07 Aug 2017 17:12:23 +1200

Unlike the trusting citizenry whose submissions, given for no reward, were supposedly what Share an Idea was all about.

Yet Chch voted this govt back in. Twice.

Moz

Mon, 07 Aug 2017 16:33:08 +1200

Had an amusing discussion with City of Sydney staff at the opening of the construction site for the new library about bike parking. The train station opposite is privately run and initially had zero bike parking. Fortunately they have lots of poles and suspension wires and all the other knick-knacks…

izogi

Mon, 07 Aug 2017 16:22:46 +1200

National is unashamedly ideology driven. [...] Would The Greens and Labour actually be any different? Well, they say they will be ...

I don't at all wish to defend the current government, which I don't especially like for many reasons, but a related issue is our general culture of punishing…

Joe Wylie

Mon, 07 Aug 2017 16:10:03 +1200

Share an Idea was a world-leading piece of civic engagement. Not every part of that Council was incompetent. Makes Brownlee's utter betrayal of the initiative even worse.

When none of the intended benefits ever materialised, who's to say that the 'award' wasn't just a form of circle-jerkery? A quick search…

william blake

Mon, 07 Aug 2017 16:00:49 +1200

I note that Sir John Key has just been awarded an honorary doctorate for that tacit support. Piled high and deep.

Sacha

Mon, 07 Aug 2017 16:00:08 +1200

Share an Idea was a world-leading piece of civic engagement. Not every part of that Council was incompetent. Makes Brownlee's utter betrayal of the initiative even worse.

Joe Wylie

Mon, 07 Aug 2017 15:54:49 +1200

The Council acted in good faith in conducting it; Brownlee and chums shat all over that by ignoring it thereafter.

Share an Idea was an initiative of Bob Parker's Council. Despite, or possibly because of Brownlee blatantly referring to Parker as a clown, it's a real stretch to claim that…

Sacha

Mon, 07 Aug 2017 15:37:57 +1200

The Share an Idea initiative, set up to foster a sense of public participation in post-quake Christchurch, was never anything other than a deliberate and contrived hoax.

The Council acted in good faith in conducting it; Brownlee and chums shat all over that by ignoring it thereafter.

Sacha

Mon, 07 Aug 2017 15:36:37 +1200

It's not an either-or.

Bart Janssen

Mon, 07 Aug 2017 15:24:40 +1200

This government has proven rather more cynically sophisticated than that.

National is unashamedly ideology driven. They simply don't accept any evidence that is contrary to their position in the belief that because their ideology is correct any such evidence must be flawed, either the evidence itself is faulty or the…

Tom Semmens

Mon, 07 Aug 2017 14:55:59 +1200

The CRL will be the work of Len Brown, not the transportblog folks.

Joe Wylie

Mon, 07 Aug 2017 14:28:03 +1200

The smart thing to do is, when groups of people get together and build knowledge and expertise in an area, the government should listen to them.

This government has proven rather more cynically sophisticated than that. The Share an Idea initiative, set up to foster a sense of public participation…

Katharine Moody

Mon, 07 Aug 2017 14:26:50 +1200

Yes I can think of many off the top of my head :Pure advantage, EDS, Law Commission, LAWF, Sallies,...

Sacha

Mon, 07 Aug 2017 14:08:31 +1200

the route from the pink path down Nelson seems to lose it's way right at the end.

See https://www.greaterauckland.org.nz/2017/01/13/nelson-st-phase-2/

Bart Janssen

Mon, 07 Aug 2017 13:21:56 +1200

I hope that this heralds a new shift towards embracing all the good work done by credible groups in civil society. About time government stopped thinking they know best.

With the best will in the world and the best bureaucracy supporting them the government simply cannot have the knowledge needed…

Glenn Pearce

Mon, 07 Aug 2017 12:57:25 +1200

I think, as he suggests here, that the big danger for the urbanists is that they become pigeonholed as narrow central Auckland liberals.

Yes, there was quite noticeable difference in diversity between the 2 events from the quick glimpses on the OneNews last night that I saw.

Both teams preaching…

Katharine Moody

Mon, 07 Aug 2017 12:30:36 +1200

Roads a potent electoral weapon? Grasping at straws. It's how WP held Tauranga and it's gridlocked now too.

Russell Brown

Mon, 07 Aug 2017 11:25:38 +1200

Another report from yesterday. Duncan Greive got to be the one to go out to Papakura for the National Party transport announcement.

I think, as he suggests here, that the big danger for the urbanists is that they become pigeonholed as narrow central Auckland liberals. (Although Ben Ross would have…

Tristan

Mon, 07 Aug 2017 11:21:54 +1200

And confused with Clark Gayford sometimes which while flattering might not play well with his wife :P

Russell Brown

Mon, 07 Aug 2017 11:19:12 +1200

I hope that this heralds a new shift towards embracing all the good work done by credible groups in civil society. About time government stopped thinking they know best.

Yes, that's how I see it. These groups are earning the right to be heard.

Katharine Moody

Mon, 07 Aug 2017 11:16:48 +1200

I hope that this heralds a new shift towards embracing all the good work done by credible groups in civil society. About time government stopped thinking they know best.

Hilary Stace

Mon, 07 Aug 2017 11:03:29 +1200

That is Andrew Kirton, with the two tone collar, in some of the photos. Labour Party general sec and campaign manager. Same generation as Jacinda.

Russell Brown

Mon, 07 Aug 2017 10:43:09 +1200

It’s interesting to see the places where they are and where they aren’t (in particular some supermarkets do and some don’t).

Countdown Ponsonby is great. Countdown Richmond Road is still bloody hopeless.

Bart Janssen

Mon, 07 Aug 2017 10:39:16 +1200

A word also for Wynyard quarter: it's a brilliant place to bike to.

Yup, although the route from the pink path down Nelson seems to lose it's way right at the end.

Bart Janssen

Mon, 07 Aug 2017 10:37:45 +1200

At Wynyard, there are proper cycle stands everywhere.

It's interesting to see the places where they are and where they aren't (in particular some supermarkets do and some don't). But also some shopping precincts need to get their shit together (looks pointedly at Newmarket).

Russell Brown

Mon, 07 Aug 2017 10:06:15 +1200

Two other accounts worth reading:

Simon Wilson at the Spinoff: ‘Come have a beer with me’: the Jacindatrain hits Auckland

Tim Murphy at Newsroom: Labour’s roll runs into National’s rock

Russell Brown

Mon, 07 Aug 2017 09:59:21 +1200

A word also for Wynyard quarter: it's a brilliant place to bike to. At most destination, still, you're hunting around for a place to lock your wheels to. At Wynyard, there are proper cycle stands everywhere.

Public Address

Mon, 07 Aug 2017 09:59:21 +1200

Discussion from blog post.