Public Address | Cafe | Hard News: Perverse Entertainment

Steve Parks

Tue, 12 Apr 2011 22:15:51 +1200

As for Palin and Bachmann being “over already” I can but hope. Apart from Obama actually losing, my next biggest fear politically is Palin winning.

Don't worry, she won't.

On the issue of Trump running, I've heard that if he wanted to run in the primaries he would be required…

Steve Barnes

Tue, 12 Apr 2011 10:35:46 +1200

I’m also dubious about sorting people into goodies and baddies according to physical characteristics,

This is a little beyond Phrenology as far as it goes but it does lend itself to the concept of shape-shifting reptiles, not entirely excluding Trotter, although he does have a good folk singing voice.
;-)…

BenWilson

Tue, 12 Apr 2011 09:16:32 +1200

Openness to new experiences and ideas is only so valuable. There are some ideas that are just plain bad, and some experiences I know I never want to have. So the conservative brain is still a vital part of the species – it's the part, on the whole, that has…

Kracklite

Tue, 12 Apr 2011 08:35:22 +1200

Addendum re the Trotteroids: I mean that those who might be inherently conservative and authoritarian have found niches under the left banner.

Kracklite

Tue, 12 Apr 2011 07:51:13 +1200

Well, I've come across other studies that also find a correlation between neurology and openness to new experiences and ideas, but I've seen plenty of (nominal) left-wing ossification and authoritarianism – Trotter, for example. I'm also dubious about sorting people into goodies and baddies according to physical characteristics, or arguing…

Lucy Stewart

Tue, 12 Apr 2011 01:29:51 +1200

There is what I call HSP – Hippie Parent Syndrome, related to CPS – Celebrity Parent Syndrome – some poor person is cursed with a name like Sunshine or Apple or Moon Unit because their narcissistic git of a parent sees their child as some sort of animate accessory to…

Steve Barnes

Tue, 12 Apr 2011 01:23:48 +1200

Now This is interesting...
Political liberalism and conservatism were correlated with brain structure
Liberalism was associated with the gray matter volume of anterior cingulate cortex
Conservatism was associated with increased right amygdala size
Results offer possible accounts for cognitive styles of liberals and conservatives

The amygdala being part…

Kracklite

Mon, 11 Apr 2011 21:00:13 +1200

it’s just making limited provocative sorties

You're right, of course. It's probing, testing limits and not going too far, but seeing just how far it can go to get a response. No grand explosion is likely, nothing that will get it definitely banned in this incarnation. There'll be another strategy,…

Kracklite

Mon, 11 Apr 2011 20:47:22 +1200

In other news... Rodders has named his child "Liberty".

Anyone remember The Young Ones? There's this classic line: "This is the band Radical Posture, and my name is Alexei Yuri Gagarin Siege of Stalingrad Glorious Five-Year Plan Sputnik Pravda Moscow Dynamo Back Four Balowski. Me Dad was a bit of…

Kracklite

Mon, 11 Apr 2011 20:39:15 +1200

Yes, that's what I find so existentially depressing about psychopaths or those that adopt their behaviour. They add nothing. They do provide entertainment if you can avoid being ensnared by them, but in the end... well, John Ralston Saul put it so nicely paraphrasing Hannah Arendt in saying that they…

Islander

Mon, 11 Apr 2011 20:30:00 +1200

In it's last incarnations, it just got frantic-

now – not least because I think our host is keeping both eye & finger on the extinction button- it's just making limited provocative sorties – which add nothing to the knowledge of our world-

which engages, one way or the other, the…

Kracklite

Mon, 11 Apr 2011 20:18:56 +1200

Yeah, a couple of notes:

I’m having fun because it gives me an opportunity to take my Doug Piranha persona out for a joyride.

I’ve known two or three people who could be classified as psychopaths, and while this isn’t T’ Standard and I won’t throw the label at anyone…

Steve Barnes

Mon, 11 Apr 2011 20:12:21 +1200

Here’s a question, what would be your favourite aquarium pet?

One of these would go down a treat.

It was a terrible, indescribable thing vaster than any subway train—a shapeless congeries of protoplasmic bubbles, faintly self-luminous, and with myriads of temporary eyes forming and unforming as pustules of greenish light…

Islander

Mon, 11 Apr 2011 19:57:15 +1200

Goodness, I even know a sauce to go with trollburghers!*
I dont think they’d like it though-

And you’re right Kracklite – the neediness is a dependence on validation – through any means whatsoever.

You know, I never dissected anything in my biology classes (entirely seperate from my law classes)?…

Kracklite

Mon, 11 Apr 2011 19:44:05 +1200

Oh, it’s trying a different track now. Bigoted epithets didn’t work, tantrums didn’t work, lies didn’t work, so now it’s trying some clumsy parody of that-there high-falutin’ talk.

You know, the sheer emotional neediness of trolls is quite fascinating in a way, that pathetic dependence that they have on validation…

son of little p

Mon, 11 Apr 2011 19:23:27 +1200

you are so far away ma'am from the awful truth of mimesis (as the pre-eminent 'cognizant' property of all higher animals and thus the one that has gotten us in to all of this most human, human trouble) that i must conclude you have become, over time, almost pathologicallly behooven…

Islander

Mon, 11 Apr 2011 18:57:07 +1200

MIMESIS:
biol.
close external resemblance between animal & another animal- or inaminate object.

In your case, I hesitate to use blunt objects ("fuckwit") or herd-words – say, a blunder of conspiracy theorists – and will restrain myself to suggest – go look at yourself in a mirror. After Kracklite's suggestion for…

son of little p

Mon, 11 Apr 2011 17:56:16 +1200

although the idea of an 'osmosis' neatly omits to mention the key active element coursing constantly throughout the whole shebang – that is, mimesis (or largely unconscious imitation of that judged to be in closest proximity to the collectively-desired object(ive')

son of little p

Mon, 11 Apr 2011 17:45:38 +1200

solly i dropped the -ly, i was under definite stress – muchly 'preciate your grandly suggestive expansiftications..

Dismal Soyanz

Mon, 11 Apr 2011 16:06:04 +1200

Been a while since I read The Black Cloud but I thought the guy's brain fried because he couldn't handle all the information the cloud downloaded into his brain (possibly because of preconceptions).

Ian Dalziel

Mon, 11 Apr 2011 15:59:58 +1200

I recall that Hoyle’s Black Cloud was actually quite intelligent.
damn, s'true...
I seem to have conflated Black Cloud and either a story, or SF TV episode, from the dimly remembered past in which the boffins' brains fry because of all their preconceptions, whereas the humble gardener/handyman can communicate with…

Kracklite

Mon, 11 Apr 2011 15:13:58 +1200

Hey Ian, you're back! Thoughgt you'd been crushed under falling masonry.

I recall that Hoyle's Black Cloud was actually quite intelligent.

Kracklite

Mon, 11 Apr 2011 15:09:02 +1200

Oh yes, Turtle Diary. Haven't read that one, but several others by Hoban. I did see a film adaptation years ago and that's worth finding in DVD. Glenda Jackson, Ben Kingsley, Michael Gambon, Jeroen Krabbe, Nigel Hawthorne. Script by Harold Pinter. It's a real delight.

There are also a couple…

recordari

Mon, 11 Apr 2011 13:33:45 +1200

Russell Hoban, and his lovely book Turtle Diary.
+1
The Lathe of Heaven.
+2

Islander

Mon, 11 Apr 2011 13:33:03 +1200

Goodness! Havent even thought of The Lathe of Heaven or Turtle Diary
for years...must go reread both, because I love 'em too.

Carol Stewart

Mon, 11 Apr 2011 13:24:25 +1200

Ah, turtles, well now, one of my favourite writers, Ursula LeGuin, uses them as a motif in one of my favourite novels, The Lathe of Heaven. They have a wonderful absurdity, and yet, ahem, dignity in their slow grace

Ditto with one of my favourite writers, Russell Hoban, and his…

Islander

Mon, 11 Apr 2011 12:38:51 +1200

Very possiblely…

There is a wonderful passage in the non-fiction book “Leviathan” by Philip Hoare:

“-the barque Pauline was sailing in moderate winds and fine weather when her crew saw some black spots on the water, with a whitish pillar high above them. As the ship drew near, it became…

Leopold

Mon, 11 Apr 2011 09:36:08 +1200

Yep – thought cuttlefish were great – its the way they wave back at you when you wave at them. Interspecies communication of a very basic sort

Ian Dalziel

Mon, 11 Apr 2011 09:10:45 +1200

Play Misty for Me – or pushing solvent abuse?
a community of blogs = a numb osmotic fog
sadly an anagram fail: the "ly" is missing...
a numbly osmotic fog would nail it!

according to my stubby pencil and old envelope back
a more damning rearrangement of __a community of…

Kracklite

Sun, 10 Apr 2011 22:49:26 +1200

compared with giant eels

Bloop?

Kracklite

Sun, 10 Apr 2011 21:50:28 +1200

OK, here were my google search terms:

watts “your brain is leaking"

His old blog has been stopped, though it’s still going in its new form as

No Moods, Ads or Cutesy Fucking Icons (Re-reloaded)

And the worst is No! Don’t, I really mean it!

He does have an interesting…

Islander

Sun, 10 Apr 2011 21:44:17 +1200

Worse! Curries!
Bugger- that doesnt seem to have loaded-

Kracklite

Sun, 10 Apr 2011 21:23:21 +1200

Of pastries?

Islander

Sun, 10 Apr 2011 21:19:14 +1200

Waua! Will go look. Apopo- (have lots of medics in family so am – um, accustomned – to *really horrible photos*-

Kracklite

Sun, 10 Apr 2011 21:10:14 +1200

Scanning Peter Watts' blog, I noted a reference he made to the fact that octopuses don't necessarily have full control over their tentacles...

Ah, here it is! Mantis shrimps as a bonus. Consciousness is distributed it appears.

(BTW, Watts has a notoriously black sense of humour, and having recently survived…

Kracklite

Sun, 10 Apr 2011 21:01:11 +1200

Ah, turtles, well now, one of my favourite writers, Ursula LeGuin, uses them as a motif in one of my favourite novels, The Lathe of Heaven. They have a wonderful absurdity, and yet, ahem, dignity in their slow grace.

That novel has something to say about the virtue of a…

Islander

Sun, 10 Apr 2011 20:54:33 +1200

Glory to our world!!!! – opalised!

The only 'pet' I have is an axolotyl – which is just there, in it's tank, after one of my nephews decided he couldnt look after it-

I'd prefer an octopus – it's that brain/eye conjunction, with the displayed curiosity-
but actually setting up…

Greville Whittle

Sun, 10 Apr 2011 20:53:48 +1200

Mine would be a Cuttlefish. I watched a tank full of them in Singapore, swimming and changing colours, for ages*.

I also like turtles, have no idea why, not one I can convey articulately anyway.

*Ages in this case, was when my Wife tugged my sleeve and said "It's been…

Kracklite

Sun, 10 Apr 2011 20:28:38 +1200

Here's a question, what would be your favourite aquarium pet? Octopus or mantis shrimp? Both clever, both weird (that's a plus for me – I love cats, like Lovecraft, but could they be just a bit more... eldritch?). The latter live longer, however.

Kracklite

Sun, 10 Apr 2011 20:21:44 +1200

Yes, there’s this, this and this!

In a novel that I wrote a while back,* I couldn’t resist adding a character whose office is panelled in slabs of polished stone rather like this (hope the link makes it – I had a bit of difficulty).

*Fingers crossed. Typesetting and illustration…

Islander

Sun, 10 Apr 2011 20:14:16 +1200

O berloody hell Kracklite!
I love mantis shrimps!
Almost certainly the fastest mover on the planet, and – the vision!
When I mentioned this, on my only visit to Japan, my hosts organised 3 of them, beautifully prepared, and very very dead, as a special treat. I loved their hospitality,…

Islander

Sun, 10 Apr 2011 20:10:41 +1200

Ammonites make beyootiful fossils (and trilobites even better ones.) Given what mayexist still in the oceans of our world (coelacanths are the least of 'em, compared with giant eels) – there is a possibility that an evolved trilobite may still be around – it just wont quite look like it's…

Kracklite

Sun, 10 Apr 2011 20:09:47 +1200

That’s “Dr” actually.

I do lots of voices. This is just one of them. You should hear my Cornish accent.

Now, as for arthropods. Mantis shrimps. Really amazing. Hyperspectral vision, can even see – and communicate – using polarised light.

son of little p

Sun, 10 Apr 2011 20:06:45 +1200

and you sir Mr Kracklite of course are now "allowing dignity in your characteristion of" myself. Via a string of abusive terms one after the other I'll be damned if you ain't the most fantastically condescending voice i have ever heard

Kracklite

Sun, 10 Apr 2011 19:58:23 +1200

Yes, of course.

Well, I’m not sure if ammonites are that interesting – even nautiloids, thought to be the most primitive cephalopods, seem to be more robust.

This

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-12127790?print=true

seems to indicate that they weren’t really able to deal with very large prey. Mind you, it could only relate to…

Islander

Sun, 10 Apr 2011 19:51:00 +1200

Alien Lizard is a total goodie Heather! Playful, punning, great & poetic insights ( and *not* ‘Lil P’!
He has come back, irrgegularly posting under his own name, and I appreciate him very much. Is in CHCH. May have access problems-

BUT – anyone wants to chat about ammonites/nautilids/trilobites et al…

Kracklite

Sun, 10 Apr 2011 19:50:48 +1200

Tea. Lie down. OK?

Try deep breaths, counting to ten and that sort of thing. I hear that when hyperventilating occurs, one should breathe into a bag to prevent over-oxygenation. Obviously the word "victim" gets to you.

On the off chance that you... no you didn't. Even in quoting you…

Heather Gaye

Sun, 10 Apr 2011 19:40:39 +1200

Can we go back to talking about ammonites & trilobites? I felt like I was actually learning something.

ETA: anagram generator! FTW! The internal PA one is called Alien Lizard, right?

son of little p

Sun, 10 Apr 2011 19:37:22 +1200

i'm not a f**king victim of anything, what on earth are you talking about? and i am entitled to nothing more than what i presume all of you believe yourselves to be a say in proceedings w/out automatically getting ridiculed and almost drooled apon by massively condescending, smug we-know-besters, so…

Islander

Sun, 10 Apr 2011 19:33:50 +1200

Did anyone mention the fondness for the anagram generator?
I loved them as a kid – rearrange those letters and – waua!
A site doing that – not so much.

Kracklite

Sun, 10 Apr 2011 19:27:27 +1200

Snap!

Kracklite

Sun, 10 Apr 2011 19:27:14 +1200

… and I’ve had some perverse entertainment.

recordari

Sun, 10 Apr 2011 19:26:32 +1200

not even entertaining now

The blog is called 'Perverse Entertainment'. Life imitating life, imitating life, imitating life... rinse and repeat.

Sacha

Sun, 10 Apr 2011 19:25:32 +1200

childish sense of thwarted entitlement

good summary

Kracklite

Sun, 10 Apr 2011 19:19:58 +1200

The only people who make it impossible to assert themselves in a dignified manner are those who refuse to assert themselves in a dignified manner to begin with, and that requires fundamentally a respect for those one addresses.

You're under stress, that's obvious. I suggest a cup of tea and…

son of little p

Sun, 10 Apr 2011 19:12:25 +1200

for a defendant to dignifiedly assert themslves, i meant to write

son of little p

Sun, 10 Apr 2011 19:11:45 +1200

so do you like to taunt 'sufferers from aspergers syndrome' in similar fashion? It is more insidious than anything i know of, the way certain people here make IMPOSSIBLE to dignifiedly assert themselves, whatever they do. I think it quite despicable, and the lowest of sport i know of..

son of little p

Sun, 10 Apr 2011 19:07:09 +1200

a community of blogs = a numb osmotic fog
da mihi sis quod nebulam dissipat!

Kracklite

Sun, 10 Apr 2011 19:04:29 +1200

Oh come on, now the wailing is getting monotonous. Higher, lower… you know, a bit of melody. Please.

Smugness, a troll complaining of smugness? Oh really, that’s not even old.

Dribblette, I have just demonstrated to you how a Chinese finger trap works – the more you struggle, the tighter…

son of little p

Sun, 10 Apr 2011 19:04:19 +1200

the smugness is just overpowering, you should know it! How can you be proud of that?

son of little p

Sun, 10 Apr 2011 19:02:25 +1200

what IS the future in calling someone endless, ritualistic names? Can you honestly answer that, w/out resorting to yet more?

Sacha

Sun, 10 Apr 2011 19:01:48 +1200

and it's not even a full moon

son of little p

Sun, 10 Apr 2011 19:00:37 +1200

the post that was deleted explained that this ('ass-burgers') was excactly how i first overheard the term spoken, that turned out to be A.S...

Kracklite

Sun, 10 Apr 2011 18:59:49 +1200

Translation of above: "Waah!"

Translation of "Quod erat demonstrandum": Thus it is proven.

Actually, I am roughly an old schoolmaster. A middle aged university tutor/lecturer/intellectual odd-job man and what have you. Dunno about everyone else here.

… I know, I know, Do Not Feed The Troll.

What about feeding on…

son of little p

Sun, 10 Apr 2011 18:58:44 +1200

i suppose you're gonna criticise me next for 'excessive deployment of exclamation-marks'! I mean, are you a blog or a convention of fusty old schoolmasters or what?

Kracklite

Sun, 10 Apr 2011 18:57:33 +1200

Oh dear, you poor thing!

Let's see, "ass-burger" = "good faith"? Continued use of scare quotes. Nope, does not compute. Sorry.

splendid wheeze

Only if you mean "gasping for breath".

son of little p

Sun, 10 Apr 2011 18:54:31 +1200

Why do you never fail to MAKE IT 'all about me' though? I totally do not get that! Had what i thought was a splendid wheeze concerning an exmaination of the social dynamics involved in 'trolling' someone (you've never even met) on the one hand, and endowing a person with…

Kracklite

Sun, 10 Apr 2011 18:52:07 +1200

near esoteric mystery to me. I can’t really get past it.

Indeed. Quod erat demonstrandum.

son of little p

Sun, 10 Apr 2011 18:47:49 +1200

here's how it looks to me. The first assertion regarding 'good faith' is a statement of near esoteric mystery to me. I can't really get past it. And i think you put it there as just that, an insuperable barrier..

son of little p

Sun, 10 Apr 2011 18:44:16 +1200

that's cos someone DELETED the whizzo post preceding what you see above, sir! As in P Minus, i like that very much, well done!)

Kracklite

Sun, 10 Apr 2011 18:37:45 +1200

Dribblette, like all trolls, is most definitely not asking any question in good faith.

Mediocrity, as Arthur Conan Doyle once put it, knows nothing higher than itself. This troll is, typically, one of those mediocre individuals who believes that certain people have elected themselves as his superiors and wants to…

Jackie Clark

Sun, 10 Apr 2011 18:33:00 +1200

Ignoring is good, Geoff.

Islander

Sun, 10 Apr 2011 18:16:55 +1200

History of here, Geoff – he *may* be traceable through the archives, maybe not. Go for 'Lil P'...

Geoff Lealand

Sun, 10 Apr 2011 18:03:52 +1200

Er...I am mightily confused by little son of p (as in p minus?) is on about and it is not a good way to start the week.

son of little p

Sun, 10 Apr 2011 16:56:29 +1200

i just can't b'lieve you DELETED it before everyone else got to read! Just what on earth could you possibly be afraid of bra, that would make you want to actually annihilate another's attempt to communicate!!!

son of little p

Sun, 10 Apr 2011 16:42:47 +1200

gosh, i really really thought you could use that 1st paragraph of mine for adverstising copy! It may not have been" made in GF" – STIIL waiting for the explanation of that one – but it was certainly composed in a sporting spirit!

Kracklite

Sat, 09 Apr 2011 00:04:46 +1200

Been a pleasure, and off to bed myself!

Islander

Fri, 08 Apr 2011 23:59:54 +1200

Yum!
Add to that (just before I haul my sorry carcass off to bed) that cetaceans can scan any body via sonar and *sieve* the results visually – and, I rather suspect, so can cephlapods (evolutionary catch-up stuff) and we are getting back to quite classic (but not really sophisticated)…

Kracklite

Fri, 08 Apr 2011 23:42:47 +1200

Now that's what I've found fascinating about some science fiction – how a different sensorium has resulted in a different form of consciousness as well. Not too many authors have really gone into depth on those terms (pun unintentional)but a few have. I've seen some CGI visualisations of how a…

Islander

Fri, 08 Apr 2011 23:17:18 +1200

O glory!
I have 2 ammonites & 7 trilobites in my desk shelf because I love spirals...I try to envision how those beings saw their oceanic world, and the best i can do is films of nautiloids – who can dwell in oceanic dark (for us) and hunt with eyes we…

Kracklite

Fri, 08 Apr 2011 23:08:59 +1200

Well, first to apologise, it's late and it's been a long week (marking a pile of assignments 13.5 centimetres thick has just been completed – yes I did measure it, – and then there's the smaller pile 1.8cm thick yet to be tackled, which is almost a relief... and perversely,…

dyan campbell

Fri, 08 Apr 2011 23:07:41 +1200

Hullo all – sorry for the threadjack, but can anyone out there tell me how (and why?) an incorrect business listing can be put up? Also, does anyone know how to get in touch with Loaded Web? Their reply thing doesn't work on their site. Could some IT genius out…

Islander

Fri, 08 Apr 2011 22:49:52 +1200

Many thanks for that!
Self & a couple of locals had seriously been considering whether anyone – except rats – ate donkeys. We truly appreciate your contribution.

Islander

Fri, 08 Apr 2011 22:45:21 +1200

We certainly can start a most interesting conversation about these matters- ready when you all are-

Kracklite

Fri, 08 Apr 2011 21:16:27 +1200

Indeed. All three intimate infinity – the ammonite, in describing a spiral, the shoe horn and umbrella in manifesting hyperboloids. Truly sublime.

Sacha

Fri, 08 Apr 2011 21:13:13 +1200

Ammonite. Shoe-horn. Umbrella.

that has promise

Kracklite

Fri, 08 Apr 2011 20:56:29 +1200

Or, you might consider this, in relation to Offspring of Little Dribble. However, I do disagree with:

..a pervasive pattern of disregard for, and violation of, the rights of others that begins in childhood or early adolescence and continues into adulthood

… as no evidence of adulthood has been presented.…

linger

Fri, 08 Apr 2011 20:34:55 +1200

On the other hand this, available to listen to until 13/04/11, is relevant.
(It has a little weather reference at the end, Sacha. :-)

Seriously: listen, and form your own conclusions.

Chris Waugh

Fri, 08 Apr 2011 20:31:53 +1200

An "ass burger" is more commonly known as a 驴肉火烧/lǘròuhuǒshāo, and is made of donkey meat stewed, chopped finely, and perhaps with a few herbs (cilantro being most common), put in a small bun similar to pita bread. It is a specialty of Hebei Province, and although the many small…

Kracklite

Fri, 08 Apr 2011 19:52:03 +1200

If it were asked in good faith, maybe – but it is not. What makes you think you deserve any consideration or respect? No, don't answer that, the surges of ennui are overwhelming as it is. It has nothing to do with the present discussion – I suggest that you…

linger

Fri, 08 Apr 2011 19:51:48 +1200

Nah, sorry, why would we do that in this thread?
Maybe you should try over on this one instead.

Sacha

Fri, 08 Apr 2011 19:49:39 +1200

how about that weather, then

Islander

Fri, 08 Apr 2011 19:24:25 +1200

O dear o dear o dear – Lil P in all his various incarnations is very well known – gak, is the only response from self-

recordari

Fri, 08 Apr 2011 19:21:22 +1200

And one of the most offensive. I suspect the baiter or his minions have gone fishing.

andrew llewellyn

Fri, 08 Apr 2011 19:15:09 +1200

OMG, I've been infrequent of late, but that Son of Little P post is the oddest I've ever seen here.

nzlemming

Fri, 08 Apr 2011 18:56:38 +1200

You're not from these parts, are you?

Emma Hart

Fri, 08 Apr 2011 11:32:16 +1200

viewing politics and society through the prism of your homosexual experience

Ooo, sparkly!

recordari

Fri, 08 Apr 2011 10:55:23 +1200

I like to think that it looked something like this.

I would say almost exactly like. They've all got no pants. What's that all about?

Sacha

Fri, 08 Apr 2011 10:34:48 +1200

here or tweer

now there's a nice phrase

Andre Alessi

Fri, 08 Apr 2011 10:31:37 +1200

That must have been one hell of a party.

I like to think that it looked something like this.

recordari

Fri, 08 Apr 2011 10:11:01 +1200

You said somewhere, here or tweer, that it was a blog you read so we don't have to. I'm taking you at your word and not reading it.

He was anti-Stalinist, but from a firmly socialist position with Trotskyist/Anarchist components.

That must have been one hell of a party.

Russell Brown

Fri, 08 Apr 2011 09:54:26 +1200

You’re free to say and think what ever you want of course, but don’t try and put across the idea that you’re some kind of white knight of objective commentary.

You know, Craig, I've never thought of you as that ... ;-)

Good job, really. It sounds like a terribly…

Kumara Republic

Fri, 08 Apr 2011 09:38:37 +1200

Craig, nothing you say on Palin has any weight. You hate Christians because you’re homosexual.

Redbaiter's aforementioned spout-out reminds me of the 'PC gone mad' urban myths that gathered legs in Britain, such as the Birmingham Winterval being a 'war on Xmas' when it was merely just a simple marketing…

Craig Ranapia

Fri, 08 Apr 2011 09:24:06 +1200

I read that as “You hate Christmas because you’re homosexual” and I was gearing myself up to agree with him. Everyone knows the gays hate seasonal interior decorating and drinking warm alcoholic drinks.

Heh... that's funny but seriously, how the hell do you rationally engage with someone who can't get…

Andre Alessi

Fri, 08 Apr 2011 09:04:35 +1200

You hate Christians because you’re homosexual.

I read that as "You hate Christmas because you're homosexual" and I was gearing myself up to agree with him. Everyone knows the gays hate seasonal interior decorating and drinking warm alcoholic drinks.

Matthew Poole

Fri, 08 Apr 2011 08:52:47 +1200

It also led to Gordon McLauchlan outing him in the Herald in the early 2000s

Ah, yes. The wailing and gnashing of teeth was wondrous to behold.

As for nicknames, Bedwetter originated from Usenet time, did it not?

Craig Ranapia

Fri, 08 Apr 2011 08:41:20 +1200

I discovered Redbaiter’s blog, TrueBlueNZ. I could comment there, but all I’d really be doing is trolling. And yet, it crowds with low-hanging fruit. Someone has to do some picking.

Please do, I gave up even trying to rationally engage with Master Baiter after crap like this:

Craig, nothing you…

Whoops

Fri, 08 Apr 2011 07:00:09 +1200

Wow, a quick google and lo... there's his article.

Redbaiter always strikes me as a smart but not quite as clever-as-he-thinks-he is fellow. Some deep frustrations there, but always good for a chuckle.

Lucy Stewart

Fri, 08 Apr 2011 06:46:59 +1200

If they're shouting and screaming crazy stuff like he's a non-citizen (and probably also that he's a muslim marxist macaroni man) it keeps them above the radar and makes the whole "opposition" look barmy.

I really think you're underestimating how seriously the barmy stuff is taken here. I mean, yes,…

glennd

Fri, 08 Apr 2011 05:21:50 +1200

Nah not a cunning plan, just a beneficial byproduct. If they're shouting and screaming crazy stuff like he's a non-citizen (and probably also that he's a muslim marxist macaroni man) it keeps them above the radar and makes the whole "opposition" look barmy. Tarred with the same brush and all…

Lucy Stewart

Fri, 08 Apr 2011 04:21:06 +1200

But as it is by not encouraging them to shut up he keeps them and others occupied.

But nothing Obama could do would encourage them to shut up. There is literally not one single piece of anything approaching evidence that he was born outside America, and yet they go on.…

glennd

Fri, 08 Apr 2011 03:39:57 +1200

Well, "playing them" in as much as they are there making a racket about something pretty loopy when they could be going on about something meaningful. If he did have his original certificate and put it out there or came out and said it was long lost then they'd lose…

Lucy Stewart

Fri, 08 Apr 2011 02:18:29 +1200

He'll be giving the appearance of being on-board perhaps, but I can't see he is dumb enough to be actually believing it. Theatre, he's playing a part for some possible role in the near future and maneuvering to flank Obama if needed.Both are playing the birthers for what they are…

glennd

Fri, 08 Apr 2011 00:01:57 +1200

Lucy Stewart

Thu, 07 Apr 2011 23:31:02 +1200

I doubt Trump actually believes Obama is a non-citizen, he’s too smart and canny to be a birther, but is playing the same game as Obama. Obama neatly keeps various nuts occupied looking for an “original” birth certificate that has no legal use, and might not exist any more anyway…

Biobbs

Thu, 07 Apr 2011 21:24:12 +1200

I recall when Redbaiter first popped up on Usenet back some time in the 1990s with posts in nz.general and nz.politics. His outstandingly nutty rants were actually quite refreshing at first, since Usenet was already in terminal decline back then and most of the posters were plainly drongoes. Redbaiter generally…

Kumara Republic

Thu, 07 Apr 2011 21:02:21 +1200

Ratings plummeted and the smarter bosses reversed it... but only just enough to get the ratings back up, of course. Now wait for readerships to fall. And the reaction? Why more layoffs, of course.

Or $43 million-dollar guarantees.

Rich of Observationz

Thu, 07 Apr 2011 20:50:01 +1200

the quote at the top of the redbaiter blog is from George Orwell

Well, after 1984 and Orwell's untimely death, he was packaged as an anti-communist proto-cold warrior. Which he of course never was. He was anti-Stalinist, but from a firmly socialist position with Trotskyist/Anarchist components.

But you wouldn't expect…

nzlemming

Thu, 07 Apr 2011 19:53:39 +1200

Well, that’s thee and me, then ;-) I think I first encountered Hard News on Usenet, when you used to post it for expats.

ETA And Steve makes 3 ;-)

glennd

Thu, 07 Apr 2011 19:53:06 +1200

Russell, to be fair to old Trump he did produce his birth certificate. But he produced the one actually issued at his birth, which ironically has no use in obtaining citizenry type things like a passport. He later produced the standard issue printout that can be used for such things.…

JLM

Thu, 07 Apr 2011 18:52:46 +1200

But seriously, where will newspapers get the stories that NZPA used to supply?

I wondered if there would be a niche for Radio New Zealand to onsell some of its news stories. The written versions on the website always look smart and to the point. Or do they get most…

Islander

Thu, 07 Apr 2011 18:47:56 +1200

Not in my opinion Rex: the “Timaru Herald” is the same mix as the other regionals- lots of local news, photographer/s/reporters at local events, plus whatever overseas links Fairfax is going to be offering them…which is why, I suppose (it is decades since I was a cardcarrying journo) the non-Fairfax…

Russell Brown

Thu, 07 Apr 2011 18:39:18 +1200

But surely so will the Timaru Herald and the Taranaki Daily news (both owned by Fairfax)? Even The Manawatu Standard, Marlborough Express, Nelson Mail, Waikato Times etc draw a lot of content from NZPA, unless things have changed since I last saw them.

I heard from someone at a regional…

Rex Widerstrom

Thu, 07 Apr 2011 18:36:35 +1200

Little local papers like the Oamaru Mail and the Greymouth Star will be starved to death

Steve Ballantyne

Thu, 07 Apr 2011 18:00:08 +1200

Islander

Thu, 07 Apr 2011 17:31:42 +1200

Well, Paul Madgwick is suggesting that the non-Fairfax papers will use whatever feeds APN uses, and is also suggesting that the new setup will be "more" like the the original NZPA – I assume that will be the local news info that each participating newspaper will contribute...

Robyn Gallagher

Thu, 07 Apr 2011 17:24:57 +1200

What I'm trying to figure out is where newspapers will get all the sorts of stories that used to come from NZPA.

I asked last night on Twitter and ended up with a whole bunch of comedians saying "from twitter!!!" or "they'll just print press releases!!!".

But seriously, where will…

Clint Fern

Thu, 07 Apr 2011 17:20:59 +1200

Bizarre that the quote at the top of the redbaiter blog is from George Orwell – is he unaware of The Road To Wigan Pier?

It'd as perverse as if you headed this blog with an Ayn Rand quote.

andrew llewellyn

Thu, 07 Apr 2011 17:06:50 +1200

And yet, I too, have wondered at times if he's some sort of cabal.

andrew llewellyn

Thu, 07 Apr 2011 17:03:34 +1200

The trolls do tend towards a certain sameness that renders them somewhat unmemorable individually.

Well I saw part of one of the quotes Russell uses quoted in comments at the DimPost today that immediately made me think "redbaiter". And lo, so it was. He's distinctive

Matthew Poole

Thu, 07 Apr 2011 16:51:11 +1200

I remember Usenet before Redbaiter.

I think I do, too, but I'm not entirely certain. The trolls do tend towards a certain sameness that renders them somewhat unmemorable individually.

Russell Brown

Thu, 07 Apr 2011 16:41:50 +1200

That electorate isn’t small, and the Democrats ignore it at their peril (see the 2004 and 2008 presidential elections, and the 2010 midterms.) No matter how crazy these people are, they will be voted for.

But they're also wildly vulnerable candidates, and the party hierarchy knows it.

When you look…

Russell Brown

Thu, 07 Apr 2011 16:33:35 +1200

I’m slowly convincing myself that the GOP doesn’t actually want to win; that they have moved on from politics being anything other than a fundraising exercise. That’s not to say that they will try not to win, only that if they do it will be incidental.

There may be something…

Andre Alessi

Thu, 07 Apr 2011 16:33:24 +1200

I don't know, I…

Russell Brown

Thu, 07 Apr 2011 16:30:44 +1200

I think he is real. The pseudonym dates back to Usenet and nz.general

ETA @MatthewPoole Snap! But less of the dinosaur, ye young whippersnapper!

I remember Usenet before Redbaiter.

Russell Brown

Thu, 07 Apr 2011 16:29:48 +1200

If I recall correctly, he showed up and got himself banned in quick order very early on in PAS’s history. Him and dad4justice.

I recall having to ban dad4justice, after his spate of heart-rending drunk commenting jags, but not Redbaiter. You may be right, though.

BenWilson

Thu, 07 Apr 2011 16:24:40 +1200

I'll say this for Redbaiter, his insults had a certain poetry about them. I often wondered if he said them out loud beforehand, just to sound-check them.

I'd be willing to bet, if you ever met him, and didn't know who he was, that he would seem like quite an…

Alex Coleman

Thu, 07 Apr 2011 16:18:57 +1200

As for Palin and Bachmann being “over already” I can but hope. Apart from Obama actually losing, my next biggest fear politically is Palin winning.

I'm slowly convincing myself that the GOP doesn't actually want to win; that they have moved on from politics being anything other than a fundraising…

Andre Alessi

Thu, 07 Apr 2011 16:18:45 +1200

Speaking of people who should be parody accounts but aren't, has anyone figured out why Tau Henare is still allowed to use Twitter? He's the New Zealand equivalent of 50 Cent, only with fewer No 1 singles to his name.

andrew llewellyn

Thu, 07 Apr 2011 16:13:07 +1200

Came across his blog for the first time today too, maybe the same way. I'm happy for you to write about it so I don't have to go there.

Ray Gilbert

Thu, 07 Apr 2011 16:08:42 +1200

with a section on its "About" page titled "Rooted in Minnesota,"

Nuff said

Andre Alessi

Thu, 07 Apr 2011 16:07:49 +1200

I don't care about Redbaiter's blog. I care that NZPA is closing.

I've found the response from many journalists regarding NZPA's closure to be pretty confusing, honestly. It sounds like a lot of people think this is the result of company politics, rather than any sort of economic decision. Surely…

BlairMacca

Thu, 07 Apr 2011 16:06:52 +1200

TV3 News led with the NZPA story, last night. Any ideas if TV1 even mentioned it ?

They did but it was further down the chain. Fairfax decided to print their own press release on it.... I guess what we will see is more press releases being printed in their…

Grant McDougall

Thu, 07 Apr 2011 15:54:04 +1200

TV3 News led with the NZPA story, last night. Any ideas if TV1 even mentioned it ?

As for Palin and Bachmann being "over already" I can but hope. Apart from Obama actually losing, my next biggest fear politically is Palin winning.

Christopher Dempsey

Thu, 07 Apr 2011 15:51:24 +1200

Personally speaking, Mr Redbaiter seems to me, personally speaking, a professional fourth former.

Kumara Republic

Thu, 07 Apr 2011 15:50:14 +1200

He's been doing it since long before blogs were the done thing. If "he" (assuming a singular male, rather than some kind of cabal) is a lefty, he's remarkably durable. Most people run out of steam after a few years of pretending to such vitriolic biliousness.

A bit like undercover…

BenWilson

Thu, 07 Apr 2011 15:40:28 +1200

My God! Part of the blogosphere I discovered before Russell! I found this site something like 6 months ago, had a bit of a chuckle, then felt mean and thought "Good on old Redbaiter, finally giving away full time trolling to make his own site". I think it will be…

nzlemming

Thu, 07 Apr 2011 15:39:19 +1200

He’s real?
I always assumed that he was a lefty running reductio ad absurdum commentary on Mr Farrar’s posts

I think he is real. The pseudonym dates back to Usenet and nz.general

ETA @MatthewPoole Snap! But less of the dinosaur, ye young whippersnapper!

nzlemming

Thu, 07 Apr 2011 15:37:34 +1200

Only the other day I came across the undeservedly-forgotton Bathroomgate, in which, six years ago, Michelle Bachmann ran screaming from a bathroom because two women tried to ask her a question. You really can't make any of this up

Ed Brayton's piece linked from that is gorgeous. Should Americans be…

Josh Addison

Thu, 07 Apr 2011 15:22:38 +1200

I wonder how long it will be until he turns up here.

If I recall correctly, he showed up and got himself banned in quick order very early on in PAS's history. Him and dad4justice.

Islander

Thu, 07 Apr 2011 14:53:04 +1200

The demise of NZPA will have much wider effects, & not just to people working for it.* Little local papers like the Oamaru Mail and the Greymouth Star will be starved to death – which I rather think is the Fairfax organisation's intent.

*One of my friends is a photojournalist of…

Matthew Poole

Thu, 07 Apr 2011 14:43:04 +1200

I always assumed that he was a lefty running reductio ad absurdum commentary on Mr Farrar’s posts

He's been doing it since long before blogs were the done thing. If "he" (assuming a singular male, rather than some kind of cabal) is a lefty, he's remarkably durable. Most people run…

Matthew Poole

Thu, 07 Apr 2011 14:40:57 +1200

So it's possible these days to access Redbaiter's insanity in one central web location, rather than having to ferret it out manually from blog comments? I feel old.

Once upon a time, those of us who're really old in intertube time (I'm probably roughly Jurassic, or maybe Triassic, but some…

Tom Semmens

Thu, 07 Apr 2011 14:35:22 +1200

It is quite hard to work out his actual politics.

I would have thought they were quite easy to work out? He is a BOMP – Bitter Old Man Party – supporter. I imagine there is a failed business or marriage in the mix as well – Redbaiter’s politics are…

Sam F

Thu, 07 Apr 2011 14:32:33 +1200

Perfect post for my almost-Friday – thanks, Russell.

So it's possible these days to access Redbaiter's insanity in one central web location, rather than having to ferret it out manually from blog comments? I feel old.

Also, having trouble registering the extent of my disappointment with the NZPA shutdown. I…

Leopold

Thu, 07 Apr 2011 14:16:16 +1200

He's real?
I always assumed that he was a lefty running reductio ad absurdum commentary on Mr Farrar's posts

Geoff Lealand

Thu, 07 Apr 2011 14:14:24 +1200

I always equate Redbaiter somehow with bedwetter

Jacqui Dunn

Thu, 07 Apr 2011 13:31:59 +1200

within days he was trying to teach me the error of his ways.

Ha ha!

HORansome

Thu, 07 Apr 2011 13:27:02 +1200

I wonder how long it will be until he turns up here. I mentioned him once and within days he was trying to teach me the error of his ways.

Rich of Observationz

Thu, 07 Apr 2011 13:00:54 +1200

his loathing of the nanny state was incompatible with his passionate love affair with the state of Singapore

That's easy. In imaginary-propertarian world, the rich (as happens in reality) get away with everything by virtue of their wealth. The proles get thrown in jail, as they deserve.

Robyn Gallagher

Thu, 07 Apr 2011 12:57:50 +1200

I don't care about Redbaiter's blog. I care that NZPA is closing.

Kumara Republic

Thu, 07 Apr 2011 12:54:48 +1200

If anything, Hong Kong is more libertarian in practice than Singapore.

Lucy Stewart

Thu, 07 Apr 2011 12:53:07 +1200

On one level it’s sad that a nation that has achieved so much has a political culture so deeply infected with The Stupid. But it really is some fun.

Only the other day I came across the undeservedly-forgotton Bathroomgate, in which, six years ago, Michelle Bachmann ran screaming from a…

Joshua Drummond

Thu, 07 Apr 2011 12:48:57 +1200

I think, like a lot of loony would-be pundits he defines himself entirely by what he opposes. He hates on a thing and is at pains to point out "Hey, that thing? The thing that I hate? I'm not like that at all. Not even a little. Nup. I'm the…

Russell Brown

Thu, 07 Apr 2011 12:40:41 +1200

I still think that Redbaiter is a troll account set up by a lefty :-P

It is quite hard to work out his actual politics. Sometimes he presents as a libertarian, but I spent ages once trying to point out to him that his loathing of the nanny state was…

Paul Rowe

Thu, 07 Apr 2011 12:39:30 +1200

Frankly I've not forgiven derp de derp for mentioning it at the Dim Post this morning, and now it's here too!

Aidan

Thu, 07 Apr 2011 12:33:02 +1200

Is there some subtle variation of Poe's law that applies to fundy christian nutbags and horrorcore clown rappers?

Maybe I need to have a lie down ...

MikeE

Thu, 07 Apr 2011 12:30:26 +1200

Then again, i'm also waiting for the time Redbaiter comes out of the closet.. theres so much pent up sexual frustration in his posts... and he's a little bit too obsessed with people's sexuality..

Emma Hart

Thu, 07 Apr 2011 12:24:42 +1200

Ridicule is the only weapon which can be used against unintelligible propositions. Ideas must be distinct before reason can act upon them

Thomas Jefferson says taking the piss is awesome.

Could you do NZConservative while you're there?

James Butler

Thu, 07 Apr 2011 12:21:44 +1200

Snap.

James Butler

Thu, 07 Apr 2011 12:21:30 +1200

I still think that Redbaiter is a troll account set up by a lefty :-P

I called Poe's Law on Redbaiter once, in a Kiwiblog thread where he claimed that the problems with road safety in New Zealand are all caused by drivers being a bunch of timid socialist poofters,…

Joshua Drummond

Thu, 07 Apr 2011 12:20:35 +1200

“Without a clear indication of the author’s intent, it is difficult or impossible to tell the difference between sincere extremism and the parody of extremism”

From the Wikipedia entry on Poe’s Law

I’m surprised Redbaiter (and Conservapedia) aren’t among the citations.

MikeE

Thu, 07 Apr 2011 12:12:13 +1200

I still think that Redbaiter is a troll account set up by a lefty :-P

Public Address

Thu, 07 Apr 2011 12:12:13 +1200

Discussion from blog post.