“Adults with a terminal illness should have the right to choose a medically assisted death,” Green Party health spokesperson Kevin Hague…

The opponents of assisted dying have offered several arguments to back up their case, but none of them are logical and evidence-based.

All that remains is their belief in the sanctity of…

Very interesting, and Kim Hill does try to raise the issue of how this legislation could affect the public perception of those with disabilities.

AND....as if we didn't already know....NZBORA isn't worth shit.

http://www.parliament.nz/en-nz/pb/sc/make-submission/0SCHE_SCF_51DBHOH_PET63268_1/petition-of-hon-maryan-street-and-8974-others

and Andrew Geddis encouraging folk to participate....http://pundit.co.nz/content/aid-in-dying-time-to-do-something

is it time to have another exchange of ideas on this issue?

Or has it all been said?

The battle lines have formed, and really...what is the fucking point because…

https://d3n8a8pro7vhmx.cloudfront.net/eolc/pages/37/attachments/original/1444699434/End_of_Life_Choice_Bill_FINAL.pdf?1444699434

Has its own webpage....http://www.lifechoice.org.nz/

The motivation for this Bill is compassion.

http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/70714278/boy-disabled-by-meningitis-after-being-sent-home-from-wellington-hospital-twice

while the parents of this brain injured little boy ...

... have learned to take medical judgments about William with a grain of salt. Doctors said he would probably need to eat through…

Phillip Patson's views....

http://podcast.radionz.co.nz/mnr/mnr-20150528-0747-im_not_afraid_to_die_and_im_not_afraid_to_live-048.mp3

There is plenty of evidence of disabled people's lives being undervalued. That makes us vulnerable to the unintended downsides of policy and law changes, as well as the upsides everyone might benefit from.

Nearly all humans do not…

Lecretia is asking for an exemption from current laws. However, that would have an impact on other people's rights. The court has to adjudge how to balance those things – and whether it is even something…

Slap bang on the head, Hilary.

The culture, the traditions, surrounding birth and death have changed over the years...almost…

In this case, it's a "personal drive" I can relate to. I do understand the appeal of having control over that final act, of being able to make the choice about when is enough.

I was trying to transfer Peter from wheelchair to car one afternoon by the side entrance to the High Court in Auckland. We were parked on a slope, and things were not going to plan...disaster loomed. Up stepped besuited and begroomed well known QC, and he…

miserable, slimy, bottom feeding scumsuckers...

Having said that, with tongue firmly in cheek, foot in mouth, same lawyer spoke with equal passion and conviction on behalf of the HRC at the Appeal Court in Attorney General (for the Miserly of Health) v Margaret Spenser.

He seemed to 'get…

bloody lawyers

This is about who has the power to decide where the boundary between life and death sits. Until now, the law has set that boundary very conservatively in favour…

Seriously, I agree,

But, in terms of; "I am dying of this illness. In all probability it will cause me pain and suffering that I am not prepared endure.…

in her case, now is good

They inject a bit if variety today.... the "abject humiliation of incontinence", and feared people dealing with…

Further degrading of services, more insecurity, and entrenching of loss of rights for disabled people...they'll be begging for the needle/pill/whatever.

All the party leaders, with handy links,…

In a hearing in the High Court at Wellington today, three groups sought to have their say on whether Ms Seales could take a lethal dose of drugs. The Human Rights Commission, Care Alliance Trust and Voluntary Euthanasia Society want to participate…

Three of them had chosen to die, that day, as they had reached the end of their ability to bear much more pain.

All three of them literally died.

No drugs or other paraphernalia of suicide....they simply made…

Why? It's a huge decision to make, and isn't the whole point of the thread emphasising the need to ensure that the people doing the dying actually do really want that?

Actually I suppose some progressive impairments become terminal too. I imagine you would need to satisfy the medical and psychological criteria even more rigorously if parents are making that decision on behalf of a…

The Belgian law also applies to child cancer (and other childhood conditions). So parents and even children can theoretically ask for euthanasia. I know a bit about child cancer and know children who have…

While I've always been an advocate…

how does that work, linguistically?

We're disable people Joe, not the "disabled". As the disabled we have been incarcerated in institutions, subject to experimentation, and a whole host of other dehumanising treatments including involuntary euthanasia...

After reading that, I wonder why we would bundle permanently disabled people with terminally ill people?

Why not legally permit early death only for the latter group? Would remove some of the obvious fishhooks.

disabled people would have to be valued a heck of a lot more before that would ever happen.

I'm pleased the committee chair included my recommendations in the final advice. Also managed some practical wins in the sparse consumer-oriented material created afterwards. However, lack of cohesive action or…

Well that’s what I’d expect from you Sacha, given your past form here. But it’s not what Martin Sullivan appears to be saying.

It's not a zero-sum thing. We are capable of solving balancing acts like this in other areas of public policy.

My position as a member of the National Screening Advisory Committee at the time Down screening…

You gotta be kidding Steven.

‘Silent’ holocaust Joe, not the holocaust.

There are some cogent arguments that prenatal screening is the new eugenics aimed…

I'm sure I'll be swiftly corrected if I'm wrong, but I recall Sacha appearing to make a case here…

Those who forget their history tend to repeat it Joe

All powerful words with very personal meanings.

An underlying issue in the euthanasia debate is that some people want to impose their understanding of the meanings of these words – such as suffering – on others who might not see their…

There's also a very thin line between supplying treatment and actively speeding a…

I’m sure that counts for something, but I’d imagine that compliance with legal oversight would be as…

But that is…

I assumed that being constructive with the opponents…

I thought I was a pretty strong, independent sort of person but I learned that cancer renders you weak and you have to accept that. It isn't easy to be less…

A single-issue activist attempts to advance their agenda by dehumanising their opposition. It's a take no prisoners approach that precludes the possibility of negotiation. Acknowledging that advocates…

Of course.

and his experience.
that's really important.

I did, and I acknowledged Moz's right to his opinion.

I did not intend to misinterpret/misrepresent what he was saying.

I still hold the veiw (based on experience) that disabled people will be at risk if legislation is…

Recent local news story is one example.

However, the criteria for inclusion in this program were not exclusively genetic, nor were they necessarily based on infirmity. An important criterion was economic. Nazi officials assigned people to this program…

This is the result we need to create.

Martin Sullivan writes:

I couldn’t help thinking “This is precisely the problem. It is people like this, with all their ‘expertise’ who will end up speaking for those disabled people who lack the communication skills or cannot speak once euthanasia is legalised.”

Then he goes…

So why all the fuss?

The debate? The moralising?

Because, as soon as one person says, " I can't see how three people providing round the clock care is a good use of anyone's time.".... that veiwpoint is out there.

You may be…

Since you've apparently not made the connection, let me state for the record: I think criminals should have the same right to die as anyone else. And I think…

The voices of those who have lived with conditions that others consider unbearable MUST be heard in this debate.

Secondly, before we legislate for the 'right to die'...we must legislate for the right to live.

ALL life must be valued...not just the able, the…

Not everyone wants to be disabled and views it as a gift. People like me look at the options and say exactly "I'd…

Exactly. In a forum such as this I’d once have assumed that the discussion would be about how that could be achieved. Instead Martin Sullivan, with the headiness born of single-issue activism, Godwins…

There’s a prevailing stereotype that depending on others is a bad…

No – they are speaking for themselves and others who may share their perspective (such as…