Public Address | Cafe | Hard News: Behind Baltimore

John Farrell

Thu, 07 May 2015 17:02:01 +1200

Surely that would be lob your lollies?

Steve Rowe

Thu, 07 May 2015 16:18:31 +1200

On a tangent, having viewed this video exactly one time, Youtube and Google seem to have decided many days later that I'm still absolutely interested in viewing CIA conspiracy videos, and not much else.

Thanks.

No problem – if you police your own mind then the thought police will be…

linger

Wed, 06 May 2015 22:52:43 +1200

Clear your cookiesMy mum'd think that had something to do with an ant infestation, and would be left vaguely wondering if she should toss her lollies as well...

Ian Dalziel

Wed, 06 May 2015 21:37:50 +1200

Clear your cookies
Hurl your url?

Katharine Moody

Wed, 06 May 2015 21:13:22 +1200

While the U.S. government loves to target and imprison small time so-called “money launderers” such Bitcoin pioneer Charlie Shrem, the real money launderers, the ones who help drug cartels and pump criminally sourced money into foreign real estate thus pricing out domestic populations worldwide, face no consequences whatsoever.

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-05-04/how-chinese-oligarchs-used-fake-trade-invoices-launder-almost-1-trillion-globally

John Farrell

Wed, 06 May 2015 19:37:25 +1200

Clear your cookies.

Ian Dalziel

Wed, 06 May 2015 19:01:56 +1200

Google seem to have decided many days later that I’m still absolutely interested in viewing CIA conspiracy videos
a coupla searches and trips to DIY
and fishing videos or sites should fix that...
but yes it has gone down on your permanent record!
:- (

Mike O'Connell

Wed, 06 May 2015 15:35:03 +1200

I find it fascinating that the Australian handwringing over the recent executions of two of its citizens in Indonesia doesn’t seem to allow them to also address the failed war on drugs. I would have thought that it would be impossible to separate these things.

In the Press today, [[http://www.stuff.co.nz/dominion-post/comment/68270005/the-indonesian-case-for-executing-for-drug-traffickers…

izogi

Wed, 06 May 2015 14:39:54 +1200

Thanks.

Steve Rowe

Mon, 04 May 2015 20:06:47 +1200

Farken scary – Keiser did a show recently on how algorithmic bots were fixing the money markets too. We actually are living the AI future now...

nzlemming

Mon, 04 May 2015 17:49:01 +1200

The list is the result of a proprietary predictive policing algorithm that likely crunches numbers on parole status, arrests, social networks, and proximity to violent crime.

Faaark! That story was supposed to be a warning, not a recipe.

Ian Dalziel

Mon, 04 May 2015 16:29:57 +1200

a total cluster-fuck.

like this:
Public services are becoming increasingly algorithmic, a reality that has spawned hyperbolic comparisons to RoboCop and Minority Report, enforcement droids and pre-cogs. But the future of high-tech policymaking looks less like science fiction and more like Google’s PageRank algorithm.
For example, according to the __Chicago…

linger

Mon, 04 May 2015 13:28:38 +1200

Or possibly a total cluster bomb.
Fucked up in all directions, anyway.

nzlemming

Mon, 04 May 2015 13:26:33 +1200

historically a total cluster in the US

Possibly you meant a total cluster-fuck.

Matthew Poole

Mon, 04 May 2015 12:29:01 +1200

There was an article in the NZ Herald recently (which I can't find online – searching for "police" or "US police" produces 100s of results) which made this point.

There are over 80 thousand statutory governance entities in the US, most of which are municipality or county structures that maintain…

Steve Rowe

Sun, 03 May 2015 14:23:57 +1200

I like Max Keiser's take on economic issues – I have never seen him get as angry as this as he talks about Baltimore. "Lynching by proxy".

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sBEaPjP7_IY

Graham Dunster

Sat, 02 May 2015 09:03:23 +1200

I find it fascinating that the Australian handwringing over the recent executions of two of its citizens in Indonesia doesn't seem to allow them to also address the failed war on drugs. I would have thought that it would be impossible to separate these things.

Michael Savidge

Fri, 01 May 2015 15:09:11 +1200

David Simon (The Wire) shares his thoughts on it all here.

Kumara Republic

Fri, 01 May 2015 13:26:09 +1200

It is quite clearly a Holocaust in slow motion – and some believe, and give evidence of, a deliberate policy of introducing drugs into poor communities to both profit the CIA and destabilise those communities. Of course with private prisons you need “customers” so what better pathway than the “war…

Ian Dalziel

Fri, 01 May 2015 13:16:20 +1200

playing at cops and robbers…
One of the criticisms of US police is many of the smaller police forces only require 12 weeks training (less for part timers)
Part timers like the rich play-policeman who ‘accidentally’ used his gun instead of his taser, killing a man the other week –…

Felix_felix

Fri, 01 May 2015 12:47:49 +1200

Yes but not only that: the police in the US are not operating in the same frame as those in NZ. The split between US and UK happened before the good Sir Robert Peel developed his principles for an ethical police force. While what we've got is not anywhere near…

Rich of Observationz

Fri, 01 May 2015 12:40:36 +1200

I think it's more about attitude than spending weeks at college?

It varies also what newly qualified cops are expected to do. I think UK police aren't allowed to drive a police car straight away, and they certainly aren't taught firearms unless they join a special unit (with aptitude tests).

izogi

Fri, 01 May 2015 12:27:27 +1200

I don't know enough to really understand how much training is the right amount, but is 'number of weeks' necessarily a great metric for comparing and measuring?

Looking at the recruitment site for the NZ Police, it seems to be 18 weeks at Police College but they also seem to…

Tom Semmens

Fri, 01 May 2015 11:50:31 +1200

One of the criticisms of US police is many of the smaller police forces only require 12 weeks training (less for part timers), with the maximum anywhere being 20 weeks. I am surprised at how little training our police receive – NZ police officers only get 19 weeks training and…

nzlemming

Fri, 01 May 2015 10:50:52 +1200

The Secret Service has been taken over by Homeland Security. It was founded in 1865 primarily to deal with the then endemic counterfeiting of currency and didn’t take on presidential protection until 1902.

Good point. I forgot about that.

nzlemming

Fri, 01 May 2015 10:47:39 +1200

The Great Game never went away…

They didn't even revise the rules.

Rich of Observationz

Fri, 01 May 2015 10:34:46 +1200

The Secret Service has been taken over by Homeland Security. It was founded in 1865 primarily to deal with the then endemic counterfeiting of currency and didn't take on presidential protection until 1902.

The FBI (1908/1935) and CIA(1947) came later.

Steve Rowe

Fri, 01 May 2015 10:04:33 +1200

Absolutely, the State is complicit in the destruction of African American poor urban communities. Then you get Fox News going into Baltimore and saying "oh look they are looting Liquor stores! They have no interest in protest they are just thugs!". It's like someone beating and abusing a dog and…

Ian Dalziel

Fri, 01 May 2015 09:46:59 +1200

a deliberate policy of introducing drugs into poor communities to both profit the CIA and destabilise those communities
It worked quite well for the British using opium to destabilise China...
see:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_opium_in_China

The Great Game never went away...

Steve Rowe

Fri, 01 May 2015 09:34:02 +1200

the war on drugs is like 'the Holocaust in slow motion'.

Mike O'Connell

Fri, 01 May 2015 07:34:17 +1200

Having been offline a couple of days, there's much to digest here. In watching the trailer for The House I Live In, the sound bite comment that struck me was that the war on drugs is like 'the Holocaust in slow motion'.

nzlemming

Thu, 30 Apr 2015 23:40:53 +1200

such as the treasury dept (which I understand is formally part of the secret service,

Actually, the Secret Service is formally part of the Treasury. Was first formed to deal with counterfeiters and is still the lead agency on that and wire fraud. Protecting the President is a side job…

Steve Rowe

Thu, 30 Apr 2015 22:41:30 +1200

How long before the US becomes a failed state, I wonder;

We are certainly seeing it unravel before our eyes. With the militarisation of the Police it is essentially at war with its citizens.

And journalists... https://www.youtube.com/watch?t=138&v=DVcoeI2YiF0

Some eloquent pushback to Geraldo from Fox News https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UTcJwYVHi6w

Finally Jon Stewart's take…

Rich Lock

Thu, 30 Apr 2015 20:47:15 +1200

every district or city has its own police force, i.e. there is no US Police Force (other than the FBI of course)

There are city/metropolitan police departments in the major cities, separate sherrif's departments in smaller towns, which are separate to but interact with the state police departments outside the…

izogi

Thu, 30 Apr 2015 15:25:10 +1200

What an enlightning handling of the interview for this guy with Wolf Blitzer.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NyYdKD0af78

As referenced by Stuff.

Russell Brown

Thu, 30 Apr 2015 15:01:55 +1200

Key stats about Freddie Gray’s Baltimore neighbourhood:

52% unemployment ...

Katharine Moody

Thu, 30 Apr 2015 14:55:40 +1200

Just received this in my FB feed re-posted by my sister-in-law back home;

https://www.facebook.com/ThePoliticalInsider/photos/a.498948690140557.1073741825.112723252096438/875835885785167/?type=1&theatre

I get this sort of stuff in my feed regularly given I've got lots of family there. I say nothing – as the brainwashing is just too complete.

How long before the US becomes a failed…

Bart Janssen

Thu, 30 Apr 2015 14:37:38 +1200

officers receive performance

One of the strongest arguments against running public services as businesses, particularly services that have specific social aims that have nothing to do with money.

Katharine Moody

Thu, 30 Apr 2015 14:34:26 +1200

The film touches on it, but the New Yorker's staggering 2013 story is the go-to.

That was a hard read – excruciating in fact. And I'm not a victim of the injustice .. it just boggles the mind to think how many of these victims still remain patriotic to 'the…

BenWilson

Thu, 30 Apr 2015 14:08:23 +1200

Considering that the spinal damage is Gray's only injury I find it extremely hard to believe it was not caused during the arrest. If he had been thrown around in the van, there would have been some bruising. The lack of such bruising is suspiciously like the spinal injuries that…

Matthew Goody

Thu, 30 Apr 2015 13:42:51 +1200

It still seems to me that the drug war is the major component of all the American judicial gimmickry

For certain. Also essential in fostering a situation where African Americans cannot find work, are deprived of education and are totally barred from participating in the political system.

Key stats about…

Russell Brown

Thu, 30 Apr 2015 13:10:23 +1200

As I understand it, you are right there – and each local police force is funded by property taxes in the main, I believe.

Crazily, the revenue gap is increasingly being filled by police use of civil forfeiture. Police forces can basically stop people and take their money and possessions…

James W

Thu, 30 Apr 2015 13:08:23 +1200

Mic.com has a good explainer article up here, including this passage which punched me in the gut:

A 43-year-old man was arrested for public urination…

He was handcuffed and placed in a transport van in good health. He emerged a quadriplegic.

Before he died, he complained to his doctor…

Craig Ranapia

Thu, 30 Apr 2015 13:06:08 +1200

Don’t, One News. Just don’t.

Rioting now just ‘a ploy to entertain violence’, ‘loot’, says Baltimore-based Kiwi

Russell Brown

Thu, 30 Apr 2015 13:00:52 +1200

Personally think David Simon is way off in his commentary. While the arguments for decriminalizing drugs are persuasive overall, to suggest that ending the war on drugs and getting back to ‘real policing’ will somehow provide the antidote to the poverty, racism and police brutality in Baltimore doesn’t really address…

Tamara

Thu, 30 Apr 2015 12:54:14 +1200

This interview about Johann Hari's book was fascinating. Racism is at the root of the "war on drugs".

http://www.radionz.co.nz/national/programmes/sunday/audio/20171890/the-war-on-drugs-johann-hari

Katharine Moody

Thu, 30 Apr 2015 12:43:23 +1200

there is no US Police Force

As I understand it, you are right there – and each local police force is funded by property taxes in the main, I believe. So, terms of employment are likely to differ – but the sentencing regime is determined federally – hence the judiciary…

Howard Edwards

Thu, 30 Apr 2015 12:36:15 +1200

As pointed out in the documentary, the structure of pay in the US Police Force is such that officers receive performance pay based on the number of arrests they make

I didn't see the documentary (thanks for the pointers to where I can get it online) but I thought that…

Kumara Republic

Thu, 30 Apr 2015 12:19:57 +1200

Civil rights lawyer Michelle Alexander theorises that the War on Drugs is "the New Jim Crow".

Ian Dalziel

Thu, 30 Apr 2015 12:14:49 +1200

This doesn't help either:
Former Philly Cop, Jeffrey Walker, held little back Tuesday as he confessed to the jurors about his disgraceful past. He let them know about how he and his fellow officers set people up, planted drugs, stole money, lied on reports, and violently assaulted people — too…

Russell Brown

Thu, 30 Apr 2015 12:14:26 +1200

Personally think David Simon is way off in his commentary.

I did think he got lost in describing "The Code" in this week's interview. But in the film he makes the point that in Baltimore the arrest rate for drug offences has doubled over time and the arrest for murder…

Brent Jackson

Thu, 30 Apr 2015 12:09:55 +1200

As pointed out in the documentary, the structure of pay in the US Police Force is such that officers receive performance pay based on the number of arrests they make.

That's a bat-shit crazy KPI ! Surely you don't want more people arrested – you want less crime. The KPI…

TracyMac

Thu, 30 Apr 2015 12:05:19 +1200

The Divide by Matt Tabibi, is an interesting look at the two-gear law enforcement system in the US at present – one law for the rich (and mostly white) and another for the poor.

Number of people criminally prosecuted for GFC- precipitating shenanigans – 0. Number of people being prosecuted…

Matthew Goody

Thu, 30 Apr 2015 12:03:20 +1200

Personally think David Simon is way off in his commentary. While the arguments for decriminalizing drugs are persuasive overall, to suggest that ending the war on drugs and getting back to 'real policing' will somehow provide the antidote to the poverty, racism and police brutality in Baltimore doesn't really address…

Katharine Moody

Thu, 30 Apr 2015 11:57:02 +1200

That's one of the most compelling parts of the film, I think.

Compelling? Not the word I'd use .. abhorrent is more appropriate. I was very taken aback by the stats regards rates of imprisonment which compared Russia, China and the US. How could the land of liberty have come…

Ross Bell

Thu, 30 Apr 2015 11:48:34 +1200

We interviewed "the real Omar" a while back. In his words “Until we come together as a people and say enough is enough, everything that’s happening is going to continue.”

Steve Curtis

Thu, 30 Apr 2015 11:39:23 +1200

Recently , a US Border guard shot and killed a mexican boy who was standing across the Rio Grande on the mexican side..There isnt any legal redress.
This wasnt a one off but part of a recent pattern

You can even see US courts action with regard Kim Dotcom,…

Russell Brown

Thu, 30 Apr 2015 11:13:30 +1200

As pointed out in the documentary, the structure of pay in the US Police Force is such that officers receive performance pay based on the number of arrests they make. So they persecute poor neighbourhoods to boost their own take home pay. In other words, it PAYS to be doing…

Russell Brown

Thu, 30 Apr 2015 11:11:47 +1200

aaand – thats what you get for not reading to the bottom – doh

The thought is appreciated :-)

fraser munro

Thu, 30 Apr 2015 10:54:58 +1200

aaand – thats what you get for not reading to the bottom – doh

fraser munro

Thu, 30 Apr 2015 10:53:53 +1200

was at leigh sawmill several new years back – at midnight a parade of loved up punters, (mostly young women), kept hugging (and kissing) the two police men present, you could tell they were quite happy with their evenings assignment :-)

fraser munro

Thu, 30 Apr 2015 10:50:48 +1200

apologies if linked already (quick skimming this from work

the house i live in – http://www.maoritelevision.com/tv/shows/tuesday-festival-documentaries/S01E001/house-i-live

played on maori tv a couple of days back – highly recommended

Katharine Moody

Thu, 30 Apr 2015 10:48:51 +1200

Compliance vs. community policing, I guess.

More to do with incentives, I’d say.

Russell Brown

Thu, 30 Apr 2015 10:42:29 +1200

Whereas in this country usually the main danger to a young policeman at music festivals is getting kissed by to many *ahem* "exuberant" young women.

The forbearance of young policemen in these situations is often a heartwarming spectacle.

Tom Semmens

Thu, 30 Apr 2015 10:28:00 +1200

It is only with slight hyperbole that I can say that in my observation a young policeman at a US music festivals is like an isolated and dangerous island, that the crowd carefully parts to avoid. Whereas in this country usually the main danger to a young policeman at music…

Public Address

Thu, 30 Apr 2015 10:28:00 +1200

Discussion from blog post.