Hard News by Russell Brown

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Hard News: Things we needed to hear

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  • merc,

    Mayor Quimby would know what to do.

    Since Dec 2006 • 2471 posts Report Reply

  • Rob Stowell,

    That was the intention of many of the protest organisers which didn't really have much to do with fighting apartheid I suppose. The thinking was - provoke a fight with the police and then ordinary NZers will rise up and overthrow the oppressors.

    Actually, Neil (just as a matter of historical accuracy) wasn't it really down to Muldoon's statement that the only way the tour would be cancelled was if the Police said it was too dangerous? This led fairly directly to a/ the cops feeling challenged in their machismo and b/ the protest movement attempting to "fulfill the requirement" and make the tour dangerous to civil order- (whatever the phrasing was).

    Whakaraupo • Since Nov 2006 • 2110 posts Report Reply

  • ron,

    From the NZ Herald 3 April:

    * Twelve police officers were found to be victims of false allegations

    * Twenty police officers were charged and acquitted

    * Two police officers were charged and committed suicide

    * 129 officers had complaints made against them that were not
    upheld

    So potentially quite a few false alegations of sexual abuse. Yet it's now been revealed that Dame Margaret Bazley wanted to conduct an unscientific survey of supporters of alleged rape victims, presumably so she could obtain the maximum amount of dirt on the police.

    Bazley is fortunate that the inquiry was held behind closed doors. Any other bad decisions by her are unlikely to be revealed. She is not required to answer questions about her report and it's not subject to the Official Information Act. Convenient.

    auckland • Since Mar 2007 • 77 posts Report Reply

  • ron,

    As for Howard Broad and his *sincere* apology on behalf of all women, well, I don't believe it for a second. Let's recall what Lynley Hood published on Scoop on April 5 2006.

    "On Thurs 1 October 1992, Detective Inspector Howard Broad of Christchurch announced to a packed press conference that four women child care workers had been arrested in the Christchurch Civic Creche case [Press, 2 Oct 92]. He named the women and described the shocking charges they faced jointly with the already-demonised Peter Ellis (who had been arrested 6 months earlier):

    “They [three of the women] are accused of sexually violating a boy by having unlawful sexual connection with him; indecent assault on the same boy, who was then aged three and four; Indecent assault on another boy, then aged three and four; and indecent assault on a girl, then aged three and four.

    “The fourth woman ... is charged that jointly with Ellis she wilfully did an indecent act in the toilets at the creche some time between April 1, 1989, and October 31, 1991.”

    The charges against the women were dismissed pre-trial. My research [A City Possessed, 2001] established that the allegations were the product of the ritual abuse hysteria sweeping Christchurch at the time. Police officers in the grip of this hysteria made the grossly unprofessional mistake of treating rumour and innuendo as established fact.

    Howard Broad’s press conference in October 1992 destroyed the careers and previously unblemished reputations of four well-qualified, experienced and dedicated child care workers.

    Since then, calls for a commission of inquiry into the creche case have been rejected by government. Consequently, none of the officials involved have learnt anything from the mistakes made. Indeed, because they have never had to admit to making any mistakes, many of them have repeated he same mistakes, over and over again. With Howard Broad’s appointment as the country’s top police officer, there is a real risk that ongoing damage caused to the fabric of New Zealand society by sex abuse hysteria and false allegations will continue unabated".

    auckland • Since Mar 2007 • 77 posts Report Reply

  • Neil Morrison,

    Rob, the two views aren't mutually exclusive. There was a hard left element that set out to orchestrate confrontations with the police because of their own domestic political agenda that had nothing to do with apartheid.

    But I suppose I'm just tired of the "I was a protestor so I don't like the police" line.

    ron, I agree with you about the Christchurch crèche business but I don't see its relevance. Ironically the Police were responding to the wilder-eyed feminist guff going around at the time. Swinging to far the other way as it were.

    Since Nov 2006 • 932 posts Report Reply

  • dad4justice,

    Just for the record - David Farrar does moderate and delete inappropriate comments as he has done today regarding my comments that I made about the Prime Minister and her marriage. It is totally unfair to say that he does not control the often-derogatory comments.Get your facts straight !

    I have suffered from police corruption since I was first arrested July 2001 and it is still an on going fight, however all of you learned pompous types would know what that all feels like? Please don’t answer as I couldn’t give a continental hoot on how or what you think!

    Since Jan 2007 • 50 posts Report Reply

  • ron,

    > ron, I agree with you about the Christchurch crèche business but I don't see its relevance.

    He apologised after Bazley's report was released because he had no other option. But he did have the option in the other case and he chose to remain silent. He has never apologised to the women creche workers. What does that say about the guy?

    auckland • Since Mar 2007 • 77 posts Report Reply

  • Russell Brown,

    Rob, the two views aren't mutually exclusive. There was a hard left element that set out to orchestrate confrontations with the police because of their own domestic political agenda that had nothing to do with apartheid.

    I think there were various sorts of people who took the chance to have a crack at the police, and I'm not even sure the "hard left" was foremost amongst them (and I'd debate that their political agenda "had nothing to do with apartheid).

    I knew a young woman who suddenly discovered anti-racist politics after it started to get violent, because, basically, she fancied a crack at the cops.

    I don't think that diminishes the overall intent and spirit of the protests though.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 22834 posts Report Reply

  • Kyle Matthews,

    As for Howard Broad and his *sincere* apology on behalf of all women, well, I don't believe it for a second. Let's recall what Lynley Hood published on Scoop on April 5 2006.

    I was interested to hear what Lynley Hood's book said about Howard Broad. My memory of his place in the case was that he was the supervisor of the supervisor of the detective who history has shown to be... well sleeping with complainants and going on a personal crusade. The press conference was bumped up the chain of command which is perfectly normal - no detective was going to be allowed to front up for a major media conference like that. I'm not sure if he had any involvement with the decision to arrest the women, or Ellis, and if he did, it would probably have been more that he was informed of the decision and briefed on it, rather than having input into it.

    I agree that history has shown the whole Christchurch Creche case to be a shocker. But senior police officers have to trust the cops that are doing the work until they're clearly proven to be incompetent/wrong. I think the fact that they got one conviction (dubious though I think it might be) would mean you'd be very unlikely to get an apology for the arrests that never led to a conviction. The courts have said that abuse took place at the creche, and simply on that looking at arresting the women wouldn't be unreasonable, as how could it have happened without some of them knowing?

    [Note I'm not saying that abuse did happen, just trying to look at it from the police's point of view. Courts of law have consistently said that abuse took place there, which is the major way that the police measure success - convictions.]

    Since Nov 2006 • 6243 posts Report Reply

  • Lambert,

    Some cops are bastards. And there's no denying the Police culture has been, and probably still is to a lesser degree, sexist, macho and clannish.

    But as someone who has a respected relative who's been in the force for a long time, and a friend who recently left after a decade or so in, I can understand how an insular police culture can develop.

    As my mate told me once, being in a job where you are dealing with people all day, every day, who absolutely hate you is draining. I think these guys who, let's not forget, put their personal safety on the line everytime they go to work, feel pretty unappreciated a lot of the time. It doesn't encourage you to want to go outside your circle of work mates.

    Both these guys are, incidentially, Maori. They're both good men with tons of integrity and, for the lack of a better description, high moral fibre (keeps them regular, I suppose). They are both under no illusions about the shortcomings of some of their colleagues and, although I haven't talked to either of them about the report or the rape trials et al, I'm sure they would be as disgusted with the behavior coming to light as the rest of us. I guess this is just a plea to spare a thought for all the good ones in uniform - if they don't get a bit of love from the public from time to time, they ain't be in blue for long and frankly, we need 'em.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 27 posts Report Reply

  • Riddley Walker,

    DPF, I get the impression that he's had little-to-no time

    he's busy alright, and not just with T&A stories and feeding meat to his pack.

    did you know he also has a political polling company called Curia? can you imagine how push polling they are?

    an acquaintance was surveyed by them a while back and frankly i would hate to think of the consequences of someone like Farrar having my name and a record of my views on all and sundry. with people like that fishing around it pays to ask all you call from pollsters before you said anything. if they say 'from Curia research', think carefully about what you say.

    AKL • Since Feb 2007 • 890 posts Report Reply

  • Lambert,

    By "getting love from the public", I don't mean anything gross...unfortunate turn of phrase on my part.

    Auckland • Since Nov 2006 • 27 posts Report Reply

  • Nobody Important,

    He has never apologised to the women creche workers.

    And while he's at it he could apologise to Ellis as well. Oh that's right, a jury found him quilty so he must be.

    Why do you think that you weren't informed that the protest you were in was going to deliberately set out to confront the police?

    Actually I was trying to keep my comment brief, hence I perhaps didn't make myself clear. It was Pythonesque because clearly everyone else in my row knew that the front group were going to peel off, leaving us as the new frontline to take on the next group of cops. Except me, who had come on their own, and had unwittingly picked the wrong row to wiggle into.

    And to be fair to 'The Protestors', that was the last day of the Tour yet the first day I'd worn a helmet to the protests. I'd seen enough in previous protest marches to realise I needed protection. I had decided that this time I was going to be more 'vigourous' because goddamn it I'd had enough of the BS. Yes, I blame Muldoon for forcing the Tour. He could have stopped it but didn't.

    the 81 Springbok Tour was when the middle class learnt the cops were actually bastards

    Rugby managed to repair their reputation over the last quarter century; so why not the Police? The middle classe experience of the Police is pretty much limited to recieving traffic tickets from them, and that when we're burgled they do nothing. On the last two occassions I've been to a Police Station to lay a formal complaint I've had counter staff actively try to dissuade me from doing so. With the last one (traffic) I was told that on the basis of my complaint it would be me that would be charged! Both complaints were 'minor' but serious enough for me to bother actually going to a station. I left both times with the feeling the Police were trying to manage the stats so they could claim crime was decreasing.

    I know this is trivial in light of what Bazley's Commission of Inquiry uncovered, but my point is that the Police seem to have lost the confidence of all sectors of the community. And when that happens you're f#kt. Banner ads on every website in NZ won't help you either ...

    expat • Since Mar 2007 • 319 posts Report Reply

  • Malcolm,

    "did you know he also has a political polling company ... can you imagine how push polling they are? "

    Riddley, you may not realise it, but this comment impugns DPF's professional ethics. He is a member of the Market Research Society of New Zealand, which forbids such practices. Bear in mind he seems to get his livelihood from market research.

    Can I respectfully suggest that you withdraw your comment?

    Since Apr 2007 • 69 posts Report Reply

  • Riddley Walker,

    Malcolm the suggestion that Farrar's Curia research might suffer from push polling was meant in the context of a discussion about Farrar's other political activities. i happily withdraw it if Curia's ethic is in no way related to that evinced by kiwiblog.

    Market Research Society of New Zealand forbids push polling? well i never. that's not an industry self-regulating body per chance is it?

    I would love to see examples of Curia's polling questions and sampling methodolgy so we can all be assured they are indeed true reflections of public opinion.

    AKL • Since Feb 2007 • 890 posts Report Reply

  • rodgerd,

    The middle classe experience of the Police is pretty much limited to recieving traffic tickets from them, and that when we're burgled they do nothing.

    Actually, my middle class experience of the police is not getting speeding tickets, and having them locate, successfully prosecute, and retrieve the greater part of my stolen possessions from the two burglaries I've suffered. Perhaps it's a question of where you live.

    Wellington • Since Nov 2006 • 512 posts Report Reply

  • Stephen Judd,

    Riddley, do you have anything other than speculation to offer? I think you're getting over-excited.

    Wellington • Since Nov 2006 • 3122 posts Report Reply

  • Riddley Walker,

    I think you're getting over-excited.

    you're probably right there Stephen. I would like some reassurance that kiwiblog's agenda doesn't seep over into 'research' a la maxim though. anyone got examples of Curia research questions and samples?

    AKL • Since Feb 2007 • 890 posts Report Reply

  • merc,

    John Key; so Dave, how are those blogs you have going over there?
    DPF; fine, fine, you know, I'm holding up, but this can't go on forever.
    JK; look, not long to go now and you're home free, I must say "WO" is very impressed...
    DPF; yeah, but maintaining 12 different personna's is killing me, especially Sonic. I'm starting to think like him you know.
    JK; there will be a complete cleansing once you have completed your task...
    DPF; look JK, I'm going to need some special help, that Riddeley guy's been asking questions about, you know, Curia.
    JK; Jebus Dave, what the...you're Riddely arn't you!!!

    Since Dec 2006 • 2471 posts Report Reply

  • Riddley Walker,

    merc you said we were going to keep quiet about that.
    J

    AKL • Since Feb 2007 • 890 posts Report Reply

  • Riddley Walker,

    i mean
    D
    (you're right, this is getting confusing)

    AKL • Since Feb 2007 • 890 posts Report Reply

  • Nobody Important,

    Perhaps it's a question of where you live.

    Crikey Rogerd - I'm moving to Wellie!! (Much better Public Transport too)

    expat • Since Mar 2007 • 319 posts Report Reply

  • merc,

    I think we need to get you in, you know, for a quiet chat, Kurtz is obviously getting to you Captain...
    "The more I read about him, the more I began to like him." (Apocalypse Now).

    Since Dec 2006 • 2471 posts Report Reply

  • Riddley Walker,

    Kimosave, i thought you were the Captain and I was Teniel?
    D

    AKL • Since Feb 2007 • 890 posts Report Reply

  • Riddley Walker,

    you said 'when all this is over, we'll be like Tonto and Teniel' and i could be the boss, that's what you said. now it's just like Don all over again.

    AKL • Since Feb 2007 • 890 posts Report Reply

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