Unfortunately, those volumes are bound back copies of The Truth.

Good one liner:)

I watched the homeopathy story last on Close Up because it was promoted and my husband likes One News. I vowed never to watch it again after the 'farm endangered species' story. But I'm fascinated by homeopathy…

Unfortunately, those volumes are bound back copies of The Truth.

I think you're being deeply unfair to New Zealand's most venerable scandal rag, there, Craig.

I've just seen the story about Brooke's apology vs PM, Craig.

Speaks volumes.

Unfortunately, those volumes are bound back copies of The Truth. Here's the most delightful part of the story.

A former TVNZ news executive said the broadcaster would have dealt the same way with Mr Key's predecessor, Helen…

Speaks volumes.

I was under the impression that the study of flags and their symbolic imagery depicting the status of a Nation was Pendantary

Not study, discussion by pundits. Fussy ones at that.

vexillology

I was under the impression that the study of flags and their symbolic imagery depicting the status of a Nation was "Pendantary"

It won't happen overnight, but it will happen.

Ah, the immortal words of one of our brightest exports.

Our flag brand is not suffciently differentiated from Australia's (and I suspect that in…

Those cards are allocated from here:

Ah, the old fashioned way.

At the presentation of the Elsie Locke's biography last year somebody pointed out that some of her best pictures had been taken by the SIS.

http://www.nzsis.govt.nz/contact/

But you may not always be notified.

John Key told off the Harawiras and yet is seen being held tightly by Titewhai.

If there's any criticism of the govt he just goes into damage control and tweaks things.

He actually made quite a funny joke today when praised for his Te Reo.…

Tame Iti, who reputedly shotgunned a NZ flag in protest, is apparently a card-carrying Leninist.

Where do you get these cards?

If someone torched the Tino Rangatiratanga flag, they'd probably be slapped with the Klan/NF/BNP/NSDAP label.

If someone…

how do you all make the image appear with the link?

You just paste the link straight into your post without any of the square bracket palaver – just make sure it has the http and the www and…

Same with anthems. Not to say I wouldn't prefer we had a far cooler one of each.

Sacha, NZ has the coolest and most beautiful anthem ever.

Trinity Roots – Home, Land & Sea

By the way, how do you all make the image appear with the link?

won't flutter over the battlefield of a race war

Agree. It's progress.

Kai Tahu have their own flag, and I'll be flying that tomorrow.

Even if you run a pair of old bloomers up the pole, I hope you — and everyone else — has a fabulous day tomorrow. Got a house guest up from Wellywood I've not seen for years, and…

I imagine actually seeing the Tinorangatiratanga flag flying will inflame a few passions tomorrow.

Oh, I'm sure you're right — and the usual suspects will be given enough face time to prove the old proverb that it's the hollow drum that makes the most noise.

Still, I have a funny…

The flag non-issue gets trotted out the first week of February every damn year

Quite. Interesting to see the difference in tone this year. Seems not just the Herald that are having a less fiery conversation. Though I'm not conversant with talkbackland, and I imagine actually seeing the Tinorangatiratanga flag…

We should take our time over it, and not rush around because the Herald wants a sales boost.

Fair enough, but there's a difference between taking your time and wasting time, doing nothing. Talking about changing the flag every year or two, only to abandon the conversation, then start it…

It's a diversionary tactic. National have dropped a few balls and the Herald have brought the flag out to divert attention.

Oh please... You do realise what day it is tomorrow — the lead of the Herald story will give you a clue.

The flag non-issue gets trotted out the…

Each passing day of ignoring people who know what they're talking about in favour of witless ideology fills me with more despair

Nice

Now about those record rates of joblessness and unemployment..

Most people seem to agree the flag should change eventually, can we not just get it fucking over with

Because the current New Zealand flag is, although a bit boring, competent and dignified. Most of the alternatives are gimmicky crap out of advertiser's offices. We will likely keep whatever the…

Q: "How do you feel about the performance of the National goverment?"

A: "Each passing day of ignoring people who know what they're talking about in favour…

It's a diversionary tactic. National have dropped a few balls and the Herald have brought the flag out to divert attention.

And on the wider issue of whitebread and media circuses...

__"Don't wanna be an Aotearoan…

But we really need a few more important issues addressed first.

Ah, the catch-all excuse for never getting anything done ever...

How many times has this "debate" come up, then petered out or dissolved into "yeah, it should change to... something... at some point..."

Most people seem to agree the…

But we really need a few more important issues addressed first.

Agreed. The flag issue is just cosmetic. And no one cares, no matter how hard the Herald tries to make them.

But we really need a few more important issues addressed first.

That said, and just to be obstinant, we had our flag first in 1869 and a Kiwi was part of the winning team to design the Oz one for 1901.…

It…

replacing the black upperfield of the tinorakatirataka flag with Pacific blue (a colour that is neither turquoise nor navy but combines those elements of our ocean)

would make us all a bloody good flag-

acknowledges the…

Eddie at teh Standard is convinced the flag malarky is a conspiracy to distract:

Someone needs to come up with A Unified Field Theory to explain Mutually Re-enforcing Traditional Media/Blog Stupidity.

Does anyone else think it’s a coincidence that Granny Herald has tried to start a meaningless debate over the national flag – ‘11 of 18 Order of NZ members support change!’ wow-wee – just as the…

It does not need to be an either/or proposition.... both statements could be true simultaneously.

Look, that's no way to start a "serious debate"!

Either we need to change our flag... or Australians are stupid.

It does not need to be an either/or proposition.... both statements could be true simultaneously.

:)

Either we need to change our flag... or Australians are stupid. Let the debate begin.

If these people get their way, there will be no confusion between the two flags.

The current Australian flag is BORING and UNORIGINAL.
...
Everyone is always saying how super laid back Australians are, and…

I had more concerns with the phrase "the Herald starts a serious debate". The rest of the article just provided entertainment after that promise.

I got quite a strange look from my neighbour this morning. I think it was probably the choked laughter I was suppressing, having just picked up…

You mean Order of New Zealand, that's what the Herald article says.

I stand corrected, and rubbing my righteously spanked bottom. :)

Either we need to change our flag... or Australians are stupid. Let the debate begin.

Of course, it would be utterly ungracious to speculate on *cough* how liquid…

Bitchy yet true — the Force is strong with this one... :)

I particularly liked Jim Bolger's anecdote about how the Australian diplomat got confused and picked up the wrong flag.

Either we need to change our flag... or Australians are stupid. Let the debate begin.

And just to be even more pedantic there are a lot more than 22 members of the New Zealand Order of Merit.

You mean Order of New Zealand, that's what the Herald article says.

But there are more, 24 apparently.

Craig, I had more concerns with the phrase "the Herald starts a serious debate". The rest of the article just provided entertainment after that promise.

Bitchy yet true — the Force is strong with this one... :)

Is it "a" majority though, if, out of 22, 11 say yes and 5 say no. As opposed to "the" majority, which would require at least 12 of them?

It is a majority of those who were 1) contacted and 2) agreed to comment. But that's not what the second…

Eleven out of twenty two is not a majority of the members of the NZOM, let alone "of New Zealand's most eminent citizens".

Is it "a" majority though, if, out of 22, 11 say yes and 5 say no. As opposed to "the" majority, which would require at least 12…

Today, two days from Waitangi Day, the Herald starts a serious debate about changing the national flag. The familiar flag with its Union Jack dates from an era when…

Absolutely not that I have Jack of All T-.

Hey, there's still the concept of basic good taste even in US-financed scenery chewers

Yes, it's a cute headline — and easy lead — that James Cameron and Kathryn Bigelow, his third ex-wife, are going head to head in the…

I get weekly email updates from the UK and everything!

I know what happens to Roseh. I had to know and looked up on Corrienet.

Not that I watch crap TV. Not that I in fact make a point of watching crap TV with NZ scenery. Certainly not that I own any of it on DVD. Absolutely not that I…

Caprica: on the basis of the pilot and first episode, it is on track to be much more than just a prequel to Battlestar Galactica.

Seconded. I likesies..

ZOMG! I thought you guys were, like, too brainy for Coro??

Cecelia, you're breaking my heart! (Oof. Sorry about that.) I am *dedicated* to Coro. I get weekly email updates from the UK and everything!

It got late, so we stopped, but I might have another look, just to see what crazy-assed place its so-called story leads to. Also, to see whether they can keep their merkins on straight.

What I've seen from various not-particularly-legal sources, it looks like Sparty works as some kind of…

"The Bill" last night (my mother addicted me to it, honest!) "Antiques Roadshow" when I've got the time (tonight) and then a dvd, much later: "Kiki's Delivery Service" tonight, because I havent watched it for about 7 months. Apopo – I start on "Blue World" again-…

(I *love* Amber)

ZOMG! I thought you guys were, like, too brainy for Coro??

It's a bit bizarre – as if they're trying to do all the "only on cable" things they possibly can: swearing, shagging, full-frontal nudity and hilarious spurts of computer-generated blood.

Perhaps US audiences will hear all the Kiwi and Australian accents as being…

PAS doesn't do tags, Geoff

The best review of Sparticus I came across on-line: "I am Sparticus. You are Sparticus. Wanna fuck before or after I stab you, Sparticus?" Heh...

Gawd, and I thought Laurence Olivier was sinister in the original: "I like the oyster and the snail" .

Spartacus is a spectacularly gory new show about gladiators in ancient Rome. It's produced by Mr. Lucy Lawless Rob Tappert, and features much nudity, much sex*, and much stomach-churning ultra-violence.

The best review of Sparticus I came across on-line: "I am Sparticus. You are Sparticus. Wanna fuck before or after…

you know who you are, Harvey Norman

Seriously, those should be illegal.

In fact, I think I did read something a month or two back about authorities in the US proposing (or considering) some sort of ban on such "intrusive" TV advertising.

The notion of Dev being irresistible to two generations of women is stretching things just a little.

And oh BOY is that actor a scenery-chewer. He's an incredible cheeseball. The poor girl who plays Amber (I *love* Amber) must spend half her time trying to keep a straight face.

The TVCs that really get up my nose are the shouting ones

Discount f#$king Tyres. Grrr.

I like shocking. I liked Rome . Who does Parker play?

Claudius Glaber.

I hadn't noticed his voice – when fast forwarding there's no audio. But it's a nice voice, I can see (hear?) why they use it.

Oh, don't get me wrong, I don't think its an unpleasant voice.…

Not everything on the…

The TVCs that really get up my nose are the shouting ones (you know who you are, Harvey Norman). Would you really want invite such an oaf into your house?

As for Fiona McDonald--is there anything she won't sell on screen? Hard to reconcile with her…

I hadn't noticed his voice – when fast forwarding there's no audio. But it's a nice voice, I can see (hear?) why they use it.

So kinda like Rome, but with more sex and less historical accuracy?

More or less, yeah. Not sure how much historical accuracy they are actually aiming for though. But the violence is utterly depraved, pornographic, cartoon-ish gore with all sorts of amazing post-production effects, and Carrie-like volumes of fake blood.…

Anyone else ever noticed that Craig Parker voices between three to five different commercials at any time?

No, our household uses the mute button every ad-break!

Having seen two episodes I can report that it comes across like a bizarre three-way between Caligula, Texas Chainsaw Massacre, and gay porn.

So kinda like Rome, but with more sex and less historical accuracy?

Really? Then how come the ads themselves are mostly so, so naff.

Anyone else ever noticed that all of the REALLY TERRIBLE NAFF ones are Australian?

Anyone else ever noticed that Craig Parker voices between three to five different commercials at any time? Why an ad agency would do that…

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=59OJ17raqWw

advertising people, where cool is king

Really? Then how come the ads themselves are mostly so, so naff.

I'm a recent Coro St re-convert, having not watched it since Minnie Caldwell and Ena Sharples left the snug

Agreed, although the bit about Minnie and Ena doesn't apply in my case. But Coro is, er, rocking at the moment. In Tony Gordon, we have that great thing: a villain…

That thing with the counting was the best product placement that Chiquita ever did.

And let's not get started on the lamb marketing genius who figured bedtime offered untapped opportunities.

advertising people, where cool is king

I still reckon you're thinking of the creatives rather than say the media buyers. Still you do spend more time than me researching their native habitats..

P.S. On my Panasonic HDD recorder at Fast Forward speed no. 3, I can hit the return from ads to programming almost exactly every time by mentally counting "1 banana 2 banana 3 banana 4 banana 5 banana 6 banana 7 banana – PLAY".

And then you get up and…

So is this ad industry rational or not?

Oh, so you're looking for consistency in my argument. I'll go and make my second coffee of the morning and get back to you ;)

I don't think just because you're irrational in one regard you can't be rational in others. Otherwise…

otherwise l'm sure the billion dollar (or whatever it is) ad industry

Only have 2008 figures handy,: advertising revenue across all media in NZ in 2008 was $NZ2.317 billion (television was $647m, or 27.9%).

I agree with you about the radio ratings--they are even more shonky. Six monthly surveys, which…

otherwise l'm sure the billion dollar (or whatever it is) ad industry would have come up with something better

So is this ad industry rational or not? Earlier you were suggesting that they weren't interested in advertising to older people for irrational reasons, now you seem to be suggesting that…

I have worked in audience research in both the UK and NZ and became an early dis-believer, largely because of the inherent flaws in the processes

@Geoff – yes, everything you say, and more. But like I said, like God, we believe when we want to. And whatever the degree…

Ratings are a lot like God. Not that they decide who lives and who dies,

Although they have consigned a few people to wander in the wilderness. I think a cream pie in the face is a much better punishment for bad programming blunders based on demographics.

Other than that…

That’s how blogs should work – we’re not journos

? How come Close Up let you on board... tut tut, standards are slipping

According to the study, viewers pupils were dilated 99 percent during fast-forwarding ads

Wow those people deserve blipverts then (hope they don't start exploding like on __Max…

I expect…

Sounds like a really truendeep summation of advertising actually-

*slightly altered words from GEOFF LEALAND

because they work in advertising, which is cool.

It ain't cool; it is clammy!

about an older guy spending his kids inheritence

Starting to come through in Lotto adverts too. Perhaps the cool agency kids are beginning to see that boomers don't aspire to wearing hair shirts and eating gruel so they can leave a pile of bonus bonds and some brick and tile…

I reckon it's pretty easy to figure out that at least 29,000 of that 30,000 will be teenage boys.

Well, perhaps, but finding video-with-nudity on the 'net is not exactly hard. I find it difficult to believe that many viewers are there just for that.

I wonder how many views…

They want to sell hip products to hip people, because that's cool and because they work in advertising, which is cool.

Ah – too true. But do the audience surveyers seriously reckon they're cool as well? Bloody geeks. :)

When does Backbenchers start again?

Feb 17th I believe is our first Welly show back for the year. Please everyone come along, esp if you haven't before, Giovanni :)

I thought Damien's point was not that older people don't buy stuff, but that advertisers believe older…

what people say they want to see on TV, and what they actually watch are not necessarily the same thing.

Ae. Same as green consumer behaviour vs what we tell researchers. "Of course I'd pay a premium for organic veges. And I always catch the bus."

older people are not…

and they're not going to change their brand of toilet cleaner or refrigerator either, so don't bother advertising to them

Hmmm. While I still haven't quite grasped the fact that TVNZ is probably never going to meet my viewing needs again, as a representative of the 54+ demographic, I dispute…

Just because umpteen people have a look at some gratuitous story on a website doesn't mean that the show's going in the right direction.

But if the success of a show is measured solely by ratings – the number of eyeballs of a given age looking at it – then,…

Buh? Whuh?

Okay, it wasn't most, but still... the Wired article.

A quote:

__According to the study’s announcement, “Brasel and Gips found that people who fast forward through shows actually pay more attention to the screen than those who view at regular speed. That’s good news for advertisers, as long…

I believe older people are also more likely to carry on propping up existing media business models – like advertising-funded television and album music – far longer than their children and grandchildren will

I agree – I'm 63 and still like to turn on the telly and watch what's on…

hip-hop vs hip-op

Some of the assumptions really have not kept pace with demographic changes, have they.

Numbers in 55+ age groups will grow much faster than younger age groups over the next two decades, presenting a larger target.

55+ is a group with increasingly high disposable incomes underpinned by…

...As for the racks [the topless sunbathing story].. well some might be critical but 30,000 people have been back for a second look on our website.. go figure if it isn't what people want to watch....

"Go figure" he says...well, I reckon it's pretty easy to figure out that at…

I also recall research that suggested that most people watching shows on DVRs don't fast-forward through the ads

Buh? Whuh?

Does anyone know what percentage of the various demographics actually watch broadcast TV?

I believe it's most people at most age groups.

I also recall research that suggested that most people watching shows on DVRs don't fast-forward through the ads.

More importantly with respect to Stephen Judd's comment "Homes may remain on the panel for a maximum of 36 months", so there is at least some churn.

It's always frustrating to watch something, knowing that they've cut a good number of minutes out in order to slot in more advertising, and that if you were watching the same program elsewhere in the world you'd see the entire thing.

That doesn't happen as often as you might think…

With the exception of TVNZ6 & 7, is the…

As I was once told in a lecture, weather forecasts aren't wrong per se, the events just don't happen in the timeframe it's predicted they will.

Somehow puts me in mind of something Billy Connolly once said:

"There's no such thing as bad weather, only bad clothing choices."

When does…

Presumably it is easy enough to calculate, The sum of the cost to run the ads in that hour divided by the number of viewers. I have access to neither of those figures though.…

The end of my regular TV watching came around 2000. I had just spent 6 months in the UK, watching very little TV because we didn't get around to buying one, but what I did see didn't have many ads.

Once back in NZ, I just couldn't…

I do actually watch a lot of TV on DVD – Lost, Sopranos, Mad Men etc. I probably watch TV shows more than I watch movies. And I watched a lot of tv in the UK and the US, where the ad breaks are only a couple times an hour…

MILF Island is testing off the charts in the most profitable demographics: Soccer moms, NASCAR dads, white collar pervs and the obese.

– 30 Rock

I have to admit I don't really watch TV – not because I'm so fucking sophisiticated I'd rather be reading Proust, but because I don't…

and what about the on-demand viewer traffic
(topless sunworshippers as a case in point)

anyway current TV seems to be too many Chefs…

It's hip-hop vs. hip-op

That's very nice. I hope you're taking the rest of the day off.

One of the shows I contract to, Back Benches, is on commercial-free Freeview.

Which I'm getting today via telstra as part of the basic sky package. Yipppeeeeee!