by doing smart stuff we can improve NZ’s economy at the same time as reducing emissions.

I'd emphasise too that the cost of taking action to reduce net…

Couple of thoughts on global warming and it's consequences for NZ.

Skipping any questions about its reality because enough evidence now exists that it is probable if not certain.…

Ozzies not returning the tailings to the ground & so the radioactive dust is spreading & so will the deaths etc.

http://greensmps.org.au/webfm_send/141

http://www.sea-us.org.au/roxby/ps-sapubinq.html#1.1

Other parts of NZ should be ruled on a colonial basis, with limited autonomy to decide on garbage collection and parking rules.

Auckland has a job for you. From where you are now, if you like – it's the traditional way.

Incidentally, I can confirm that the low-low group that ChrisW noted before ALL had a noticeably lower turnout at the…

Yes. We have brains.

Apparently only 35.9% of you :P

The informal votes (spoilt) seem to have gotten a fair bit of coverage given they were under 10,000.

There must be something special about this electorate?

Yes. We have brains.

I actually feel that only the electors of Wellington Central should be allowed to vote on anything. Other parts of NZ should be ruled on a colonial basis, with limited autonomy to decide on garbage collection and parking…

The proportionate Yes-vote and overall turnout are negatively correlated, very strongly so for the most part. So 'high' turnout low Yes, and low turnout 'high' Yes, and it's much more than just the…

Regarding the referendum, firstly, it was a loaded and misleading question.

Secondly, 90% of 54% is 48%, which is not a majority.

Thirdly, it's sad that 48% of NZers are predicate child abusers. I think on that basis, it's ok to pick out random mainstream looking people, ask them how…

I just hope this story doesn't make the Oddly Enough circuit of the world's newspapers.

a concentrated burst of innumeracy, functional illiteracy and plain making shit up.

New Zealanders have overwhelmingly voted for the anti-smacking law to be canned.

That's contradicted by the actual story that links to, which says:

Almost 90 percent of people who participated ...
there was a 54 percent voter turnout.

Secondly, 90% of 54% is 48%, which is not a majority.

Thirdly, it's sad that 48% of NZers are predicate child abusers. I think on that basis, it's ok to pick out random mainstream looking people, ask them how…

the operation in Grenada didn't go all that well.

Indeed, it was a bit of a military fiasco from beginning to end, and came rather closer to defeat than admitted at the time. Notoriously they had to rely on tourist maps, which made the golf courses easy to find but…

Sending 10,000 heavily armed troops to an island that has a population of 100,000 is hardly a war, it is more of "a flagrant violation of international law"

Only if you market it wrong. Which America does tend to do.

Sorry Steve,

No worries, I pulled that "fact" out of my ass. I was surprised to find out how true it was. :)
Referendum result,
I wonder how many voted NO because saying yes felt like you were agreeing with the smackwits?

US 1, Grenada nil

Sorry Steve, was just a bit of hit and run smartarsery, doesn't bear too much analysis.
Although the question, "Has the US won any of its ill-conceived wars since 1945? does have a passing resemblance to "Should a smack as part of good parental correction ..."…

When the United States invaded Grenada in 1983, it did not permit the media near the place during the critical first 2 days, and…

US 1, Grenada nil

I think Grenada was quite well conceived, if "easy win" is your goal.

Iraq, Vietnam, Afghanistan, Korea, not so much.

Tell me exactly what "disruption" would go down if Hide handed in his ministerial warrant.

But what would Aucklanders do, Craig, without Rodney to guide them? What would they DO?

(I think actually the argument might be that if Hide flounces off it will lead to drama and delays and…

I am not being cryptic, though I may be assuming some wider knowledge of similar discussions here, which you have been…

One thing that struck me about the wingnuts gnashing their teeth about Obama and all that he does and their totally batshit crazy fixation with his birth certificate, is the fact that they seem to get all their opinions from a media mogul that hails from Australia. Murdoch became a…

No wonder the US has lost every one of its ill conceived wars since WW2.

US 1, Grenada nil

As for coming along and posting every now and again, and then disappearing for a while, I don’t have an interest in many of the topics, and I don't have the time to post that many of you apparently do!!

And there was I thinking it was you who posted…

It's different of course, but Helen Clark took New Zealand to war in Afghanistan in the knowledge that it would split the Alliance, and then used the opportunity to declare an early election (despite having the confidence of the House).

George, that might be something you genuinely believe but absent…

http://www.thedailyshow.com/watch/wed-august-19-2009/fox-news--the-new-liberals

FFS, disruption to real Aucklanders, not some beltway political process. Lift your eyes, man.

Tell me exactly what "disruption" would go down if Hide handed in his ministerial warrant. Can you do that without pissing yourself?

The other thing that many of the opponents are doing is deliberately conflating anger towards the bailouts (passed under Bush) towards the general public's desire for proper health reform.

Erm, just to clarify something here, what I'm saying is that the GOP talking points seem to suggest the public's anger…

As usual Craig valiantly grasps the wrong end of any stick that's going. Rodney is threatening disruption if he stays, not if he goes.

Well, might have been nice if you'd said that at the time because, as usual, my mind-reading skills are kind of crap. And how exactly is…

That doesn't mean he will succeed but I still believe Rodney out of any portfoliios would be a good thing for this country. Feel free to…

I wonder if members of the public are concerned about the healthcare proposals because they're believing the unreconstructed falsehoods being circulated by a lot of unscrupulous pharmaceutical companies and their bought-and-paid-for lackeys in the Congress and Senate? (Aided and abetted by a news media apparently incapable of doing some basic…

I have wondered from time to time; what the many frequent posters do for jobs, because whatever they do apparently allows them a lot of time for non-work related activities!!

James: I pay my bills with the sweat of my own brow, and how I do it (or how long…

http://twitter.com/blonderaider21

Feel free to discuss the semiotic, religious and political madness.

http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/current_events/healthcare/august_2009/voters_skeptical_about_health_care_reform_claims_made_by_pelosi_and_hoyer

Article describing how Obama got himself into the pickle he is now in. Not very skillful one has to say.

http://money.cnn.com/2009/08/20/news/economy/obama_health_care_miscalculate.fortune/index.htm?postversion=2009082009

__In other words, no matter what legislative package…

One is a Minister threatening significant disruption to many.

Really? I'm sure this is going to wound a few politician's egos, but I don't recall the ship of state grinding to a halt on the occasions Helen re-shuffled, stood down, or "reluctantly accepted the resignations" (aka flat out sacked) Ministers.…

It's different of course, but Helen Clark took New Zealand to war in Afghanistan in the knowledge that it would split the Alliance, and then used the opportunity to declare an early election (despite having the confidence of the House).

Fair point- I was thinking about that as soon as…

I don't remember Anderton behaving like this in his ministerial roles during the fifth Labour Government.

It's different of course, but Helen Clark took New Zealand to war in Afghanistan in the knowledge that it would split the Alliance, and then used the opportunity to declare an early election (despite…

I got that — but if you want to throw that kind of snark around, it can be turned around. What is keeping Anderton and his meta-fictional party in Parliament besides a little over four thousand folks in Wigram?

True, but it's the way that Hide's willing to risk his…

@Craig. I think you will find that Sofie was referring to Mr Hide, he used to be Mr 3% but it would appear he has lost two thirds of his supporters. Cool.

I got that — but if you want to throw that kind of snark around, it can be…

Financial pain is probably the only thing that would make Fox News reel him in.

Based on the figures that were on the Daily Show last night, Fox is probably feeling OK about things financially at the moment. CNN is apparently burning however.

And could we at least get rid of Mr 1% from Auckland?

When did Jim Anderton move back to Auckland, Sofie?

Financial pain is probably the only thing that would make Fox News reel him in.

And for those who can't get enough of Obamacare-related crazy, the Wall Street Journal is now printing very bad science fiction on the op-ed page. Jesus, there are days I miss being un-medicated..

Meanwhile, the Onion's latest report, Congress Deadlocked Over How To Not Provide Health Care seems to…

Godwin's Law leaps from the internet into a townhall debate.

And she dropped her Nazi reference so casually. I liked how Franks called her for what she was.

Yesterday's most totally batshit award, however, may have gone to the woman who shouted "Heil Hitler!" at a Jewish man praising Israel's…

Godwin's Law leaps from the internet into a townhall debate.

I'm really not sure what to say about that, um, column ...

That it makes Ayn Rand at her most wooden and didactic look like Chekhov?

And for those who can't get enough of Obamacare-related crazy, the Wall Street Journal is now printing very bad science fiction on the op-ed page. Jesus, there are days I miss being un-medicated..

I'm really not sure what to say about that, um, column ...

You might not see it this way, but I see the binary nothing or all approach as a journalistic construct. In my experience, journalists glaze over…

I see a lot of people pulled over, but I believe the offence they have usually committed is Driving While Brown.

Poor old Russell eh?
Anypoo, Cellphone shmellphone. Any half decent phone these days has a built in mp3 player and some even have a wireless (radio for you young…

I don't doubt that, in cars, hands-free is safer than not, but ...

But that's just it. Research shows that (contrary to common sense), hands-free is not any safer than hand held phones.

People try to argue with this, stating that surely hands-free talking is just like talking…

But I doubt I'd ever get stopped anyway – pulling people over seldom seems to happen any more, unless you're really asking for it. The cops are either too busy or too lazy.

[splutter] Not where I've been driving, mate. I know I do a lot of long distance stuff…

In this part of the world I'd just be happy if they could stop people from txting on a motorbike whilst riding with three children and a dog in the fast lane.

Ha! excellent :)

I'd always had the idea Objectivist philosophy was bunk but I didn't realise they needed to invent their own logic to not prove their point with.

As an objectivist (small ' o ') I always assumed (even though I hadn't read much of Rand's philosophy) that I had a similar…

Can't see how you can lay all the dumbosity on AGS.

LOL. I can, but there may be subjective, personal-history reasons for that ...

I'm not sure what the point of doing research into the risks of using cell phones when driving if it's not to affect public policy.

But, OTOH, how many common rooms would turn into a sea of erect hackles at the very idea that their research should be guided by…

But I doubt I'd ever get stopped anyway – pulling people over seldom seems to happen any more, unless you're really asking for it. The cops are either too busy or too lazy.

Whereabouts are you? I've seen 4 pulled over (probably for speeding) in the last 2 days. Two…

When compound adjectives attack! Just to clarify the clarification: I wasn't referring so much to the schools themselves as the teachers, and pointing out the fact that they all had Grammar connections. Is all.

And I was more concerned by how much they'd both be improved by ball gags and…

Incestuous bunch, those self-consciously 'elite-school' teachers.

Just to clarify, Kelston Boys may have a good rugby team, but it's not regarded as an "elite school". (sorry if this offends any Kelston Old Boys)

When compound adjectives attack! Just to clarify the clarification: I wasn't referring so much to the schools…

Sofie, you may need to remind your therapist of his homeland's sterling treatment of its own minorities.

Nah, his comparisons are his way of trying to understand the country he, his wife and kids have chosen to call home and the reasons he left China are obvious to him (pollution…

"Mr Theobald has received a letter from human resources head Patrick Crawford.
In it, Mr Crawford said: "Information has come to my attention which indicates that you may have intentionally driven a car through Inland Revenue's Christchurch building ... I am concerned that your conduct may be inconsistent with the…

I don't doubt that, in cars, hands-free is safer than not

One of the reasons why psychology research often gets bagged for testing the apparently obvious, is that it's surprisingly how often the 'obvious' is not true. I gave some instances of why this might not be true above (and…

Hence the pragmatic decision to restrict in-car use to hands-free.

In this part of the world I'd just be happy if they could stop people from txting on a motorbike whilst riding with three children and a dog in the fast lane.

Perhaps a little less Fox TV of an evening would be a step in the right direction.

But that's James..wanders on here every now and then, toddles out a few Fox talking points as fact, has them fairly sharply shot down by anyone who's turned the dial one notch further…

There's a lot of bitching that goes on PAS about science and academics not getting coverage for their research and the implications it should have for policy, in the media. Until a newspaper covers an academic doing that very thing and then people attack that. WTF?

Kyle: I had no…

he's asking that he and his research determine the policy and law, much more than inform it

Umm, I'm pretty sure I didn't say it was his research, and I don't think he claimed it was his either. And I'm sure the journalist played no role in leading you to…

Kyle, you seem to be assuming that all cell-phone users will convert to hands-free in their cars. Is that a valid assumption? (Happy to concede that it might get an 80% uptake.)

Oh yes indeed.

But what you're saying is "by making using a cell phone slightly more inconvenient, they…

If you want them, I can't see that you shouldn't be allowed them if you're prepared to pay. If you don't let rich folks get some advantages from all their cash, they get uppity.

Damn right — they were going to take that solid platinum bed pan out of my…

This is the vision of a Mactional party health care.

The private sector takes the cream from the top. The sour difficult nasty stuff at the bottom is picked up by the state – they have the resources.

Seems to work OK. The private care does give you a little…

"Mr Theobald has received a letter from human resources head Patrick Crawford.
In it, Mr Crawford said: "Information has come to my attention which indicates that you may have intentionally driven a car through Inland Revenue's Christchurch building…

That doesn't mean that you can't look sideways at weird contracting practices.

Certainly doesn't, and I'm sorry if I gave you that impression. But over on Kiwiblog (where else?), some hapless troll certainly picked the wrong time — about three weeks before the BH's by-pass — to go on a…

Not exactly, he's asking that he and his research determine the policy and law, much more than inform it. It seems he can only imagine Government either ignoring his research, or doing his bidding.

He's pointing out that as far as his research goes, the change won't improve the situation.…

You know something, that's an argument we can have until the sun grows cold. But I still have no problem sleeping that my partner's by-pass was performed in the private sector. Really — and I don't know how fair or useful a term like "rort" is.

I don't think anyone…

Krugman made a useful (ie: not batshit insane) comparison between other systems and what's actually being proposed by Obama:

Hey, I'm still waiting for a Birthing tea-bagger to stand up and say this filthy nest of government-run 'socialized medicine' needs to be rooted up and destroyed.

Actually, I think his point is that that makes banning the use of non-handsfree headsets tokenism, but tokenism that looks good.

And that's an argument Professor O'Hare is quite entitled to make, but I have a funny feeling that what he calls a "cop-out" Stephen Joyce might well describe as…

In this country, the Massachusetts health reform more or less follows the Swiss model; costs are running higher than expected, but the reform has greatly reduced the number of uninsured. And the…

Don't you think it's rather odd that in all countries with a national or socialised health system, there is no great outcry over the fact the nanny state clearly has it's jackboot on our throats?

I don't see all that many people marching down Whitehall chanting: 'give us fully…

But trying to get anything done required permission from the…

If you work for Company X doing Job A you can't work for Company Y and do job A. It's a clear conflict.

Say what? I do it all the time. It's called contracting. Occasionally it's been for the government, but they're just another client.

A ban on use of hands-free cell-phones while driving would be about as enforceable as a ban on thinking of sex while driving.

Actually, I think his point is that that makes banning the use of non-handsfree headsets tokenism, but tokenism that looks good.

I think Russell would call that earning a living. :)

I also don't think preventing specialists from earning good money is a wise way to go about preventing the flood overseas of experienced medical staff. A necessary evil, perhaps?

I think Russell would call that earning a living. :)

Heh.

If you work for Company X doing Job A you can't work for Company Y and do job A. It's a clear conflict.

I think Russell would call that earning a living. :)

If you work for Company X doing Job A you can't work for Company…

Basically American healthcare fixes up rich people better than most and older people are richer than young people.

And even if you're richer than God — and have insurance to match — that won't stop your insurance company trying to finger fuck you.

In February 2001, King filed a lawsuit…

FWIW, our family's experience of the New Zealand health system in recent years has been stellar, and that includes a series of breast cancer procedures and a comprehensive follow-up process that still continues.

I must say my own family's experiences of the public health system have been good ones. It…

America is the Afghanistan of the Western world: That's to say, it has a slightly higher infant-mortality rate than other developed nations (there are reasons for that which I'll discuss in an upcoming column). That figure depresses our overall "life expectancy…

My Godmother in Chch got a cancerous lump on her chest, had to wait over 6 months to see a specialist by which time the cancer was inoperable, so now she is on palliative care waiting to die.

If your GrandMother and her cirumstances as described by you are real…

FWIW, our family's experience of the New Zealand health system in recent years has been stellar, and that includes a series of breast cancer procedures and a comprehensive follow-up process that still continues.

And while my experience in the public health system has been not quite so stellar (but not…

Maori and general treatment of them is one area that perplexes him.

Sofie, you may need to remind your therapist of his homeland's sterling treatment of its own minorities.

Like Uyghurs. Especially talkative ones like Rebiya Kadeer. Maori Television don't seem to have trouble joining the dots.

Read an article a while back

Great reference.
Anyway I had a look. Its all corporate hype so far, no independent analysis. Its great that reactors that small can be made, for all the space travel our descendants will want to embark on.

Still 5 years away apparently from predicted…

No thank you very much, you can keep your national health nonsense and I and the 70 or 80% of Americans who are happy with their healthcare will have healthcare when we need it.

From Pew, this month:

59% of Americans believe their healthcare is average or below average compared…

Joe,
No I am not misinformed or a scoundrel. This happened to her. As I understand it there are waiting lists for most heart related procedures, so why would a waiting list for anything else be a surprise? Go to the UK, Canada etc, it is all the same.

Sure…

$22k for a pregancy is not anything like normal.

It's not standard (see the article) but shouldn't be possible.

but the biggest positive technological change for the environment and our lives will be safe small local nuclear power stations, if the environmentalists let it happen!!

The environmentalists won't shoot it down. The bean counters will.

malpractice litigation

The threat of which looms so largely over the heads of doctors that the USA's caesarean rate in some hospitals is nearly 50%. Since we're talking about birthing babies, and whatnot.

single digit thousands of which we paid about $1000 out of pocket

And that's a good deal, in your mind? Awesomesauce.

Even the free-market godfather Miltion Friedman once pointed out:

Health insurance premiums increased 78 percent since 2000, compared to wages increasing 20 percent, while over the same time period employers…

I slipped a disk in NZ, I waited weeks and weeks to see a specialist, and then was told that there was a 6 week waiting list to get a lumbar punch at Wellington Public

The hell? A lumbar puncture isn't standard treatment for a disc injury, it's a test…

Joe,
No I am not misinformed or a scoundrel. This happened to her. As I understand it there are waiting lists for most heart related…

Well the topic has never come up here has it? Not that I have seen anyway.…

In fact the govt has probably spent far more on her care since she became inoperable than they would have spent if they had operated immediately.

I repeat – lack of early intervention causes such problems, you should be raising the issue of your relative's GP's competence, rather than twisting…

When you have politicians, bureaucrats and unions involved, as you do in most national health systems, how can the consumer get a good deal? They are last on the pecking order.

Let me rephrase that;
When you have Accountants, Salesmen and Shareholders involved, as you do in the USl health…

No thank you very much, you can keep your national health nonsense and I and the 70 or 80% of Americans who are happy with their healthcare will have healthcare when we need it.

NZers can get private care too. They just don't have to. Your Godmother, if she is…

I thought a lumbar punch was the same as an epidural injection. Apparently not. Big deal Steve.

Danielle, that medical bankruptcy number is wrong by a mile.

OK, sure, whatever. I think the key point is not the number of bankruptcies (isn't *one* too many?), but the proportion of people who were supposedly *already covered* yet still went bankrupt.

When you have politicians, bureaucrats and unions involved, as you…

Either you're exaggerating, or your godmom's GP should be struck off, or she's living in a parallel universe.

I'm amazed – amazed! – by the numbers of Republican-friends-and-relatives suffering so, so terribly in countries with socialised medicine at the moment. It's funny that you never hear about them at any…

Some polling info showing the lack of enthusiasm for the current reform plan

I wouldn't be keen on Obama taking Air Force One to Alaska to smother Trig Palin and execute any old person whose walker crossed his path either... There are perfectly rational critiques being made of 'Obamacare' from…

Read an article a while back that laid out the current and future developments in this area. Might sound a bit out there, but apparently the technology it is on the way.

My Godmother in Chch got a cancerous lump on her chest, had to wait over 6 months to see a specialist by which time the cancer was inoperable, so now she is on palliative care waiting to die.

You don't say. When my GP discovered a mysterious lump in my…

safe small local nuclear power stations, if the environmentalists let it happen!!

Thats just hilarious.
So is that on the building consent form?
Nuclear power station must be small and safe.
Are there any other aesthetic considerations a flower bed out front perhaps, or a small zoo for the kiddies.

Russell, who cares if the 2.2 jobs lost for…

So why doesn't Professor O'Hare resign from academia, enter Parliament and get in a position where he can directly influence government policy and legislation? Scientists aren't exactly an occupational group that is grossly over-represented in the legislature.

I think he possibly considers that he's doing some good in his current…

"NZ's health system is better and cheaper by every measure than the US".

As the Tui ad says, "Yeah right!!". If NZ's national health system is so good then why do so many NZers buy private medical insurance? Because they want healthcare when they need it, rather than…

Even Libertarian David Kelley tried to get Perigo to understand what philosophers' mean when they say an argument is "valid", but he just didn't get it.

It's really quite embarrassing. Perigo's insistence on an 'Objectivist' logic which somehow only works from true propositions to infer true conclusions is hilarious. Objectivists…

One more point on so called "green tech" jobs that are going to be so wonderful. A study in Spain found that for every one "green job" created, 2.2 other jobs were destroyed. Maybe not after all.

Important to sort out the bs from reality.

James, that's not even a…

The cost of which has nearly doubled since 2001, and will double again in the next ten years, while incomes have remained stagnant.

I forgot to say: the worst statistic I've read during this whole debacle is that of the million people per year in the USA who go bankrupt…

The last thing healthcare over here needs is more direct govt involvement with a public option, there are very good and viable ways of helping those who need med insurance but can’t afford it without actual govt involvement in the marketplace.

Really? You're from New Zealand, with universal healthcare, based…

Med insurance is just a mechanism – a failed, expensive[*], disgusting mechanism – for possibly achieving health care if you're lucky enough.

The cost of which has nearly doubled since 2001, and will double again in the next ten years, while incomes have remained stagnant.

"Why do we do research? I mean, there's 15 or 20 years of science that show that the problem with cellphones is the conversation."
This from a guy who pulls in millions of dollars from NASA to study pilot decision making, and strategies to prevent errors.

So why doesn't Professor…

So slight diversion, an Otago psychologist, David O'Hare, ripped into the govt's cellphone ban exclusion on hands free headsets.
"Why do we do research? I mean, there's 15 or 20 years of science that show that the problem with cellphones is the conversation."

Only a…

The last thing healthcare over here needs is more direct govt involvement with a public option, there are very good and viable ways of helping those who need med insurance but can’t afford it without actual govt involvement in the marketplace.

The framing of the debate in this country is…

Important to sort out the bs from reality.

Of course, it had to be the evilchimpybushhitler's fault,…

the China-bashing was a specific campaign by Bush, Howard and the oil industry who, as the climate science began to firm up considerably in the late 90's, began pointing the finger at China as the [future] problem [and ignoring historical emissions].

Very true, and not only is China on board,…

http://www.nbr.co.nz/opinion/nevil-gibson/no-worries-climate-change-debate-goes-nowhere-fast

There are 3 separate issues to consider, is agw true? If agw is true will it lead to the dooms day scenarios some predict? And lastly regardless of your views on the first 2 questions, is any kind of collective action going to happen to…

"Why do we do research? I mean, there's 15 or 20 years of science that show that the problem with cellphones is the conversation."
This from a guy who pulls in…

Sure, you want to fiddle with the methane and other emissions if someone can figure out an equitable way of distributing…

But the government's latest statement adds to signs that some specific emissions goals may be included in the country's next five-year development plan starting from 2011.

Better be careful linking to a five year plan round here Cindy, the self appointed NZ minister of education might start calling you a…

back atcha, badger..

Sometimes a little P is not enough.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EIyixC9NsLI&feature=fvst

Yes.
And this non-conversation is now ended.

so read your mail Islander. It's exciting. :)

I've always thought that there would be a crucial point when there would be a GM technology whose environmental benefits were so compelling that people "GE free" people would have to choose.

"Ah Dr. Zoidberg you have made a bacteria that will eat all the co2"
"Yes Fry, but all…

i HAVE…

China's got a long way to go but it appears to have been listening to scientists.

I recall hearing precisely this from someone with some insight about three years ago: whatever other issues we might have with the Chinese government, they do tend to listen to their scientists.

Flicking through these pages I read about conspiracy theories. Here's a real one.

yup, the US oil industry getting its employees to look like ordinary citizens to get out and oppose the Waxman Bill in states key to the senate vote on the…