Public Address | Cafe | Hard News: Over the paywall?

Myles Thomas

Fri, 25 Jul 2014 00:31:55 +1200

How not workable? Levies exist throughout most industries without problem. Yes Netflix would be one of a small minority of websites who successfully operate paywalls, most of which sell exclusive video content. I'm referring to everything else.

Richard Grevers

Thu, 24 Jul 2014 12:36:02 +1200

must.read.rest.of.thread.before.replying

Richard Grevers

Thu, 24 Jul 2014 11:17:47 +1200

So there are very strong incentives to get up a story as fast as possible (ie with minimal subbing and checking) and then update it continuously. Once readers know a story will likely develop over the day they’ll keep refreshing.

The problem being (on Stuff, at least) that the way…

TracyMac

Wed, 23 Jul 2014 22:01:56 +1200

there are very strong incentives to get up a story as fast as possible... and then update it continuously. Once readers know a story will likely develop over the day they'll keep refreshing.

Really? The only story I'll refresh on is the kind that specifically says "live updates". If I…

Russell Brown

Wed, 23 Jul 2014 17:31:21 +1200

Well, here’s an interesting quote, from a source familiar with the story:

**REDACTED AND PARAPHRASED AT SOURCE'S REQUEST:

Basically, Fairfax had no intention of putting up a paywall but indicated otherwise as a feint to try and lure the Herald into doing so. They will be somewhat annoyed that this…

Russell Brown

Wed, 23 Jul 2014 11:38:19 +1200

Last night's show, where I revealed a bit more of what I've been told about the internal conversation at Fairfax.

Tom Semmens

Tue, 22 Jul 2014 14:55:55 +1200

Some of there more controversial articles seem to get plenty of attention from Public address commenters.

It’s opinion pieces are designed to troll, not inform. Sure, trolls are gonna troll but do i want to pay to read trolls? The flame wars are lot funnier on reddit. And why would…

Russell Brown

Tue, 22 Jul 2014 13:52:28 +1200

Their editorial and opinion writers often betray an astonishing ignorance of the facts.

The sad fact is, the quality of op-ed writing in New Zealand newspapers is generally very poor.

Personally, I would never subscribe to the Herald because but I would subscribe to a properly resourced Guardian NZ site…

Kumara Republic

Tue, 22 Jul 2014 13:21:36 +1200

It was possibly in the episode with the Donghua Liu bias controversy, or the 1 or 2 after.

James Green

Tue, 22 Jul 2014 13:15:03 +1200

There was a brief discussion about just that in a recent RNZ Media Watch podcast. Get it while it’s still online.

Which episode is it in?

linger

Tue, 22 Jul 2014 13:07:29 +1200

a recent RNZ Media Watch podcast. Get it while it’s still online
Eh? Have they started expiring their podcasts?

Kirk Alexander

Tue, 22 Jul 2014 12:59:51 +1200

Funny to hear the exact opposite argument to what I normally hear re wafer-thin ISP margins and highly profitable over-the-top operators like Netflix. Interesting... I don't think it is workable personally.

Kumara Republic

Tue, 22 Jul 2014 12:18:35 +1200

Actually, the Herald’s owners have got to be worried about the possibility of the Guardian Australia reaching across the Tasman and setting up a local bureau.

There was a brief discussion about just that in a recent RNZ Media Watch podcast. Get it while it's still online.

In the meantime,…

Stephen Judd

Tue, 22 Jul 2014 10:40:49 +1200

News sites are rewarded for being first, and they want repeat page views.

Tom Semmens

Tue, 22 Jul 2014 07:43:21 +1200

The Herald’s specific problem is it isn’t a very good newspaper in a globalised marketplace. It is, for all intents and purposes, a red top in disguise. The thing is, if I want a bit of Daily Mail in my life I don’t need the Herald because I have got…

SteveH

Mon, 21 Jul 2014 21:44:45 +1200

The staff posting those stories to the website can be very junior, under-skilled and overworked.
They might have to do something about that if they want people to pay.

Russell Brown

Mon, 21 Jul 2014 20:07:11 +1200

On the Herald online this morning they had the headline
“Tobacco giant vows to find $23b award”

and now I see it has been changed to “Tobacco giant vows to fight $23b award” but there is a big difference between those two. At times it looks like the content on…

Sacha

Mon, 21 Jul 2014 19:50:33 +1200

What they may pay for is something relevant that has been carefully, thoughtfully and competently composed.

Curation is valuable. How does it get rewarded economically?

Myles Thomas

Mon, 21 Jul 2014 18:32:44 +1200

What continues to bother me is that while the content creators struggle to monetise their work the distributors are rolling in it, just for connecting a few wires and superior marketing. I strongly believe govt should levy the ISPs and distribute that to content creators – stuff and nzherald included.

Hilary Stace

Mon, 21 Jul 2014 16:59:54 +1200

I compile content for a free disability-related e-newsletter and use a lot of links from Stuff and the Herald (also Scoop etc). I expect most readers would not pay for content, and many probably don't have access to newspapers at all. Where articles are behind a paywall or not on…

pohutukawa tree

Mon, 21 Jul 2014 16:56:36 +1200

Newspapers anywhere that have moved online in an effort to survive all face the same order of magnitude reduction in revenue, and what they do receive invariably needs to be shared with online partners.

Gone are the days where they owned the bridge between advertisers and news on the one…

Russell Brown

Mon, 21 Jul 2014 15:31:04 +1200

If, however, there was an inexpensive option that gave me Saturday and Sunday editions delivered to my letterbox, and e-access the rest of the time, I’d probably buy that even though I could get similar news for free via Stuff.

That's exactly what we get: the Herald on Friday, Saturday…

Mikaere Curtis

Mon, 21 Jul 2014 15:08:43 +1200

I was a solution architect for a short time on the Herald paywall project. The porous paywall model (where you get a certain number of free articles per month) is perhaps the most technically difficult to deliver. Page requests need to be intercepted and free articles/subscriptions/entitlements confirmed, all within a…

Russell Brown

Mon, 21 Jul 2014 15:05:33 +1200

Alex Clark of Victoria University got people’s attention at NetHui when he talked about his Masters project, ‘News, Renewed’:

PROJECT OVERVIEW

The news industry is struggling to survive in an online environment. In New Zealand, it has been estimated that for every $1 that is gained in online advertising each…

Jason Kemp

Mon, 21 Jul 2014 14:54:34 +1200

If the content is worth paying for I don't mind subscribing but the system has to actually work and be easy to use for both staff and readers.

On the Herald online this morning they had the headline
"Tobacco giant vows to find $23b award"

and now I see it…

william blake

Mon, 21 Jul 2014 14:51:18 +1200

Praps the NZ Harold will go to pay wall once the national are safely reelected. :(

kiwicmc

Mon, 21 Jul 2014 14:23:52 +1200

I'm a print subscriber to the Sydney Morning Herald and get access to the semi-paywalled website as part of that. I usually never bother because even though the SMH is a far superior print newspaper to the NZ Herald, its web site is a hopeless mess compared to the NZ…

Tom Semmens

Mon, 21 Jul 2014 14:08:34 +1200

I find it extremely depressing how many ostensibly serious news sites are aping the "You won't believe what happens when..." relentless click bait trivia approach of Buzzfeed.

This is just how the internet rolls.

It doesn't mean that serious news doesn't get a look in – take a look at…

Rich of Observationz

Mon, 21 Jul 2014 13:40:46 +1200

Has any paywall ever succeeded on non-professional content?

(The FT and Wall St Journal have charged for their content since forever (late 80's?) but they have a large pool of people (over a million) that need to see it for their work).

Richard Grevers

Mon, 21 Jul 2014 13:29:31 +1200

Paywalls imply a significant vendor-lock-in. I'm in Taranaki, so the Herald misses a lot of relavant news for me, but there are times it way outperforms stuff on breaking stories. But I'm not going to pay for both. (And I'm certainly not prepared to pay for stuff based on the…

Sacha

Mon, 21 Jul 2014 13:28:17 +1200

there had to be substantial new content

yes, how’s that data journalism going for them? I recall Mr Currie was keen on school league tables, etc.

Russell Brown

Mon, 21 Jul 2014 13:22:08 +1200

This is why paywalls tend to mostly fail, unless your producing content of a high enough quality, most people won’t pay for it.

I know they've been very aware of this fact at the Herald. I'm not sure of where they're at with it, but Jeremy Rees told me a…

Brodie Davis

Mon, 21 Jul 2014 13:16:28 +1200

But if they make you pay for access, don't they then have to provide quality content?

HAHAHA sorry I couldn't help myself. This is why paywalls tend to mostly fail, unless your producing content of a high enough quality, most people won't pay for it.

Russell Brown

Mon, 21 Jul 2014 13:12:00 +1200

I read that as a minimum of AUD$14.5 million p.a, without counting advertising income. Is that really unsustainable? Or is that a reflection of having to maintain hard copy (capital equipment, marginal costs of printing) as well as a digital presence (which I see as mostly cost of content)?

I…

Russell Brown

Mon, 21 Jul 2014 13:10:22 +1200

As well as the endless "Ten things you need to know about..." mashups which are scattered throughout Stuff and the Herald these days.

Junior staff are required to come up with ideas for those as part of their jobs.

Otoh, the most compelling Twitter reports from the MH17 site over…

Alfie

Mon, 21 Jul 2014 12:48:28 +1200

Paywalls aren't working for the Australian and although it's difficult to obtain accurate figures, it doesn't seem to be working for the Times in London either. The "ten free stories a month" model operated by the Telegraph and others is very easy to bypass once you realise that it's cookie-based.…

Fooman

Mon, 21 Jul 2014 12:29:33 +1200

Mitchell formerly helped run the metered news paywall at Murdoch paper The Australian, which starts at $4 a week for web and app access and moves up through various print subscription bundles. The paper was an early mover but currently still has only 70,000 subscribers, which isn’t sustainable.

I read…

Rob Stowell

Mon, 21 Jul 2014 12:15:37 +1200

I find it extremely depressing how many ostensibly serious news sites are aping the “You won’t believe what happens when…"
It is depressing. And it’s turned on itself, to the point where ‘you won’t believe what happens next!’ is translated by the brain as ‘you don’t want to waste your…

Russell Brown

Mon, 21 Jul 2014 11:52:55 +1200

rein in its paywall plans*

D'oh! Shame!

It didn't even occur to me I'd typed that :-)

Nik Dirga

Mon, 21 Jul 2014 11:20:37 +1200

I find it extremely depressing how many ostensibly serious news sites are aping the "You won't believe what happens when..." relentless click bait trivia approach of Buzzfeed. There IS a place for that sort of thing, but it devalues the brand when used without restraint.

TracyMac

Mon, 21 Jul 2014 11:19:29 +1200

rein in its paywall plans*

(Sorry for the grammar nitpick – the idiom relates to runaway horses, not Her Maj)

Russell Brown

Mon, 21 Jul 2014 10:59:23 +1200

Does that involve detailed user tracking?

Yes.

Sacha

Mon, 21 Jul 2014 10:56:47 +1200

the eyeballs-and-data-capture strategy of Daily Mail and Buzzfeed

Does that involve detailed user tracking?

Public Address

Mon, 21 Jul 2014 10:56:46 +1200

Discussion from blog post.