Public Address | Cafe | Hard News: Media3: We have much to discuss

Kumara Republic

Mon, 17 Jun 2013 18:05:10 +1200

John Drinnan calls bailout (again). One's mileage may vary.

Russell Brown

Mon, 17 Jun 2013 14:01:21 +1200

attempted offhand humour…
shan’t try it again.

Ah. I see :-)

Ian Dalziel

Mon, 17 Jun 2013 13:48:17 +1200

attempted offhand humour...
shan't try it again.

Russell Brown

Mon, 17 Jun 2013 13:11:42 +1200

Steven Joyce just got out in time, eh?

In 2001, when he sold Radioworks to Canwest?

Rich of Observationz

Mon, 17 Jun 2013 12:30:55 +1200

Obviously the $40mln bailout from the taxpayer wasn't enough.

They seem to be using this as an
opportunity to opt out of tax and pay "suppliers" (for which read overpaid "talent" and management) ahead of other creditors. Which I thought was illegal?

Ian Dalziel

Mon, 17 Jun 2013 09:03:27 +1200

Mediaworks in receivership – holy shite!

Steven Joyce just got out in time, eh?

tussock

Fri, 07 Jun 2013 22:02:50 +1200

Witches, eh. You'll know 'em when you see 'em. All out to eat your children they are. Horrible. Don't wait 'till the kids are in the pot, just watch for the signs; black cats, night walks, unmarried women, don't attend church, said anything bad about the witchfinder, denied the danger…

BenWilson

Thu, 06 Jun 2013 18:20:11 +1200

Seriously, what the hell does that mean?

Yes, it's a crap standard. I suspect it comes down to whether they think people will wank off over it. But the pleasure release from watching extreme graphic violence is somehow less disturbing? I don't get it.

BenWilson

Thu, 06 Jun 2013 18:05:07 +1200

Possessing copies within New Zealand might still be, so they’d have to try to get around that somehow…

Does having it on MySky count as possessing a copy?

Graeme Edgeler

Thu, 06 Jun 2013 12:29:34 +1200

If Spartacus started showing underage sex, though, I expect they would not get away with it. Sexual violence is constantly depicted, gratuitously, though. It’s pretty near the line already.

Actually, they might. The censorship legislation doesn't cover broadcasting. It would be a breach of broadcasting standards, but wouldn't be a…

Craig Ranapia

Thu, 06 Jun 2013 08:44:16 +1200

Yes, presumably underage sex can be depicted, just as sexual violence can be, so long as the presentation is in a way that is not designed to tittivate.

Seriously, what the hell does that mean? Arthur Everard got slagged off from both the left and right for being an excessively…

BenWilson

Wed, 05 Jun 2013 17:23:46 +1200

What would protect any production of R+J that went further down the Zeffirelli line would be the view that it was primarily artistic rather than pornographic

Yes, presumably underage sex can be depicted, just as sexual violence can be, so long as the presentation is in a way that is…

Sacha

Wed, 05 Jun 2013 17:08:13 +1200

only 13

Middle-aged at the time, then

Sacha

Wed, 05 Jun 2013 17:07:47 +1200

link whoring

please do

Tommy Honey

Wed, 05 Jun 2013 16:23:48 +1200

Olivia Hussey was 15 when she appeared as Juliet in Zeffirelli's version – still the best, but illegal to take out of the video shop now? Or watch it (heaven forbid) at a high school?

Emma Hart

Wed, 05 Jun 2013 10:30:17 +1200

What's scary is that this proposal would make it illegal to produce an explicit version where the leads simply look under 18, regardless of their actual age.

No. It increases the penalty, but this is already the law.

Our laws ban material that encourages the sexual exploitation of children. If…

Matthew Poole

Wed, 05 Jun 2013 07:17:38 +1200

How many versions of Romeo and Juliet have there been? She was only 13.

And anyone who tried to produce an explicit version that wasn't the written word would have to find an actor and actress who were at least 18 in order to not be breaking the (current) law.…

Stephen Doyle

Tue, 04 Jun 2013 18:16:29 +1200

How many versions of Romeo and Juliet have there been? She was only 13.

Euan Mason

Tue, 04 Jun 2013 16:17:58 +1200

Ok. Missed the Maori Council's response, and also Metiria Turei's. They have abandoned the moral high ground.

Euan Mason

Tue, 04 Jun 2013 16:11:10 +1200

"But do the lefties who wanted Al Nisbet’s unpleasant, unfunny newspaper cartoons put down with the full force of law have any moral high ground of their own here?"

I must have missed that. Who called for an actual prosecution of Al Nisbet? Sure the cartoons were unhelpful, borderline racist…

Stewart

Tue, 04 Jun 2013 12:55:33 +1200

That link about Metiria Turei seems to be mis-represented. She's only asking that the Race Relations Conciliator do some investigating which is not the same as 'demanding prosecution'.
(Apologies if I have missed something in my quick once-through of the linked post.)

The Ruminator

Tue, 04 Jun 2013 11:49:39 +1200

We just put up a piece on the Al Nisbet thing. It's tricky, because yes free speech is a thing, but then also so is not being a dick. And I think the "not being a dick" line was crossed – the cartoonist was free to draw whatever cartoon he…

Rich of Observationz

Tue, 04 Jun 2013 11:02:04 +1200

I know that, but given that all our mass-media owners *are* foreign, it's easier to attack foreign right-wing monopolists than just right-wing monopolists.

BenWilson

Tue, 04 Jun 2013 10:18:03 +1200

Who’s got jurisdiction on that one? A successful attempt would render most prosecutors unavailable.

Probably depends on the planet. For some uncharted tiny nowhere planet it might just be a small claims court thing. But to take out something like Earth it's really important to go through the proper channels.…

Matthew Poole

Tue, 04 Jun 2013 09:40:01 +1200

under 16

Under 18, surely? Legal to have sex at 16, but cannot legally be depicted sexually until 18.

Karen Adams

Tue, 04 Jun 2013 08:46:52 +1200

Well hopefully it also includes those horrendously distasteful images shown on "reality" tv, with people who have just been in accidents showing their boobs half out when they are clearly in a dazed state and unable to hold an objecting arm in the face of the camera.

Matthew Poole

Tue, 04 Jun 2013 07:39:25 +1200

heinous crimes ... planetary destruction
Who's got jurisdiction on that one? A successful attempt would render most prosecutors unavailable.

Stephen Judd

Tue, 04 Jun 2013 07:35:45 +1200

The Rich Man's Crumbs.

Craig Ranapia

Tue, 04 Jun 2013 06:49:04 +1200

It should also be noted that the 'child' only has to look like they're under 16. This also applies to cartoon fantasy characters – fairies, centaurs, dragons, etc, who look like they might be minors.

So, would now be a good time to hide the season one Game of Thrones…

Craig Ranapia

Tue, 04 Jun 2013 06:31:35 +1200

What I object to is that a foreign multinational is able to operate monopoly newspapers that, as a matter of policy, encourage the proletards and toryscum in their worst prejudices

*sigh* Yeah, Rich, because New Zealand media was so thoroughly enlightened when it was being run by local media oligarchs…

TracyMac

Mon, 03 Jun 2013 23:35:04 +1200

One of the more disgusting examples I've seen of child porn was a drawing. A very representational, albeit 19th Century, drawing. Hiding behind "it's just a cartoon!" isn't quite good enough. (It's very much a hot-button for me.)

It's a tough one, but my feeling is that if the figure…

Chris Waugh

Mon, 03 Jun 2013 23:14:17 +1200

Ah, yes, thanks Emma. Couldn't remember where I'd read about it, turns out one place was right here.

Stephen Judd

Mon, 03 Jun 2013 18:13:48 +1200

Alex Coleman (@shakingstick) had a rather good series of tweets a few days ago, provoked by a recent Listener editorial, suggesting that the current "gotcha" mode of political journalism exemplified by Gower and co was actually a consequence of the slick media management now practised by modern parties — that…

Russell Brown

Mon, 03 Jun 2013 17:24:51 +1200

Um, which lefties exactly? What I’ve been hearing is people saying the cartoons were unpleasant and unfunny – not that they should be censored, and particularly not that they should be “put down with the full force of law”.

I was thinking of Te Ururoa Favell and the Maori Council,…

Emma Hart

Mon, 03 Jun 2013 17:13:04 +1200

Didn't Australia recently have that problem, trying to ban explicit images of females under a certain bra size in case they were minors?

A while back, but yes. And the law is the same here.

Chris Waugh

Mon, 03 Jun 2013 17:05:42 +1200

Presumably one can spot an underage dragon by its small breasts?

Didn't Australia recently have that problem, trying to ban explicit images of females under a certain bra size in case they were minors? Plenty of adult women have small breasts.

Ewan Morris

Mon, 03 Jun 2013 17:05:09 +1200

But do the lefties who wanted Al Nisbet’s unpleasant, unfunny newspaper cartoons put down with the full force of law have any moral high ground of their own here?
Um, which lefties exactly? What I've been hearing is people saying the cartoons were unpleasant and unfunny – not that they…

BenWilson

Mon, 03 Jun 2013 16:54:56 +1200

And I’d be madder about the ‘penalty for distribution worse than penalty for commission’ if it wasn’t already illegal to distribute images of things it’s perfectly legal to do.

Also, bizarrely, there's a great many things we're not allowed to do, heinous crimes, for which depiction is so normalized as…

BenWilson

Mon, 03 Jun 2013 16:41:49 +1200

This also applies to cartoon fantasy characters – fairies, centaurs, dragons, etc, who look like they might be minors.

Presumably one can spot an underage dragon by its small breasts?

ETA: But for boy dragons? Presumably if the penis is less than 10 feet long it's underage?

Emma Hart

Mon, 03 Jun 2013 16:20:55 +1200

From I/S:

As the RIS points out, the proposal to increase penalties creates a perverse situation whereby making or distributing indecent material carries a higher penalty than the physical crime it depicts. For example, performing an indecent act with a child under 12 currently carries a penalty of 10 years…

Sacha

Mon, 03 Jun 2013 14:27:39 +1200

I agree with this informed take from Local Board member Julie Fairey about Council's communication failures (cross-posted on the old thread).

My sense is that the large level of interest, and the misleading approach taken by some, just was not anticipated by the team working on the draft, who are…

Rich of Observationz

Mon, 03 Jun 2013 12:10:23 +1200

do the lefties who wanted Al Nisbet's unpleasant, unfunny newspaper cartoons put down with the full force of law

Who?

What I object to is that a foreign multinational is able to operate monopoly newspapers that, as a matter of policy, encourage the proletards and toryscum in their worst prejudices…

Matthew Poole

Mon, 03 Jun 2013 11:32:00 +1200

Orsman should be interesting. The man has been leading Granny's fact-free, ratings-driven charge against the DUP, willingly assisted by Roughan. They make an interesting (and depressing) contrast with Fran O'S's much more sensible take on things.

Chris Waugh

Mon, 03 Jun 2013 10:54:02 +1200

Judith Collins seems to have learned really well on her trip to China last year. Frame it as going after something nobody disagrees with, but phrase it to cover a wide variety of stuff you might want prefer wasn't out there, classic CCP move. Yes, we do need to keep…

Public Address

Mon, 03 Jun 2013 10:54:02 +1200

Discussion from blog post.