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Speaker: Identification strategy: Now it’s personal

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  • Tze Ming Mok, in reply to Danielle,

    You don’t mean that the way it sounds, right?

    Like a yellow star or something for the PRCs, that'd work; and silver ferns for 'local' Chinese; but when the line is blurred, make them do tests to make sure they *can't* speak Mandarin. Then put the locals into a special camp for their own safety.

    Seriously, this is my teenage nightmare.

    SarfBank, Lunnin' • Since Nov 2006 • 154 posts Report Reply

  • Russell Brown, in reply to Tze Ming Mok,

    Seriously, this is my teenage nightmare.

    I’m really sorry you had to read that. Took my eye off the ball a bit there. jh is not welcome here.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 22825 posts Report Reply

  • Mike Steinberg,

    Focusing on ethnicity is always going to lead to calls of racism. Unfortunately if politicians are going to address the housing issue they need to identify the causes. Ex Reserve Bank economist Mike Reddell has pointed out the Auckland housing crisis is the direct result of policy decisions. The liberalisation of immigration from the mid 80's and restrictions on housing supply. The immigration minister could reduce inward migration and take the heat out of the market. Labour should have focused on this as it's a far bigger factor but it would likely have prompted similar complaints. The bottom line should be economic sovereignty and acting in the best interests of NZ citizens regardless of ethnicity.

    Since Jul 2015 • 3 posts Report Reply

  • steven crawford,

    Focusing on ethnicity is always going to lead to calls of racism.

    Not always, but when an ethnic group is scapegoated and made vulnerable to abuse by ignorent mobs, for political advantage; I call that Insighting racism.

    Unfortunately if politicians are going to address the housing issue they need to identify the causes.

    Which isn't Tze Ming Mok or Keith Ng.

    Atlantis • Since Nov 2006 • 4411 posts Report Reply

  • Kumara Republic, in reply to Mike Steinberg,

    There are many local speculators who are just as guilty if not more so, but the House of Lords in Britain have nothing on NZ’s self-appointed Lords of Houses, including anti-RMA types like Denise Krum who’ll use the RMA when it suits them. So Chinese financiers are a much easier target.

    What I do agree with is that fiscal nativism is a symptom of the gains of fiscal globalisation not ‘trickling down’ as promised by its loudest cheerleaders. Amy Chua’s “World on Fire” chronicles the more extreme examples overseas.

    The southernmost capital … • Since Nov 2006 • 5429 posts Report Reply

  • Deborah,

    Raybon Kan in the NZ Herald: If Chinese buy houses and pay you too much - you don't like it

    Being Chinese in New Zealand always puts you on the back foot. We don't play the race card: we show up with it stuck to our face. So, when mainland Chinese house-buyers are accused of being the nation's problem, I can't help but feel attacked as well. Because I don't entirely buy it when you say it's not about being Chinese in the face. We know what you mean when you say foreign ownership. You don't mean state houses being sold to Australia. You don't mean Canadian pension funds. You don't mind the white: you don't see the white. White is how things should be.

    New Lynn • Since Nov 2006 • 1447 posts Report Reply

  • simon g,

    The Herald seems to be churning out columns by the hour. Four or five new ones today?

    The columns themselves might say different things, but the comments underneath don't.

    (I liked Raybon Kan's piece, although (because?) it clearly went over lots of heads).

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 1329 posts Report Reply

  • Katharine Moody, in reply to simon g,

    The Herald seems to be churning out columns by the hour. Four or five new ones today?

    This is a useful one - although I disagree with the suggestion to only impose the stamp duty to Auckland properties - we really don't want to exacerbate the problem to a nationwide one;

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=11481287

    Wellington • Since Sep 2014 • 798 posts Report Reply

  • Katharine Moody, in reply to simon g,

    (I liked Raybon Kan’s piece, although (because?) it clearly went over lots of heads).

    Chris Trotter refers to it in his recent comment;

    http://thedailyblog.co.nz/2015/07/15/perilous-whites-labour-china-and-the-liberal-intelligentsia/

    Wellington • Since Sep 2014 • 798 posts Report Reply

  • Joe Wylie, in reply to simon g,

    (I liked Raybon Kan'http://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/speaker-identification-strategy-now-its-personal/?i=100#post343710s piece, although (because?) it clearly went over lots of heads).

    I'd say it went right over the heads of the significant and growing proportion of NZers whose names don't, and probably never will, appear on a property title deed.

    flat earth • Since Jan 2007 • 4593 posts Report Reply

  • Dismal Soyanz,

    And meanwhile Phil Twyford goes for the double and shoots the right foot as well:

    "I think the whistle-blower I dealt with did Aucklanders a favour and put this information into the domain out of a sense of public duty. I think Aucklanders owe that person a debt of gratitude."

    The race to the bottom in this country's politics is starting to get depressing.

    Wellington • Since Nov 2010 • 310 posts Report Reply

  • Katharine Moody, in reply to Joe Wylie,

    I’d say it went right over the heads of the significant and growing proportion of NZers whose names don’t, and probably never will, appear on a property title deed.

    Seems like another example of typecasting to me? Just what category do these "significant and growing proportion of NZers " belong to? As it seems to me you have 'profiled' them into some kind of homogeneous grouping that are supposedly less intelligent than you (because the post referred to did not go over your head)?

    Wellington • Since Sep 2014 • 798 posts Report Reply

  • Katharine Moody, in reply to Mike Steinberg,

    Agree.

    Wellington • Since Sep 2014 • 798 posts Report Reply

  • Joe Wylie, in reply to Katharine Moody,

    Seems like another example of typecasting to me? Just what category do these "significant and growing proportion of NZers " belong to? As it seems to me you have 'profiled' them into some kind of homogeneous grouping that are supposedly less intelligent than you (because the post referred to did not go over your head)?

    As a non-property owner and longtime renter I happen to be very much a part of this group - not that that's any of your goddam judgmental business. When Khan reduces his case to what one might be prepared to pay for the 'privilege' of living in one's homeland, he's blissfully ignoring the reality of those who are simply unable to pay.

    flat earth • Since Jan 2007 • 4593 posts Report Reply

  • Katharine Moody, in reply to Joe Wylie,

    So you are part of this group - but you're smarter than most of them? Is that what you mean? Who's Khan?

    Wellington • Since Sep 2014 • 798 posts Report Reply

  • Joe Wylie, in reply to Katharine Moody,

    So you are part of this group - but you're smarter than most of them? Is that what you mean? Who's Khan?

    Raybon Khan. As for the rest of your questions, bothering to answer them would have about as much point as asking you whether you really are running for village idiot around here.

    flat earth • Since Jan 2007 • 4593 posts Report Reply

  • Katharine Moody, in reply to Joe Wylie,

    Raybon Khan.

    Oh, it’s Kan, actually.

    I might be an idiot (i.e., not on your level by your standards along with all those other masses of NZers out there), but am I am on ‘your side’ in terms of the injustice of this free flow of foreign direct capital investment in our residential RE market. Just read my posts of the first page of this thread.

    Wellington • Since Sep 2014 • 798 posts Report Reply

  • Kumara Republic, in reply to Katharine Moody,

    but am I am on ‘your side’ in terms of the injustice of this free flow of foreign direct capital investment in our residential RE market.

    I'd say most of us agree that ugly nativism is a symptom of globalisation benefiting only those at the very top. But at the very least, political leaders like Twyford need to know the difference between a laser-guided smart bomb and a MOAB.

    The southernmost capital … • Since Nov 2006 • 5429 posts Report Reply

  • Joe Wylie, in reply to Katharine Moody,

    Kan. My bad.

    Katharine, I'm not taking sides on this. I'm simply dismayed that Kan, a writer I generally admire, joins so many others in ignoring the growing proportion for whom, regardless of ethnicity, home ownership is a fading dream. If his message goes 'over their heads' it's because it's irrelevant to their situation, not because of any intellectual shortcomings on their part. If I've made that a little clearer then I regret not having said so sooner.

    BTW I've been a homeowner. I even had a stake in a modest commercial property once, but sometimes these things don't last. While it might not be the commonest set of threads in life's tapestry, IMHE there's a bit of it about.

    flat earth • Since Jan 2007 • 4593 posts Report Reply

  • Katharine Moody, in reply to Joe Wylie,

    If his message goes ‘over their heads’ it’s because it’s irrelevant to their situation, not because of any intellectual shortcomings on their part.

    Right, I get what you mean now - good point!!!

    Wellington • Since Sep 2014 • 798 posts Report Reply

  • Rich Lock, in reply to Kumara Republic,

    But at the very least, political leaders like Twyford need to know the difference between a laser-guided smart bomb and a MOAB.

    Hard not to see this as a massive stuff-up, whether the alienation angle was planned/accounted for, or not.

    From here (which is, admittedly, some way away), it appears that the only thing being discussed is whether this is racist, or not. And the thing not being discussed is the actual underlying issue. So instead of hammering the government on lack of affordable housing, potential problems with massive overseas investment, etc, Labour are spending their entire time explaining how this totally isn't racist, you guys, geez.

    There's a political strategy known as the dead cat strategy that is apparently much loved by everyone's favourite Australian political advisors.

    Seems to me that Labour have carefully prepared, and thrown, their very own dead cat onto the table, and are now desperately trying to get people to talk about something else, while acting utterly confused as to why the only thing their guests want to talk about is the dead cat.

    If that's a correct analysis, then perhaps a peashooter or a nerf gun would be slightly more suitable ordnance. Slightly less chance of massive friendly fire casualties...

    back in the mother countr… • Since Feb 2007 • 2728 posts Report Reply

  • WH,

    We’ve discussed Auckland’s housing market and the extent of foreign ownership of New Zealand’s economy on many occasions here. This is part of a story that goes back past the 1990 sale of Telecom to Bell Atlantic and Ameritech. I find it remarkable that statistical methods that clearly show an unexpected amount of foreign investment activity are being used to obscure the social and economic consequences of that investment. Short of a crash, this is not a trend that is going to stop on its own.

    Phil Goff recently said:

    I would die in a ditch to give people of whatever ethnicity the same rights as New Zealand residents. But I have a very clear view that people from overseas should not be investing in the New Zealand market.

    I think that’s a pretty easy thing to understand if you’re inclined to make the effort, and I’m wary of the way in which unsubstantiated allegations of racism can damage reputations and subvert discussion of what in this case are critical issues. Whilst acknowledging that racism itself is by far the more prevalent and pressing concern, I think more care is needed.

    Putting foreign ownership and ethnicity entirely to one side, my personal view is that we have some very serious and potentially irreversible mistakes with respect to our housing market.

    Since Nov 2006 • 794 posts Report Reply

  • Sacha, in reply to WH,

    and subvert discussion

    that was my concern at the outset - and sure enough, days later what are we talking about?

    Ak • Since May 2008 • 19706 posts Report Reply

  • steven crawford, in reply to WH,

    I think that’s a pretty easy thing to understand if you’re inclined to make the effort, and I’m wary of the way in which unsubstantiated allegations of racism can damage reputations and subvert discussion of what in this case are critical issues.

    Phil Goff saying he is prepared to die in a ditch, dosn’t change what the Labour Party has done. Now I’m not clear about who thinks what discussion is being subverted. I know what I’m talking about. It’s the New Zealand Labour Party and its cowardly generation of resentment and decision among the comunity for its own political ends.

    The conversation about how we feel about being colonised by people who speak with a different tong, is well wearth having. It is frightening. Social anxiety is real. And this is what I find slitly offensive about releasing shoddy research, in a way that’s cleary going to start this conversation which is nominated by the argument that there is a problem ( House prices ) and that’s a justification to try to ignore the inappropriate method of addressing it.

    Observation: there’s not much talk about dairy farm land, or power generators being included in ‘the foreign invester problem’. It could be that it’s a different problem, that the opposition party dosn’t have an emotive tabloid style media release at this time. Without that is it hard to get traction?

    Atlantis • Since Nov 2006 • 4411 posts Report Reply

  • nzlemming,

    Waikanae • Since Nov 2006 • 2932 posts Report Reply

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