Now that the ARC has made it a…

I suspect the quick, easy flow of passengers is more valuable to them than carparking...

Indeed. Passengers spend money inside the terminal, which generates revenue. The more passengers, the better.
Plus, if it's easier to get to AIAL it reduces pressure for another airport in the region. That means no…

I'm sure it has nothing to do with the influential airport company making over 30 million dollars every year from carparking fees.

Probably less than you'd think, actually. If they can build on some of the carparking space they can get both rents and percentages of turnover. AIAL's income from…

I'm sure it has nothing to do with the influential airport company making over 30 million dollars every year from carparking fees.

Clearly I don't think about this enough with my 5 minute walking commute, bloody parking earnings hadn't occurred to me.

I'm sure some more interesting use for the…

Anyway, I actually think that we're jumping the gun on the need for another harbour crossing. I have read the traffic assessments for the Victoria Park Tunnel project and they…

Re the Island. Nice to see it has been called that before!! And the transport blog is A1.

but I just can't see what you're thinking

I see the northern parts of Fanklin including the south edge of the Manukau turing into burbs some time in…

Where is Auckland going to expand?

Joshua unearthed a 1946 map of Auckland showing a southeast to northwest network design which would have driven housing and industrial development accordingly.

You can see the Southdown-Avondale rail corridor that is about to be turned into the Mt Roskill-Waterview motorway. The CBD rail…

I'd use a train to the airport every damn time. It'd make our visitors much happier too. Frankly I think it's bizarre that a line isn't already in.

I'm sure it has nothing to do with the influential airport company making over 30 million dollars every year from carparking fees.

It might be absurd. but it might not be either.....in time. I look forward to other options. There aren't too many left though. Look outside of the box.

Of course it's absurd. The number of people who want to go North of Auckland without travelling through Auckland for the odd…

Auckland is a bloody funny shape. Stretched a long way north along a coastline, and through a relatively narrow isthmus funnelling out to the south and east while to the west it wraps around two harbours.

Unusual, but not radically so. Sydney is at least somewhat comparable geographically, being sandwiched…

Yamis: have you see "Auckland, City of cars?"

It debunks the population density and the cost arguments pretty well, I think.

I'm just playing devils advocate to an extent. I think light rail should be developed along the middle of the northern and northwestern motorways at least but I…

It might be absurd. but it might not be either.....in time. I look forward to other options. There aren't too many left though. Look outside of the box.

I didn't mean to sound rude, honest, but I just can't see what you're thinking. No one is going fund a phenomenally…

Just like around Wgtn Harbour. From Petone to Oriental bay, try getting to the shoreline and paddling in the sea. Motorway, rail line, ferry, wharfs, Event Centre, Te Papa, Overseas Terminal,

Like in Auckland, these obstructions were constructed in the first half of the century. There is no chance of…

1955 rejecting the railway system around Auckland in favour of motorways. Absurd.
Rejecting Robbies Light rail. Absurd.
Expanding Auckland both North and South without rail corridors in place by ANY of the councils. Absurd.
Isolating the CBD from the rest of the universe as above. Absurd.…

How about this one? Simple, elegant. 200 ft at highest point, so navy boats can chug under, and the bridge has a massive curve – don't have to have a straight one.

Sigh. I know......It is more the line of a "Love Hate" relationships but.

And an outside perspective is useful at times – but someone who hates something should never be put in a position of advice around it. Hence Rodney Hide being a poor choice for Local Govt Minister.

I never joke Russell :-)

As I said. Out of left field.

Oh, okay then. In that case, it's an idea for which the word "absurd" is inadequate. An idea that could only be seriously voiced by someone whose familiarity with the proposed route is based on looking at a…

I didn't say a full-on munter. I said subnormally intelligent.

Sigh ... this is fairly adolescent. Get a grip, please.

Someone who for all intents and purposes seems normal but is only a fraction away from being classed as handicapped.

And that's just offensive. Behave like a grown-up or I'll…

I hate the place.

Word, Ross. Anyone who likes it is either subnormally intelligent, wilfully blind or hasn't travelled much.

Trolling.

I read an article recently on the psychology of self-depection.

Is self-depection turning yourself into an 80's New Wave electronic act?

Wow. I know I'm not the last, so trying to work out which of the first two I must be?

Probably wilful blindness. I read an article recently on the psychology of self-depection. It was really interesting.

Do I now have to make a joke about a priori conceptions of…

Then I'm sure you'll understand when we suggest you aren't the sorta person we want to tell us how to sort out the place. Which we actually kinda like.

Sigh. I know......It is more the line of a "Love Hate" relationships but.

PS Where the hell WOULD be Big Key…

I hate the place. Word, Ross. Anyone who likes it is either subnormally intelligent, wilfully blind or hasn't travelled much.

Yikes! I really like the place and I don't live there. Excuse me whilst I wipe the drool from the corner of my mouth, pick up my white cane and…

Anyone who likes it is either subnormally intelligent, wilfully blind or hasn't travelled much.

Oh good gravy. Do I now have to make a joke about a priori conceptions of what a city should be like?

Which we actually kinda like.

Anyone who likes it is either subnormally intelligent, wilfully blind or hasn't travelled much.

Wow. I know I'm not the last, so trying to work out which of the first two I must be?

I hate the place.

Word, Ross. Anyone who likes it is either subnormally intelligent, wilfully blind or hasn't travelled much.

I've said it before, and I'll say it again, we have to have a discussion, as a country, about whether we want to be a country with high levels of…

What would a new bridge be actually for? (i.e.what the current bridge can't provide already)

Well, for one thing the current bridge can't provide anything more than an aerial nuisance and a pathway for light (think bicycles and motorcycles) vehicles in the long-term. Structures like that have a finite life,…

I hate the place

Then I'm sure you'll understand when we suggest you aren't the sorta person we want to tell us how to sort out the place. Which we actually kinda like.

I'm assuming you're joking.

I never joke Russell :-)

As I said. Out of left field.

But I'm sorry to keep harping on about it since I recall these conversations in an earlier piece. But I cannot help think that the vast amounts destined for more motorways could be spent…

Depends if Labour can get the message through

Currently I don't have much faith in labour to get much of a message through. Flailing, badly.

or even a life-size Lego© or Meccano© bridge, or one made from recycled ice-cream sticks or matchsticks... kiwiana…

Not at 60% according to the latest polling. Every Auckland voter who voted national in the last election could swap over and they'd still be able to form the government.

But if the multitudes of lemmings in Epsom (regretfully the electorate of my residence) were to turn their backs on…

you should vote for us because we saved you from higher taxes.

Which ties into this editorial in this morning's Granny. True courage would be admitting that the only way to avoid saddling the next two generations with exorbitant debt is to reverse the tax cuts. That would take real guts,…

It debunks the population density and the cost arguments pretty well, I think.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sCKDBHT3i74

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9QYNpS7SI7k

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LO3d13EOfRI

I'm also never sure why roads and bridges now cost so many billions. They didn't in my parents day (they must be making the pilings out of gold...).

Do other cities in the world not have cars on their roads?

Yes but not as many per capita. Auckland has the population of Copehangen with the traffic problems of Los Angeles. It's insane.

And I don't buy the population size argument at all. Lots of smaller cities have good…

Gio, they were all out of industrial-size metaphorical blenders when I went into Hardly Normal the other day, so I had to make do with the household-size variety from Blond and Blond.

And who told you that puns are my kryptonite?

I doubt it. For about 2/3 of the population, the only way the government could go wrong electorally would be to throw too much money at Auckland.

Ah, but Kyle, 1/3 of the population is a voting bloc that's perfectly capable of tossing the inestimable Messrs Key and Hide out…

I could have sworn there's a fair few in all the international cities I've been to including ones with rather extensive subway and bus networks.

Auckland will be a hundred years away from the type of public transport…

I'm really hoping that it's Auckland transport that'll be the hammer that knocks the gloss off National's honeymoon, but I'm beyond holding my breath about the electorate's ability to digest and be outraged about any information that doesn't affirm Key's messianic status.

I doubt it. For about 2/3 of the…

I heard some stunning approval rating figure cited on Natradio yesterday for Our John. 60%? But I can't think of anything the bugger's done to deserve it.

Bread & circuses.

Kath & Kim.

It would/could take a few Westies as well in the process!!

Oi! Also: hmph.

Oh yes!

And yes, can we let the brainstorming session continue a bit longer before howling down the idea?

I was kind of thinking that too.

And yes, can we let the brainstorming session continue a bit longer before howling down the idea? It's obvious that the current bridge is inadequate,…

sniggernui

ooh I like that

Ditto. A more refined variation on a PAS standard.

PS...looking at the map it is not such a stupid idea though....is it?

I'm assuming you're joking.

Ummmm...convince me why you guys want another bridge that has one end slightly shifted a bit north and the south end closer to the city??? Madness from down here.

Here's one from left field for you. Since the super city is…

I'm beyond holding my breath about the electorate's ability to digest and be outraged about any information that doesn't affirm Key's messianic status.

I heard some stunning approval rating figure cited on Natradio yesterday for Our John. 60%? But I can't think of anything the bugger's done to deserve it.…

I'm really hoping that it's Auckland transport that'll be the hammer that knocks the gloss off National's honeymoon

To mix that metaphor any further I think you'd need some sort of industrial appliance.

I'm really hoping that it's Auckland transport that'll be the hammer…

You do put your finger on a crucial point – much transport design is very narrow-focussed, for example looking at shoving bypasses through without considering either alternatives or the overall urban pattern and habitation – as Prenderghastly did here in Wellington.

Is this a peculiarly NZ thing, or is it…

You do put your finger on a crucial point – much transport design is very narrow-focussed, for example looking at shoving bypasses through without considering either alternatives or the overall urban…

Why get rid of the present bridge? It is not falling down.

Yet. Metal fatigue.

How much difference would it make if the clip-ons could be removed, and automotive traffic routed through a tunnel? Is the gradient on the current bridge within the capabilities of a rail solution?
Just thinking…

6) Why get rid of the present bridge? It is not falling down.

Yet. Metal fatigue.

As a yachty I'm pretty sure there would be some opposition to a bridge…

Did any of the architects, steel merchants or soldiers backing this ever stop to consider the harbour itself? For the last hundred years Aucklanders have been "reclaiming"…

How about a Badger then?. I can see it now

Earworm, eyeworm. Damn you.

I'd like to see a moratorium on structures that look like sails in Auckland, as well as a ban on buildings that look like boats. It is time to grow up.

How about a Badger then?. I can see it now badger badger badger Snaaaaaake badger badger badger
;-)

Anyhow, how could a bridge look like sails? Bridges are horizontal, sails vertical.

Depends how well you sail. :)

The rush is something he created, with the urgent need to get the plan built by the centenary of ANZAC.

Paul, I mean the first time around. A few years back.

the Vic Park tunnel. If we could get it to dive under the city as soon as possible (presumedly not on Tank Farm but hopefully?)

Probably too late given that work on the Vic tunnel starts quite soon. I remember something in one Wynyard proposal about the spine park running…

Simpson thinks you can start with a vision, get lots of people to believe in it and then everything will be alright.
...
I am sure Jasmax spent a very productive lunchbreak on this one, but the fact is they are not bridge builders.

Did Simpson describe the rushed early…

As far as the bridge height goes, my hazy recollection of the datum…

I'm just very wary of "here we go again…

Paul, I wish your #6 were true without reservations. Like the rest of our roading network it's heavy trucks that are the problem.

Bridge engineer Virlogeux (ta for link) seems…

4) The world's best bridge builder says it is crap

Well the world's best bridge builder actually said "definitely build a new bridge but at first glance that initial concept doesn't seem to be the right one". So he's all for the project, but believes you need to get the…

1) Where does all the traffic go? Eight lanes heading straight for the heart of the city – what happens next?

2) Eight lanes of…

For once, I want what Dubai's got.

Little known fact: it doubles as the world's largest harp.

Much like David Fisher's dynamic tower, I'll believe that particular piece of Dubai infrastructure when I see it.

Millau is a bit stiff for the harbour in my opinion, but I like it where it is. Something that responds to its setting would be ideal.

However, that current plan does come at a cost of around $3.7-$4.1 billion. Ouch.

Pfft, doesn't Joyce run up a billion dollars of promises a week anyway? A harbour crossing or two is at most a month's work for a man of such energy. ;-)

When it comes to roads,…

it would be damn difficult to get a railway line from Britomart up to the bridge. I'm thinking that at a 1:50 grade the line would have to be rising for about 1.5km to get from 8m below ground level to 20m above ground level.

I think the plan for…

1) It would result in the current Harbour Bridge being removed. While it sure isn't perfect, it is an icon for Auckland I must say the city would feel pretty strange without it.…

Manage the traffic with a variable congestion charge (like air fares). On busy days, the charge goes up to whatever level makes people get out of their cars and…

Just why must all infrastructure be around an event?

I'd think St Mary's Bay residents would be stoked to no longer have a motorway at the bottom of the cliff, and an elegant span to look at. The residents of Lighter Quay might not be so happy

Lighter Quay people definitely not happy! But don’t underestimate the St Mary's…

This will take lots of space, and I don’t see the costs for buying up all the land needed in those numbers, or pictures showing what it would look like.

Presumably, December 3 will be the day for that — but I can't see there'd too much of a problem…