[00:00:00:00]Susie
And staying with Dirty Politics, and Cameron Slater is lashing out on his Whale Oil blog claiming a series of text messages from Kim Dotcom prove the internet entrepreneur is responsible for hacking his emails. Mr Slater has refused to be interviewed by Radio New Zealand. Mr Dotcom couldn't be reached for comment. 
Mr Dotcom has written on the Internet Party's website though, saying he had nothing to do with Nicky Hager's book. The leader of the Internet Party, Laila Harre, was listening to that previous interview with the Prime Minister, John Key. She's with us now. Good Morning.

[00:00:28.19] Laila: 
Good Morning Susie

[00:00:30.00] Susie: 
Just, first of all, what is your reaction to what John Key had to say there to Guyon and what do you think should happen next to Judith Collins?

[00:00:37.07] Laila: 
Well, I think that for anybody who's read the book, what we've just heard is a masterclass in the strategy that the, um, that the book outlines, the Prime Minister in deep denial publicly about what has been happening, unable to, um, respond to the specific issues that have been raised in the book - not because he doesn't know the information but because the whole strategy here is for the Prime minister to apparently remain above the fray while his own staff, his senior ministers are deeply embroiled in a strategy to undermine our democracy.

[00:01:18.22] Susie: 
And so, as a result of that, what then do you think should happen with Judith Collins?

[00:01:23.20] Laila: 
Well, I think there is no doubt that any Prime Minister who was leading a government, um, that gave a moral compass to New Zealand would have removed her a long time ago. The, um, the evidence provided in this book, ah, shows clearly that she should be removed. This is the woman who is part of a strategy to reduce voter turnout in the election and she is the minister in charge of the Electoral Commission, our public body charged with engaging voters, enrolling them and ensuring that they turn out to vote. She should go.

[00:02:01.18] Susie: 
Okay. So, let's talk, then, about the latest on Whale Oil. Ultimately, as regards Kim Dotcom. You'll have seen the information that was put up last night about the texts and what this reveals. What do you think they say?

[00:02:14.15] Laila: 
Well, and not only that, the information that was put on his website that I was somehow involved in a conspiracy to hack his databases and to release this information to Nicky Hager. Let's just lay about here. We have a book which shows - 

[00:02:36.02] Susie: 
No, no, no, we've talked a lot about the book. I'm asking you about these texts. What do you think the texts say?

[00:02:40.07] Laila: 
Look-

[00:02:44.11] Susie: 
From Kim Dotcom

[00:02:44.11] Laila: 
-him and Slater is producing all sorts of so-called evidence on his website. Among the evidence that he produced yesterday, so-called, was an allegation that I had been involved in this process - 

[00:02:58.08] Susie: 
yeah and we're going to come on to talk to that but I'm asking you about the text messages. What do the text messages reveal, do you think, from Kim Dotcom.

[00:03:07.14]  Laila: 
They reveal nothing to me, and let's look at the process that's happening here - 

[00:03:10.06] Susie: 
No, lets, let's just hang on and stay on these texts because if you see these text messages, he is saying that this shows that this leads straight back to Kim Dotcom. You're saying they reveal nothing so what have you - what conversation have you had with Kim Dotcom about what these mean?

[00:03:28.22] Laila: 
Nicky Hager and Cameron Slater are the two people whose evidence is out here on the source of the hacking. Who do you believe? Nicky Hager has said that the origins of the information had no association whatsoever to do with Kim Dotcom. Cameron Slater has said that he has drawn inferences from texts which- I don't know whether or not they're authentic,

[00:03:54.28] Susie: 
But have you asked Kim Dotcom whether they are or not?

[00:03:56.10] Laila: 
You are missing the entire point here - 

[00:04:00.14] Susie: 
No, I'm asking you a very straight-forward question about whether you've talked to Kim Dotcom about these texts or not.

[00:04:05.29] Laila: 
No, I haven't talked to Kim Dotcom about these texts.

[00:04:08.10] Susie: 
Why not? Do you not want to know what they are and ascertain exactly what this means? 

[00:04:15.12] Laila: 
What I want to know is why you're continuing to amplify this message from Cameron Slater. This is exactly at the core of this book. Cameron Slater makes unsubstantiated slurs and sneers against people. The purpose of this is to amplify the message through the mainstream media. We have Nicky Hager on one hand saying that the source of his information is not at all connected with Kim Dotcom. We have Cameron Slater on the other hand providing more smears and slurs to the extent, including drawing me into it - 

[00:04:57.17] Susie: 
So do you think this is just a smear and a slur-

[00:05:00.12] Laila: 
Absolutely. And-

[00:05:00.12] Susie: 
Do you think they're authentic? Do you think they are from Kim Dotcom?

[00:05:02.11] Laila: 
The question that you have to ask as somebody within the media that has been caqught up in this process over  the last six years, and I'm not saying you personally or Morning Report, but the media in general, is 'are you just following this path again?' The whole - 

[00:05:24.19] Susie: 
But it is very important to know where this information has come from. I'm interested in finding-

[00:05:33.19] Laila: 
This information is coming from Cameron Slater, somebody who we now see - 

[00:05:33.19] Susie: 
So, you don't think these texts - you don't think these texts are authentic, then?

[00:05:40.02] Laila: 
-exposed as a fantasist, a person who has deliberately set out on a course in cooperation with people within the Prime Minister's office with senior ministers to broadcast slurs on the basis that those slurs will be picked up in the mainsteam media and amplified. It is time that he was muted, that these ridiculous assertions did not feed the amplification or get the amplification - 

[00:06:07.25] Susie: 
Okay, 

[00:06:10.16] Laila: 
-that is  occurring again today.

[00:06:10.16] Susie: 
I've got a couple of other things that I really want to touch on with you 

[00:06:17.07] Laila: 
[not intelligible because of Susie over talking] ...need to disconnect from this process of dirty politics rather than to amplify it.

[00:06:20.19] Susie: 
Okay, well, I've got a couple of other things that I would like to talk to you about regarding this, just very quickly because we are getting short on time. When did you see a copy of the Nicky Hager book?

[00:06:28.28] Laila: 
Ah, two days, I think, after I, after it was released -

[00:06:32.03] Susie: 
So you didn't know how - you didn't know about it ahead of time?

[00:06:37.15] Laila: 
[unintelligible]...at the time it was released, I had no idea about what the contents of the book would be. And again, -

[00:06:42.18] Susie: 
So, hang on a minute, if I can just stop you there, though, because Martyn Bradbury did have an advance copy, didn't he? And he works for Internet/Mana.

[00:06:46.09] Laila: 
I have no idea. I have no, no idea whatsoever.

[00:06:53.11] Susie: 
So you're telling us that someone who works for Internet/Mana had an advance copy of the book and he didn't tell anyone else about what was in it?

[00:06:58.01] Laila: 
Martyn Bradbury doesn't work for Internet/Mana. 

[00:07:03.13] Susie: 
And you had no conversations with him, no contact at all about what was in that book?

[00:07:05.24] Laila:
No, I've had no contact with anybody prior to the release of the book. And to suggest otherwise is in fact to do exactly what this book - the thesis in this book wants you to do. It's to rely on innuendo, on smears, to amplify that message, to get people like me on your programme  to respond to a smear, rather than to talk about the policy issues that we're promoting in this election campaign. Now this is becoming - this in itself is becoming a serious issue for this campaign. We have at the core of our government, lead from the 9th floor of the beehive, with the support of senior ministers,  a calculated strategy to manipulate public opinion, to create smears, to amplify those smears through on-going reporting in the mainstream media and as a result to reduce voter turnout.

[00:08:08.28] Susie: 
Okay, 

[00:08:14.21] Laila: 
It's been very successful over the last 6 years and we have a collective responsibility to stop it being successful in this election campaign.

[00:08:18.27] Susie: 
Laila Harre, thank you very much for your time this morning on Morning Report, that's the leader of the Internet Party.