all hiphop artists presented a united public front in supporting each other regardless of merit
Yes, that is something has been that is characteristic of all hiphop artists.
No it's not and it's something i've always argued against because the foundation of hiphop is the challenge, the battle and the mastery of the artforms to subdue your opponent as an alternative to violence.
there was a time not long ago when the hiphop heads here in NZ didn't diss each other in public out of respect for being in the 'game' and that is what Kirk was referring to in his blog and in reply to scribe dissing sesh.
it's one thing to create diss tracks and slag peeps off in the underground when you're coming up, but once you're go mainstream it's generally frowned upon unless it's part of come orchestrated beef for marketing purposes.
...otherwise look where it got biggie and pac ?
I'm know as a lurker - but even I would like to see the end of this.
Easiest thing Linda, would be to respect the diversity of opinions and how they're expressed without trying to conform us to some boring cookie cut clones of each other and to not make things personal by resorting to insults we wouldn't say to each other, face to face in real life...
...nor to pretend that by what limited interaction we have on here it is possible to 'Know' someone that you feel you have the right to insult them from behind a 'puter screen.
ummm.. enough said - I thought.
I read, i formulate my own opinions - sorry I'm the only one home to pick on tonight Robbie. Carry on - or not.
Maybe your family is just a little too strict Robbie.
heh...maybe they'd give me a hiding if i brought the family name into disrepute or maybe my ancestors would exact karmic revenge on my kids.
Those are consequences i am fearful of. Not so much the hiding, so getting my account blocked doesn't even rate.
sorry I'm the only one home to pick on tonight Robbie. Carry on - or not.
heh...no need to apologise
...and no i'd rather not carry on eh
goodnight and possibly goodbye :)
But - you thought it Ok to go attack people behind several 'alter egos' as you put it?
(and, I have noticed, you're still doing it.)
Robbie Siataga - if you are any kind of front for hiphop - you've lost a large number of people, very young people, my whanau in the South.
They think you're crap. Your evident espousal of violence, your inability to engage in written argument (these are young people who can argue in Maori as well as English), and - above all - your nasty sexism- means
lost it mate.
Not up to me Robbie - Russell has the sway.. and say.
I don't understand the references to karmic revenge - so will ignore.
Please don't respond to anything i write or post Islander as you once said you would and i will offer you the same repsect. But just this once as a right of reply, here's one for the road...
Your whanau don't mean shit to me. I gave up on fake hiphoppers like them ages ago. I don't espouse violence, i only insult people who insult me first, i can argue a point as good as the next man and really, you have no idea if im sexist or not.
The only thing i see lost is your mana in that this is what you've been reduced to, trolling on the internet. What the fuck happened to you ?
you know what?... i don't care and wont be replying to you again and i'm not your mate.
mate= death (you know? Maori word)
Nothing personal and no hard feelings. I'll still do a beer, a chat and laugh sometime. You too Sacha:)
email me offsite whatever you decide so as to save it being all me all the time here.
cos really i dont need the death threats..lol
tau'ina ia savavali pea i le malamalama
Mate also means ending/ finality/disapearance. If you had, Robbie, an understanding of Eastern Polynesian languages - which you dont -it, in this circumstance = conclusion (death in the sense of finality.)
Only a stupidhead would take that as a threat - but, given all it's how you percieve everything (it's me, me , me) and have this inability to understand nuances - well, par for the course.
Whatever makes you think my whanau would care in the slightest about you? What you should care about is that they now find your kind of yap about hiphop et al is totalling unappealing - we've got Scribe and your lot is eww-
Testing daylight saving - posted later than the one below. As you were.
I'm personally OK (other than frustrated at the communication gulf) - but I do worry about how all this macho talk affects the willingness of women like Linda to speak here.
I know that has been an important factor for Russell and one of the strengths of this community that I appreciate so much, and I'd be happy if he prioritises that in deciding what to do now.
In any case, I offer apologies for my part in making this sound (and probably feel) more like Kiwibog lately.
And I hope Robbie can listen to someone he trusts about how his input comes across, regardless.
I too offer my apologies.
Like i said earlier, hiphop was, back in the day, my first culture of choice. Back when it could possibly serve as a vehicle for positive change.
Unfortunately it couldn't live up to the hype, so all thats left in the real is a ghetto state of mind and for the rest, it's just another consumer product...IMHO
I don't think women like Linda aren't willing to speak here because of my hiphop posturing. I dont even know what type of woman Linda is but i'm sure she'll say whatever she likes regardless of whatever i say.
if theres one rule for governing internet forum chat it should be.Tit for tat. This from wiki...
This strategy is dependent on four conditions that has allowed it to become the most prevalent strategy for the prisoner's dilemma:
1. Unless provoked, the agent will always cooperate
2. If provoked, the agent will retaliate
3. The agent is quick to forgive
4. The agent must have a good chance of competing against the opponent more than once.
In other words. Play nicely, give everyone the benefit of the doubt until one chooses not to play nice, then thereafter do unto them as they do to you and don't get too hung up on things.
I'm more interested in how this plays out with regards to Russell commenting on Kirk's business and scribe on sesh.
I don't think women like Linda aren't willing to speak here because of my hiphop posturing.
I am. I gave up on this thread a few days ago, and only came back to take a look because someone mentioned it to me elsewhere. I am distressed that this community which I value is filling itself with talk of breaking balls and stepping up to each other, with implied notions that physical size and the ability to be menacing matter, that some people wouldn't dare to say some things to other people if only they met them face to face. In other words, "I'm so big and tough looking that I don't need take anything you say seriously." I thought we had moved beyond being a society where what mattered was physical might.
I really, really don't want to read threats of physical violence here, no matter whether they are part of some sub-culture or not.
[edited to remove typos]
I don't think women like Linda aren't willing to speak here because of my hiphop posturing.
I've definitely stopped bothering with this one because of it, and I am neither a woman, nor particularly faint-hearted, but I just can't be bothered dealing with this crap.
Belatedly and for what it's worth, I'd like to acknowledge what TracyMac wrote here.
I have had a number of German acquaintances, and I like almost all of them. I’ve been to Germany twice and enjoyed it both times (the second in particular was one of my favourite times in my life). I like Germany, and German people, culture, and language. I was a tad disquieted by what seemed to be anti-German (as opposed to anti-Nazi) sentiments in another PAS thread not that long ago.
Well, as i've said on here before, I don't think there was anything in the German national psyche that inveitably led to Nazism, or made them worse than any other European people or culture of the time. A unique set of circumstances, yes, but if the deck had been shuffled a little differently...
Our best friends over here are German, and I've found a lot to admire in their culture generally. They have an efficiency and pragmatic approach to problems that I find admirable. Referring back to another discussion we had recently, did you know that if a car hits a cyclist in Germany, it's always the drivers fault? and the penalties are really stiff. Needless to say, drivers are a wee bit more careful over there.
And their buttoned-down, efficient, humorless work culture just seems to mean that when it's party time, they really go to town. And for those that want to go leftfield and do something different, the crazy just quirts out with that much more force.
Course, it doesn't hurt that he's a master brewer. Which in Germany is a qualification held in as high regard as, say, a degree in medicine or engineering. Like I say, much to admire in their culture :)
Ve are very much alike, him und I. Anyvay, ve are oll friends now, nein?
But still, can't resist posting this:
I think a few people have said regrettable things in this thread.
I've been too busy having an Easter break to moderate much here, but there's a point where we're all intelligent adults, and we're capable of not saying the thing that will escalate a problem. Right?
Rich: Cosi is actually a pretty good example of what I mean.
'Soave sia il vento' is achingly beautiful, but the whole opera turns on a ugly bet that two men can, in disguise, seduce the other's fiancée because... well, all women are whores, right? And no matter how prickish men are they'll be forgiven by the final curtain...
not to mention that the audience is expected to swallow that fact that the two women are too stupid to recognise their partners when they return in disguise...
I deliberately picked 'Cosi' because it is notorious for sexism. I remeber seeing it on the beeb once as a live broadcast from the Royal opera House or similar. In the intermission, they had a short doco on various interpretations of 'cosi' through the years, which included a french programme that included a sketch showing one of the main female characters on her back with spread legs, and an army marching up between them.
buttoned-down, efficient, humorless work culture
I think that's a cliche. I've worked in German offices, and they're no more buttoned-down than NZ or anywhere else.
Fair enough. I've not worked in Germany, so not really a fair call on my part.
But for what it's worth, I find NZ work/office culture to be very small-c-conservative.
He carried on killing Nazis.
Yes, a great many them when they were prisoners. Not exactly one of the good guys.
Which leaves you Bridget von Hammersmark who, as I explained, is shown as shooting an unarmed man after he negotiated to lay down his weapon. She's also shown to be a bit of a buffoon too, in having made the stupid choice of location that lead to the carnage and near failure of the plot.
There are also no particularly nice non-German characters, but the tone of the film suggests everything they do is OK because it's against Nazis. So burning people to death in a theater is fine, braining them with baseball bats after surrender is actually cool, scalping them is funny, branding marks into them is poetic, etc.